Do you think education is emphasized enough in this hobby?

ShadyDave

I often hear that you "have to pay tuition" in this hobby as a collector as you learn and progress in the hobby. I agree that sometimes you have to learn the hard way, but I try to avoid those costly situations at all costs!



While I think I know the series I collect well, I'm always interested in learning more and testing my knowledge and skills. I like reading posts on this forum (and others), reading books on different numismatic topics, going to coin shows and handling as many coins as dealers will hand to me, BS'ing with collector friends or dealers and submitting my coins to PCGS or CAC to test my grading skills.





I know that some of the major shows have educational seminars and topics and that the ANA has their summer seminar in Colorado Springs, but why is there not more in-person educational opportunities out there for collectors? Is it purely about logistics and $$$ or am I unaware of other opportunities? Don't you think that the major TPG'ers, major auction houses or dealers could be capitalizing on holding regional in-person seminars on grading, conserving, authenticating and other tasks essential to this hobby?





If PCGS held a paid seminar on coin grading or authenticating with different levels: novice/intermediate/advanced then I know I'd be happy to pay for those classes.



What are your thoughts on this? Do you think there is enough education for collectors out there? Do you think collectors have to learn the hard way? Am bitter that I would have to travel out of New England just to attend one of these classes?

TomB

At virtually every show that I attend I will spend significant time with collectors attempting to help them with questions they might have or strategies they might want to follow. It is rare that these collectors actually buy anything from me, so these efforts are done by me on a volunteer basis. Additionally, my website has more than a dozen articles that I have written on it and while some of them aren't all that educational; others are. However, I can view how many "hits" or web visits each of my pages gets and the educational pages rarely are hit, while the inventory gets hit all the time.

BillJones

In a word, NO!!!!

I can't get a place at the FUN show to speak. The only time I did it was to talk about the coins of 1795. I had a Power Point presentation and a display of a complete type set of the coins including the gold. I had about 25 people attend. To get an audience you need to give out a free book and a topic like "How to make a fortune investing in coins."

I can remember back in April 1993 when Eric P. Newman gave a presentation on the 200th anniversary of the first U.S. Mint. The room was not full. The great thing is Q. David Bowers can still publish wonderful books on numismatic history and still keep going.

Zoins

I hear a lot about tuition but I don't think tuition should be mandatory. I've avoided some expensive tuition by hanging out on message boards and think you can avoid some if you are careful.

Per Bill, to get traction on education, it does seem like books and catchy topics work. The book below seems educational, valuable and exciting!

topstuf

Originally posted by: BillJones

In a word, NO!!!!



I can't get a place at the FUN show to speak. The only time I did it was to talk about the coins of 1795. I had a Power Point presentation and a display of a complete type set of the coins including the gold. I had about 25 people attend. To get an audience you need to give out a free book and a topic like "How to make a fortune investing in coins."



I can remember back in April 1993 when Eric P. Newman gave a presentation on the 200th anniversary of the first U.S. Mint. The room was not full. The great thing is Q. David Bowers can still publish wonderful books on numismatic history and still keep going.

How to make a fortune investing in 1795 coins should have been your seminar.

garrynot

The two coin clubs I attend have presentations each month. When I have given presentations, the response is overwhelming. People, young and old really appreciate information on numismatic topics that they have never considered. There are so many. I gave a presentation on a Carson City topic and one older gentleman told me afterwards, " I have two Carson City double eagles I haven't looked at in years." The next meeting he brought them in and passed them around.

astrorat

Of course not. Then again, it's as emphasized as the hobby wants. If collectors were clamoring for educational programming that improved their knowledge and skills, then those programs would be offered to a much greater extent. Most collectors do not travel to a major convention to listen to educational programs ... they want to buy and sell coins. Just look at the attendance at the FUN, ANA, etc educational programs (which run concurrently with the bourse) and there will be a dearth of attendees at the educational sessions.

One of the biggest challenges to advancing education in the hobby is that far too few people who have numismatic expertise know how to teach. People may think they know how to teach, but mastering "death by PowerPoint" is not the answer. The most successful educational programs are ones in which the attendees actively participate. Nonetheless, those hour-long sessions where someone delivers numismatic content have value, just like watching a video has value. To increase the educational value, the audience needs to be engaged not just passive observers.

Case in point ... grading classes and counterfeit detection classes. One can "teach" either subject by lectures alone, but the real education occurs when participants actively evaluate coins and are assessed on those skills. One of the best examples is the Advanced Grading classed at the ANA summer seminar. While a fun and educational class ... it is a lot of work, but participants learn a lot. Could it be improved? Sure, but that's another conversation.

ricko

I buy numismatic books... I used to attend shows (none in this area where I live now),

frequent forums, ask questions, used to attend seminars.... all of those options are available...

plus, hands on experience and interaction with other collectors. Short of college courses on numismatics, I am not sure what else one can ask for. Cheers, RickO

ShadyDave

Thanks for everyone's perspective so far. It sounds like many people are saying that us collectors would rather have instant gratification (buying something shiny) than building up the skill-set to be successful over the long run. That's not too surprising.





TomB- I try to be a patron of dealers who spend time with me (I'm not usually asking for much) and if I have questions or want perspective/opinion on a coin/topic I'll normally ask when the dealer doesn't look busy. So, I hope collectors who you try to educate remember you and come back when they are ready to purchase....as it is a two-way road for collectors and dealers.





Garrynot- Thanks for the idea, I have not joined/attended a coin club. I'll definitely look into that.

Originally posted by: astrorat

Of course not. Then again, it's as emphasized as the hobby wants. If collectors were clamoring for educational programming that improved their knowledge and skills, then those programs would be offered to a much greater extent.



Case in point ... grading classes and counterfeit detection classes. One can "teach" either subject by lectures alone, but the real education occurs when participants actively evaluate coins and are assessed on those skills. One of the best examples is the Advanced Grading classed at the ANA summer seminar. While a fun and educational class ... it is a lot of work, but participants learn a lot. Could it be improved? Sure, but that's another conversation.

I agree that even videos can be educational. but not to the extent to having a coin in hand and having an instructor over your shoulder pointing something out to you. It looks like I'll just have to pitch a vacation idea to my girlfriend in Colorado Springs.

mr1931S

Buy the book before the coin is the best advice I have to offer.

Do you think there is enough education for collectors out there? Do you think collectors have to learn the hard way?

With the advent of the internet,there is more easily obtained,accurate information available for collectors than ever before.

Some collectors make the coin collecting hobby unnecessarily hard for themselves by not paying attention to what the veterans have to say.

Insider2

Originally posted by: BillJones

In a word, NO!!!!



I can't get a place at the FUN show to speak. The only time I did it was to talk about the coins of 1795. I had a Power Point presentation and a display of a complete type set of the coins including the gold. I had about 25 people attend. To get an audience you need to give out a free book and a topic like "How to make a fortune investing in coins."



I can remember back in April 1993 when Eric P. Newman gave a presentation on the 200th anniversary of the first U.S. Mint. The room was not full. The great thing is Q. David Bowers can still publish wonderful books on numismatic history and still keep going.

Dear Bill,



I am not sure what time period you are speaking of. Lots has changed since 1993. When was the last time you approached/contacted Mr. Randy Campbell, the FUN Education Chairman and current President of that organization.



When Bill, Bob, Fred, Skip, Scott, Tony, etc. give presentations the room is filled - often with people standing along the wall. Perhaps you should pick a subject of more universal interest and then call Mr. Campbell.



PS IMO, the room is filled by "content" not "handouts." I believe Campbell can be reached at ICG in Tampa,FL. Please let us know when you'll be speaking.

clarkbar04

The partial issue is the gap between teaching and actual learning. Everybody learns differently. I personally would have learned a lot quicker by means of a display showing an array of improperly cleaned coins. Most are obvious, but some not as much.

Not everything has to be learned the hard way, but unfortunately, this is still a big part of it.

One or 2 potentially good draws would be "how to spot a slider" or "how to differentiate strike weakness from wear".

Jackthecat1

Our club has a presentation at every monthly meeting. We also have show and tell sessions where members bring a few coins and talk about them. If anyone has a coin they want to learn more about, they can show it to the room and solicit input.

Nic

Folks have to put in the time and effort and want to learn.



Study any series as best you can. Go to a major auction/show, view your series, make predictions, and look at prices realized. Repeat.

swhuck

Originally posted by: Nic
Folks have to put in the time and effort and want to learn.

Study any series as best you can. Go to a major auction/show, view your series, make predictions, and look at prices realized. Repeat.

Well put. Like everything else, people have to want to put in the effort to learn. I give presentations around here regularly, but if someone doesn't want to put in the effort to learn the difference between an XF coin and an MS65 coin you can't make them do it.

MrEureka

Don't you think that the major TPG'ers, major auction houses or dealers could be capitalizing on holding regional in-person seminars on grading, conserving, authenticating and other tasks essential to this hobby?

Capitalizing? As in like making money? I highly doubt it.

Anyway, there's plenty that can be learned at home, at coin club meetings, at coin shows and at auctions. I'm not convinced that there's really a problem.

The Federalist

Rather than a lack of education regarding the hobby (which there defeinetly is some in certain unresearched areas), I think the bigger problem is amassing all of the info regarding every corner of the hobby into a single place that is accesible by every single person.

TwoSides2aCoin

Education is free. It's the tuition that will kick your ass.

You can lead a horse to water.... But you have to beat him with a stick.

MICHAELDIXON

Do individuals in today's society want to spend the time to be educated? I do not believe they do. It is the McDonald's Drive thru mentality that exists in all facets of society to include coin collecting. It seems many individuals think they are too intelligent to make mistakes, and do not need education. The education is there, but most do not want it. It has always saddened me whenever I schedule speakers at shows and nobody shows up. Many coin clubs have folded due to no participation. To me, this is a sign of, not only changing trends, but of coin collectors not wanting to be educated. So, yes, I believe education is emphasized in this hobby.