On the last bid...it looks like the bidder was playing Russian Roulette (spin and hope you don't get it!). The bid was increased by only $100 on a $400k dollar item. If you are a serious bidder...at least increase the bid by 1% (~$5k).
I highly doubt the auction will hold up...just not the right forum to sell a card like that...just my opinion..how many top bidders are just goofing around? Plus...and this is a huge plus...who in their right mind is going to spend HALF A MILLION DOLLARS without looking at it in person? The stain alone is a red flag that any serious bidder would have to look at it with their own eyes...The 8 that was on display at the National that went for 383k I believe, was nice and I saw it up close. How many bidders will bail and Brent has to go down the list? Not even sure that's appropriate or what the consignee should adhere to...It would be nice if this was one clean and complete auction but I highly doubt it.
This is very suspicious bidding. Raising each other by a few hundred. I think on cards like this you should have to be approved to bid. Anyone can place a bid with no intention to honor it. In terms of who is buying a card like this it is anyone's guess. To purchase a card that is in this price range to hold for any length of time you have to have seriously deep pockets. Each card is different but having a single card that represents more then 1% of your net worth better be very special and have strong investment potential. I could see a few cards where perhaps a higher weighting is warranted but not many.
Bidder Click here to know more about anonymous user IDs Bid Amount Bid Time
-***o ( 1271Feedback score is 1000 to 4,999) US $425,700.00
Oct-31-15 09:09:32 PDT
h***o ( 7 ) US $425,600.00
Nov-01-15 15:32:21 PST
1***n ( 177Feedback score is 100 to 499) US $425,400.00
Oct-31-15 12:57:26 PDT
a***i ( 1145Feedback score is 1000 to 4,999) US $425,200.00
Oct-31-15 12:29:54 PDT
h***h ( 942Feedback score is 500 to 999) US $425,000.00
Oct-30-15 21:36:46 PDT
-***o ( 1271Feedback score is 1000 to 4,999) US $425,000.00
Maybe someone looking to upgrade their set then selling their lesser copy. I wasn't interested for that reason,but maybe someone else is. For me it's about being able to buy things I had as a kid. I don't see how net worth has anything to do with it.
Originally posted by: tntdynomite Maybe someone looking to upgrade their set then selling their lesser copy. I wasn't interested for that reason,but maybe someone else is. For me it's about being able to buy things I had as a kid. I don't see how net worth has anything to do with it.
How would someone with a net worth of say, 100K or 300K pull the trigger on a 500K card? I don't see someone liquidating their life savings and selling the house to buy a Mantle RC.
Anyone that buys this card will likely have a net worth north of 10MM and most likely in the 100MM range. You really need F U money to buy a card like this.
Originally posted by: belz Can you imagine if PSA put the ST on the label? Difference of 350k.
I noticed that as well - right below the "EY" does not look good.
It's a small stain that's why there's no qualifier. PSA graded the card correctly.
if the stain wasn't there, this would be a 9; and worth well over $1M.
Collecting PSA 9's from 1970-1977. Raw 9's from 72-77. Raw 10's from '78-'83. Collecting Unopened from '72-'83; mostly BBCE certified boxes/cases/racks. Prefer to buy in bulk.
Originally posted by: belz I highly doubt the auction will hold up...just not the right forum to sell a card like that...just my opinion..how many top bidders are just goofing around? Plus...and this is a huge plus...who in their right mind is going to spend HALF A MILLION DOLLARS without looking at it in person? The stain alone is a red flag that any serious bidder would have to look at it with their own eyes...The 8 that was on display at the National that went for 383k I believe, was nice and I saw it up close. How many bidders will bail and Brent has to go down the list? Not even sure that's appropriate or what the consignee should adhere to...It would be nice if this was one clean and complete auction but I highly doubt it.
this is the beginning of the end of AH's. The eyeballs and money are at ebay; not waiting at home for a catalog to bid on an auction that closes 3 different times and ends at 3:00 AM.
Are there some goofballs throwing bids in to say "I bid over $300K on a 52 Mantle", absolutely. That's why there is the 48 hour vetting period.
Collecting PSA 9's from 1970-1977. Raw 9's from 72-77. Raw 10's from '78-'83. Collecting Unopened from '72-'83; mostly BBCE certified boxes/cases/racks. Prefer to buy in bulk.
sdub..youre correct the AH's are worried. as they should be. now lowering their fees, cash advances etc. Those days of charging 20% on both sides are going away. Think about that...40% fees!! But memoribilia AH always corrects me.."19.5% for you" and "20% for them" talk about greed. Wow, 0.5% for me, 39.5% for him.I digress
but for a card like this I still think an AH is the way to go
1. you need more than 9 days to have active bidding. and more advertising like some AH's are doing.
2. of course the vetting process. you always see ridiculous bids on some rare items that use ebay that end up being relisted there or somewhere else
Both have their place but online has so many more positives for the buyer as of now.
Interested in higher grade vintage cards. Aren't we all.
seebelow; I'm sure AH's have issues also with retractions and vetting, but we don't hear about because we can't hear about. You can't see the bidders/retractions/increments on the AH's, it's proprietary. Hence, why I mostly stay away from them.
I don't understand the cash advances. Are sellers that hard up for cash that they can't wait another 30-50 days to get their money. In some cases they've had these cards for years/decades. What am I missing here? Why do consignment houses have to offer cash advances?
I see PWCC is offering 6 months free financing with 10% down on the Mantle. I'm assuming with 10% down, he's keeping the card for 6 months.
If the card sells for $600,000, 10% down is $60,000. If you borrow the $60,000 on your HELOC at 2%, that's $1,200 per month. Over 6 months that's $7,200. At the end of 6 months, you have PWCC sell it again. Beat the commissions and interest, then you've got a deal.
This is starting to sound like the folks that bought those houses in Merced 10 years ago.
Collecting PSA 9's from 1970-1977. Raw 9's from 72-77. Raw 10's from '78-'83. Collecting Unopened from '72-'83; mostly BBCE certified boxes/cases/racks. Prefer to buy in bulk.
how much would a 1952 topps mickey mantle psa 10 go for?
$1 million? absolutely.
$2 million? more likely than not.
$3 million? would not be surprised.
$5 million? well, i'm an attorney so anything is possible.
I was just thinking about this very question a couple of days ago. There are 6 PSA 9s and 3 PSA 10s (and 2 PSA 8.5s). There are 32 PSA 8s. So, if you have a PSA 8.5 or above, you own one of the top 10 Mantles in existence.
With the last 2 PSA 8s hitting $400K (from Goldin and Heritage), and if the bidding on the current PWCC 8 holds up, if one of the PSA 9s shows up, it's an easy $1M card, and quite possibly, a $2M card.
If one of the 3 PSA 10s shows up for auction/sale, it will easily beat the T206 Wagner high of $2.7M, and become the new record holder.
I would MUCH rather have this example than any of the few that have crossed the public auction circuit as an 8 over the past few years where the centering was clearly inferior to this example. The bottom line is, truly eye popping 1952 Topps Mantles at 8 or above probably exist in numbers that one can use the fingers on one hand to count. If you have to have one, you usually will have to settle for a not so clean example. That could be said of many issues. Hank Aaron's rookies are almost ALWAYS a complete eyesore even in GEM MINT grades. I would say that DM23HOF probably has one of the nicer examples even if it is "just" a '4'.
I agree with the above on all counts. Aaron rookies have issues up the wazoo. And probably less than fifty #311 Mantle cards in the world that have centering like this PWCC card.
I think I know the card in question that you say DM23HOF owns. It was in the Slugger museum in Louisville. I saw it pictured on Net54, which I read regularly, and also saw it at the museum. Truth be told, I would take that 4.5 over the PWCC 8 and keep the change. DM's card in the museum had even better centering and color. Wish I saw that card at the auction where he bought it. I would have liked to throw my hat in that ring and given it a run.
I also missed the nice "3" that was on eBay a few months ago. Hope not to miss the next one. I check "auction report" now often.
I would MUCH rather have this example than any of the few that have crossed the public auction circuit as an 8 over the past few years where the centering was clearly inferior to this example. The bottom line is, truly eye popping 1952 Topps Mantles at 8 or above probably exist in numbers that one can use the fingers on one hand to count. If you have to have one, you usually will have to settle for a not so clean example. That could be said of many issues. Hank Aaron's rookies are almost ALWAYS a complete eyesore even in GEM MINT grades. I would say that DM23HOF probably has one of the nicer examples even if it is "just" a '4'.
I agree with the above on all counts. Aaron rookies have issues up the wazoo. And probably less than fifty #311 Mantle cards in the world that have centering like this PWCC card.
I think I know the card in question that you say DM23HOF owns. It was in the Slugger museum in Louisville. I saw it pictured on Net54, which I read regularly, and also saw it at the museum. Truth be told, I would take that 4.5 over the PWCC 8 and keep the change. DM's card in the museum had even better centering and color. Wish I saw that card at the auction where he bought it. I would have liked to throw my hat in that ring and given it a run.
I also missed the nice "3" that was on eBay a few months ago. Hope not to miss the next one. I check "auction report" now often.
Would take Matt's 4.5 all day and pocket the change. Has just as nice eye appeal and with the savings you could literally buy a house to store it in! Evans PSA was also a great one and it lasted less than 2 hours on Ebay. Very hard card to find centered.
With this economy if any of the (3) PSA 10's were up for sale they would crush the Wagner - $4-5 million without a doubt.
Originally posted by: Dpeck100 This is very suspicious bidding. Raising each other by a few hundred. I think on cards like this you should have to be approved to bid. Anyone can place a bid with no intention to honor it. In terms of who is buying a card like this it is anyone's guess. To purchase a card that is in this price range to hold for any length of time you have to have seriously deep pockets. Each card is different but having a single card that represents more then 1% of your net worth better be very special and have strong investment potential. I could see a few cards where perhaps a higher weighting is warranted but not many.
Bidder Click here to know more about anonymous user IDs Bid Amount Bid Time -***o ( 1271Feedback score is 1000 to 4,999) US $425,700.00 Oct-31-15 09:09:32 PDT
h***o ( 7 ) US $425,600.00 Nov-01-15 15:32:21 PST
1***n ( 177Feedback score is 100 to 499) US $425,400.00 Oct-31-15 12:57:26 PDT
a***i ( 1145Feedback score is 1000 to 4,999) US $425,200.00 Oct-31-15 12:29:54 PDT
h***h ( 942Feedback score is 500 to 999) US $425,000.00 Oct-30-15 21:36:46 PDT
-***o ( 1271Feedback score is 1000 to 4,999) US $425,000.00 Oct-30-15 22:08:46 PDT
Originally posted by: Warriors8 The person with the high bid has 85 percent bidding with pwcc and 9 retractions-shady.
I see your bidder and raise you. Bidder that took it over $425k has 96% bids with this seller and 18 retractions. I have never had to retract a bid - why would someone have 18 of them???
Originally posted by: Warriors8 The person with the high bid has 85 percent bidding with pwcc and 9 retractions-shady.
I see your bidder and raise you. Bidder that took it over $425k has 96% bids with this seller and 18 retractions. I have never had to retract a bid - why would someone have 18 of them???
Because they are bidding on items that have no intention of winning. It is fairly common to run up an item and become high bid and then retract so they are the under bidder and the other persons high bid is exposed.
I hate bid retractions and wish EBAY would address the issue but they have no interest it appears.
Originally posted by: Warriors8 The person with the high bid has 85 percent bidding with pwcc and 9 retractions-shady.
I see your bidder and raise you. Bidder that took it over $425k has 96% bids with this seller and 18 retractions. I have never had to retract a bid - why would someone have 18 of them???
Because they are bidding on items that have no intention of winning. It is fairly common to run up an item and become high bid and then retract so they are the under bidder and the other persons high bid is exposed.
I hate bid retractions and wish EBAY would address the issue but they have no interest it appears.
My dad has the entire columbo series on DVD so as a younger guy I've seen most episodes. I really love the first episode, Columbo wasn't a "goofball" yet. He played more of a no nonsense detective.
More $100 bump bidding. Let me get this straight. 1271 decided he was will to pay $200 more for a card that they are bidding over $430,000 on. Yeah sure. 24 bids already on the card.
You would think a bidder would perhaps try and disguise themselves better. It is a real shame that this card will not be sold in a legit auction.
30-Day Summary
Total bids: 415
Items bid on: 78
Bid activity (%) with this seller: 86% Help
Bid retractions: 1
Bid retractions (6 months): 9
Bidder Click here to know more about anonymous user IDs Bid Amount Bid Time
h***h ( 942Feedback score is 500 to 999) US $430,500.00
Nov-03-15 20:52:37 PST
s***y ( 672Feedback score is 500 to 999) US $430,400.00
Nov-03-15 07:42:39 PST
-***o ( 1271Feedback score is 1000 to 4,999) US $430,300.00
Nov-03-15 07:15:19 PST
_***a ( 8 ) US $430,200.00
Nov-02-15 17:36:05 PST
-***o ( 1271Feedback score is 1000 to 4,999) US $430,100.00
Oct-31-15 09:09:32 PDT
m***n ( 316Feedback score is 100 to 499) US $430,000.00
This may set a record: Watch Count: 2,697 watchers
There is no doubt that EBAY is a qualified platform to get the reach needed to maximize a collectibles selling price. The only problem is anyone can bid on any item.
I am curious to see how Brent handles the final 48 hours and if some bids drop off leading up to that point or if he outright cancels them.
Originally posted by: baseball But I'm just not sure where this other "legitimate auction" exists.
I would argue this is the most legitimate auction of one of these. The bids on this one can at least be analyzed for abnormal patterns, allowing interested buyers to make their own determination on whether shilling is occurring and if it impacts their desire to purchase at a given price. Other places, not so much.
Originally posted by: Dpeck100 The only problem is anyone can bid on any item.
Because shilling never happens at AHs?
There are at least consequences for not honoring your bid. Other major auction houses require you to qualify to bid on extremely high priced items. On EBAY you could have $2 to your name and bid on any item with absolutely no ability to pay for it and all you get is a non payment strike. Shilling can take place anywhere and as was stated the larger bid increments make it a more risky strategy through an auction house. I think to bid on an auction of this nature through EBAY a pre qualification process like existed for the Super Man Action Comics or the Honus Wagner should take place and in both cases the items were paid for and exchanged hands.
From Mile High's website:
7. Payment - Invoices will be sent to all winning bidders within 3 business days after the auction by e-mail hard copy invoices will only be sent to winning bidders who do not have an email on file with MHCC or to those customers who rerquest them and will contain all of your auction totals, including the items you won, shipping and insurance costs and tax if applicable. A copy of the payment instructions will also be enclosed with your invoice. Any bidder who has not paid in full without having made prior arrangements for late payment will have future bidding privileges revoked. Invoices are payable upon receipt with payment due no later than two weeks from date of invoice. Payments may be made by cash, check, wire transfer (invoices above $10,000 ONLY with a $20.00 charge for wire transfers), or money order. Items paid by cash, wire transfer or money order will be shipped immediately. Unless known to Mile High Card Co., personal checks will be held for 7-10(No Exceptions) days before merchandise is approved for shipment which can take up to 5-7 days after funds are collected. Any returned checks will incur a $30.00 fee. NO CREDIT CARDS will be accepted for this sale. In the event of a Late/Non Payment, the bidder agrees to pay all of the auctioneer's reasonable attorney's fees and costs involved in collection of funds, plus 1.5% interest per month on any unpaid balance, starting from the original due date until the date that all funds have been collected. The jurisdiction for any litigation shall be in the State of Colorado, or the Federal District Court of Colorado at the discretion of the auctioneer. Each of the terms in the auction rules are distinct and separate. If a winning bidder does not honor his or her bid with payment in full per the auction rules, then it is agreed that MHCC at its sole discretion can sell the given item(s) to the under bidder or re offer the items in a future auction, and that the original winning bidder is responsible for any losses incurred or service charges involved in the sale of the said item(s) and that the non paying winning bidder explicitly agrees to pay any and all costs of collection, including, but not limited to, reasonable attorney's fees incurred by MHCC in the collection of these losses and/or service charges from the non paying winning bidder.
Originally posted by: Dpeck100 There are at least consequences for not honoring your bid.
I think eBay's terms are pretty similar, they just never enforce them realizing how easy it is to create another identity. I don't know if the AHs ever enforce these terms either, but haven't personally heard of anyone brought to court over it.
I doubt anyone who works for eBay is bumping things up to a bidders max a la Mastro (or the active allegations and admitted bidding records destruction of another major AH). baseball's experience outside of eBay is far too frequent. Thankfully, sniping allows your max to remain hidden until the last few seconds on eBay. Non-paying bidders is eBay's biggest problem, but still the lesser of evils and far more transparent.
This auction does require approval by PWCC for bids in the last 48 hours and scrutiny of all those placed before the 6th. Getting pre-qualified for an AH is a joke; I've never been declined Do they pull credit reports or require you to provide bank/asset statements? How do they know any more than eBay does about your ability to pay?
How do luxury auctions guarantee a successful sale?
All potential buyers are screened and must pre-qualify in order to even participate in a luxury auction. Sacchi says that parties must prove they will be able to purchase the property if they are the winning bidder, and are required to put down a deposit of $100,000 or more in order to compete. She adds that the amount of work that goes into attracting, screening and consulting with potential buyers ensures that by the time the auction takes place, the auction company is confident that the property will be sold for a price acceptable to the seller
I know there was a very extensive screening process on the two auctions I referenced. You may recall the number of bids were very low in both cases. I am not certain if an escrow deposit was needed or a signed affidavit and submission of proof of funds.
Either way it is clear there are people bidding on this card with no intent to win.
Let's limit this to SC&M AHs. Sotheby's and Barrett-Jackson are a completely different class of AH and I would agree are far better than eBay for the types of items they sell.
I am not certain but when I created an account with Heritage to see the prices of a recent auction I believe I saw a note indicating you had to qualify to bid on a high priced item.
On the Super Man Action Comics and The Honus Wagner that went for close to 1.3 million I do know that EBAY advertised those auctions for a few weeks in advance and an intense qualification process was required to place an initial bid.
I personally think that would have been the best route to go on a item that was going to garner this much interest.
"baseball"..+1 i think you're exactly right..and its a very unappreciated fact that has the most significance...costing most every one here a lot of money without us realizing it.
I can't overemphasize the importance and agreeing with your point.
Interested in higher grade vintage cards. Aren't we all.
Speaking of Emily Litella: Why make Puerto Rico a steak? If you do, they'll just want a baked potato, with sour cream and chives, and those little bacon bits.
Bidding surpasses $450k! Only nose-bleed bids remaining. Bidder (1271) has been chasing this card since it opened for bidding with his initial $300k+ dollar bid at the open. Someone will probably lead this collector to the 1/2 million dollar finish line...
Comments
Bidder Click here to know more about anonymous user IDs Bid Amount Bid Time
-***o ( 1271Feedback score is 1000 to 4,999) US $425,700.00
Oct-31-15 09:09:32 PDT
h***o ( 7 ) US $425,600.00
Nov-01-15 15:32:21 PST
1***n ( 177Feedback score is 100 to 499) US $425,400.00
Oct-31-15 12:57:26 PDT
a***i ( 1145Feedback score is 1000 to 4,999) US $425,200.00
Oct-31-15 12:29:54 PDT
h***h ( 942Feedback score is 500 to 999) US $425,000.00
Oct-30-15 21:36:46 PDT
-***o ( 1271Feedback score is 1000 to 4,999) US $425,000.00
Oct-30-15 22:08:46 PDT
Maybe someone looking to upgrade their set then selling their lesser copy. I wasn't interested for that reason,but maybe someone else is. For me it's about being able to buy things I had as a kid. I don't see how net worth has anything to do with it.
How would someone with a net worth of say, 100K or 300K pull the trigger on a 500K card? I don't see someone liquidating their life savings and selling the house to buy a Mantle RC.
Anyone that buys this card will likely have a net worth north of 10MM and most likely in the 100MM range. You really need F U money to buy a card like this.
Can you imagine if PSA put the ST on the label? Difference of 350k.
I noticed that as well - right below the "EY" does not look good.
It's a small stain that's why there's no qualifier.
PSA graded the card correctly.
if the stain wasn't there, this would be a 9; and worth well over $1M.
Collecting Unopened from '72-'83; mostly BBCE certified boxes/cases/racks.
Prefer to buy in bulk.
I highly doubt the auction will hold up...just not the right forum to sell a card like that...just my opinion..how many top bidders are just goofing around? Plus...and this is a huge plus...who in their right mind is going to spend HALF A MILLION DOLLARS without looking at it in person? The stain alone is a red flag that any serious bidder would have to look at it with their own eyes...The 8 that was on display at the National that went for 383k I believe, was nice and I saw it up close. How many bidders will bail and Brent has to go down the list? Not even sure that's appropriate or what the consignee should adhere to...It would be nice if this was one clean and complete auction but I highly doubt it.
this is the beginning of the end of AH's. The eyeballs and money are at ebay; not waiting at home for a catalog to bid on an auction that closes 3 different times and ends at 3:00 AM.
Are there some goofballs throwing bids in to say "I bid over $300K on a 52 Mantle", absolutely. That's why there is the 48 hour vetting period.
Collecting Unopened from '72-'83; mostly BBCE certified boxes/cases/racks.
Prefer to buy in bulk.
but for a card like this I still think an AH is the way to go
1. you need more than 9 days to have active bidding. and more advertising like some AH's are doing.
2. of course the vetting process. you always see ridiculous bids on some rare items that use ebay that end up being relisted there or somewhere else
Both have their place but online has so many more positives for the buyer as of now.
seebelow; I'm sure AH's have issues also with retractions and vetting, but we don't hear about because we can't hear about. You can't see the bidders/retractions/increments on the AH's, it's proprietary. Hence, why I mostly stay away from them.
I don't understand the cash advances. Are sellers that hard up for cash that they can't wait another 30-50 days to get their money. In some cases they've had these cards for years/decades. What am I missing here? Why do consignment houses have to offer cash advances?
I see PWCC is offering 6 months free financing with 10% down on the Mantle. I'm assuming with 10% down, he's keeping the card for 6 months.
If the card sells for $600,000, 10% down is $60,000. If you borrow the $60,000 on your HELOC at 2%, that's $1,200 per month. Over 6 months that's $7,200. At the end of 6 months, you have PWCC sell it again. Beat the commissions and interest, then you've got a deal.
This is starting to sound like the folks that bought those houses in Merced 10 years ago.
Collecting Unopened from '72-'83; mostly BBCE certified boxes/cases/racks.
Prefer to buy in bulk.
how much would a 1952 topps mickey mantle psa 10 go for?
$1 million? absolutely.
$2 million? more likely than not.
$3 million? would not be surprised.
$5 million? well, i'm an attorney so anything is possible.
I was just thinking about this very question a couple of days ago. There are 6 PSA 9s and 3 PSA 10s (and 2 PSA 8.5s). There are 32 PSA 8s. So, if you have a PSA 8.5 or above, you own one of the top 10 Mantles in existence.
With the last 2 PSA 8s hitting $400K (from Goldin and Heritage), and if the bidding on the current PWCC 8 holds up, if one of the PSA 9s shows up, it's an easy $1M card, and quite possibly, a $2M card.
If one of the 3 PSA 10s shows up for auction/sale, it will easily beat the T206 Wagner high of $2.7M, and become the new record holder.
IMHO at least
Steve
I would MUCH rather have this example than any of the few that have crossed the public auction circuit as an 8 over the past few years where the centering was clearly inferior to this example. The bottom line is, truly eye popping 1952 Topps Mantles at 8 or above probably exist in numbers that one can use the fingers on one hand to count. If you have to have one, you usually will have to settle for a not so clean example. That could be said of many issues. Hank Aaron's rookies are almost ALWAYS a complete eyesore even in GEM MINT grades.
I would say that DM23HOF probably has one of the nicer examples even if it is "just" a '4'.
I agree with the above on all counts. Aaron rookies have issues up the wazoo. And probably less than fifty #311 Mantle cards in the world that have centering like this PWCC card.
I think I know the card in question that you say DM23HOF owns. It was in the Slugger museum in Louisville. I saw it pictured on Net54, which I read regularly, and also saw it at the museum. Truth be told, I would take that 4.5 over the PWCC 8 and keep the change. DM's card in the museum had even better centering and color. Wish I saw that card at the auction where he bought it. I would have liked to throw my hat in that ring and given it a run.
I also missed the nice "3" that was on eBay a few months ago. Hope not to miss the next one. I check "auction report" now often.
I would MUCH rather have this example than any of the few that have crossed the public auction circuit as an 8 over the past few years where the centering was clearly inferior to this example. The bottom line is, truly eye popping 1952 Topps Mantles at 8 or above probably exist in numbers that one can use the fingers on one hand to count. If you have to have one, you usually will have to settle for a not so clean example. That could be said of many issues. Hank Aaron's rookies are almost ALWAYS a complete eyesore even in GEM MINT grades.
I would say that DM23HOF probably has one of the nicer examples even if it is "just" a '4'.
I agree with the above on all counts. Aaron rookies have issues up the wazoo. And probably less than fifty #311 Mantle cards in the world that have centering like this PWCC card.
I think I know the card in question that you say DM23HOF owns. It was in the Slugger museum in Louisville. I saw it pictured on Net54, which I read regularly, and also saw it at the museum. Truth be told, I would take that 4.5 over the PWCC 8 and keep the change. DM's card in the museum had even better centering and color. Wish I saw that card at the auction where he bought it. I would have liked to throw my hat in that ring and given it a run.
I also missed the nice "3" that was on eBay a few months ago. Hope not to miss the next one. I check "auction report" now often.
Would take Matt's 4.5 all day and pocket the change. Has just as nice eye appeal and with the savings you could literally buy a house to store it in! Evans PSA was also a great one and it lasted less than 2 hours on Ebay. Very hard card to find centered.
With this economy if any of the (3) PSA 10's were up for sale they would crush the Wagner - $4-5 million without a doubt.
This is very suspicious bidding. Raising each other by a few hundred. I think on cards like this you should have to be approved to bid. Anyone can place a bid with no intention to honor it. In terms of who is buying a card like this it is anyone's guess. To purchase a card that is in this price range to hold for any length of time you have to have seriously deep pockets. Each card is different but having a single card that represents more then 1% of your net worth better be very special and have strong investment potential. I could see a few cards where perhaps a higher weighting is warranted but not many.
Bidder Click here to know more about anonymous user IDs Bid Amount Bid Time
-***o ( 1271Feedback score is 1000 to 4,999) US $425,700.00
Oct-31-15 09:09:32 PDT
h***o ( 7 ) US $425,600.00
Nov-01-15 15:32:21 PST
1***n ( 177Feedback score is 100 to 499) US $425,400.00
Oct-31-15 12:57:26 PDT
a***i ( 1145Feedback score is 1000 to 4,999) US $425,200.00
Oct-31-15 12:29:54 PDT
h***h ( 942Feedback score is 500 to 999) US $425,000.00
Oct-30-15 21:36:46 PDT
-***o ( 1271Feedback score is 1000 to 4,999) US $425,000.00
Oct-30-15 22:08:46 PDT
+1
The person with the high bid has 85 percent bidding with pwcc and 9 retractions-shady.
I see your bidder and raise you. Bidder that took it over $425k has 96% bids with this seller and 18 retractions. I have never had to retract a bid - why would someone have 18 of them???
The person with the high bid has 85 percent bidding with pwcc and 9 retractions-shady.
I see your bidder and raise you. Bidder that took it over $425k has 96% bids with this seller and 18 retractions. I have never had to retract a bid - why would someone have 18 of them???
Because they are bidding on items that have no intention of winning. It is fairly common to run up an item and become high bid and then retract so they are the under bidder and the other persons high bid is exposed.
I hate bid retractions and wish EBAY would address the issue but they have no interest it appears.
i'm sure i have a ton. i retract them because i "cant get in touch w/ the seller"
don't really care about eBay's 48 hour response time. it's my dime.
i'll make a solid offer and let it sit for 24 hours.
if I don't get a response by then in this day and age, i retract it.
doesn't show whether there are other offers in these days, so it's useless for the seller to have it just sit.
funny thing is 90% of the time i get a response w/i an hour of the retraction.
well then i stand corrected and have none!
Just verified for you Bid retractions (last 12 months): 0, near the top of the 'Feedback as a buyer' tab of your eBay profile.
The person with the high bid has 85 percent bidding with pwcc and 9 retractions-shady.
I see your bidder and raise you. Bidder that took it over $425k has 96% bids with this seller and 18 retractions. I have never had to retract a bid - why would someone have 18 of them???
Because they are bidding on items that have no intention of winning. It is fairly common to run up an item and become high bid and then retract so they are the under bidder and the other persons high bid is exposed.
I hate bid retractions and wish EBAY would address the issue but they have no interest it appears.
+1
youre just a regular ol columbo, huh kyle?
Speaking of, you should have him today it looks like.
You would think a bidder would perhaps try and disguise themselves better. It is a real shame that this card will not be sold in a legit auction.
30-Day Summary
Total bids: 415
Items bid on: 78
Bid activity (%) with this seller: 86% Help
Bid retractions: 1
Bid retractions (6 months): 9
Bidder Click here to know more about anonymous user IDs Bid Amount Bid Time
h***h ( 942Feedback score is 500 to 999) US $430,500.00
Nov-03-15 20:52:37 PST
s***y ( 672Feedback score is 500 to 999) US $430,400.00
Nov-03-15 07:42:39 PST
-***o ( 1271Feedback score is 1000 to 4,999) US $430,300.00
Nov-03-15 07:15:19 PST
_***a ( 8 ) US $430,200.00
Nov-02-15 17:36:05 PST
-***o ( 1271Feedback score is 1000 to 4,999) US $430,100.00
Oct-31-15 09:09:32 PDT
m***n ( 316Feedback score is 100 to 499) US $430,000.00
Nov-02-15 13:41:53 PST
+1
There is no doubt that EBAY is a qualified platform to get the reach needed to maximize a collectibles selling price. The only problem is anyone can bid on any item.
I am curious to see how Brent handles the final 48 hours and if some bids drop off leading up to that point or if he outright cancels them.
The only problem is anyone can bid on any item.
Because shilling never happens at AHs?
are you insinuating that there are some unscrupulous things occurring at these auction houses?
But I'm just not sure where this other "legitimate auction" exists.
I would argue this is the most legitimate auction of one of these. The bids on this one can at least be analyzed for abnormal patterns, allowing interested buyers to make their own determination on whether shilling is occurring and if it impacts their desire to purchase at a given price. Other places, not so much.
a-what!
are you insinuating that there are some unscrupulous things occurring at these auction houses?
I insinuate nothing
The only problem is anyone can bid on any item.
Because shilling never happens at AHs?
There are at least consequences for not honoring your bid. Other major auction houses require you to qualify to bid on extremely high priced items. On EBAY you could have $2 to your name and bid on any item with absolutely no ability to pay for it and all you get is a non payment strike. Shilling can take place anywhere and as was stated the larger bid increments make it a more risky strategy through an auction house. I think to bid on an auction of this nature through EBAY a pre qualification process like existed for the Super Man Action Comics or the Honus Wagner should take place and in both cases the items were paid for and exchanged hands.
From Mile High's website:
7. Payment - Invoices will be sent to all winning bidders within 3 business days after the auction by e-mail hard copy invoices will only be sent to winning bidders who do not have an email on file with MHCC or to those customers who rerquest them and will contain all of your auction totals, including the items you won, shipping and insurance costs and tax if applicable. A copy of the payment instructions will also be enclosed with your invoice. Any bidder who has not paid in full without having made prior arrangements for late payment will have future bidding privileges revoked. Invoices are payable upon receipt with payment due no later than two weeks from date of invoice. Payments may be made by cash, check, wire transfer (invoices above $10,000 ONLY with a $20.00 charge for wire transfers), or money order. Items paid by cash, wire transfer or money order will be shipped immediately. Unless known to Mile High Card Co., personal checks will be held for 7-10(No Exceptions) days before merchandise is approved for shipment which can take up to 5-7 days after funds are collected. Any returned checks will incur a $30.00 fee. NO CREDIT CARDS will be accepted for this sale. In the event of a Late/Non Payment, the bidder agrees to pay all of the auctioneer's reasonable attorney's fees and costs involved in collection of funds, plus 1.5% interest per month on any unpaid balance, starting from the original due date until the date that all funds have been collected. The jurisdiction for any litigation shall be in the State of Colorado, or the Federal District Court of Colorado at the discretion of the auctioneer. Each of the terms in the auction rules are distinct and separate. If a winning bidder does not honor his or her bid with payment in full per the auction rules, then it is agreed that MHCC at its sole discretion can sell the given item(s) to the under bidder or re offer the items in a future auction, and that the original winning bidder is responsible for any losses incurred or service charges involved in the sale of the said item(s) and that the non paying winning bidder explicitly agrees to pay any and all costs of collection, including, but not limited to, reasonable attorney's fees incurred by MHCC in the collection of these losses and/or service charges from the non paying winning bidder.
There are at least consequences for not honoring your bid.
I think eBay's terms are pretty similar, they just never enforce them realizing how easy it is to create another identity. I don't know if the AHs ever enforce these terms either, but haven't personally heard of anyone brought to court over it.
I doubt anyone who works for eBay is bumping things up to a bidders max a la Mastro (or the active allegations and admitted bidding records destruction of another major AH). baseball's experience outside of eBay is far too frequent. Thankfully, sniping allows your max to remain hidden until the last few seconds on eBay. Non-paying bidders is eBay's biggest problem, but still the lesser of evils and far more transparent.
This auction does require approval by PWCC for bids in the last 48 hours and scrutiny of all those placed before the 6th. Getting pre-qualified for an AH is a joke; I've never been declined
Do they pull credit reports or require you to provide bank/asset statements? How do they know any more than eBay does about your ability to pay?
How do luxury auctions guarantee a successful sale?
All potential buyers are screened and must pre-qualify in order to even participate in a luxury auction. Sacchi says that parties must prove they will be able to purchase the property if they are the winning bidder, and are required to put down a deposit of $100,000 or more in order to compete. She adds that the amount of work that goes into attracting, screening and consulting with potential buyers ensures that by the time the auction takes place, the auction company is confident that the property will be sold for a price acceptable to the seller
I know there was a very extensive screening process on the two auctions I referenced. You may recall the number of bids were very low in both cases. I am not certain if an escrow deposit was needed or a signed affidavit and submission of proof of funds.
Either way it is clear there are people bidding on this card with no intent to win.
Read this article.
Barrett-Jackson
On the Super Man Action Comics and The Honus Wagner that went for close to 1.3 million I do know that EBAY advertised those auctions for a few weeks in advance and an intense qualification process was required to place an initial bid.
I personally think that would have been the best route to go on a item that was going to garner this much interest.
Edit: to set up Stewie's follow up a little better
I can't overemphasize the importance and agreeing with your point.
Why make Puerto Rico a steak? If you do, they'll just want a baked potato, with sour cream and chives, and those little bacon bits.