Some of my thoughts on building a set of 19th century coins
BillJones
Posts: 34,632 ✭✭✭✭✭
I recently completed the first date and mint set that I have done in a long time, the Type I Gold Dollars. I had had some interest in this set for a number of years. When I started I had one coin, 1853 in PCGS MS-64, which is better than some of the pieces I've seen in MS-65 holders. This is BY FAR the most common date in the set.
Before I decided to try to put the set together, I bought an 1849-D in PCGS MS-62. The reason I bought that one was for a Dahlonega Mint type set. The 1849-D is the most common Dahlonega Mint gold dollar, and it is the easiest one to find in Mint State. After that I decided to assemble the full set excluding the 1849-C, Open Wreath reverse of which there are now five known.
I bought the coins as they became available to me. I made no effort to buy the rarities first. Along the way I got lucky with a few tough pieces like an 1850-C in PCGS AU-58 that was an outstanding strike for that issue. I also ran into an 1853-C in NGC AU-55 that was interesting because it had an undocumented retained cud on the reverse. I know some you think that I should have been going for a set that was virtually all Mint State that would be truly outstanding, but that was not my goal. I wanted a pleasant set that would please me, and represent the history of this odd little series which was actually quite popular in the wheels of commerce before the Civil War.
Like most collectors I got itchy fingers to finish which tempted to fill some of the tougher spots with coins I found on the bourse floor. The trouble is there are more than few over graded and problem pieces for sale, and there are some dealers who place very high prices on the better dates. By high prices I mean numbers that were well ahead of recent auction results and the PCGS price guide on "Coin Facts." I just couldn't bring myself to buy "burials" like that.
Ultimately I did finish the set with few pieces that some people might think were subpar. They were EF-45 graded coins for some really tough date and mint mark combinations, like the 1849-C Close Wreath and the 1854-D. These pieces were not my "dream coins" for the set, but given the price difference ($10,000 +) between them and some "almost dream coins" (Coins that were still not great by higher grade), these pieces suited me.
I had a lot of fun forming the set and very much enjoy looking at it on a regular basis. I have displayed pieces of it in exhibits at the Summer and Winter FUN shows.
Now here's a bit of a surprise. What coin gave me the most trouble? It was the 1852-P. Why? This is supposed to be second most common date in the set, below the 1853-P. Part of my trouble was that I thought about buying an MS-65 to fill the hole and upgrade my type set. I bid on a couple of pieces, but didn't win them even when I made strong bids on coins in NGC MS-65 holders, which met my standards. I passed on a MS-66 that was close $8,000 in price and an MS-67 that was $15,000. I just could not spend that kind of money on a common date. Finally I bought an NGC MS-64 that met my standards. That was the last coin I needed to complete the collection.
In conclusion, I don't subscribe to the "buy the key coins first" philosophy. I believe that you should be the coins that meet your standards when they become available, at least for 19th century coins, which are not nearly as common as many of the modern issues. Second while quality is nice, unless you are obsessed with having the #1 registry set or assembling the finest set every known, no problem "collector grade" coins can bring one a lot of satisfaction.
Those are just some of my thoughts. Here is a link to the set if anyone is interested.
Type I Gold Dollar Set
Before I decided to try to put the set together, I bought an 1849-D in PCGS MS-62. The reason I bought that one was for a Dahlonega Mint type set. The 1849-D is the most common Dahlonega Mint gold dollar, and it is the easiest one to find in Mint State. After that I decided to assemble the full set excluding the 1849-C, Open Wreath reverse of which there are now five known.
I bought the coins as they became available to me. I made no effort to buy the rarities first. Along the way I got lucky with a few tough pieces like an 1850-C in PCGS AU-58 that was an outstanding strike for that issue. I also ran into an 1853-C in NGC AU-55 that was interesting because it had an undocumented retained cud on the reverse. I know some you think that I should have been going for a set that was virtually all Mint State that would be truly outstanding, but that was not my goal. I wanted a pleasant set that would please me, and represent the history of this odd little series which was actually quite popular in the wheels of commerce before the Civil War.
Like most collectors I got itchy fingers to finish which tempted to fill some of the tougher spots with coins I found on the bourse floor. The trouble is there are more than few over graded and problem pieces for sale, and there are some dealers who place very high prices on the better dates. By high prices I mean numbers that were well ahead of recent auction results and the PCGS price guide on "Coin Facts." I just couldn't bring myself to buy "burials" like that.
Ultimately I did finish the set with few pieces that some people might think were subpar. They were EF-45 graded coins for some really tough date and mint mark combinations, like the 1849-C Close Wreath and the 1854-D. These pieces were not my "dream coins" for the set, but given the price difference ($10,000 +) between them and some "almost dream coins" (Coins that were still not great by higher grade), these pieces suited me.
I had a lot of fun forming the set and very much enjoy looking at it on a regular basis. I have displayed pieces of it in exhibits at the Summer and Winter FUN shows.
Now here's a bit of a surprise. What coin gave me the most trouble? It was the 1852-P. Why? This is supposed to be second most common date in the set, below the 1853-P. Part of my trouble was that I thought about buying an MS-65 to fill the hole and upgrade my type set. I bid on a couple of pieces, but didn't win them even when I made strong bids on coins in NGC MS-65 holders, which met my standards. I passed on a MS-66 that was close $8,000 in price and an MS-67 that was $15,000. I just could not spend that kind of money on a common date. Finally I bought an NGC MS-64 that met my standards. That was the last coin I needed to complete the collection.
In conclusion, I don't subscribe to the "buy the key coins first" philosophy. I believe that you should be the coins that meet your standards when they become available, at least for 19th century coins, which are not nearly as common as many of the modern issues. Second while quality is nice, unless you are obsessed with having the #1 registry set or assembling the finest set every known, no problem "collector grade" coins can bring one a lot of satisfaction.
Those are just some of my thoughts. Here is a link to the set if anyone is interested.
Type I Gold Dollar Set
Retired dealer and avid collector of U.S. type coins, 19th century presidential campaign medalets and selected medals. In recent years I have been working on a set of British coins - at least one coin from each king or queen who issued pieces that are collectible. I am also collecting at least one coin for each Roman emperor from Julius Caesar to ... ?
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Congrats on building a set w/o the #1 "key" date. It doesn't make one bit of difference really. I always wanted coins near the finest known and couldn't possibly afford a complete gem set in anything seated. So I did the next best thing and went after gems of the most underrated issues....ending up with a few dozen of those over the years. And for those building a type set, there's no requirement to how many series and denominations you extend to. That can make the set affordable to you.
Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
edit: changed "me" to "more"
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<< <i>Those are some good looking gold dollars! I am a Type Collector, and looking at the same design is boring (to me), perhaps like you have here, a "Branch Mint Type Set" (C, D, O, P and S) would probably be the most extensive on any series for me. Besides, it appears that your pockets are filled quite a bit me than mine, that would just mean acquiring the best example of each Type.
The thing about the Charlotte, Dahlonega and to a lesser extent New Orleans coins is that they are different animals from the Phildelphia coins. There are distinctive differences between them that make every piece different. It's not like a set of Roosevelt Dimes where the mint mark is pretty much only difference from one coin to another.
I understand your point about type coins, however. I thought the same way, but once I completed my type sets, I needed to look at other collecting avenues.
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Another group of very nice examples to go along with
your other type sets. I always enjoy seeing your pieces.
A lot of work went into it.
R.I.P. Bear
Definitely one of the more interesting sets to complete...
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Bill makes it out to be. Congratulations on this hard to accomplish
achievement. Truly some nice eye candy!! The branch mint coins
are truly rare this nice.
bob
<< <i>I've seen many 19th century type without one CC. Shame not to include one from each mint along the way.
bob
Unfortunately the Carson City Mint never made any gold dollars. By the time the Carson City Mint opened in 1870, the gold dollar was on its way out, and the last branch mint coin was the 1870-S.
Besides, those guys out west didn't care about a sissy coin, like a gold dollar. They were into silver "cartwheels."
Mike
The only "widget" is the 1853-P. You can find that one in MS-63, 64, and 65 without much trouble at the major shows. The rest are a bit tougher. I thought I'd got the Winter FUN show get all of the Philadelphia Mint coins in MS-64, except perhaps the 1850-P. Was I wrong! Beyond the 1853-P, which I didn't need, the rest were few and far between.
I'm not saying that these coins are scarce ... far from it. I think that a lot of them are sitting in collections and are simply not available.
Here's one that is a bit of a "sleeper," the 1849-P with the "Close Wreath." If you look at the price catalogs, you will think that it is just as common as the "Open Wreath" varieties (There are more than one.) It's not, and the coin tends have satin luster as opposed to bright luster.
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