1909s VDB, beginning to rise in price?

joeykoins · July 23, 2015 3:05AM

Hi guy's, I just noticed in our host Price Guide that our beloved 1909 has shown a tiny surge in price. In the 4 grade, as well as, in the 66 grade at least. I know this is just a price guide as so many others but still, any change is a good thought. Do you guy's think the beginner of all Lincolns will ever rise in price again? At least to where it was 5 or 6 years ago? I certainly hope so. When I bought mine, in a PCGS 12 fine grade, it was priced at $1000! Now the PCGS Price shows a mere $775. This coin is so, so under rated. Esp. for it's mintage (484,000) and History. 484,000! Think of that number for a second. Like I said, It is also the cavalier of all Lincoln Cents. Oh well, fingers crossed anyway.

segoja · July 23, 2015 3:31AM

The problem with this coin is supply. Virtually every dealer has one or more in their case.

They are always available in almost any grade anytime.

BillJones · July 23, 2015 3:35AM

When I was dealer, there another dealer at the Clear Water, Florida coin show who had a cerified hoard over 100 of them. They were all NGC certified, and they all had a similar look. He had obviously found a hoard.

joeykoins · July 23, 2015 3:36AM

So in realty, In this case, Popular and high in demand is a curse to this particular coin. Instead of the opposite. Usually, this elevates the coin price.

coinbuf · July 23, 2015 3:43AM

<< So in realty, In this case, Popular and high in demand is a curse to this particular coin. Instead of the opposite. Usually, this elevates the coin price. >>

Not quite, it's the high level of supply that has suppressed the prices over the last few years, this could also signal a lull in demand.

BillJones · July 23, 2015 4:08AM

<< 

<< So in realty, In this case, Popular and high in demand is a curse to this particular coin. Instead of the opposite. Usually, this elevates the coin price. >>

Not quite, it's the high level of supply that has suppressed the prices over the last few years, this could also signal a lull in demand. >>

When the perceptions are that something is "too common," and lot of potential buyers in the coin market refuse to buy it. It's part of this "key dates only" mentality which I find disappointing and disturbing.

JCMhouston · July 23, 2015 4:52AM

Perhaps in 2108-9 there will be another well timed promotion to drive the price up, as happened in 2008-9. These aren't rare, not even scarce, NGC has over 8,000 certified examples in grades from G-MS66, probably averaging around VF. So anyone that wants one can find multiple examples whenever they want, and I assume PCGS has as many examples graded.

Even if you limit it to MS examples there are over 100 graded in 66 alone at NGC, and a couple of thousand in all MS grades with likely an equal or greater number at PCGS.

Overdate · July 23, 2015 5:07AM

<< This coin is so, so under rated. Esp. for it's mintage (484,000) and History. 484,000! Think of that number for a second.( >>

Too many lower mintage moderns are competing for the collector's dollar. For example, the 2015-W proof Roosevelt dime has a mintage of 75,000 and sells for under $40. Even allowing for the dime's 100% survival rate, which coin do you think will appreciate faster over the next 5 to 10 years, the 2015-W dime or the 1909-S VDB cent? My money is on the dime.

BillJones · July 23, 2015 5:20AM

<< 

<< This coin is so, so under rated. Esp. for it's mintage (484,000) and History. 484,000! Think of that number for a second.( >>

Too many lower mintage moderns are competing for the collector's dollar. For example, the 2015-W proof Roosevelt dime has a mintage of 75,000 and sells for under $40. Even allowing for the dime's 100% survival rate, which coin do you think will appreciate faster over the next 5 to 10 years, the 2015-W dime or the 1909-S VDB cent? My money is on the dime. >>

My bet is the price the price of the dime will remain steady or go down.

MidLifeCrisis · July 23, 2015 5:22AM

<< 

<< This coin is so, so under rated. Esp. for it's mintage (484,000) and History. 484,000! Think of that number for a second.( >>

Too many lower mintage moderns are competing for the collector's dollar. For example, the 2015-W proof Roosevelt dime has a mintage of 75,000 and sells for under $40. Even allowing for the dime's 100% survival rate, which coin do you think will appreciate faster over the next 5 to 10 years, the 2015-W dime or the 1909-S VDB cent? My money is on the dime. >>

I would be very disappointed if the value of the 2015-W increased more than the 09-S VDB in the next five to ten years. What a sad commentary on the state of our hobby that would be.

It's not just about mintage. Historical significance should count a lot more.

Boosibri · July 23, 2015 5:34AM

<< This coin is so, so under rated. Esp. for it's mintage (484,000) and History. 484,000! Think of that number for a second. >>

It seems like a lot compared to an average half eagle

mr1931S · July 23, 2015 5:55AM

Do a search on ebay "1909 S V.D.B." You get 546 results.How can anyone consider this coin rare or even scarce as a date for collectors?

1909 S V.D.B. is necessary to include in a date-mint set of Lincolns.Problem is,as each year goes by,fewer and fewer collectors are collecting by date-mint.At 484,000 original mintage the supply is more than ample.Demand is waning.

Cool to have one if assembling a date-mint set of Lincolns.Otherwise,there are better ways to spend $1000 or more on coins rather than on a 1909 S V.D.B.

BillJones · July 23, 2015 6:35AM

<< 

<< This coin is so, so under rated. Esp. for it's mintage (484,000) and History. 484,000! Think of that number for a second. >>

It seems like a lot compared to an average half eagle >>

The Charlotte Mint issed 1.2 million coins and the Dahlonega Mint issued 1.4 million coins over a 24 year period. Collectors didn't pay attention to mint marks at all until the 1890s so most of those low mintages were used up and melted.

Those who thought that the 1973-S Proof Silver Ike dollar with a mintage of just over 1,000,000 coins and a high survival rate might have considered that before they shelled out over $200 apiece for them in the late 1970s.

Walkerguy21D · July 23, 2015 6:37AM

As others have said, waning demand vs- plentiful supply, doesn't bode well for price increases...except perhaps high grade red certified examples.

originalisbest · July 23, 2015 8:52AM

I agree. Nobody wants 1909-S VDBs. Why, may as well spend 'em.

Overdate · July 23, 2015 10:07AM

<< I would be very disappointed if the value of the 2015-W increased more than the 09-S VDB in the next five to ten years. What a sad commentary on the state of our hobby that would be.

It's not just about mintage. Historical significance should count a lot more. >>

Historical significance counts, just not always at the cash register. Most collectors of wheat cents aren't overly concerned with historical significance, they just want to fill all the holes in their coin board or its modern-day virtual equivalent. This was true even back in the 1960s when I began collecting. And colonials have always been "underpriced" as far as historical significance is concerned.

Additionally, I don't think the 1909-S VDB is any more historically significant than its Philadelphia counterpart, which is readily available at about 2% of the price of the San Francisco version.

MidLifeCrisis · July 23, 2015 10:24AM

Maybe I should have said nostalgia should count for a lot more.

cohodk · July 23, 2015 10:53AM

I wish high grade 1909-S no VDB would rise. Its a much more rare coin.

GrumpyEd · July 23, 2015 12:14PM

<< I wish high grade 1909-S no VDB would rise. Its a much more rare coin. >>

On a similar note...
I see a lot of high grade 1909 plain VDBs in dealers cases but not many high grade 1909 plain no VDBs.
I wonder if the pops match what I see?

SoCalBigMark · July 23, 2015 12:37PM

<< I wish high grade 1909-S no VDB would rise. Its a much more rare coin. >>

Yup.

Overdate · July 23, 2015 12:37PM

<< I see a lot of high grade 1909 plain VDBs in dealers cases but not many high grade 1909 plain no VDBs.
I wonder if the pops match what I see? >>

Yes, VDB's outnumber plains by about 6 to 1.

ClosedLoop · July 23, 2015 12:41PM

I think survival rate would play a part in this.

SoCalBigMark · July 23, 2015 12:43PM

1909 VDB S is the series that will punish you if you fail to check what the next grade up is worth.

joebb21 · July 23, 2015 1:06PM

over the last 3 years there have been over 500 coins that were in rolls that came into the market. ms66 RD, MS65 RD ms64 RD pops shot through the roof.

Since then, prices have been falling tremendously. Better off with a 1916-d 10c in higher grade for the same money as those are definitely tougher to find.

GrumpyEd · July 23, 2015 2:54PM

<< Yes, VDB's outnumber plains by about 6 to 1. >>

Thanks Overdate!
Interesting that the VDBs cost more, I guess they make a nice type coin or the VDB mystique does it.

Overdate · July 23, 2015 5:48PM

<< Interesting that the VDBs cost more, I guess they make a nice type coin or the VDB mystique does it. >>

Plus they are the key to a complete Mars set!

BillJones · July 23, 2015 10:57PM

One year type coins bring a premium relative to their rarity. Some of the really common ones, like the 1909-VDB Lincoln and the 1883 No Cents Nickel were hoarded in quantity in high grade. Interestingly both of those coins bring strong premiums in Proof, especially the 1909-VDB.

lkeigwin · July 23, 2015 10:59PM

<< 

<< Yes, VDB's outnumber plains by about 6 to 1. >>

Thanks Overdate!
Interesting that the VDBs cost more, I guess they make a nice type coin or the VDB mystique does it. >>

Actually the two are priced about the same. In the highest grades the VDB is worth less than the non-VDB.
Lance.

1909s VDB, beginning to rise in price?

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