Silverbaron here ....
SilverBaron
Posts: 767 ✭
OK ........ First I need to apologize to Mr. Willis.
I stated to him that I would be silent for awhile ... and after this post I will. Mr. Willis, for breaking my word, I apologize.
Second ... I owe the forum an apology. YES ... I LIED ...
I am the owner of Silver Bay Coin & Bullion in Melbourne, FL. . I was TRYING to keep this under wraps for 2 reasons. First and foremost .. SECURITY !! As you all know, shop owners are at very high risk of both
their inventory as well as their personal safety. How many time have we read about coin shop , auto, show and home robberies? I felt that the form could be enjoyed without raising my risk factor.
So, dolomite... " The Truth Shall Set You Free " will now have me looking over my shoulder even more. Thank You. Mission Accomplished.
[ And yes, I know who you are as well ... do not ever call or come back again.]
2nd reason ....... I have noticed that when dealers post on these boards, there is ALWAYS someone yelling SPAM !! SPAM !! ....... Notice that I NEVER offered to sell, or put a price on ANYTHING I pixed?
Next subject ........ I posted item(s) that were not mine or were for resale. WRONGGGGG!
I only posted the items I was stacking for myself. Now, can I PROVE that any given monster box or bar was put back as opposed to being for sale? Of course not. A box is a box is a bar is a bar.
Next Subject ........ THE MAIN EVENT !! The 2 oz. Silver Engelhard bar.
As I stated ... It, along with 99% of my holdings are NOT even in the state. The shop is to small, and in the event of robbery ... I would not want to be wiped out of PM's.
I will tell everybody again .... I will not be able to even look for it for at least 6 months. BUTTTT...... since the concern is that the discovery of a 4th bar would increase the know
number by 25% ....... and there by lower the value of the first 3 .... SINCE I AM A LIER .... DO NOT COUNT MY CLAIM of owning one as valid, lest the value on the other 3 be affected.
And to that end....I see that the bar on the bay is at $4900. with time to go. SO ....... I will put a floor on any massive value drop by offering $4000. for the first/next 5 bars offered to me.
Bring'm in person or wrap'm and ship ...no matter.
And just as an aside ..... 2 months ago, there was only 1 known 50 oz. stick bar. Now there are 3.
A 300% INCREASE in the supply! WOW! What was the first bar worth? I don't know ... But as dolomite can verify, I paid $2500 for #--- 767.
If one or both of the owners of the other 2 wish to sell, I will pay $2500 for each of them. Wouldn't want a market crash on 50 oz. stick bars.
Last Subject .......... I Thank everyone that DID NOT jump on the " think the worst " band wagon.... ESPECIALY derryb and jmski52.
Sirs ...... Please watch your respective PMs. How about a long weekend trip for you and yours to a PCGS show at the Venetian .... My treat? I will be in touch.
Done.
[ Flame Away ]
I stated to him that I would be silent for awhile ... and after this post I will. Mr. Willis, for breaking my word, I apologize.
Second ... I owe the forum an apology. YES ... I LIED ...
I am the owner of Silver Bay Coin & Bullion in Melbourne, FL. . I was TRYING to keep this under wraps for 2 reasons. First and foremost .. SECURITY !! As you all know, shop owners are at very high risk of both
their inventory as well as their personal safety. How many time have we read about coin shop , auto, show and home robberies? I felt that the form could be enjoyed without raising my risk factor.
So, dolomite... " The Truth Shall Set You Free " will now have me looking over my shoulder even more. Thank You. Mission Accomplished.
[ And yes, I know who you are as well ... do not ever call or come back again.]
2nd reason ....... I have noticed that when dealers post on these boards, there is ALWAYS someone yelling SPAM !! SPAM !! ....... Notice that I NEVER offered to sell, or put a price on ANYTHING I pixed?
Next subject ........ I posted item(s) that were not mine or were for resale. WRONGGGGG!
I only posted the items I was stacking for myself. Now, can I PROVE that any given monster box or bar was put back as opposed to being for sale? Of course not. A box is a box is a bar is a bar.
Next Subject ........ THE MAIN EVENT !! The 2 oz. Silver Engelhard bar.
As I stated ... It, along with 99% of my holdings are NOT even in the state. The shop is to small, and in the event of robbery ... I would not want to be wiped out of PM's.
I will tell everybody again .... I will not be able to even look for it for at least 6 months. BUTTTT...... since the concern is that the discovery of a 4th bar would increase the know
number by 25% ....... and there by lower the value of the first 3 .... SINCE I AM A LIER .... DO NOT COUNT MY CLAIM of owning one as valid, lest the value on the other 3 be affected.
And to that end....I see that the bar on the bay is at $4900. with time to go. SO ....... I will put a floor on any massive value drop by offering $4000. for the first/next 5 bars offered to me.
Bring'm in person or wrap'm and ship ...no matter.
And just as an aside ..... 2 months ago, there was only 1 known 50 oz. stick bar. Now there are 3.
A 300% INCREASE in the supply! WOW! What was the first bar worth? I don't know ... But as dolomite can verify, I paid $2500 for #--- 767.
If one or both of the owners of the other 2 wish to sell, I will pay $2500 for each of them. Wouldn't want a market crash on 50 oz. stick bars.
Last Subject .......... I Thank everyone that DID NOT jump on the " think the worst " band wagon.... ESPECIALY derryb and jmski52.
Sirs ...... Please watch your respective PMs. How about a long weekend trip for you and yours to a PCGS show at the Venetian .... My treat? I will be in touch.
Done.
[ Flame Away ]
Silver Baron
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Silver is the mortar that binds the bricks of loyalty.
********************
Silver is the mortar that binds the bricks of loyalty.
0
Comments
<< <i> How about a long weekend trip for you and yours to a PCGS show at the Venetian .... My treat?
>>
I'm in.
Crazy.
How's the weather in Florida? It's the furthest state from me and I imagine the weather is nothing like what I love here in the PNW
As for the security part, it looks like you've already changed your photobucket account but make sure that if you are trying to disconnect yourself from SilverBayCoin in online forums not to use that old account. I first noticed that back in the $1,000,000 silver thread because you posted some amazing photos there that I wanted to share on another forum. When I copied the img URL I saw SilverBayCoin in the title so ever since then I've thought there was a good chance you owned or worked at that shop. Definitely gotta cover all your tracks to remain even somewhat anonymous on the net these days. Sorry if in that original post I did anything to jeopardize your feeling of security.
Don't feel like you need to prove anything to anyone on this forum unless they make it worth your time. Given the pics of your personal stash, I'd say your time is worth a lot. The majority of posters here just like that you contribute what you do. So please stay, and continue!
MY GOLD TYPE SET https://pcgs.com/setregistry/type-sets/complete-type-sets/gold-type-set-12-piece-circulation-strikes-1839-1933/publishedset/321940
Looking forward to putting this behind us
<< <i>And just as an aside ..... 2 months ago, there was only 1 known 50 oz. stick bar. Now there are 3.
A 300% INCREASE in the supply! WOW! What was the first bar worth? I don't know ... But as dolomite can verify, I paid $2500 for #--- 767. >>
I acquired the first known example in 2012 for $3500 though it is awfully well preserved. 2nd and 3rd examples 000767 and 000768 were sold via eBay about two years ago by same seller for around $2k. That is where the seller of the bar you now own acquired the piece. I had the two new serial numbers within the registry though had not been prompted to update the 50oz Definitive Page until your post.
Will be interesting to see if this current 2oz auction beings any more examples forth and how that may affect value of known examples.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/gold/liberty-head-2-1-gold-major-sets/liberty-head-2-1-gold-basic-set-circulation-strikes-1840-1907-cac/alltimeset/268163
<< <i>Will be interesting to see if this current 2oz auction beings any more examples forth and how that may affect value of known examples. >>
You out a man's identity and place of business on the internet and attempt to impugn his character.
Now you just want to talk metals?
I think your mommy's calling.
Thanks.
i just wanted to add that your posts of pics is one of the reasons i entered this particular forum/world. And now I'm buying PMS. Which help you all in a little ways. Don't stop posting. Those pics are amazing and much appreciated.
..and actually, are his last two major posts still here? links to threads of the silver and gold caches? ha
Now you just want to talk metals?
Really? The man lied and admitted to doing so. Give credit for that if you feel it's deserved. The bottom line is we now know the population remains at 3. On something that there only 3 of in the whole friggin world, don't half-hazardly go around saying you have one unless you truly do and know there are people who are going to call you out if you say you do.
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"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
At this moment, YES...3 known. It's like anything else that has miniscule mintage, people become sensitive when another one surfaces, or should I say claim is made to there being another. What don't you get about that? Think of it in Numismatic terms, Fine Art, etc.
<< <i>Only three in the whole world? Now I gotta have one
At this moment, YES...3 known. It's like anything else that has miniscule mintage, people become sensitive when another one surfaces, or should I say claim is made to there being another. What don't you get about that? Think of it in Numismatic terms, Fine Art, etc. >>
Just because you, I and the Engelhard website are aware of only three does not mean there are only three. But I still gotta have one just in case.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
<< <i>
<< <i>Only three in the whole world? Now I gotta have one
At this moment, YES...3 known. It's like anything else that has miniscule mintage, people become sensitive when another one surfaces, or should I say claim is made to there being another. What don't you get about that? Think of it in Numismatic terms, Fine Art, etc. >>
Just because you, I and the Engelhard website are aware of only three does not mean there are only three. But I still gotta have one just in case. >>
If you insist...here is your chance.
3 hrs left..
yet you feel it necessarry to open your mouth and reply. You will now try to make this about me because that's the kind of troll you are. Note is surely being taken by many.
You see, I am glad at the outcome of it all. A rare bars pop. is now verified, an amount for said bar is about to be established, the person who falsely laid claim to owning an example has admitted they do not and obviously still has fans (pun intended) and can now attempt to restore his name. As I have said before here and someone replied by quoting poetry about it, our name is everything. SB obviously isn't hurting and will be ok. By admitting lying about it actually earns him some cred back in my book. I'm sure it was very humbling and to publicly admit it takes some nads.
And finally a mesage has been sent that if you make serious false claims or accusations, be prepared to be called out. Some may think it's drama or maybe even trivial, know now collectors of rare bars take it very seriously.
We all will have deep rooted feelings about this going forward but I'm done with it, time to move on. Best wishes to all.
<< <i>
<< <i>Only three in the whole world? Now I gotta have one
At this moment, YES...3 known. It's like anything else that has miniscule mintage, people become sensitive when another one surfaces, or should I say claim is made to there being another. What don't you get about that? Think of it in Numismatic terms, Fine Art, etc. >>
Just because you, I and the Engelhard website are aware of only three does not mean there are only three. But I still gotta have one just in case. >>
But they are EXPERTS...they have a website and everything! SB is just a long time business owner with years of experience buying and selling PMs.
How could you not believe Cpt Wordpress and his trusty sidekick Engeltroll
Loves me some shiny!
<< <i>this guy doesn't know when to stop fanning the flames
yet you feel it necessarry to open your mouth and reply. You will now try to make this about me because that's the kind of troll you are. Note is surely being taken by many.
You see, I am glad at the outcome of it all. A rare bars pop. is now verified, an amount for said bar is about to be established, the person who falsely laid claim to owning an example has admitted they do not and obviously still has fans (pun intended) and can now attempt to restore his name. As I have said before here and someone replied by quoting poetry about it, our name is everything. SB obviously isn't hurting and will be ok. By admitting lying about it actually earns him some cred back in my book. I'm sure it was very humbling and to publicly admit it takes some nads.
And finally a mesage has been sent that if you make serious false claims or accusations, be prepared to be called out. Some may think it's drama or maybe even trivial, know now collectors of rare bars take it very seriously.
We all will have deep rooted feelings about this going forward but I'm done with it, time to move on. Best wishes to all. >>
not afraid of you, or getting banned. no one cares. Most here tolerate you but MOST know what you are. So buzz off clown
<< <i>Just because you, I and the Engelhard website are aware of only three does not mean there are only three. But I still gotta have one just in case. >>
<< <i>If you insist...here is your chance.
3 hrs left.. >>
Seems strange that one of the three "known" bars is up for public auction at the same time a sandstorm about its rarity hits the forum?
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
SB- I do own the other bar S/N 000768 and paid $2500 for it. So you're not doing too bad with your bar after all
<< <i>
<< <i>Just because you, I and the Engelhard website are aware of only three does not mean there are only three. But I still gotta have one just in case. >>
<< <i>If you insist...here is your chance.
3 hrs left.. >>
Seems strange that one of the three "known" bars is up for public auction at the same time a sandstorm about its rarity hits the forum? >>
derryb, the discussion about the 2 oz silver now for sale started with my February 22nd thread noting that one was for sale. What follows is my first sentence of that thread:
<< <i>These don't show up often. 3 known and this one is for sale. At $3,000 now but reserve not met. Let's see if this one sells. >>
"
The present "sandstorm" came much later. Its not my item and I am not bidding on it. Since I own another example I found the first auction (with reserve) interesting and thought other PM and or bar fans might as well.
My interest remains the same: spectator interest and hoping to see a value established. I have no idea how many were produced, why they were produced and how many still exist. Let's hope more surface.
FWIW, I believe Silverbaron's offer of $4,000 is a realistic valuation, especially if some additional ones appear.
https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/gold/liberty-head-2-1-gold-major-sets/liberty-head-2-1-gold-basic-set-circulation-strikes-1840-1907-cac/alltimeset/268163
<< <i>A rare bars pop. is now verified, an amount for said bar is about to be established, the person who falsely laid claim to owning an example has admitted they do not >>
The population has been verified by who, you and dolomite? Dolomite openly admitted that there could be more 2 oz bars out there. How accurate was your "forum consensus" on the $3000 value for the bar currently for sale?
Where did SB admit that he does not have one? If you sharpen your reading comprehension skills, he said that he cannot verify one way or another at this point and likely not for another 6 months. I know you must think that because he doesn't hop on a plane to go dig this bar out of storage to prove to a couple of people on the CU forum whether he has it must mean he doesn't, because you have repeatedly demonstrated that is how your brain works.
Just a couple of days ago you were talking about how you "never doubted" SB and now you call him a liar. Also in the thread you and rt1 kick up a crap storm because I suggest he MIGHT be associated with a coin shop. You already have egg on your face over that one so maybe you should hold back on calling SB a liar until he cares to offer this forum a definitive answer in ~6 months IF he chooses to do so.
Ever hear of a thing called sarcasm? You're taking one line out of the whole context of an entire thread and drawing a conclusion, you GOOF!
I know your post is a crude attempt to draw me in for further discussion, but I've said my part and have an informed opinion. Done with it, now move onto the next troll you GOOF!
And so much for your suggestion to stay out of each others way that you said in a pm. Please note how I was attacked first by a hypocrite.
I'm glad SB came and set the record straight as so many posts have been edited and a couple threads deleted.
I'm confused about the security issue Silver Baron implies as Silver Bay has a website with directions to the store. They sell silver and gold. I'm not sure how Dolomite increased that concern by taking Silver Baron to task. Again he sells silver and gold out of a shop. There are already inherited maximum security risks.
These 2 oz bars are rare. There are at least 3 known bars that is a fact. Silver Baron may indeed own another one. Even with the deception he has shown, I believe him. Don't forget another member also said he owned a few of these bars which he said he bought at spot in the 2 oz thread that is still running. I do not believe he owns these. Perhaps he is simply mistaken or confused. If he posts these I'll be the first to apologize. If you are indeed an owner of one of these rarities it is natural to be protective of the populations in this niche market. I don't fault Dolomite in the least for protecting his turf. He method was aggressive and Silver Baron is a legend so I knew this would not go over well. Maybe Dolomite could have handled this better but in the end the truth came out. It is what it is now. What's done is done.
For the record I'm raising my bid on the 2 ounce bar in question to $4000 as well.
For the record I would do business with Silver Baron or Dolomite in a heart beat.no questions asked.
Thanks again Silver Baron for stepping up to the plate to clear the air. That's what a man does.
Mark
Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
A man protects his turf and a man admits when he's wrong. Both have been done, it's time to move on.
<< <i>That's what a man does
A man protects his turf and a man admits when he's wrong. Both have been done, it's time to move on. >>
I literally just said that
Mark
Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
Now anyone contemplating paying serious money for any of these should take a step back and re-evaluate their priorities, and as for the emotionalism displayed, get back on the meds and double your dosage.
<< <i>Somewhere out there, in a safety deposit box that's been in a family for decades, in the back of some old miser's safe (Rollo?), in the buried stash of some suvivalist, or in the bottom of a filing cabinet of some stacker who is not aware of the 'rarity' of these metal globs, there's a load of these bars just awaiting their respective time for seeing the light of day. It's a safe bet that these were produced in quantity. and that these numbers merely represent the tip of the tip of the tip of the iceberg.
Now anyone contemplating paying serious money for any of these should take a step back and re-evaluate their priorities, and as for the emotionalism displayed, get back on the meds and double your dosage. >>
Silverbaron is offering to pay $4,000 for 2 oz silver examples. He clearly has been in the business for a long time and understands rarity.
Lets see if your theory that "there's a load of these bars just awaiting" pans out as the lure of a $4,000 to $5,000 payday is hard to resist.
FWIW, Engelhard promotional brochures from the 1970's (when the poured bars were being made) do not mention 2 oz silver bars but do advertise 3 oz, 4 oz, 5 oz , 7 oz and 10 oz examples for sale.
IMO it is not a safe bet to claim they were produced in quantity.
Time will tell.
https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/gold/liberty-head-2-1-gold-major-sets/liberty-head-2-1-gold-basic-set-circulation-strikes-1840-1907-cac/alltimeset/268163
To some a fair trade...
Lets see if your theory that "there's a load of these bars just awaiting" pans out as the lure of a $4,000 to $5,000 payday is hard to resist
This will certainly be the draw. Let's see what come out of old cabinets now that a price point has now been established. Let's give it 3 months for word to spread and time for people who think they have one to find it and offer it.
I've been messing around with silver bars since the 90's and I've certainly never seen one in person.
They sure appear to be scarce!
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