Do any dies still exist from the Civil War era & earlier?

ms70 · January 28, 2015 7:30AM

Dies that are still in usable condition?

BustHalfBrian · January 28, 2015 7:31AM

Bashlow Restrikes

Broadstruck · January 28, 2015 7:48AM

Civil War Token dies sell from time to time.

BillJones · January 28, 2015 7:54AM

Yes.

Here is the die that was used to strike Patriotic Civil War token #131, and I own it. There are three other Civil War token dies known to the hobby. I was the underbidder on another one that was sold about 10 months ago.

Die face

Example of CWT variety #131.

The Union League reverse.

JJSingleton · January 28, 2015 8:23AM

Bill, That's really cool.

EXOJUNKIE · January 28, 2015 8:33AM

VERY cool!

Bill - If you don't mind sharing, what is the going rate on these?

Outhaul · January 28, 2015 8:40AM

I can honestly state that I've never been disappointed with a "Bill Jones" post.

Cheers,

Bob

brg5658 · January 28, 2015 8:56AM

The Fuld die #173 sold for ~ $5,100 in June 2014. Maybe that's the one BillJones was underbidder on?: Link to auction

The Fuld #131 die also was sold by Steve Hayden, went for $5,000 back in October 2011. Not sure if that's where or when BillJones acquired it: Link here.

Brol · January 28, 2015 8:58AM

<< I can honestly state that I've never been disappointed with a "Bill Jones" post.

Cheers,

Bob >>

+1 Like.

ms70 · January 28, 2015 8:58AM

<< Yes.

Here is the die that was used to strike Patriotic Civil War token #131, and I own it. There are three other Civil War token dies known to the hobby. I was the underbidder on another one that was sold about 10 months ago.

Die face

>>

WOW. I'm impressed!

NumisOxide · January 28, 2015 9:01AM

That is neat!

Outhaul · January 28, 2015 9:02AM

The only dies I ever owned and wish I still had were the pair of GAR dies and a master hub to boot. I picked them up on ebay as one lot for around $5 a few years ago and sold them on for huge money. I regret it to this day. Sometimes the money is just not worth letting go of something you'll probably never have again.

Cheers,

Bob

TopographicOceans · January 28, 2015 9:26AM

That's cool.

Now Bill can make his own CWT's.

I'd assume any US Mint dies from that ear would be illegal even to this day.

BillJones · January 28, 2015 10:01AM

<< That's cool.

Now Bill can make his own CWT's.

I'd assume any US Mint dies from that ear would be illegal even to this day. >>

I think that they are legal if they have been cancelled. The oldest one I have seen personally was the obverse die for an 1808 half dollar. It had a significant die crack that demonstrated that the break could run down the whole body of the die. I have also seen a couple of Morgan dollar dies at the shows, both cancelled.

Timbuk3 · January 28, 2015 10:21AM

Wow, sweet !!!

Gemini · January 28, 2015 11:06AM

In 2064 if I owned that die I would strike a 200 year celebratory issue.......never mind I did the math

That's a Really Cool Item Bill !!!

EXOJUNKIE · January 28, 2015 11:48AM

<< The Fuld die #173 sold for ~ $5,100 in June 2014. Maybe that's the one BillJones was underbidder on?: Link to auction

The Fuld #131 die also was sold by Steve Hayden, went for $5,000 back in October 2011. Not sure if that's where or when BillJones acquired it: Link here. >>

Thanks for the info BRG!

shorecoll · January 28, 2015 11:55AM

I read reports years ago that all the Russian dies going back centuries still exist, but I haven't seen anything on it lately. Would make you think about collecting certain dark-side "rarities".

savoyspecial · January 28, 2015 4:50PM

Bechtler dies exist

Treashunt · January 28, 2015 9:49PM

there are tons of dies, all made in China.

ricko · January 28, 2015 10:12PM

Very cool BillJones.... thanks for showing those dies... Cheers, RickO

DCW · January 29, 2015 12:23AM

Civil War token dies seem very undervalued at these levels. Given the growing popularity of these tokens, it would seem that these dies would easily achieve 5 figures.
(They're not making any more of 'em!)

SullivanNumismatics · January 29, 2015 2:09AM

The 1849 Territorial Oregon Beaver $5 (or $10...can't remember which) dies are still around (in a museum in Oregon I believe.) Those are in good shape.

northcoin · January 29, 2015 10:16AM

The dies used for The Territorial Gold Mormon Gold coins (1849-1860) can be seen at the Pioneer Historical Museum just West of Temple Square in Salt Lake City.

northcoin · January 29, 2015 7:13PM

<< The dies used for the Territorial Coins - Mormon Gold (1849 - 1860) can be seen at the Pioneer Historical Museum just West of Temple Square in Salt Lake City. >>

Here are photos of the dies from the exhibit as included in Moulton's recent book "John J. Ford and the 'Franklin Hoard'":

UtahCoin · January 29, 2015 11:41PM

I don't own the dies, but I made the poster....

Sonorandesertrat · January 29, 2015 11:46PM

Wow. I lived in Salt Lake City from 1988 to 1995 and in Logan from 1996 to 2006, and never went to that museum. I will have to check it out when I am in northern Utah again.

northcoin · January 30, 2015 9:39PM

<< Wow. I lived in Salt Lake City from 1988 to 1995 and in Logan from 1996 to 2006, and never went to that museum. I will have to check it out when I am in northern Utah again. >>

To be more accurate, the Pioneer museum I made reference to is formally known as The Museum of Church History and Art and is located at 45 North West Temple immediately to the west of Temple Square.

shorecoll · January 30, 2015 10:27PM

I'm heading to SLC on Monday and hope I get a chance to stop at the museum.

Zoins · August 2, 2015 3:15PM

These original, hand-cut, dies (possibly from 1801) are on display at the Philadelphia Mint and look to be in exceptional condition.

Regulated · August 3, 2015 4:11AM

Just sold the die that struck this:

Regulated · August 3, 2015 4:12AM

Conway's dies still exist, as do the HH Smith $5 dies (although we've never seen the coins) and the Kellogg $50 dies.

BillJones · August 3, 2015 4:31AM

The dies for the Comitia Americana medal (Revolutionary War era) that was awarded to John Paul Jones still exist. They are on display at his tomb at the Naval Academy in Annapolis, Maryland. Here they are with an example of the model by Augustin Depre. Dupre, who in my opinion was the greatest of the French medalists of his era (best in the whole world probably), designed this piece. Dupre also designed the Libertas Americana and Daniel Morgan (Battle of the Cowpens) Medals which were also outstanding.

The medal is a French restrike made from the original die pair within the era from 1845 to 1860.

johnny9434 · August 3, 2015 5:19AM

neat stuff billjones, glad to see things like that

Zoins · August 22, 2015 7:27AM

<< Here is the die that was used to strike Patriotic Civil War token #131, and I own it. There are three other Civil War token dies known to the hobby. I was the underbidder on another one that was sold about 10 months ago. >>

That's a great looking die in what looks to be great condition. Out of curiosity, which dies are known?

BillJones · August 22, 2015 7:45AM

<< 

<< Here is the die that was used to strike Patriotic Civil War token #131, and I own it. There are three other Civil War token dies known to the hobby. I was the underbidder on another one that was sold about 10 months ago. >>

That's a great looking die in what looks to be great condition. Out of curiosity, which dies are known? >>

The dies for Patriotic varieties 130, 131 and either 173 or 174. There is a fourth one, which I can't recall.

Here are numbers 129 and 130. The white metal piece die was used to make a token for a Central States coin show in the late 1930s. I have one of those tokens. The piece in the picture is an orginal CWT.

Zoins · September 16, 2015 4:34PM

<< I'd assume any US Mint dies from that ear would be illegal even to this day. >>

The US Mint used to discard uncancelled, but rusted, dies so if you owned them, they could still be legal. Some years later, they began buying some of the dies back.

Zoins · December 20, 2015 4:13AM

I recently picked up a civil war token die which has turned into one of my favorite pieces, mostly because it's so different from everything else so far.

johnny9434 · December 21, 2015 5:12AM

neat job bill

keets · December 21, 2015 6:54AM

in November of 2014 Stack's sold one of the reverse dies made for Prof. M. Dickeson and later owned/used by Thomas Elder to strike some SC$'s the Perseverando and Eagle & Heron issues. it can be found in their auction archives.

CoinZip · December 21, 2015 7:30AM

Originally posted by: Zoins

These original, hand-cut, dies (possibly from 1801) are on display at the Philadelphia Mint and look to be in exceptional condition.

CaptHenway · December 21, 2015 8:22AM

Originally posted by: keets

in November of 2014 Stack's sold one of the reverse dies made for Prof. M. Dickeson and later owned/used by Thomas Elder to strike some SC$'s the Perseverando and Eagle & Heron issues. it can be found in their auction archives.

Could somebody please give me a link to this? Thanks.

TD

Zoins · December 21, 2015 10:57AM

Originally posted by: CaptHenway

Originally posted by: keets

in November of 2014 Stack's sold one of the reverse dies made for Prof. M. Dickeson and later owned/used by Thomas Elder to strike some SC$'s the Perseverando and Eagle & Heron issues. it can be found in their auction archives.

Could somebody please give me a link to this? Thanks.

TD

Here's the link for the Perseverando Dollar reverse die, HK-863, DeLorey Dickeson 4 - Stack's 2014 Baltimore Auction, auction 6039, lot 3139. It was posted in another thread earlier by keets. Cool that you've cataloged it!

Do any dies still exist from the Civil War era & earlier?

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Do any dies still exist from the Civil War era &amp; earlier?

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Do any dies still exist from the Civil War era & earlier?