Well this sucks - 1943 Lincoln PCGS MS67 turned in holder

remumc

Was looking at some of my coins that have been locked away for awhile and found this.
This is the second 1943 I've had turn in the holder as my 1943-S turned a couple years ago.
Was no problem then as PCGS made me whole. Hope they will again.
Such a waste! Any idea what caused this? Was stored in a blue box, in a gun safe, with desiccant,
and an electric goldenrod dehumidifier.

Walkerguy21D

Holy cow - I've had a gem BU raw steel cent from an original roll in my 7070 album for decades, and I live in FL,
and it still looks pristine.....

crypto79

Most of them will look like that in a generation. I would be surprised if PCGS makes you whole this time. After the reshuffling of coverage it specifically excludes environmental damage which that is. I hope I am wrong but please follow up and let us know what happens.

AMRC

Are there guns in the gun safe? More importantly, is there anything with gunpowder in the gun safe?

When I was about 13 years old I bought a BU OBR of these. I found the roll 20 years later and the whole tube full had corroded. Sad for me.

Baley

Do you happen to have a "before" picture? At MS67 we're assuming it looked great. Dip residue reacting with the zinc?

or, maybe

an electric goldenrod dehumidifier. has electrogalvano-something to the dry air in that enclosed gun safe

BustHalfBrian

Two words: Guarantee resubmission

If this coin doesn't qualify I don't what would.

amwldcoin

I had 2 like this that came from a well known major dealer. Obviously they were quickly dipped without proper rinsing and submitted. PCGS made me whole!

BaronVonBaugh

Is your gun safe a fire safe?

An inexpensive fire save uses drywall. When used as a component in fire barriers, drywall is a passive fire protection item. In its natural state, gypsum contains the water of crystallization bound in the form of hydrates. When exposed to heat or fire, this water is vapourised, over a range of temperatures from 80¡ to 170 ¡C (see calcium sulfate), retarding heat transfer until the water in the gypsum is gone. This makes drywall an ablative material because as the hydrates sublime, a crumbly dust is left behind, which, along with the paper, is sacrificial.

Good fire safes are expensive!

TopographicOceans

You might want to keep that sealed up.

It could be worse than Ebola

7Jaguars

I recently have had problems with desiccant in a safe where it seemed to all of a sudden pull MORE MOISTURE to it and damn near spoiled some copper-nickel bits stored inside...

GRANDAM

I have a 1943-D MS67 with similiar spotting but not near as bad.

PLMK how it turns out.

GrandAm

remumc

I'm hoping that the guarantee that was in place when the coin was holdered is still in place,
as I think it was holdered before the "reshuffling". I bought the 1943 steel cent PDS set in
MS67 several years ago. As I said, they made me whole on the 43-S. I will let everyone
know what happens as I will be contacting PCGS tomorrow.

All guns in the safe have been cleaned, then "aired out" for a couple of weeks before being
put back in the safe. I have documents and other things in there I don't want exposed to
chemicals.

Sorry, no before photo, but it was beautiful pristine mint and every bit a MS67.

Don't think the Goldenrod was the problem, if it was, there are other things in there
that would be showing problems.

My first thought when I saw it was a cough or sneeze somewhere in the room sometime
in it's life.

Hope you are correct BustHalfBrian!

To be continued.....

remumc

<< <i> is there anything with gunpowder in the gun safe?.../ >>



Absolutely not! No ammo, no powder. No solvents.

bolivarshagnasty

Was the safe new when you first stored your steel cent?

sparky64

That's a shame.
It had to be a beauty before turning on you.

remumc

<< <i>Was the safe new when you first stored your steel cent? >>



No, I've had this safe for 25 years. It's really not mine, I just got custody of it in someone else's divorce and have had it ever since, long story. Fort Knox, pretty good stuff from what Chuck Yeager told me in the advertisements back when. Bought the PCGS 1943 PDS MS67 set 5 - 6 years ago. Wondering how soon the "D" will turn now.

SeattleSlammer

maybe your dehumidifier is on the fritz

remumc

<< <i>maybe your dehumidifier is on the fritz >>



Good question, I'll check it and report back.

But there are no other issues with any number of other mediums
stored in that safe.

GrumpyEd

1943 cents can be like a canary in a coal mine.

crypto79

<< <i>I'm hoping that the guarantee that was in place when the coin was holdered is still in place,
as I think it was holdered before the "reshuffling". I bought the 1943 steel cent PDS set in
MS67 several years ago. As I said, they made me whole on the 43-S. I will let everyone
know what happens as I will be contacting PCGS tomorrow.

To be continued..... >>



Good luck, I have seen OGH rejected for environmental damage and preexisting conditions such as putty and PVC. If OGH aren't grandfathered it doesn't apper to be a retroactive policy in place. Good luck I hope you get your resolution

AUandAG

Do you really think the solvents used to clean your guns just "airs" out? If that were the case most guns would just
rust away with age. That, my friend, is the most likely culprit. I use a safe that has never had guns or ammo stored and
have never had a problem in the 40 plus years I've owned it for coin storage.

Sorry to hear and hope that PCGS makes you whole or at least better off.

bob

Jinx86

Are guns stored in the safe? Most cleaners used on firearms have chemicals to dissolve certain elements.
Vapors from these can fill the small area. I play the safe side and don't store the two together.


^beat me to it

georgiacop50

Guns and ammo and zinc cents? the most fragile of all Lincolns in high grade? zinc is a very reactive metal...

some day they will be real rarities...

PS- I made the very first PCGS mS67 43-D....don't know how it has faired... sold off b4 the pops rose.

lkeigwin

What a shame. Be thankful it is "only" a $100 coin.

I don't think you'll get anywhere with the PCGS guarantee. They'll call it environmental damage...not covered anymore. To my knowledge there is no grandfathering coverage except for copper color pre-2010.
Lance.

ricko

Wow... too bad. I store coins in a gun safe as well.... have had no issues. Safe has been in Florida, Arizona, Washington State and New York State...Many climates, no issue. A roll of '43's is just fine...and been in there for 20 years....Cheers, RickO

CaptHenway

Gack!

What else was in the safe?

ms70

<< <i>I recently have had problems with desiccant in a safe where it seemed to all of a sudden pull MORE MOISTURE to it and damn near spoiled some copper-nickel bits stored inside... >>



This is exactly right. Desiccant should only be used in an air tight environment such as a military ammo box. The other thing is the chemicals that come with guns. The cleaning
fluids like Hoppes 9 among others, oil, silicone wipe cloths, etc..... No matter what anyone tells you, they will penetrate coin holders over time.

Bottom line is guns and coins should not be stored together. You may want to get a separate safe and keep the slabs in archival quality boxes for long term storage.

DollarAfterDollar

Might have to get a new safe for Christmas.

EagleEye

My first impression was "what was done to the coin prior to it being submitted".

It looks like it was not an original coin to begin with. While the external atmosphere may have contributed to the problem, the problem was with the coin prior to submission in my opinion.

TopographicOceans

<< <i>the problem was with the coin prior to submission in my opinion. >>



Now we have an expert witness who can be called to testify on the stand.

Broadstruck

The second larger obverse photo makes it look kind of artsy...

The map of the United States behind Lincoln with Stars showing the Major Cities is cool

crypto79

<< <i>What a shame. Be thankful it is "only" a $100 coin.

I don't think you'll get anywhere with the PCGS guarantee. They'll call it environmental damage...not covered anymore. To my knowledge there is no grandfathering coverage except for copper color pre-2010.
Lance. >>





And I'll never know how the TPGs walked back their promises to customers without any outrage to speak of. What happens to coins like this that don't get taken off the market. Is it ethical for the OP to blow it out to a shady eBay dealer for 10$ to be passed to a sucker? Isn't this where we were with raw coins?

remumc

<< <i>My first impression was "what was done to the coin prior to it being submitted".

It looks like it was not an original coin to begin with. While the external atmosphere may have contributed to the problem, the problem was with the coin prior to submission in my opinion. >>



I agree, and as I said in an earlier post, looks to me like it may have been coughed or sneezed upon at some time prior to slabbing. I think the dispersal pattern confirms an aerosol attack on the surfaces.

If PCGS does not make me whole, this slab photo will be my new avatar as soon as I am able to make it so.

OldIndianNutKase

This is a very disappointing result. I do not think that storing your coins in a gun safe should be an issue, regardless of the vapors existent in the safe. The slab should be a hermetic barrier to any number of possible corroding agents.

While your coin is not of exceptional value, it makes me wonder if someone had a +$100,000 coin the result could be the same. PCGS should make this right with you, but more importantly they should understand if this is a defective slab or if all of their slabs may have the same issue,

OINK

amwldcoin

PCGS will now tell you point blank their holders are not airtight!

OPA

<< <i>PCGS will now tell you point blank their holders are not airtight! >>



They've been saying that for years.

ambro51

I have a few in my grandmothers blue Whitman that are fully UNC and fully white

Broadstruck

<< <i>If PCGS does not make me whole, this slab photo will be my new avatar as soon as I am able to make it so. >>



You'd be getting off cheap as I don't even wanna mention what I paid for my avatar

Bubblehead

<< <i>Wow... too bad. I store coins in a gun safe as well.... have had no issues. Safe has been in Florida, Arizona, Washington State and New York State...Many climates, no issue. A roll of '43's is just fine...and been in there for 20 years....Cheers, RickO >>



I also use a gun safe to share coin storage. Since 2000. I bot several firearms in late 1999, having some concern for anticipated millennium festivities.
In this 6'X3'X3' safe, I have always kept gun cleaning supplies, gun powder, lubricants of all manner, chemicals of all manner... well....acetone, goof off,
goo gone, and aerosol duster cans. Several bricks of Big 5 .22 ammo (when it was on sale), several boxes of Remington 12ga slugs, 12 ga bird shot, 30-06
ammo, 44 mag ammo, 45 ACP ammo, .380 ammo, 9mm (BT) ammo, and, and.... hundreds of coins... coins in all manner of TPG slabs, raw coins, sealed rolls,
paper wrapped rolls, mint boxes/packaging, loose in jars, loose in open trays....

...what I want to get across I guess, is that never have I found any coin to have changed, turned as the example steel cent, discolored, or toned in some way...
I did notice a silver Nevada SQ, in PCGS plastic, that developed a pretty rose peripheral toning.. It was not stored in the safe.

I am unable to attribute any coin problems at all simply due to storage in my gun safe.

Doh..zinc?

pennyannie

I do not co mingle or co habitat. Guns have there own safe and coins get theirs. I love the smell of freshly fired gun powder.

remumc

<< <i>....... I love the smell of freshly fired gun powder. >>



Aromathearpy?