POLL ---- Listening to Feedback: Experiment at Long Beach.

AMRC

I know myself I like to see prices on coins in a case without having to ask. It does help to know if I am looking at hundreds or thousands or hundreds of thousands of dollars before I waste anyone's time. While I do a pretty good job of knowing what stuff generally should go for, I don't know it all. So many dealers, especially those with high end coins and graded coins, require either looking at the back of the coin, or looking at their price sheet to quote you price. So I am going through all of my inventory right now and I am going to put the price on the front of the slab. Not only am I going to price the coin on the front, but I am going to put the actual price I will take for the coin; the take it or leave it no haggle price for the coin. I am even thinking of making a sign that says "this is my best price"

I guarantee no matter what many people will want to haggle, and will, no matter what my starting price is, buy a coin at my listed price. The market has conditioned many collectors that it is a game, and that you are supposed to get something off. So I am going to try, straightforward, the price you see is the price you pay, experiment in Long Beach.

Do you think this will?


Edited to add Poll in the title.

TONEDDOLLARS

I like your style, I only wish you sold what I collect

jesbroken

hopefully this will stop an error in your figures, but your 1st and 3rd are the same option.
hope this works for you.
Jim

braddick

You now seem ever so slightly obsessed with this vendetta.

Zoins

The answer must be "Increase Customer Satisfaction and increase sales" because it's listed twice

kaz

I think it's a great idea. Carmax did it with used cars and their business booms.

AMRC

<< <i>hopefully this will stop an error in your figures, but your 1st and 3rd are the same option.
hope this works for you.
Jim >>



I swear I read it three times! Fixed and thanks. O'h well it is not scientific anyway.

BillJones

When I was dealer my experience was that every customer expected a discount under the price asked. If you were dealing with more experienced and reasonable customers you can go from there. The other aspect was the "$1,000 rule" for sales tax, which I understand to be the "$1,500 rule" in California. I know, I know, you are supposed to add the sales tax to the bottom of the invoice for sales that were below the exemption limit, but I lost the sale almost every time I tried to do that when I was dealer. A lot of "low information" buyers expect you to evade or absorb the sales tax. That is a fact of life.

lkeigwin

<< <i>

<< <i>hopefully this will stop an error in your figures, but your 1st and 3rd are the same option.
hope this works for you.
Jim >>



I swear I read it three times! Fixed and thanks. O'h well it is not scientific anyway. >>

It needs to be fixed again.
Lance.

blu62vette

I think you will have more sales with the customers you talk to and waste less time talking to people you are no where near on price with.

I really like posted prices. At least it lets you and the buyer know if you are starting in the same ballpark.

mozin

I think you meant for the third one to be "Decrease Sales".

pennyannie

I give you a 50/50 chance

Actually I do not think it is going to work, as most want some type of discount. I generally price my stuff at best price plus 5 or 10 percent on most items, a few at rock bottom and a few at moon money to give everyone a chance to buy at the style they like.

Sometimes I have to reprice in mid show if I feel the need to generate cash and I have seen what other dealers have priced similar merchandise for. I am a seller and when I set up I intend to move the material, not everything is a homerun and sometimes I sell at under my cost if the item has lingered to long depending on how much cash I have tied up in it. A 2500 dollar item has a shorter shelf life than something I have 50 bucks in.

lostincoins

When Saturn cars first started out this primes worked well for them. I have yet to get the grocery store clerk to negotiate with me lol. When negotiating appears to be the way a dealer wants to operate it always makes me feel like I am at a yard sale. That being said how do you gauge this without having 2 different tables with the same inventory at 2 different locations on the floor. I bet you would get even more sales if you also put up a sign that states " Free secret gift with every purchase" and then had a little wheel they could spin and give them something inexpensive like a new proof coin of some sort. People love free stuff even if they just throw it away right away. Look at Cracker Jack!

valente151

I like this as an educated buyer on the floor. I typically am a pass or play buyer- i even like the price I'm quoted and buy the coin or I pass. I don't like when dealer's try to justify their prices to me- I don't need that and it annoys me and keeps me from buying a coin rather than leading me to buy it.

Although, I will say that as a new collector several years ago, I can recall one experience that would have been different if the dealer put their prices like this on coins. I was looking for a nice XF/AU capped bust half dollar for my type set in PCGS plastic. I saw one in a dealer's case and asked to see it, and loved the coin from the second I got it under the light. It should have been a $500 coin or so, so I was shocked to be quoted a price of several thousand. Turns out it was a rare Overton variety, and the dealer spent upwards of 20 min teaching me about the variety and Overton numbers in general. It was a great experience for me, and my first exposure to early die varieties. How this connects to you is that I most likely would have never asked to see the coin if it was priced on the front- as $500 was doable for a teenager, but a 4k coin was out of reach. I want to be clear though- I don't think it is your or any other dealer's responsibility to teach people about the hobby, but when learning moments can happen it is definitely appreciated.

gypsylea

I voted none of the above. I just don't think you can tell for sure. But why are you going to the show in the first place? Blow out your inventory (based on your web site, you have some nice stuff, so I doubt you want to do that). Buy coins? Many dealers I have known say that is their measure of a good show. Build better relationships with existing customers? Make some new customers?

I personally prefer to have prices marked. If you want to preclude haggling, just politely say you've priced everything at net. Besides, what are you going to do if someone wants to do a trade? And Bill Jones makes a good point about sales tax.

You seem like a really nice guy. I know the business of numismatics can be stressful, as can any business. I would just encourage you to think about all the reasons you attend shows and try to balance things out so that one thing (your pricing strategy) doesn't get in the way of other objectives you might reasonably accomplish. Try to have some fun.

AMRC

<< <i>I voted none of the above. I just don't think you can tell for sure. But why are you going to the show in the first place? Blow out your inventory (based on your web site, you have some nice stuff, so I doubt you want to do that). Buy coins? Many dealers I have known say that is their measure of a good show. Build better relationships with existing customers? Make some new customers?

I personally prefer to have prices marked. If you want to preclude haggling, just politely say you've priced everything at net. Besides, what are you going to do if someone wants to do a trade? And Bill Jones makes a good point about sales tax.

You seem like a really nice guy. I know the business of numismatics can be stressful, as can any business. I would just encourage you to think about all the reasons you attend shows and try to balance things out so that one thing (your pricing strategy) doesn't get in the way of other objectives you might reasonably accomplish. Try to have some fun. >>



Thanks for your kind words. I think you are right, I will not be able to tell for sure, but I can't resist the opportunity to see the look on some people's faces. I seldom sell a coin for a loss. This is all fun for me. I do well at it and try and stock very nice coins. My prices will by no means be give-aways, just net pricing right on the front of the coin. I can afford to experiment. None of this puts milk on the table.

I have made plenty of good customers over the years.

Sales tax. Not my problem, it is theirs. I don't make the laws. If they want to buy coins for less than $1,500 they have to pay the sales tax. If they do not want to, they can move on to some other dealer who will sell them the coin. If they have my coins.

Davideo

Some customers will like it more, others will like it less. It's difficult to say how it will work out overall. Though it may tend to weed more annoying lowballing, lookie-loos, which could be a major positive. I do think a sign stating something like "Best Price as Marked" would be helpful as potential customers will know the ground rules of your booth so to speak.

Either way, good luck!

joebb21

I have been doing this for years now and find it very effective.
No hassle no games.
Either pass or walk away.

There are many others dealers that now do the same thing (especially wholesales). This way instead of going through a double row box of 60 coins and pulling out 45 that I need to ask a price on, I have pulled out 10 that I believe should be in line with what I will pay and then its 1-2-3.

some people may still try and ask your best price, but give it 6 months of doing this and you will get the reputation for no haggling.
The only question then is if your prices are in line with their correct valuations.
If you are selling coins then you know you did it right.

JerseyJoe

I think it is a good idea. Both the dealer and collector should their prices.
I hate having to ask prices of multiple coins just to realize they are X%
over what I think is fair price. I generally use recent auction prices to
guide me.

I asked to see a set of coins once and realized I wanted it. When I asked
the price I saw they were almost 15% over recent auctions so I went to hand
it back and said they were nice. The seller asked me to make an offer which
I did and he accepted. I paid what recent auction prices were.
The coins graded well for me and I consider it a win win.

291fifth

Remember what happened to J. C. Penney. Consumers want discounts because it makes them feel like they didn't pay full retail (even though the discounted price often is the true retail price.)

stman

<< <i>I guarantee no matter what many people will want to haggle, and will, no matter what my starting price is, buy a coin at my listed price. The market has conditioned many collectors that it is a game, and that you are supposed to get something off. >>



I'm just glad a lot of the dealers don't act like the above.



<< <i>You now seem ever so slightly obsessed with this vendetta. >>



Agreed, but ever so slightly obsessed? You're being very kind.

RedTiger

My guess is that the difference will be minor. Customers for collector coins tend to know their prices, and their dealers. Most that are shopping for a coin at full retail price aren't shy about asking. Many show buyers are repeat customers. There are very newbies walking up shopping for high dollar value collector coins, and that is the audience where marked prices will tend to help the most. If it were more low value material, I think it would definitely help, because customers only spending a little may be more shy or not want to bother asking over something that doesn't cost much. They'll just move to another table where there is a marked price, but that is more for low priced material.

I've seen different variations of this. Some have a sign saying 10% or 20% off marked price, another has a sign "slightly higher than marked" because the marked price is what they just bought the coins for and their profit for the show is maybe 12%. Personally, I find all variations of marking better than no price at all. There is one dealer with a 50% off sign, but his marked prices tend to be about triple regular retail. Only a few coin show buyers are dumb enough to fall for his trick, most of the time the table is empty. Unfortunately, it is young kids with their dads that tend to fall for his trick, and immediately process to learn the lesson about sharks in the hobby.

One problem with marked prices is that they have to be relabeled when the market changes. Some have plenty of air in their marked prices, so it isn't that much of an issue. Others may have to re-price more often and it can become a significant drain on time and energy.

Separately, the department store JC Penney tried going to a fixed price schedule, doing away with most of their weekly, monthly promotions. Their customers didn't like it and sales went down about 20%. It is different crowd that shops for clothes than coins, and most other clothes stores do have promotions.

Anyway, good luck, report back. There is a chance that it takes some time to catch on. That potential customers might see a coin, but might have to save up for it, and only come to buy several shows later. Slight variations might be more successful, such as marking 5% or 10% higher, leaving some room for the inevitable hagglers. There will be a few that will just pay the marked price, but many more will want a discount and feel better if they get a discount. There is also the coin flip variation, you want the coin, we'll flip a coin. Customer wins the coin flip, a 10% discount, dealer wins, full price as marked.

stman

<< <i> I bet you would get even more sales if you also put up a sign that states " Free secret gift with every purchase" and then had a little wheel they could spin and give them something inexpensive >>



You mean like at a carnival?

Broadstruck

Guessing this is more then just eBay make an offer related

Shamika

Some people actually like to haggle. These people want to chisel you down even if you priced your coins 50% below retail.

amwldcoin

This is my opinion. I believe this is a regional thing. People on the East Coast are mostly the non haggle type from my experience. People in the South will haggle to the bone! I remember when I started doing Baltimore well over a decade ago how different things were. When I priced my coins I always left some wiggle. My 1st few Baltimore shows I was very surprised very few would counter offer and look aghast when I told them I would sell the coin for less. If I net priced a coin in the SE my sales would drop substantially because we are a haggling bunch! While many of my coins have prices on them some do not! Not nary a one of my slabbed coins has a price on it and I use the smallest sticker I can find to cost code it. I am tired of the clean up job required from crappy stickers! I also see many holders devalued due to sticker damage! Just wait and see what happened with the new PCGS slabs with the security sticker destroyed by dealer stckers! If I have a price on a coin more times than not there is wiggle room.

BryceM

Well, like you said it's an experiment. You'll know by the end of the show if it worked or not.

My preference is to find a coin I really like, see a reasonable price, and pay it.

The other (more common scenario) is to find a coin I really like, see a slightly high price, haggle for a while, try not to offend or be offended, listed to the little story about how it's really under-graded (100% guaranteed lock to sticker or get a plus on re-submission.... yadda, yadda), and eventually close the deal (or not).

As a collector, you never know the mindset of the guy behind the table. You don't know if he's inventory overloaded, over-extended, and desperate to make a sale, or if he's already had a tremendous show and he's hoping to keep one or two things to take home for the website. So......, don't be surprised if you still get asked to haggle by virtually every person that comes by. If the price on the coin is fair, they'll know it and I guess it won't make much difference in overall sales either way.

Baley

I voted None of the Above (without reading any responses) and here is why:

I have no idea if your "best prices" are high, low, or about right.

I do know that you are right, most people like to feel that they are getting a "deal" and will want something off the market price.

good luck with your experiment, unless your prices are very low, I think you will confirm what you already know about human nature.

now to read the discussion..

coppertoning

I know that when I have to ask for a price and the first one is moon money I don't ask for any more

Not sure if bottom dollar is good pricing but visible pricing is nice

ms70

I think it's a great idea and I applaud you for doing this, but I'm not sure what will happen. I think the hobby has become so entrenched into the mindset of being able to
get somewhere between 10 to 20% off, that some people will still feel they can get you down more on the price no matter what you do.

To echo coppertoning's post just above, visible pricing of any sort is a great idea and maybe would be a good thing even if it's not bottom line pricing. At least it's ball park and will
give a collector an idea of where the price stands before asking. In other words it takes at least one step out of the process if there's going to be haggling.

AUandAG

I would prefer to shop this way. No haggling at CarMax or Sears.....price you see is price you pay,
or move along.

bob

AUandAG

Isn't option one the same as three???

bob

OldIndianNutKase

I agree with you that posting a price on the front of the slab is a great idea and will be appreciated by everyone. In addition to this I would also post the CoinFacts value for the coin. For coins less than a certain value, let's just say $2,000 just say that is your best price. For more expensive coins just list the price and indicate "Or Best Offer". The higher the asking price you need more flexibility to maximize sales.

OINK

AMRC

<< <i>I agree with you that posting a price on the front of the slab is a great idea and will be appreciated by everyone. In addition to this I would also post the CoinFacts value for the coin. For coins less than a certain value, let's just say $2,000 just say that is your best price. For more expensive coins just list the price and indicate "Or Best Offer". The higher the asking price you need more flexibility to maximize sales.

OINK >>



What about if it was CAC'ed?

OldIndianNutKase

<< <i>

<< <i>I agree with you that posting a price on the front of the slab is a great idea and will be appreciated by everyone. In addition to this I would also post the CoinFacts value for the coin. For coins less than a certain value, let's just say $2,000 just say that is your best price. For more expensive coins just list the price and indicate "Or Best Offer". The higher the asking price you need more flexibility to maximize sales.

OINK >>



What about if it was CAC'ed? >>



If CAC'd perhaps list the coin higher than the CoinFacts price. Just indicate Best Price or Offer?

OINK

messydesk

It will increase the customer throughput at your table, because if you're busy with someone, a potential buyer can tell at a glance whether to wait or move on. Also, if you're away, being able to see pricing might make some potential customers make note to come back. You can still make people feel special by putting out a sign saying "all prices net for this show only" or something like that.

WildIdea

For me, up front pricing is appreciated. Sometimes shows can be so busy it's really tough to get a dealers attention just to ask to see a coin. I like to see both sides before the question even crosses my mind. If the reverse is hideous or there are problems you can't see from the case, I figure it's sitting around because nobody wants it and if the coin is a killer, it's still in inventory because the dealer wants too much as I'm sure many a coin hawk has combed the room before opened to public. If a dealer has to bust out a current weekly periodical to find a price, do I really want to be in something that volatile? Most of the time I hand the coin back with a thanks uninterested and a price isn't required. At that point, if a price was listed it would naturally get my wheels turning to see if it worked or not, so there's that.

That's if the dealer is at their booth. I always come by when they are eating or something. I've been known to google the dealer by their banner and see what they are asking on their website. If it's listed at a bearable price, I may circle the room a few times hoping they return.

Kove

First, many dealers don't put prices on the front of their coins due to security concerns. A large show like Long Beach might be less of a concern, but putting large numbers on price tags on coins at regional or local shows can make you a security target.

Second, what happened to actually looking at the coin close-up before getting to price? If you've got a very nice coin for the grade, and a higher price to match the quality, you're going to let a lot of people judge the coin from three feet away, and keep walking, just based on the price tag. Let them see up-close why you've priced the coin where you did.

I prefer prices to be clearly stated on a sticker on the back of the slab.

Boosibri

Lots of interesting takes... I look forward to hearing your results for the show.

3keepSECRETif2rDEAD

...I voted for option #4...but seriously, why can't you fix the poll??? Option #1 & #3 are twins...and with the same vote total as of now (9 & 9)

Erik

Bochiman

Posted prices that are REALISTIC tend to get my business when I am looking to buy a coin.
If the price is significantly above what similar coins have been selling for, and there are no exceptional properties about the coin that would put it above those recent sales, then either I haggle a little or I walk.
I'm not there to be the one get reamed to help pay for the dealer's 3 kids going to college

If the price is in-line, and I want the coin, I will buy it more often when the price is listed. If not listed, I often don't find out the price as I often look at walk. I have been known to ask on unmarked prices, but I have usually found them to be, imho, unrealistically high, and I end up passing on the coin.

Justlooking

For whatever reason (all mental), it's better to slightly overprice a coin and then come down than it is to slap an "honest" price on the piece. People love getting a deal — even a deal that isn't.

GrumpyEd

I think that if you put on good prices and people don't suspect that you still drop them for special customers so it's truly priced as marked for all then it will increase sales and increase throughput. If the prices aren't realistic then it will fail hard.
This will work especially well for customers that did their homework and already know what they want and have a buy price in mind, if the coin and price is right they buy it, if not they walk.

PollywogRancher

Please everybody. Double your desired price and have banners reading "50% OFF ON EVERYTHING!" Problem solved

Lakesammman

I have no idea what will happen but look forward to your post-LB report.

Tookybandit

Looks like I voted with the majority.

Figure out your best price and then add 15% and put that price on your coins. You have to leave yourself room to haggle or you will turn off a bunch of good customers. Also, as a bonus, you will probably make some sales at the full 15% price!

leothelyon

<Do you think this will?>

Will what? Because I sell coins, why would I part with information on how to increase your sales and likely diminish mine? Not only are collectors in constant competition with each other so are dealers. I may already have the disadvantage of having to accept a table at the far end of the bourse floor where very few customers trek back to but why would I share what works for me with my competitor? Hey, would you mine opening a window up there so I can breathe a little easier? Let's line up all the tables into one single row and you have table #421..........do I really need to say anything more?



Leo

commoncents05

For what it's worth, I walked by AMRC's table yesterday and bought a coin I wouldn't have purchased if it wasn't priced when I walked by. Nice to meet you in person!

-Paul

Boosibri

<< <i>For what it's worth, I walked by AMRC's table yesterday and bought a coin I wouldn't have purchased if it wasn't priced when I walked by. Nice to meet you in person!

-Paul >>



Did you try and haggle with him just for fun?

Boosibri

How about an update on how this experiment went?

Yacorie1

I like having the prices on the coin. I dont' think you need to have a sign stating this is your rock bottom price. I think pricing them a few bucks higher, anticipating someone offering a few bucks lower is just fine.

To me, the biggest thing is having a starting point on a coin. I'm more inclined to buy something I have no clue about if I can see right away I can afford it. Also, if its a coin I know, and have a good feeling of the price range - seeing your prices lets me know if we're going to have a chance to close the deal.

Hopefully it worked out for you.