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Shipwreck Coins

erwindocerwindoc Posts: 5,051 ✭✭✭✭✭
in U.S. Coin Forum
I was playing on ebay and came across several shipwreck coins. I thought they looked pretty neat. I know they have been under the water for a couple hundred years and have been "conserved". Has anyone ever seen these in hand that have been conserved? Do they "look cleaned?"

Here is a nice example of one(and for what its worth, it is not my auction, I was just curious)...Shipwreck coin

Comments

  • mdwoodsmdwoods Posts: 5,545 ✭✭✭
    Pretty cool. The seller has quite a few of them for sale. Lots of bids on most.
    National Register Of Big Trees

    We'll use our hands and hearts and if we must we'll use our heads.
  • jayPemjayPem Posts: 4,076 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I do frequent ebay searches for 8 reales and have finally figured out to block the words El Cazador and shipwreck from my searches....there are SO many of these in NGC holders...
    they obviously have a strong following/promotion image

    When or if I ever get one, I'd want the most "shipwrecked" one I could find. Some of them I have seen have a really great sea sculpted look, in those cases whatever cleaning has happened would matter very little.

    The so called higher grades of these El Caz pieces make little sense to me....they are super obviously cleaned and usually cost about the same as a choice, undamaged portrait 8...
  • jp84jp84 Posts: 201 ✭✭✭
    Check out the Royal Mint "Gairsoppa" issue. They minted 1/4 ounce Britannia coins out of silver bars that were recovered from a WWII shipwreck in the Irish Sea. Edge lettering indicates Gairsoppa. They run about 25-30 pounds each but a neat story.
  • SonorandesertratSonorandesertrat Posts: 5,695 ✭✭✭✭✭
    The ones that I save seen in hand looked a bit funky---very bright from the 'conservation' and the surfaces looked porous.
    Member: EAC, NBS, C4, CWTS, ANA

    RMR: 'Wer, wenn ich schriee, hörte mich denn aus der Engel Ordnungen?'

    CJ: 'No one!' [Ain't no angels in the coin biz]
  • WeissWeiss Posts: 9,939 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I like them, but they have a lot in common with the most easily recognizable fakes in our industry: washed out detail, surfaces that are too clean, unnatural overall appearance. In other words, they look fake. And if they look fake from the get-go, how difficult would it be for them to be faked in the first place? So if I were to buy one, which is unlikely, I'd want it graded by a TPG.
    We are like children who look at print and see a serpent in the last letter but one, and a sword in the last.
    --Severian the Lame
  • FullStrikeFullStrike Posts: 4,353 ✭✭✭
    To satisfy a long running curiosity I finally won an El Cazador Coin several years ago. I think I won it at around $78
    or so. At the time that was really cheap but the Coin is a total Dogg. It is heavily pitted and it has a slight cupped
    appearance like a HOF Coin. Looks like it was pried off a big clump of Coins or something. Anyway it is cool to me
    because it has a lot of history behind it. One day soon I hope to get a nice xf-au non shipwreck 8 Reales - slabbed
    of course. When that happens, all my 8 Reale dreams will have come true. From the first time I saw these in the
    front of the Red Book, I've wanted one.
  • rickoricko Posts: 98,724 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I really have no interest in 'story' coins - such as shipwreck or the California dug hoard - however, I do like the coin and have looked for a nice specimen at shows in the past. Cheers, RickO
  • COALPORTERCOALPORTER Posts: 2,900 ✭✭
    I bought some shipwreck seated halfs and the only saving graces - NO HAIRLINES!
  • BillJonesBillJones Posts: 33,899 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I don't care for shipwreck coins unless they are attractive, or I don't have any alternatives.

    Here are two cases in point. A great many 1857-S very nice double eagles came off the salvage operation of the SS Central America. I have one of those, and I really like the piece because of its state of preservation. The coin was in the middle of the pile, preserved from the effects of moving seawater and is very attractive.

    The second case is an 1654, 8 reale cob that I acquired a year a so ago. From what I understand most all of these coins come from shipwrecks because the ones that stayed "topside" were almost all melted. The thing I really like about this piece is that it does not look like it was recovered from a shipwreck despite that fact that it came with a certificate that said that it was. Most shipwreck silver coins have an unappealing white color, and their surfaces have a sandpaper appearance from their time in seawater. I don't care for look at all and would never buy a coin that looks like that. Here is the coin.

    imageimage
    Retired dealer and avid collector of U.S. type coins, 19th century presidential campaign medalets and selected medals. In recent years I have been working on a set of British coins - at least one coin from each king or queen who issued pieces that are collectible. I am also collecting at least one coin for each Roman emperor from Julius Caesar to ... ?
  • ms70ms70 Posts: 13,953 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Question- Let's pretend I was diving on an old shipwreck and I somehow came upon a gold coin on my own at the site. I send the coin to PCGS. Will they recognize
    the surface as legitimate "shipwreck effect" and grade it as such, or absent some sort of proof, will they call it ungradeable due to surface damage?

    Great transactions with oih82w8, JasonGaming, Moose1913.

  • GrumpyEdGrumpyEd Posts: 4,749 ✭✭✭
    They have been selling the graded El Cazador coins on the TV coin shows for years, they never seem to run out.

    There are a lot of them, maybe half a million pieces or something were recovered.
    I do like the story of how the guy named his fishing boat "The Mistake" because his wife told him it was a mistake to buy it then as he was going broke the boat got it's net fouled and the net came up full of coins from the El Cazador (The Hunter).
    Ed
  • JustlookingJustlooking Posts: 2,895 ✭
    A little piece of history. I like 'em.
    Let's try not to get upset.
  • BillJonesBillJones Posts: 33,899 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>Question- Let's pretend I was diving on an old shipwreck and I somehow came upon a gold coin on my own at the site. I send the coin to PCGS. Will they recognize
    the surface as legitimate "shipwreck effect" and grade it as such, or absent some sort of proof, will they call it ungradeable due to surface damage? >>



    Advanced collectors and dealers can recognize the "shipwreck effect" on gold coins. If the coin was Mint State when it went into the water, much of the design detail will remain, but the luster will mostly or totally impaired. Such coins have a matte like finish similar to that seen on a Matte Proof gold coin except that the graininess of the surface will more pronounced.
    Retired dealer and avid collector of U.S. type coins, 19th century presidential campaign medalets and selected medals. In recent years I have been working on a set of British coins - at least one coin from each king or queen who issued pieces that are collectible. I am also collecting at least one coin for each Roman emperor from Julius Caesar to ... ?
  • PurfrockPurfrock Posts: 545 ✭✭✭
    When I was into coins outside of early copper, I owned on of the El Cazador shipwreck coin. Mine was probably mid-grade, but clearly exhibited the shipwreck effect.
    I enjoyed it for a year or two and then sold it. Didn't take long to sell as it was in a labeled NGC holder and I was just asking to get my money back.

    I may be in the minority, but I really do enjoy the history of where a coin has been (shipwreck or otherwise), and do put a premium on a solid provenance.
    EAC, ANA Member
  • SeanthecoincollectorSeanthecoincollector Posts: 88 ✭
    Shipwreck coins are awesome i have 2 myself, the price they bring always depends on the condition the nicest of examples from the El Cazador shipwreck sell for 100's of dollars, lower end pieces with a lot of design missing can sell for as little as $20.00 each !! I would say it is always nice to own a piece !! I would recommend you pick one of the ones in the 50-60 dollar range !!
    Successful Sales on this forum to:erickso1
  • BillJonesBillJones Posts: 33,899 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>I may be in the minority, but I really do enjoy the history of where a coin has been (shipwreck or otherwise), and do put a premium on a solid provenance. >>



    The best is when you can get a good, collectable coin, as many are from the SS Central America AND have a great history surrounding it.
    Retired dealer and avid collector of U.S. type coins, 19th century presidential campaign medalets and selected medals. In recent years I have been working on a set of British coins - at least one coin from each king or queen who issued pieces that are collectible. I am also collecting at least one coin for each Roman emperor from Julius Caesar to ... ?

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