SS Central America inventories here - September update

HalfStrike

The inventory of the SS Central America recovery is now posted for all to see. There are some coins not listed individually yet like the 8910 dimes they found but it looks like all the gold and a lot of the silver is. It is in 6 sections, you can read the dates they logged them to see how it went sequentially. As far as what is left they are projecting between two to 5 times what they have found here, but that is what the passengers carried. I imagine it will be scattered date coins, gold dust and nuggets. I doubt the passengers had bars but they did withdraw fresh coins from the bank prior to departure so maybe we see more quality coins too. Here are the PDFs

September update: They have finished doing the SS Central America recovery for this year, the last amount was in PDF 6 below. They spent a lot of time doing a video survey this month so there are not a lot of coins. No word yet on how or when the coins will become available.

PDF 1

PDF 2

PDF 3

PDF 4

PDF 5

PDF 6


Latest photos

UltraHighRelief

Anyone want to go diving with me?

Elcontador

If the gold can be conserved and wind up Unc. in first world holders, like the first SS Central America Double Eagles, between this find and the one in 1996, we have something similar to the discovery of a bag of 1903 O Morgan $s with respect to the 1857 S Double Eagle. I don't know how much the price drop in the latter would be offset by the SSA pedigree.

Thanks for posting the details of the find in the four pdf files.

amwldcoin

Man it is insane how much they are pulling up! Never mind the 57-S's! They were already common after the last haul and now they seem to be as common as the 04's!. There are tons' and ton's of territorial Gold pieces.......many are just listed as privately minted. I bet Mr. Bowers would love to study this lot! I noticed a lot of 55-S 1/2's as well. Still hoping they find a 54-S 2+1/2 or 5! Fair amount of C + D mint stuff also!

coindeuce

I'm amazed at the size of the gold ingots shown in the images, but I'm even more amazed at the clarity of the seawater at this depth, where the only light available is from the artificial lighting equipment.
I counted 4 1855-S Half Dollars on Exhibit A manifest already.

ms70

Wow. That's a lot of double eagles.... Can't wait for the stuff to go to auction. I'm more interested in the silver stuff so there's a lot to look forward to for everyone.

CaptHenway

Love that inventory. Will study it closer, but looks like most of the silver is of the new 1853 weight. The culling of the old weight silver must have been ruthless!

DaveG

Since the ship was coming back from California when it sank, I wouldn't have expected there to have been much silver on board, as the returning Californians would have been bringing gold with them, not silver. Also, looking at the mintage figures in the Red Book, it doesn't look like there was all that much demand for silver coins from the newly established San Francisco Mint.

I don't think I've ever read of any of the private minters producing silver coins before the SF Mint was established and the only other way for silver coins to have gotten to San Francisco was in the pockets of travelers (which, of course, could have been a substantial source of supply).

In addition, the flood of gold from California was such that it drove the price of silver up fairly early in the Gold Rush. Carothers (in Fractional Money) says that by early 1851, the silver in two half dollars was worth $1.035 and the coins were subsequently heavily exported. As a result, silver coins pretty much disappeared from circulation shortly thereafter.

Timbuk3

I think they may have fallen
out from my pocket when I
went swimming !!!

ms70

<< <i>I don't think I've ever read of any of the private minters producing silver coins before the SF Mint was established and the only other way for silver coins to have gotten to San Francisco was in the pockets of travelers (which, of course, could have been a substantial source of supply). >>



That's what I was thinking too. Being able to own a piece would give it such a different perspective knowing it was not likely cargo, but rather someone's personal possession.

LotsoLuck

Shaawing!!!


Can I say that

ClosedLoop

yes you can, you just beat me to it.
they missed all this first time around?
wow

Boosibri

I cant help but be surprised at the amount of territorial gold here. Makes sense I suppose but I'm curious how this compares to the findings from the last expedition. Also, the amount of C and D mint gold perhaps represents personal holding of southern gold miners who ventured to California as the veins were depleting in the south. Very interesting.

LanceNewmanOCC

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i'm honing my en-masse data sorting skills, so here in a bit i'll finish up these xls files and post some totals.

edited to add:

i'm not going to do the census as there are too many dates/mm combos. i will however make the xls available for download in this thread once i am finished.

there would just be too many lines where the qty would be (1). that is my excuse anyway. all the denoms will be separated though and organized by date within each tab.
.

CaptHenway

There are contemporary reports to the effect that the economy in the gold fields was so expensive that mere silver was not welcome.

Perhaps somebody headed back East with money to transport could buy silver from the money changers at a discount to gold and then get full face value for it back East?

keets

why have none of the regulars posted about why it's the equivalent of a Numismatic Mortal Sin to conserve these coins and thus remove them from a state of originality??

crump41

When the original coins from the wreck were first cleaned up, did they have that distinctive orange color? Or did the toning develop later? I always found it to be quite attractive.

Sunnywood

Can anyone summarize what are some of the rarest regular issue U.S. gold and silver coins to show up in this astounding shipwreck recovery? I have read about some of the gold, but nothing really about the silver. I'm not sure it's possible for the silver to be in an acceptable condition after conservation. Gold is obviously more inert, and it is therefore not inconceivable for a gold coin to survive immersion in seawater, plus "conservation," and come out having acceptable surfaces.

Anyway just curious what especially interesting "finest knowns" etc have come out of this, or the odd example of a very rare date ...

Best,
Sunnywood

Boosibri

<< <i>Can anyone summarize what are some of the rarest regular issue U.S. gold and silver coins to show up in this astounding shipwreck recovery? I have read about some of the gold, but nothing really about the silver. I'm not sure it's possible for the silver to be in an acceptable condition after conservation. Gold is obviously more inert, and it is therefore not inconceivable for a gold coin to survive immersion in seawater, plus "conservation," and come out having acceptable surfaces.

Anyway just curious what especially interesting "finest knowns" etc have come out of this, or the odd example of a very rare date ...

Best,
Sunnywood >>




I think it is way too early to know if any finest knowns have been found but from a quick glance through the list the rare territorial issues jumped out to me. 1852 Wass Molitor eagle, US Assay office $20's, Moffat $20's, Wass Molitor $5's, and a handful Dahlonega and Charlotte $5's.

LanceNewmanOCC

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ok, starting from scratch. i'll sort them all together and remove any duplicates before sorting by denom/type etc.


EDITED TO ADD:

phew. it wasn't my mistake.

there are duplicates. 100% confirmed. thought maybe i got a little happy with the copy/paste like i sometimes do. not this time.

had to start over either way. but this is good experience on working with large unknown data groups for combining/sorting. thank goodness for the SCA sorting numbering system.
.

LanceNewmanOCC

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ok. everything is as accurate as i could get it w/o going insane. i'm pretty sure i've removed the dups and most mistakes. there were a lot of both unfortunately.

hope it helps.
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topstuf

<< <i>There are contemporary reports to the effect that the economy in the gold fields was so expensive that mere silver was not welcome.

Perhaps somebody headed back East with money to transport could buy silver from the money changers at a discount to gold and then get full face value for it back East? >>



So..... silver was as dumb to own back then as it is now.
I wish I had sold all mine.

kick me.

lostincoins

First off Thank you very much for getting that sorted out Lance. Now my brain has gone numb over this as it is a serious amount of metal to enter the market and to find such as this is just beyond me. Fortunes made and lost are a normal part of life but I do not envie those that could loose much should this affect the pops drastically thus dropping values by large sums.

CaptHenway

Lance...can't download that file. WHat format is it in?

mdwoods

It's in Excel format. I opened it with Open Office.

CaptHenway

OK got it, thanks.

dagman100

<< <i>.
ok. everything is as accurate as i could get it w/o going insane. i'm pretty sure i've removed the dups and most mistakes. there were a lot of both unfortunately.

hope it helps.
. >>



Wow - this is incredibly helpful. Thank you for you organizing by type and date. Many thanks!

LochNESS

I just want to say ...

(1) wow y'all are some knowledgeable folks

and

(2) it's a nice warm fuzzy feeling to know I'm not the only nerd in town

LochNESS

<< <i>... I noticed a lot of 55-S 1/2's as well. Still hoping they find a 54-S 2+1/2 or 5! Fair amount of C + D mint stuff also! >>

Just scanned PDF #1 using Ctrl+F for "1854" some 54-S $10 but only 54-P $2.5

I feel like there's gotta be some in there, though. Given the sheer magnitude of what they've already published.

also, boy is Doug Winter's 2010 article interesting now that these inventories have been published ...

LanceNewmanOCC

.
can someone crash-course me on the dates and names of these wreck(s)? or perhaps just this one. i can search others unless someone wants to share/brag how many they know, it is ok to show off here. hehe

this one is referred to as "SS Central America" BUT, i have images in my database for TPG holders of much older generations with this ship name.

have they been pulling stuff up from some of the same wrecks for decades? or maybe more than one ship with the same name(i figure highly unlikely).

or is it something else i am missing entirely.

i thought a neat project would be to combine census for hoards found within say the past decade to start but before i even think about doing something like that, i gotta get some ducks in a row so i don't have another mess like when i started doing this particular one.

assistance is appreciated and anyone that knows of other manifests/inventories is welcome to forward them or links.

it would all be in xls format since imo, it is one of the best methods of fast, efficient data management, especially using copy/paste and data sort along with advanced filter and find & replace.



<< <i>Wow - this is incredibly helpful. Thank you for you organizing by type and date. Many thanks! >>

you are welcome.

i figured it was time to delve down into this type of stuff a little deeper and diving in (no pun intended) seemed to be the way to go this time. that and there is virtually no way i could mentally process all that data as random as it was. sometimes i can do it but mostly i have to find a way to organize/process in order for the info to be of much use to me and the way my mind works, the benefit is sharing the results with others (GRATIS).
.

LochNESS

Well, the article I posted above is referring to the first half of the salvage effort as I understand it. Someone posted the actual date near the beginning of this thread ... I think it was 1996? This guy in the article, Doug Winter is talking in 2000 (or was it 2010?) about how the prices had finally relaxed to a reasonable buyers' market atmosphere. But he goes into detail about other things besides price, such as the affects of the hoard on the supply and demand of certain dates and the concept of grade rarity / condition rarity.

So I guess the short answer is yes, they've been salvaging coins from the same ship for multiple decades. Unless I completely misunderstood the earlier posts and his article.

SethChandler

Did anyone notice the 1853-S Eagle? Maybe a typo.......????? How awesome would that be?

LanceNewmanOCC

<< <i>Well, the article I posted above is referring to the first half of the salvage effort as I understand it. Someone posted the actual date near the beginning of this thread ... I think it was 1996? This guy in
>>



ty. i did look stuff up but i do like an endorsement of info from others when i'm not certain and i'm putting a fair amount of effort into the info.

from what i gathered, the recovery process was being done carefully in multiple respects.

very lucky that any shipwrecks in shipping lanes or hunting grounds are still intact. those drag nets go down pretty ##*& far.
.

SethChandler

Lance, forgot to add, thank you so much for creating an easy to read spreadsheet. Much appreciated.

Seth

LanceNewmanOCC

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welcome
.

FullStrike

Can we get a Second Recovery Operation - First Sold label on one of these?


Sell it at auction - benefits to homeless line sitters fund.

BillyKingsley

Cool to read this thread today. I just finished reading the 1998 book "Ship of Gold in the Deep Blue Sea" about 8 PM tonight. (Sunday). It told the story of how the ship was found, but very little on the actual recovery items- it was more about the recovery process. (Something I find very interesting in and of itself). It's a really interesting story and what they went through to get where they got is inspiring in and of itself. They also discovered more than a dozen new species of aquatic life forms by the time the book was published in 1998, I'd guess they've identified more since then.

One of my goals is to see something pulled out of this ship in person. I'll never be able to afford to own anything recovered from it, so I will be happy just to see it.

They actually don't know how much gold was on the ship, according to the book. They know 21 tons (!) were registered, but they believe that much or more may have been unregistered. Or at least they did in 1998. I'm too tired to read the articles or investigate the spreadsheets tonight, but I am looking forward to reading them in the future.

Treashunt

<< <i>Anyone want to go diving with me? >>



[Note: my hand is raised!]

coinsarefun

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the spreadsheet has been updated to reflect the most recently publicly available pdf. thanks to those involved and for sharing this info!

i kept this update separate from the original and if you would like, you can data sort by date (column F) to get an updated/organized census.

did some minor "tweaking" to previous version as well.

I hope this helps

enjoy!
.

dcarr

<< <i>Did anyone notice the 1853-S Eagle? Maybe a typo.......????? How awesome would that be? >>



There is also an "1836-O" quarter eagle listed.

FullStrike

OMG. They found coal! Bring it up - I want some certified SSCA Coal . Black Gold !

HalfStrike

The final recovered coins for the year are posted in PDF 6 on the first post.