All's fair......................

keets · June 29, 2014 2:06AM

.............................in Love and War --- and CherryPicking. Do you think it is, regardless of who the participants are and what the dynamics might be??

Al H.

AUandAG · June 29, 2014 2:10AM

Sure it is all fair. Many of us specialize and know what we want. We become "experts" in that search. Some
of us don't take the time to do the research and are fair game for those that do. I know I've been cherried
on series I don't care about...oh well.

bob

bidask · June 29, 2014 2:22AM

After graduating college and when I was a younger man I almost chose numismatics as a profession.

I enjoyed the hunt for coins, especially raw coins , among dealer cases on a bourse at coin shows.

I enjoyed buying, selling and trading coins among fellow collectors and dealers.

I had no problem cherry picking those folk ( and btw I have been cherry picked) for what I hoped to be for profit.

I also wanted to establish a brick and mortar coin shop.

But after thinking long and hard about that and seeing first hand what goes on in other B&M's I chose not pursue numismatics as a profession because I could not in good conscience rip buying coins from an unsuspecting public.

I could not live with myself doing that so I relegated numismatics as a hobby and instead chose another vocation.

Moldnut · June 29, 2014 2:41AM

.

I enjoyed buying, selling and trading coins among fellow collectors and dealers.

I had no problem cherry picking those folk ( and btw I have been cherry picked) for what I hoped to be for profit.

But after thinking long and hard about that and seeing first hand what goes on in other B&M's I chose not pursue numismatics as a profession because I could not in good conscience rip buying coins from an unsuspecting public.. >>

What's the difference if you don't have a problem doing it to fellow collectors and dealers than doing it in a B&M shop. Same thing really.

TwoSides2aCoin · June 29, 2014 2:42AM

The statement is false.
All is not fair in war. Only in love.
in numismatics, cherry picking is an art form with the lowest standards, that is; until the cherry pick is in the right hands. That can sometimes lead to war, which isn't fair.

MrHalfDime · June 29, 2014 2:44AM

All may be fair in love and war, but sometimes that may not be true in cherrypicking, depending upon who the participants are.

I may have told this story before, but it bears repeating. I was at the FUN Show in Orlando a dozen years ago or so, and stopped by one of my favorite dealer's table. I always stopped by to chat, no matter whether or not he had anything for me. This time I was rewarded with a very special coin, however. The dealer reached behind him and pulled out a small bank envelope from his briefcase with my name on it. This coin, whatever it was, was not out for public consumption; it was held exclusively for me, a privilege that I very much valued. Inside the envelope was a very nice, raw, AU Capped Bust half dime, precisely what I collect. I quickly noticed that it was an 1837, a date which included two very scarce (at that time, one scarce, one rare) die marriages, the LM-2/V4 and the LM-3/V5, which were at the time R5 and R6, respectively. Instinctively, I turned the coin over to check the C in AMERICA, and saw the diagnostic doubled serif, characteristic of both of the scarce marriages. My heart started to pound as I turned the coin over, knowing that I was looking at either an R5 or an R6 coin, and a nice one at that. I looked at the relationship of star 13 to the curl, and nearly fainted when I saw that it pointed high on the curl. This was a high AU example of the scarcest die marriage for the date, an R6 at the time. I was completely speechless, and went on 'automatic pilot'. I looked at the dealer, ignored his very reasonable price listed on the holder for a generic 1837 CBHD, and asked what he would take for it. I don't really know what I was thinking, as I would have gladly, nee eagerly, paid him his asking price. I was just completely speechless. He thought a second and countered with a price about $20 lower. Fortunately, I came to my senses and gave him his original asking price, shook his hand, and walked away, still in a daze. Later that evening, at a JRCS open house, the coin was passed around the room, and all agreed that I had the cherrypick of the day, if not the entire show. All agreed that it was the finest known 1837 LM3/V5, a solid AU-55. [The coin is now in a PCGS AU-58 holder].

After much thought, I decided that I would go back to the seller, my friend of many years, and give him more money for my serendipitous find. I mentioned this idea to a very good friend and confidant, and he looked at me with a look I had never seen before and stated "Don't you dare!!". I told him that I felt a bit guilty about the purchase, and because he was a friend I felt obligated to give him more money. This other friend again forcefully repeated his admonishment not to give him one more cent, and when I inquired as to why, he made a rather interesting point. He asked me if I was happy with my purchase, at the price I paid. I, of course, said yes. He then asked me if I thought that the seller was happy with the transaction and the price he was paid, knowing what he knew at the time, and I guessed that he was. He then asked me how much more I was thinking about giving the seller, and I said "I don't know, maybe $500". My friend then pointed out that by volunteering to pay the seller multiples of the original selling price, the day after the sale, the seller would always wonder what the coin was really worth, and would likely be skeptical of selling me coins in the future. He suggested that I just keep mum about the cherrypick, and continue to purchase coins from the seller, even make a few 'courtesy purchases' from him, and make no mention of the cherrypick. I took my friend's advice, and never made mention of the fabulous cherrypick to the seller, who remains a good friend, and from whom I have subsequently made many coin purchases. Was this the right choice? I may never know. But no one's feelings were hurt based upon what each of the participants knew at the time.

johnny54321 · June 29, 2014 2:45AM

<< After graduating college and when I was a younger man I almost chose numismatics as a profession.

I enjoyed the hunt for coins, especially raw coins , among dealer cases on a bourse at coin shows.

I enjoyed buying, selling and trading coins among fellow collectors and dealers.

I had no problem cherry picking those folk ( and btw I have been cherry picked) for what I hoped to be for profit.

I also wanted to establish a brick and mortar coin shop.

But after thinking long and hard about that and seeing first hand what goes on in other B&M's I chose not pursue numismatics as a profession because I could not in good conscience rip buying coins from an unsuspecting public.

I could not live with myself doing that so I relegated numismatics as a hobby and instead chose another vocation. >>

So are you saying that dealers, in general, rip people off?

bidask · June 29, 2014 2:45AM

<< .

I enjoyed buying, selling and trading coins among fellow collectors and dealers.

I had no problem cherry picking those folk ( and btw I have been cherry picked) for what I hoped to be for profit.

But after thinking long and hard about that and seeing first hand what goes on in other B&M's I chose not pursue numismatics as a profession because I could not in good conscience rip buying coins from an unsuspecting public.. >>

What's the difference if you don't have a problem doing it to fellow collectors and dealers than doing it in a B&M shop. Same thing really. >>

No not really.......

Many coins that are brought into B&M's for sale are inherited, come out of an estate, etc.

The people who bring those coins in most often have no experience in coins.

MidLifeCrisis · June 29, 2014 2:45AM

Cherry Picking is not unique to numismatics.

If I went into a guitar shop and found an original '59 Cherry Sunburst Les Paul on sale for a couple grand because the shop owner didn't know what he had, I'd buy it as fast as I could get my wallet out.

The flip side of that record is that it's likely the shop owner paid less than his asking price for the guitar so he still makes a profit.

So it is with coins.

bidask · June 29, 2014 2:47AM

<< 

<< After graduating college and when I was a younger man I almost chose numismatics as a profession.

I enjoyed the hunt for coins, especially raw coins , among dealer cases on a bourse at coin shows.

I enjoyed buying, selling and trading coins among fellow collectors and dealers.

I had no problem cherry picking those folk ( and btw I have been cherry picked) for what I hoped to be for profit.

I also wanted to establish a brick and mortar coin shop.

But after thinking long and hard about that and seeing first hand what goes on in other B&M's I chose not pursue numismatics as a profession because I could not in good conscience rip buying coins from an unsuspecting public.

I could not live with myself doing that so I relegated numismatics as a hobby and instead chose another vocation. >>

So are you saying that dealers, in general, rip people off? >>

What do you think?

TwoSides2aCoin · June 29, 2014 2:51AM

I'll admit the temptation is strong to "RIP"…. and often times I flat out tell people my pockets are not deep enough, but " if you are not offered at least $____________, call me. I will put a mortgage on the house, or place a call to a few rich guys who would love 5 % on 5 figures in 5 days.

BAJJERFAN · June 29, 2014 2:52AM

<< .

I enjoyed buying, selling and trading coins among fellow collectors and dealers.

I had no problem cherry picking those folk ( and btw I have been cherry picked) for what I hoped to be for profit.

But after thinking long and hard about that and seeing first hand what goes on in other B&M's I chose not pursue numismatics as a profession because I could not in good conscience rip buying coins from an unsuspecting public.. >>

What's the difference if you don't have a problem doing it to fellow collectors and dealers than doing it in a B&M shop. Same thing really. >>

Other dealers and collectors can be assumed to be knowledgeable whereas the general public is likely not. If they were knowledgeable they wouldn't be selling to B & Ms for pennies on the dollar in the first place. If deceit or lying is involved, it is unfair on all levels.

291fifth · June 29, 2014 3:04AM

Sometimes the cherry-pickers fool themselves by buying items that really don't have a market. They just keep piling up their treasures unaware that the only people who are interested in them are other cherry-pickers who won't buy them if they have to pay a premium.

Justlooking · June 29, 2014 3:11AM

<< Sometimes the cherry-pickers fool themselves by buying items that really don't have a market. They just keep piling up their treasures unaware that the only people who are interested in them are other cherry-pickers who won't buy them if they have to pay a premium. >>

That's a good point.

I don't know ... just because something's fair doesn't mean it feels right.

DeliaBug · June 29, 2014 3:14AM

When John Ford asked Wayte Raymond what the secret to being a successful dealer was, Wayte's reply was "just know more then the person you're dealing with". Still holds water. And the same saying is true on the buying side. And I don't like the term 'cherry-picking' - if you have the knowledge, use it.

ctf_error_coins · June 29, 2014 3:16AM

In almost every profession, the business owner uses their knowledge to make a profit.

TwoSides2aCoin · June 29, 2014 3:30AM

<< In almost every profession, the business owner uses their knowledge to make a profit. >>

True enough. Cherry picking is obsolete in a brothel.

Moldnut · June 29, 2014 3:32AM

<< 

<< In almost every profession, the business owner uses their knowledge to make a profit. >>

True enough. Cherry picking is obsolete in a brothel. >>

ricko · June 29, 2014 3:42AM

The term 'cherrypicking' has, for some, a negative connotation. Strangely enough, in most businesses, it is looked upon favorably. Getting a 'good deal' is not a crime, nor is it unethical. If you pay the asked price, you have conformed to both the legal and ethical aspects of the deal. Knowledge in your field is an advantage and should be rewarded. Go forth and cherrypick with a clear conscience. Cheers, RickO