How's that Bundesbank Gold Repatriation going? Opps! LOL! Sure is hard when all the Gold has '...dis
C0INB0Y
Posts: 627 ✭✭
***********This series of emails explains IMHO, the basis of all the 'monkey-hammering' going on in Gold. It is simply an attempt (not working anymore) by the Banksters to induce panic and shake out the physical as well perpetuating the 'great unwinding' which is now hilariously failing. You can't make this absurdity up! The decoupling of paper to physical is happening before our eyes. Keep on stacking!**********
Gold trying to be explained away
Did the Bundesbank get even a little of its original gold back?
Submitted by cpowell on Sat, 2014-01-04 20:00. Section: Daily Dispatches
3:49p ET Saturday, January 4, 2014
Dear Friend of GATA and Gold:
Correspondence between the German financial journalist Lars Schall and Germany's Bundesbank suggests that the small amount of gold the Bundesbank claims recently to have repatriated from the Federal Reserve Bank of New York was not returned in the form in which it was deposited many years ago -- that, indeed, the original German gold was not and is not available to be returned because something undisclosed was done with it.
Schall's correspondence with the Bundesbank is appended along with a statement by Peter Boehringer of the German Precious Metal Society and a leader of the movement in Germany seeking repatriation of the country's gold supposedly vaulted abroad, who raises questions the Bundesbank has yet to answer.
CHRIS POWELL, Secretary/Treasurer
Gold Anti-Trust Action Committee Inc.
* * *
December 26, 2013
Dear Ladies and Gentlemen:
I am an independent financial journalist.
In connection with the transfer of 37 tons of Bundesbank gold from New York to Germany, I came across the news that the bars were a melted before the transfer. May I kindly ask you for the following information:
Why were the bars melted at all? And why couldn't that wait until the bars arrived in Frankfurt?
Kind regards,
Lars Schall
* * *
January 3, 2014
Dear Mr Schall:
Thank you for your enquiry.
At a press conference on the topic of Germany's gold reserves on 16 January 2013, Executive Board member Carl-Ludwig Thiele presented the Deutsche Bundesbank's new storage concept. In addition to the relocation of gold bars, this concept includes, amongst other things, measures to ensure that the specifications of the London Good Delivery (LGD) standard are met. You can find these specifications on Page 17 of the following presentation:
http://www.bundesbank.de/Redaktion/DE/Downloads/Presse/Publikationen/201...
Storage plan (new)
..................... 2012 ........... 2020
Frankfurt ....... 31% ............ 50%
New York ....... 45% ............ 37%
London .......... 13% ............ 13%
Paris .............. 11% .............. 0%
Planned relocations:
-- Phased relocation of 300 tonnes of gold from New York to Frankfurt.
-- Phased relocation of 374 tonnes of gold from Paris to Frankfurt.
-- Achieve LGD standard, where this is not already the case.
You can find the specifications for the London Good Delivery (LGD) standard at the following address:
http://www.lbma.org.uk/pages/index.cfm?page_id=27.
In cases where these specifications were not already met, the Bundesbank had these original gold bars melted down and recast in order to meet this standard. This was achieved without any difficulties.
Please understand that in order to ensure the security of the gold transports and our employees, the Bundesbank is unable to provide you with any further information.
Yours sincerely,
DEUTSCHE BUNDESBANK
Communication
Wilhelm-Epstein-Strasse 14
60431 Frankfurt am Main
Tel.: +49 69 9566x3511 or 3512
* * *
Statement by Peter Boehringer, president of German Precious Metal Society and co-initiator of the Repatriate our Gold campaign --
http://www.gold-action.de/campaign.html
-- on the Bundesbank's response.
Why does the Bundesbank continue to avoid transparency regarding Germany's gold holdings?
Why not just come up with easy-to-deliver facts instead of repeated rhetoric about an alleged remelting of gold bars in the United States that even people with some knowledge of the gold industry and some common sense fail to understand?
There is no reason why the original gold bars acquired in the 1950s and 1960s (if they ever existed at all, which has never been proven, as by publication of bar lists or photos) had to be melted down and recast into LGD-compliant bars in New York as opposed to Frankfurt. Nor is there reason why all this had to be done in obscurity without any published report of the recasting.
The public is still waiting for answers to crucial questions like these:
-- What kind of gold bars were melted? Original material from the 1950s and '60s?
-- How can the Bundesbank hint in its press release that some of the old bars already met the LGD specifications when those specifications were not defined and made a standard for central bank bars until 1979?
-- Why has the Bundesbank not published a bar number list of the old bars? How can there be security concerns about bars that no longer exist? Why has the Bundesbank not published a bar number list of the newly cast bars?
-- Who exactly melted the bars? Where exactly was this melting performed? Is there a smelter at the Federal Reserve Bank of New York?
-- Who witnessed the melting and recasting of the bars?
-- Are there any reports on this in writing with a valid signature? By whom?
-- And especially: Why was it deemed necessary to perform this action in the United States as opposed to Frankfurt or nearby Hanau, where there are some of the best facilities in the world for metal probing, melting, and recasting? Had these actions been performed in Germany in a fully transparent manner, it would have been so easy for the Bundesbank to dismiss all questions from "paranoid gold conspiracy theorists."
The Bundesbank is just the custodian of Germany's national gold, which is worth more than $125 billion. The Bundesbank owes the public full transparency in all these gold matters. That is, physical audits, independently verified storage reports, and a publication of the full bar lists of all its gold in all national or international vaults.
Despite having now had the excellent opportunity of this partial repatriation, the Bundesbank has again failed to produce any proof or indication that at least 37 tonnes (out of 1,500 tonnes of German gold at the New York Fed) still existed through 2013 in their original 1950s-'60s bar form. Instead, Germany is now owner of almost 3,000 LGD-compliant standard bars, which proves nothing and dismisses no allegations of decade-long manipulation of the gold price.
It is still possible and even probable that the old German bars were lent into the market long ago or that they have multiple owners or are backing multiple gold exchange-traded fund derivatives. Of course the same holds for our remaining 120,000 bars at the New York Fed.
The "repatriation" of a mere 1.5 percent of Germany's foreign gold holdings and the supposed melting and recasting of the original gold bars do not prove the continued existence of Germany's remaining gold holdings supposedly vaulted at the New York Fed.
The Bundesbank has missed a great opportunity to bring transparency to Germany's gold reserves. What a pity. And at its current speed the Bundesbank will require 60 years to accomplish the repatriation mission forced upon it by an impatient public. What a shame.
The initiators of the Repatriate Our Gold campaign --
http://www.gold-action.de/campaign.html
-- are considering legal action based on freedom-of-information law against the Bundesbank and possibly also against its auditors, who have certified the Bundesbank's balance sheet without having adequately considered the risks associated with a non-transparent gold hoard, which is the only asset of substance on the Bundesbank's books. (Ninety percent of those assets are mere paper claims, many of dubious quality, like "Target 2" claims.)
Our objective remains to achieve the publication of all gold bar lists and full transparency involving Germany's gold. The German people are entitled to have all information about their golden property.
And the American people have a right to know as well. After all, it is the U.S. Federal Reserve System and the U.S. Treasury Department that have been obscuring their gold holdings and foreign gold holdings since the last proper audit in 1953.
Gold trying to be explained away
Did the Bundesbank get even a little of its original gold back?
Submitted by cpowell on Sat, 2014-01-04 20:00. Section: Daily Dispatches
3:49p ET Saturday, January 4, 2014
Dear Friend of GATA and Gold:
Correspondence between the German financial journalist Lars Schall and Germany's Bundesbank suggests that the small amount of gold the Bundesbank claims recently to have repatriated from the Federal Reserve Bank of New York was not returned in the form in which it was deposited many years ago -- that, indeed, the original German gold was not and is not available to be returned because something undisclosed was done with it.
Schall's correspondence with the Bundesbank is appended along with a statement by Peter Boehringer of the German Precious Metal Society and a leader of the movement in Germany seeking repatriation of the country's gold supposedly vaulted abroad, who raises questions the Bundesbank has yet to answer.
CHRIS POWELL, Secretary/Treasurer
Gold Anti-Trust Action Committee Inc.
* * *
December 26, 2013
Dear Ladies and Gentlemen:
I am an independent financial journalist.
In connection with the transfer of 37 tons of Bundesbank gold from New York to Germany, I came across the news that the bars were a melted before the transfer. May I kindly ask you for the following information:
Why were the bars melted at all? And why couldn't that wait until the bars arrived in Frankfurt?
Kind regards,
Lars Schall
* * *
January 3, 2014
Dear Mr Schall:
Thank you for your enquiry.
At a press conference on the topic of Germany's gold reserves on 16 January 2013, Executive Board member Carl-Ludwig Thiele presented the Deutsche Bundesbank's new storage concept. In addition to the relocation of gold bars, this concept includes, amongst other things, measures to ensure that the specifications of the London Good Delivery (LGD) standard are met. You can find these specifications on Page 17 of the following presentation:
http://www.bundesbank.de/Redaktion/DE/Downloads/Presse/Publikationen/201...
Storage plan (new)
..................... 2012 ........... 2020
Frankfurt ....... 31% ............ 50%
New York ....... 45% ............ 37%
London .......... 13% ............ 13%
Paris .............. 11% .............. 0%
Planned relocations:
-- Phased relocation of 300 tonnes of gold from New York to Frankfurt.
-- Phased relocation of 374 tonnes of gold from Paris to Frankfurt.
-- Achieve LGD standard, where this is not already the case.
You can find the specifications for the London Good Delivery (LGD) standard at the following address:
http://www.lbma.org.uk/pages/index.cfm?page_id=27.
In cases where these specifications were not already met, the Bundesbank had these original gold bars melted down and recast in order to meet this standard. This was achieved without any difficulties.
Please understand that in order to ensure the security of the gold transports and our employees, the Bundesbank is unable to provide you with any further information.
Yours sincerely,
DEUTSCHE BUNDESBANK
Communication
Wilhelm-Epstein-Strasse 14
60431 Frankfurt am Main
Tel.: +49 69 9566x3511 or 3512
* * *
Statement by Peter Boehringer, president of German Precious Metal Society and co-initiator of the Repatriate our Gold campaign --
http://www.gold-action.de/campaign.html
-- on the Bundesbank's response.
Why does the Bundesbank continue to avoid transparency regarding Germany's gold holdings?
Why not just come up with easy-to-deliver facts instead of repeated rhetoric about an alleged remelting of gold bars in the United States that even people with some knowledge of the gold industry and some common sense fail to understand?
There is no reason why the original gold bars acquired in the 1950s and 1960s (if they ever existed at all, which has never been proven, as by publication of bar lists or photos) had to be melted down and recast into LGD-compliant bars in New York as opposed to Frankfurt. Nor is there reason why all this had to be done in obscurity without any published report of the recasting.
The public is still waiting for answers to crucial questions like these:
-- What kind of gold bars were melted? Original material from the 1950s and '60s?
-- How can the Bundesbank hint in its press release that some of the old bars already met the LGD specifications when those specifications were not defined and made a standard for central bank bars until 1979?
-- Why has the Bundesbank not published a bar number list of the old bars? How can there be security concerns about bars that no longer exist? Why has the Bundesbank not published a bar number list of the newly cast bars?
-- Who exactly melted the bars? Where exactly was this melting performed? Is there a smelter at the Federal Reserve Bank of New York?
-- Who witnessed the melting and recasting of the bars?
-- Are there any reports on this in writing with a valid signature? By whom?
-- And especially: Why was it deemed necessary to perform this action in the United States as opposed to Frankfurt or nearby Hanau, where there are some of the best facilities in the world for metal probing, melting, and recasting? Had these actions been performed in Germany in a fully transparent manner, it would have been so easy for the Bundesbank to dismiss all questions from "paranoid gold conspiracy theorists."
The Bundesbank is just the custodian of Germany's national gold, which is worth more than $125 billion. The Bundesbank owes the public full transparency in all these gold matters. That is, physical audits, independently verified storage reports, and a publication of the full bar lists of all its gold in all national or international vaults.
Despite having now had the excellent opportunity of this partial repatriation, the Bundesbank has again failed to produce any proof or indication that at least 37 tonnes (out of 1,500 tonnes of German gold at the New York Fed) still existed through 2013 in their original 1950s-'60s bar form. Instead, Germany is now owner of almost 3,000 LGD-compliant standard bars, which proves nothing and dismisses no allegations of decade-long manipulation of the gold price.
It is still possible and even probable that the old German bars were lent into the market long ago or that they have multiple owners or are backing multiple gold exchange-traded fund derivatives. Of course the same holds for our remaining 120,000 bars at the New York Fed.
The "repatriation" of a mere 1.5 percent of Germany's foreign gold holdings and the supposed melting and recasting of the original gold bars do not prove the continued existence of Germany's remaining gold holdings supposedly vaulted at the New York Fed.
The Bundesbank has missed a great opportunity to bring transparency to Germany's gold reserves. What a pity. And at its current speed the Bundesbank will require 60 years to accomplish the repatriation mission forced upon it by an impatient public. What a shame.
The initiators of the Repatriate Our Gold campaign --
http://www.gold-action.de/campaign.html
-- are considering legal action based on freedom-of-information law against the Bundesbank and possibly also against its auditors, who have certified the Bundesbank's balance sheet without having adequately considered the risks associated with a non-transparent gold hoard, which is the only asset of substance on the Bundesbank's books. (Ninety percent of those assets are mere paper claims, many of dubious quality, like "Target 2" claims.)
Our objective remains to achieve the publication of all gold bar lists and full transparency involving Germany's gold. The German people are entitled to have all information about their golden property.
And the American people have a right to know as well. After all, it is the U.S. Federal Reserve System and the U.S. Treasury Department that have been obscuring their gold holdings and foreign gold holdings since the last proper audit in 1953.
I was ‘COINB0Y' with 4812 posts and ‘Expert Collector’ ranking (Joined in 2006).
0
Comments
I knew it would happen.
<< <i>There's no need to account for any gold. It's a useless metal. Nobody really needs it. If it was really important, we would be using it as money. There's not enough of it to function as money, anyway. It doesn't draw interest or provide a stream of cash flow. It's so irrelevant that nobody even knows where it is. End of story. No, really - there's nothing to see here.
well said! Plus, it's none of your business unless it's YOUR GOLD
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
I was under the distinct impression that Ft. Knox does hold my gold (or did at one time). Silly me. I must have been dreaming. If only everyone could take a more passive approach to government finance. These pesky people who want accountability are making things crazy. Yes, they must be nut jobs!
I knew it would happen.
<< <i>it's none of your business unless it's YOUR GOLD
I was under the distinct impression that Ft. Knox does hold my gold (or did at one time). Silly me. I must have been dreaming. If only everyone could take a more passive approach to government finance. These pesky people who want accountability are making things crazy. Yes, they must be nut jobs! >>
What gave you that impression that it was your gold? The Feds purchased it with so called "worthless fiat" currency from the 49's, Todd Hoffman & Parker Schnabel.
<< <i>it's none of your business unless it's YOUR GOLD
I was under the distinct impression that Ft. Knox does hold my gold (or did at one time). Silly me. I must have been dreaming. If only everyone could take a more passive approach to government finance. These pesky people who want accountability are making things crazy. Yes, they must be nut jobs! >>
The gold in Fort Knox "belongs" to you in the same sense that Yosemite "belongs to you"... it's and "undivided interest, with mutual shared use"... similar to the 1/144th "ownership" I have in my condo's pool, spa, trees, greenbelts, etc.
No, you don't get to "have your share" for your exclusive use... that gold is busy being the nation's asset... and the subject of conspiracy theories
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
<< <i>
<< <i>it's none of your business unless it's YOUR GOLD
I was under the distinct impression that Ft. Knox does hold my gold (or did at one time). Silly me. I must have been dreaming. If only everyone could take a more passive approach to government finance. These pesky people who want accountability are making things crazy. Yes, they must be nut jobs! >>
The gold in Fort Knox "belongs" to you in the same sense that Yosemite "belongs to you"... it's and "undivided interest, with mutual shared use"... similar to the 1/144th "ownership" I have in my condo's pool, spa, trees, greenbelts, etc.
No, you don't get to "have your share" for your exclusive use... that gold is busy being the nation's asset... and the subject of conspiracy theories
What gold?
"How many times can a man turn his head and pretend he just doesn’t see?” - Bob Dylan
Exactly! Out if sight, out of mind. There's hope for you yet
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
The implication here is that treasury gold , 90% gold bars are being recast into .999 bars to backstop the fed because instead of storing the German gold they sold it. The treasury gold belongs to the people of America not the Fed.
The Fed doesn't have the authority to take Fort Knox gold on its own.
"How many times can a man turn his head and pretend he just doesn’t see?” - Bob Dylan
<< <i>FED is given authority to create money. Surely they are free to get rid of it. >>
*BINGO*
<< <i>FED is given authority to create money. Surely they are free to get rid of it. >>
DOUBLE BINGO
I was under the impression that only the secretary of the treasury is authorized to sell gold belonging to the United States Treasury. There were restrictions on when and what price such sales could take place. Have those restrictions been lifted?
"How many times can a man turn his head and pretend he just doesn’t see?” - Bob Dylan
If you leased it it would still be there right? so the original bars could be returned. It's either a case of stolen gold by the Fed or it represents another bailout of the Fed by the Treasury.
<< <i>I was under the impression that only the secretary of the treasury is authorized to sell gold belonging to the United States Treasury. There were restrictions on when and what price such sales could take place. Have those restrictions been lifted? >>
I believe that under U.S. law, gold can only be sold by the Treasury to repay government debt.
The general public is not asking when the delivery dates are as that could pose a security compromise. The other questions could be answered. Is the German gold in NY from the 1950's and 1960's West Germany? Is there a concern that it might be from the Germany of 1933-1945? By melting down the bars to a different purity could also be interpreted as covering metallurgical tracks.
Conspiracy theories.....
BST: Tennessebanker, Downtown1974, LarkinCollector, nendee
HE>I
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
random gold chart
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
<< <i>There's a man holding a gun over a dead person therefor he must have killed him. >>
guilty until proven innocent.
"How many times can a man turn his head and pretend he just doesn’t see?” - Bob Dylan
Some news on this subject only 5 tons came from the FED the rest was from Paris
<< <i>There's a man holding a gun over a dead person therefore he must have killed him. >>
In our bizzarro legal and criminal system, such a person would likely end up in jail for a long time unless they could afford a high priced lawyer....and were actually innocent.
Sadly, appearances are nine tenths of the law. It's not good enough to be innocent any more. You need more than that on your side.
"How many times can a man turn his head and pretend he just doesn’t see?” - Bob Dylan
"All bars brought into the vault for deposit are carefully weighed, and the refiner and fineness (purity) markings on the bars are inspected to ensure they agree with the depositor instructions and recorded in the New York Fed’s records. This step is vital because the New York Fed returns the exact bars deposited by the account holder upon withdrawal—gold deposits are not considered fungible."
<< <i>why sell it when you can loan it out over and over and over and over and over and over >>
Why not sell it AND lease IT?
HE>I
"The German government then asked to visit the FED vaults to inventory the gold and determine its actual existence, but the FED refused to permit Germany to examine its own gold. The reasons given were “security” and “no room for visitors”. And nothing else."
"How many times can a man turn his head and pretend he just doesn’t see?” - Bob Dylan
I remember going to the vault at the Maiden Lane with the group of other students and walking across the cages with huge piles of the gold bars while the guide was saying "This cage is the gold reserve of Country X" ant that one is "Country Y".
At the time NY Fed vault was just another tourist attraction, now they would not let the owners in.
If I knew I would've counted Germany's pile :-) On the other hand they may already have been painted tungsten :-)