Detroit files for bankruptcy, holy crap!
morgansforever
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The city's long-term debt is estimated at $18.5 billion. How do you financial guys interpret this? I find it very disturbing.
Detroitlink
Detroitlink
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Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
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I knew it would happen.
• it's the largest city to file but not the first (so one of y'all should look up how the market was affected last time)
• debt is over 300 million, long term debt is 14.5 billion
• the "white house is monitoring the situation closely"
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<< <i>I thought Obama saved Detroit.
He's down to just "killing OBL."
<< <i>How many days does it take to become eligible for Chapter 9? Is this done by a Federal agency? I can't believe what I'm reading
Papers have been filed, they're already Chapter 9.
Current broadcast interviewee (some expert) is saying the municipal bonds market is already going nuts and nearby Oakdale(?) which has a AAA credit rating may be affected.
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Maybe I'll get bailed out !!!
<< <i>Just a way for them to get out of paying city employees their retirement pensions.
There's a rash about to spread.
Meaning there are other cities not far behind? Buffalo, Cleveland, Cincinnati?
<< <i><<There's a rash about to spread.>>
Meaning there are other cities not far behind? Buffalo, Cleveland, Cincinnati? >>
I would imagine more than that.
<< <i>
<< <i><<There's a rash about to spread.>>
Meaning there are other cities not far behind? Buffalo, Cleveland, Cincinnati? >>
I would imagine more than that. >>
California, etc.............................................times up over POW!
<< <i>
<< <i>I thought Obama saved Detroit.
He's down to just "killing OBL." >>
The POS didnt even do that. The Navy Seals did
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
peacockcoins
Many cities, districts and States (country??) could be next.
"“Those who sacrifice liberty for security/safety deserve neither.“(Benjamin Franklin)
"I only golf on days that end in 'Y'" (DE59)
Do you think there are investors that see an opportunity?
There are likely some folks from China that could look at the total debt and think this might be a nice entry into finding some decent land in a commercially well connected location to begin some colonization efforts ala Hong Kong. One thing for sure if it goes that way...all this PC silliness with the "underserved" population will be over and the Unions that drove that city into the ground will never be heard from again. Could be an interesting scenario. It would certainly dominate the news cycle for a while.
Edited to add: Think of the Chinese buying the city as the latest evolution of the "Factory Outlet" or "Regional Distribution Center" for Chinese products.
Jefferson County, Alabama, filed the biggest U.S. municipal bankruptcy after an agreement among elected officials and investors to refinance $3.1 billion in sewer bonds fell apart.
The county, home to Birmingham, the state’s most-populous city, listed assets and debt of more than $1 billion in Chapter 9 papers filed today in U.S. Bankruptcy Court in Birmingham.
Jeffco officials react to being surpassed by Detroit as largest municipal bankruptcy in U.S. history
July 18, 2013 at 6:40 PM, updated July 19, 2013 at 3:29 AM
SKYLINE.JPGDowntown Birmingham in Jefferson County.
BIRMINGHAM, Alabama -- Jefferson County no longer is the largest municipality to file a Chapter 9 bankruptcy in U.S. history.
Detroit, with $18 billion in debt and liabilities, today eclipsed Jefferson County as the largest municipality to file bankruptcy.
"This is one category I'm happy to be number two," said Jefferson County Manager Tony Petelos.
Detroit's Chapter 9 case filed in U.S. Bankruptcy Court for the Eastern District of Michigan came after the city's emergency manager failed to reach agreements with bondholders, pension funds and other creditors to restructure Detroit's debt outside of bankruptcy court.
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I have a very strict gun control policy: if there's a gun around, I want to be in control of it - Clint Eastwood
One such street 'Grand River' has empty lots and boarded up buildings.
The only buildings that were operating were churches, Christian centers, community centers and the odd US Post office, oh and I forgot, one or two liquor stores and dry cleaners.
"“Those who sacrifice liberty for security/safety deserve neither.“(Benjamin Franklin)
"I only golf on days that end in 'Y'" (DE59)
abandoned detroit slideshow
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<< <i>Just one more step on the downward spiral of America....Cheers, RickO >>
No argument here!!!!!
Yes, I see tremendous investment potential in Detroit.
Bankruptcies are an excellent way to rid excess. I hope there are more. And no, these events do not make gold a guaranteed winner.
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
<< <i>Bankruptcies are an excellent way to rid excess. I hope there are more. And no, these events do not make gold a guaranteed winner. >>
For municipalities bankruptcies are the way to negate outrageous public employee retirement pay and benefits that were recklessly promised earlier by municipal politicians seeking re-election. Promises were made that can no longer be kept, especially with declining revenue and a reduction in money veloctiy (generates sales tax income). Excess can generally be dealt with by internal reorganization/cutbacks in spending. Bankruptcy is used to void contracted promises that can otherwise not be reduced. Keep in mind that events such as Detroit can have a negative affect on the states fiscal status.
Investment potential in Detroit wil not exist until Detroit sees real jobs and not entitlement income dependent residents. Like fiat money, cities can also experience a slow death.
Detroit is a perfect example of what happens when jobs are destroyed, income earners leave, and the majority of the population is living off of entitlements. A classic case of Thatcher's "the problem with socialism is you eventually run out of other peoples' money." Detroit has run out and lost its sources of replenishment. While not the first municipality in modern times, Detroit is far from the last to get to this point. The affect of these events on gold is dependent upon creation of new money (QE) to help in a recovery - a very good possibility if enough large cities suffer the same demise.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
<< <i>So ... what will this do to the PM market(s)? >>
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<< <i>
<< <i>So ... what will this do to the PM market(s)? >>
>>
The affect of these events on gold is dependent upon creation of new money (QE) to help in a recovery - a very good possibility if enough large cities suffer the same demise.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>So ... what will this do to the PM market(s)? >>
>>
The affect of these events on gold is dependent upon creation of new money (QE) to help in a recovery - a very good possibility if enough large cities suffer the same demise. >>
I don't think QE money will ever be used to help any little people.
<< <i>abandoned detroit slideshow >>
Wow, that was quite a show...
So ... what will this do to the PM market(s)?
I was thinking about how much unrecovered copper in so many huge buildings.
It's all about what the people want...
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>So ... what will this do to the PM market(s)? >>
>>
The affect of these events on gold is dependent upon creation of new money (QE) to help in a recovery - a very good possibility if enough large cities suffer the same demise. >>
I don't think QE money will ever be used to help any little people.
don't forget the little people are voters. When enough of them are affected they become eye candy for a politician.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
<< <i>
<< <i>So ... what will this do to the PM market(s)? >>
>>
I'm guessing Detroit city employees, pensioners, and contractors will be buying fewer PM's.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
The investment potential will be largely over by then. A smart investor buys assets and infrastructure first and then brings in the jobs.
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
<< <i>I thought Obama saved Detroit.
Obama did not "save Detroit." George Bush began (and made the first payments amounting to $17.4 billion) to Chrysler and GM (Ford did not believe in accepting bailout money, and thus looked elsewhere for help). Chrysler and GM are hardly synonymous with Detroit- not only are they headquartered in different cities, but unlike corrupt cities, the recipients of the bailout money had to produce a somewhat coherent and viable plan toward recovery, and unlike corrupt cities, they were held accountable to their practice and results. Congress under Obama did vote on providing the remaining $84 billion to the industry, which I believe, has to be paid back. A corrupt city wouldn't pay that money back.
Edited to add: this is coming from a man who's not a fan of American autos, no offense to anyone here
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<< <i>Ah, Detroit, where its citizenry is dependent upon themselves. . .
Just get a little dog to help with the crazies and tough guys
Edited out so that's it
Coin's for sale/trade.
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<< <i>abandoned detroit slideshow >>
The architecture in that slide show is stunning...classic. What Detroit needs is to be in an episode or two of "This Old House" but on a grand scale. I love the melted clock...Dali-esque.
<< <i>
<< <i>I thought Obama saved Detroit.
Obama did not "save Detroit." ... >>
No kidding.
<< <i> Chrysler and GM are hardly synonymous with Detroit- not only are they headquartered in different cities, ... >>
GM's HQ is in downtown Detroit.
<< <i>I thought Obama saved Detroit.
He couldn't find his ass with both hands and a flashlight
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
In God We Trust.... all others pay in Gold and Silver!
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
Nine homes currently selling for $100 or less in Detroit, including three for sale at $1 each.
For less than the price of a tank of gas, you too can be a slumlord!
Knowledge is the enemy of fear