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Is there no way to stop shiill bidding like this?

McDonnellFarmMcDonnellFarm Posts: 13
in Trading Cards & Memorabilia Forum
It's so blatant it makes me very angry. Look at this bidding activity of the highest bidders bidders: 75% bidding activity with this seller, then 85%, then a bidder with 109 bid retractions in the last 6 months. Bums me out.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=400449446562

Even the PSA 9 1951 Maurice Richard had guys with 48% and 58% bidding activity. Lame. I don't understand why anyone would buy from these people. Sell of course - they have a whole network of shill bidders to drive the price up.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=350730869222

Comments

  • Dpeck100Dpeck100 Posts: 10,912 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Both of the top bidders have a high percentage with this seller but a low overall number of items they bid on. Neither have any bid retractions in the past six months either.

    This can happen without any shilling for sure.

    Maybe there is shilling but I think at first glance you need more evidence.

  • Dpeck100Dpeck100 Posts: 10,912 ✭✭✭✭✭
    The top two bids look very legit on the second item.

    One guy clearly snipes everytime and the other places what appears to be no more then two bids on a card and has a 0% bidding history in the past 30 days.

  • MapleleafMapleleaf Posts: 506 ✭
    PWCC is a solid seller with a good reputation. Lots of buyers have a high percentage of activity with him.
    Sure, consignors can bid on their own stuff but bidders will only bid as much as they are willing to pay.
    That Howe is still a solid bargain.
  • MomandPopCardShopMomandPopCardShop Posts: 83 ✭
    There is no way PWCC is involved with shill bidding. Brent is a nice guy so some people may bid on numerous items to help him out, but if they dont pay, they are blocked.
  • addicted2ebayaddicted2ebay Posts: 2,096 ✭✭✭✭
    "some people may bid on numerous items to help him out"

    Okay.....Hmmmmm
  • DodgerfanjohnDodgerfanjohn Posts: 491 ✭✭✭


    << <i>There is no way PWCC is involved with shill bidding. >>

    Brent is a nice guy so some people may bid on numerous items to help him out, but if they dont pay, they are blocked. >>



    WTF does that mean?!?!?!?!
  • japhijaphi Posts: 223


    << <i>PWCC is a solid seller with a good reputation. Lots of buyers have a high percentage of activity with him.
    Sure, consignors can bid on their own stuff but bidders will only bid as much as they are willing to pay.
    That Howe is still a solid bargain. >>



    Agreed, last sale was 2009 for 11K so seems like the buyer did very well.
  • McDonnellFarmMcDonnellFarm Posts: 13
    What does that have to do with the issue of shill bidding going on?! If the PSA 10 Family Fun Ozzie Smith had 2 shill bidders eith 38% and 16% bid acutivity and they jacked up the price $500 on esquiresports, that should be illegal whether he got a good deal on the card or not.
  • digicatdigicat Posts: 8,551 ✭✭
    using a sniping service is a good way to avoid most shilling behavior.
    My Giants collection want list

    WTB: 2001 Leaf Rookies & Stars Longevity: Ryan Jensen #/25
  • japhijaphi Posts: 223


    << <i>What does that have to do with the issue of shill bidding going on?! If the PSA 10 Family Fun Ozzie Smith had 2 shill bidders eith 38% and 16% bid acutivity and they jacked up the price $500 on esquiresports, that should be illegal whether he got a good deal on the card or not. >>



    The idea is that no one can make you pay a price you don't want to pay. If you believe a shill bidder is driving up the price, stick them with the card.
  • JoeBanzaiJoeBanzai Posts: 12,000 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Don't bid more than you are comfortable paying. Don't worry if you don't win every card you "need".

    Have fun collecting.

    Joe
    2013,14 and 15 Certificate Award Winner Harmon Killebrew Master Set and Master Topps Set
  • scotgrebscotgreb Posts: 809 ✭✭✭
    Don't bid more than you are comfortable paying.

    That's good advice but I've taken it a step further . . .

    Don't support consignees who knowingly allow shilling.
    Focusing on baseball “playing years” HOFers. My HOF Set; https://psacard.com/psasetregistry/baseball/hall-fame-sets/hall-fame-players-managers-owners-executives-pioneers-commissioners-umpires/publishedset/77755

    Always plenty of PSA-graded cards in my ebay store -- https://ebay.com/str/thelumbercompanysportscards
  • shagrotn77shagrotn77 Posts: 5,615 ✭✭✭✭
    How can someone with 100+ bid retractions still be allowed on eBay???
    "My father would womanize, he would drink. He would make outrageous claims like he invented the question mark. Sometimes he would accuse chestnuts of being lazy. The sort of general malaise that only the genius possess and the insane lament. Our childhood was typical. Summers in Rangoon, luge lessons. In the spring we'd make meat helmets. When we were insolent we were placed in a burlap bag and beaten with reeds - pretty standard really."
  • Baez578Baez578 Posts: 967 ✭✭✭


    << <i>Don't bid more than you are comfortable paying.

    That's good advice but I've taken it a step further . . .

    Don't support consignees who knowingly allow shilling. >>



    +1
  • shagrotn77shagrotn77 Posts: 5,615 ✭✭✭✭
    The truth of the matter is, shilling is absolutely rampant with these large consignment sellers and eBay turns a blind eye because doing the right thing would take money out of their pockets. So often with these auctions, the card is at or near where it should FINISH within hours of being listed. Why? Because the shillers waste zero time.
    "My father would womanize, he would drink. He would make outrageous claims like he invented the question mark. Sometimes he would accuse chestnuts of being lazy. The sort of general malaise that only the genius possess and the insane lament. Our childhood was typical. Summers in Rangoon, luge lessons. In the spring we'd make meat helmets. When we were insolent we were placed in a burlap bag and beaten with reeds - pretty standard really."
  • esquiresportsesquiresports Posts: 1,360 ✭✭✭


    << <i>What does that have to do with the issue of shill bidding going on?! If the PSA 10 Family Fun Ozzie Smith had 2 shill bidders eith 38% and 16% bid acutivity and they jacked up the price $500 on esquiresports, that should be illegal whether he got a good deal on the card or not. >>



    Thanks for looking out for me. I'm not overly concerned with the bids on the Ozzie, although saving $500 would be nice! They were for the same amount, so presumably at least one was legit. One may have been a "safety" bid - win the card if the price isn't right, but I and at least one other person appeared to be willing to go at least $1500.

    [Edited to correct my grammar]
    Always buying 1971 OPC Baseball packs.
  • MapleleafMapleleaf Posts: 506 ✭


    << <i>Don't bid more than you are comfortable paying.

    That's good advice but I've taken it a step further . . .

    Don't support consignees who knowingly allow shilling. >>



    Good idea except all consignees can be targets of shill bidding. Even if they know about it, it is impossible to stop.
  • hammeredhammered Posts: 2,671 ✭✭✭
    There is absolutely no way for PWCC/probstein to prevent shilling. A consignor can easily shill from one of several eBay accounts, a wife's account, a friend's account. It cannot be tracked and cannot be eliminated. If you are bidding and worried about being shilled, and don't want to get stuck with a card at or near your max bid, set you max bid lower so if you're shilled and still win, you still got the card for a good price.
  • JoeBanzaiJoeBanzai Posts: 12,000 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>How can someone with 100+ bid retractions still be allowed on eBay??? >>



    Good question, while there might not be a way to keep people from shilling, can't we at least make A TOKEN EFFORT to make it a little harder?

    PLEASE!

    image

    Joe
    2013,14 and 15 Certificate Award Winner Harmon Killebrew Master Set and Master Topps Set
  • neildownneildown Posts: 183


    << <i>There is absolutely no way for PWCC/probstein to prevent shilling. A consignor can easily shill from one of several eBay accounts, a wife's account, a friend's account. It cannot be tracked and cannot be eliminated. If you are bidding and worried about being shilled, and don't want to get stuck with a card at or near your max bid, set you max bid lower so if you're shilled and still win, you still got the card for a good price. >>



    It would be nice if they attempted to monitor and enforce once in while. Sure, 78s and 79s are all the rage.
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