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Gold Bullion % owned privately?

tneigtneig Posts: 1,505 ✭✭✭
in Precious Metals
Do we even know or have an estimate of how much Gold bullion (non-jewlery) is owned privately?

Likely less than the national repositories.
Likely less than jewlery.
Less than industry?

Most just traded back and forth I would think.

I guess there is some percentage that is remelted to make newer looking bullion or coin..
COA

Comments

  • derrybderryb Posts: 36,790 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I haven't registered mine with anyone. Have you? image

    Do we really know how much gold there really is? Supposedly certain Asian families have had untold amounts hidden for centuries. Gold was being mined centuries before the mining of it was even recorded.

    "Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey

  • secondrepublicsecondrepublic Posts: 2,619 ✭✭✭
    The total gold ever mined is supposedly 171,000 tons. Link #1. Total government/central bank reserves are reported as 35,000 tons. Link #2. Based on these numbers, you can roughly estimate that about 80% of gold is privately held and 20% is held by central banks worldwide.

    Edited to add: There are statistics showing what percentage of gold is used annually for jewelry vs. bullion/investment. However, that's just for any given year. It's impossible to know how much privately held bullion versus jewelry gold there really is at any given time. It's continually changing as jewelry gets scrapped, recycled, and re-fabricated. And in places like India, gold jewelry is often so pure (22 karat +) that there's really not a big distinction between the categories of jewelry vs. bullion.
    "Men who had never shown any ability to make or increase fortunes for themselves abounded in brilliant plans for creating and increasing wealth for the country at large." Fiat Money Inflation in France, Andrew Dickson White (1912)
  • OPAOPA Posts: 17,119 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>The total gold ever mined is supposedly 171,000 tons. Link #1. Total government/central bank reserves are reported as 35,000 tons. Link #2. Based on these numbers, you can roughly estimate that about 80% of gold is privately held and 20% is held by central banks worldwide.

    Edited to add: There are statistics showing what percentage of gold is used annually for jewelry vs. bullion/investment. However, that's just for any given year. It's impossible to know how much privately held bullion versus jewelry gold there really is at any given time. It's continually changing as jewelry gets scrapped, recycled, and re-fabricated. And in places like India, gold jewelry is often so pure (22 karat +) that there's really not a big distinction between the categories of jewelry vs. bullion. >>



    Your assessment is flawed. Are we to believe, that all the gold ever mined since the dawn of mankind, is still in their possession? I don't think so. As such, 80% is way over estimated.
    "Bongo drive 1984 Lincoln that looks like old coin dug from ground."
  • tneigtneig Posts: 1,505 ✭✭✭
    Yeah, this was the tricky part. I assumed the national repositories had most of it. However, I'm happier that people may have more of it, hopefully in hand....

    But what really blew me away was..

    ..the realization that if 'all of the gold ever mined! (about $10trillion worth)' was givin to the US, including the gold we already have, we still could not pay off our national debt.

    Is that correct?

    If that is so, now I'm getting worried...
    COA
  • secondrepublicsecondrepublic Posts: 2,619 ✭✭✭


    << <i> Your assessment is flawed. Are we to believe, that all the gold ever mined since the dawn of mankind, is still in their possession? I don't think so. As such, 80% is way over estimated. >>



    I think you need to read a little more carefully. When you see the words "supposedly" and "roughly" in my comment, that's a signal that this is a ballpark figure based on the available numbers.

    As to the merits of your question, we have no way of knowing how much gold has been "lost" over the years. But considering how incredibly valuable gold is, my guess is not much has been lost. Certainly not half or even a third.
    "Men who had never shown any ability to make or increase fortunes for themselves abounded in brilliant plans for creating and increasing wealth for the country at large." Fiat Money Inflation in France, Andrew Dickson White (1912)
  • BaleyBaley Posts: 22,660 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>Yeah, this was the tricky part. I assumed the national repositories had most of it. However, I'm happier that people may have more of it, hopefully in hand....

    But what really blew me away was..

    ..the realization that if 'all of the gold ever mined! (about $10trillion worth)' was givin to the US, including the gold we already have, we still could not pay off our national debt.

    Is that correct?

    If that is so, now I'm getting worried... >>



    It's a good thing that Gold is not the only asset that individuals or nations posess. It isn't even close, proportionally, to their most valuable natural resource assets, much less infrastructure, industrial, and human productivity assets.

    Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry

  • roadrunnerroadrunner Posts: 28,303 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Gold is good to have around to balance the nation's debt and/or currency in circulation.

    During the only workable gold standard in modern history (1870-1913) most nation's kept about 40-65% of gold against debt/paper money.
    At least I read that in an article recently and it seemed reasonable. Interest rates were quite stable during that period...and the industrial world grew by leaps and bounds.

    The middle class of India is said to hold 20-30% of their total wealth in gold....probably 20,000 tonnes or more.
    Barbarous Relic No More, LSCC -GoldSeek--shadow stats--SafeHaven--321gold
  • MesquiteMesquite Posts: 4,075 ✭✭✭
    Here is an interesting graphic.

    http://www.trustablegold.com/the-gold-tree-infographic/
    There are two ways to conquer and enslave a nation. One is by the sword. The other is by debt.
    –John Adams, 1826
  • cohodkcohodk Posts: 19,095 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Gold is good to have around to balance the nation's debt and/or currency in circulation.

    Why?

    Are there other things that could be used to balance and/or provide faith?
    Excuses are tools of the ignorant

    Knowledge is the enemy of fear

  • razzlerazzle Posts: 987 ✭✭✭
    Fun graphic, mesquite. Glad they don't know where my 2% isimage
    Markets (governments) can remain irrational longer than an investor can remain solvent.
  • rickoricko Posts: 98,724 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I would like to understand what estimate was used to cover the gold mined before statistics were kept..... seems it must have been a 'guestimate'..Cheers, RickO
  • OverdateOverdate Posts: 7,007 ✭✭✭✭✭
    << The total gold ever mined is supposedly 171,000 tons. >>

    I read that they mine 97,000 tons per year. Oh wait, that's tungsten . . . image

    My Adolph A. Weinman signature :)

  • roadrunnerroadrunner Posts: 28,303 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i> Are there other things that could be used to balance and/or provide faith? >>



    Apparently not. Gold is the best thing we've been able to come up with so far.

    Not depleted, large enough volumes but still very scarce, portability, divisibility, repeatability, acceptability, stability, immutability, and readily stored and tracked.

    Faith is way overrated considering no paper currency in the world's history has ever survived. But the entire commodities complex does participate
    in this rebalancing as their prices get out of whack as well during the 20 yr bull market in "faith."
    Barbarous Relic No More, LSCC -GoldSeek--shadow stats--SafeHaven--321gold
  • derrybderryb Posts: 36,790 ✭✭✭✭✭
    All The Gold In The World - The Definitive Infographic

    "Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey

  • jmski52jmski52 Posts: 22,820 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Are there other things that could be used to balance and/or provide faith?

    Yes, it used to work in such a way that legal contracts and laws were binding, starting with the Constitution and extending to other areas of law. As many of the legal precedents are being destroyed and ignored, there is no basis left to maintain confidence that any future promises will be kept and any future obligations will be enforced.

    Absent these things, the only things you can rely on are the things in which you can still exert a modicum of control yourself.
    Q: Are You Printing Money? Bernanke: Not Literally

    I knew it would happen.
  • BaleyBaley Posts: 22,660 ✭✭✭✭✭
    there is no basis left to maintain confidence that any future promises will be kept and any future obligations will be enforced.

    image

    Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry

  • joefrojoefro Posts: 1,872 ✭✭


    << <i>All The Gold In The World - The Definitive Infographic >>



    Yep, love those graphics. The last image contains the answer to the OP's question. Supposedly private investment accounts for 18.7% of all gold. Jewelry takes up the majority with slightly over 50%.
    Lincoln Cent & Libertad Collector
  • derrybderryb Posts: 36,790 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Gold's "risk premium" is currently about $870 oz.

    "Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey

  • MesquiteMesquite Posts: 4,075 ✭✭✭
    That "risk premium" link doesn't work
    There are two ways to conquer and enslave a nation. One is by the sword. The other is by debt.
    –John Adams, 1826
  • derrybderryb Posts: 36,790 ✭✭✭✭✭
    thanks, fixed

    "Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey

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