my ngc submission of toned peace dollars and gold
indiananationals
Posts: 1,094
#1
#2
#3
#4 i though this should be a 64 at minimum
#5 this is the only one i agree with
was hoping they would grade all the toned peace dollars may have to try again later i think it is hit or miss with them
#2
#3
#4 i though this should be a 64 at minimum
#5 this is the only one i agree with
was hoping they would grade all the toned peace dollars may have to try again later i think it is hit or miss with them
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0
Comments
please tell us your point
-Paul
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<< <i>Rule 7) This is a PCGS forum. Posts promoting or bashing other grading companies or service are not allowed. Those posts will be removed and your posting privileges may be removed as well.
>>
I would tread real careful here.
any chance you were wrong?
Sorry to say... But based on the scans the coins themselves killed 80% of this submission.
The MS62 $5 Lib looks nice based on the verification scan, yet would love to see real photo's to see why you feel it was under graded 2 whole points
Steve
<< <i>And I thought I was a "complete idiot" (I recently started a thread where in which I stated that I was a complete idiot)? >>
i must have been cause i was positive the peace dollars would grade out as for the $5 gold i have seen many graded 64 or even 65 that i didnt think were as nice as this one so i was kinda bummed to only see a 62 but he at least they didnt say it was cleaned
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<< <i>If you feel #4 is MS64 then you should feel fortunate because now you can get a gold bean on it and sell for big bucks! >>
didnt think about that ...good point i may just try
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<< <i>as for the $5 gold i have seen many graded 64 or even 65 that i didn't think were as nice as this one so i was kinda bummed to only see a 62 but he at least they didn't say it was cleaned >>
Have you seen these MS64-65 $5 Libs in hand at shows or online
There's a good amount of MS61-62 dipped out common date $5 gold that's PQ to a novice...
Yet once you compare surface condition difference of a fully skinned lustrous MS64 in hand it's like day and night.
as a example i have a old $5 in a doily it is graded ms61 it was sent to CAC and JA said it was a easy ms63 so he gave it a gold bean....the coin i just sent in destroys the one with a gold sticker so i was very positive it would be higher but oh well guess i was wrong no biggy just disapointed
gdavis70,Musky1011,cohodk,cucamongacoin,robkool,chumley, drei3ree, Rampage,jmski52, commoncents05, dimples, dcarr, Grouchy, holeinone1972, JonMN34, mission16,meltdown,Omega,PQpeace, SeaEagleCoins, WaterSport, whatsup,Wizard1,WinLoseWin,MMR,49thStateofMind,SamByrd,Ahrensdad,BAJJERFAN,timrutnat,TWQG,CarlWohlforth,Ciccio,PreTurb,NumisMe,Patches,NotSure,luvcoins123,piecesofme,perryhall,nibanny,atarian,airplanenut
This 1907-D half eagle did get the MS-65 grade from NGC. You can compare your coin with it when you get it back.
<< <i>
<< <i>Rule 7) This is a PCGS forum. Posts promoting or bashing other grading companies or service are not allowed. Those posts will be removed and your posting privileges may be removed as well.
>>
I would tread real careful here. >>
+1
<< <i>i have looked at both online and at shows ...i have been thinking about sending this for about a year now
as a example i have a old $5 in a doily it is graded ms61 it was sent to CAC and JA said it was a easy ms63 so he gave it a gold bean....the coin i just sent in destroys the one with a gold sticker so i was very positive it would be higher but oh well guess i was wrong no biggy just disapointed >>
Having seen your Gold sticker MS61 doily which I recall has a nice spot...
I'd wager that it would only easily MS63 as your seller mentioned after multiple submissions on that special day that all the planets are aligned and piggies fly!
gdavis70,Musky1011,cohodk,cucamongacoin,robkool,chumley, drei3ree, Rampage,jmski52, commoncents05, dimples, dcarr, Grouchy, holeinone1972, JonMN34, mission16,meltdown,Omega,PQpeace, SeaEagleCoins, WaterSport, whatsup,Wizard1,WinLoseWin,MMR,49thStateofMind,SamByrd,Ahrensdad,BAJJERFAN,timrutnat,TWQG,CarlWohlforth,Ciccio,PreTurb,NumisMe,Patches,NotSure,luvcoins123,piecesofme,perryhall,nibanny,atarian,airplanenut
<< <i>but i do disagree on the toned peace dollars like i said i know for a fact the one laid face down in a silk box for 30+ years so i dont know how it could be AT >>
You are free to believe what you like, but if you continue to buy coins like this, you will continue to get grades that will disappoint you. Peace dollars with attractive, natural toning are very scarce. Pieces with the deep bright color that appears on some Morgan dollars (and on many of those pieces, it’s artificial) are virtually non-existent.
We are trying to help you, but if you don’t want to listen then there is nothing anyone can do to help you. Learning to grade coins and spotting coins that have been processed is not easy. It takes years of learning and experience for most people. Some people never acquire those skills no matter how hard they try.
<< <i>NGC just killed my submission of toned peace dollars and undergraded my gold
>>
Looks more like a case of suicide.
<< <i>
<< <i>but i do disagree on the toned peace dollars like i said i know for a fact the one laid face down in a silk box for 30+ years so i dont know how it could be AT >>
You are free to believe what you like, but if you continue to buy coins like this, you will continue to get grades that will disappoint you. Peace dollars with attractive, natural toning are very scarce. Pieces with the deep bright color that appears on some Morgan dollars (and on many of those pieces, it’s artificial) are virtually non-existent.
We are trying to help you, but if you don’t want to listen then there is nothing anyone can do to help you. Learning to grade coins and spotting coins that have been processed is not easy. It takes years of learning and experience for most people. Some people never acquire those skills no matter how hard they try. >>
i understand and am not knocking you but i truely know the one peace was stored for 30+ years so how can it be AT thats all im asking could the oils in silk have done this ??? and if it did dosen't that make it NT ???
gdavis70,Musky1011,cohodk,cucamongacoin,robkool,chumley, drei3ree, Rampage,jmski52, commoncents05, dimples, dcarr, Grouchy, holeinone1972, JonMN34, mission16,meltdown,Omega,PQpeace, SeaEagleCoins, WaterSport, whatsup,Wizard1,WinLoseWin,MMR,49thStateofMind,SamByrd,Ahrensdad,BAJJERFAN,timrutnat,TWQG,CarlWohlforth,Ciccio,PreTurb,NumisMe,Patches,NotSure,luvcoins123,piecesofme,perryhall,nibanny,atarian,airplanenut
<< <i> i understand and am not knocking you but i truely know the one peace was stored for 30+ years so how can it be AT thats all im asking could the oils in silk have done this ??? and if it did dosen't that make it NT ??? >>
It could have been the box itself too. AT is based on what is seen in the marketplace for that series, the TPG doesn't have a little camera in the box to verify.
<< <i>yep and im 100% #2 is not for sure it was stored in a silk box for 30+ years >>
Story usually doesn't matter. If it looks bunk, it will probably be graded bunk.
Why, and it's your money, would you get common grade Peace dollars graded, unless
you expected a 65+ or better? Save your fees for better coins. Good luck and I too
had huge problems understanding dipping when I started looking at coins for grading.
bob
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>but i do disagree on the toned peace dollars like i said i know for a fact the one laid face down in a silk box for 30+ years so i dont know how it could be AT >>
You are free to believe what you like, but if you continue to buy coins like this, you will continue to get grades that will disappoint you. Peace dollars with attractive, natural toning are very scarce. Pieces with the deep bright color that appears on some Morgan dollars (and on many of those pieces, it’s artificial) are virtually non-existent.
We are trying to help you, but if you don’t want to listen then there is nothing anyone can do to help you. Learning to grade coins and spotting coins that have been processed is not easy. It takes years of learning and experience for most people. Some people never acquire those skills no matter how hard they try. >>
i understand and am not knocking you but i truely know the one peace was stored for 30+ years so how can it be AT thats all im asking could the oils in silk have done this ??? and if it did dosen't that make it NT ??? >>
You're missing the point in the whole AT vs NT debate. It is really a MA vs NMA and the TPG's have decided that Peace dollars with color are not really welcome in their plastic making just about all of them AT or NMA. Just because a couple of people trade in the few dozen or so examples that were slabbed before the TPGs locked down on the practice doesn't mean it is a real phenomenon or a mainstream accepted niche, most of the ones that bring big money would never make i back into plastic if cracked. As long as you collect these just be prepared to not have a mature two-way market for resale and never being able to get them slabbed, if you can live with those conditions then have fun but don't whine when they bite you.
gdavis70,Musky1011,cohodk,cucamongacoin,robkool,chumley, drei3ree, Rampage,jmski52, commoncents05, dimples, dcarr, Grouchy, holeinone1972, JonMN34, mission16,meltdown,Omega,PQpeace, SeaEagleCoins, WaterSport, whatsup,Wizard1,WinLoseWin,MMR,49thStateofMind,SamByrd,Ahrensdad,BAJJERFAN,timrutnat,TWQG,CarlWohlforth,Ciccio,PreTurb,NumisMe,Patches,NotSure,luvcoins123,piecesofme,perryhall,nibanny,atarian,airplanenut
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>but i do disagree on the toned peace dollars like i said i know for a fact the one laid face down in a silk box for 30+ years so i dont know how it could be AT >>
You are free to believe what you like, but if you continue to buy coins like this, you will continue to get grades that will disappoint you. Peace dollars with attractive, natural toning are very scarce. Pieces with the deep bright color that appears on some Morgan dollars (and on many of those pieces, it’s artificial) are virtually non-existent.
We are trying to help you, but if you don’t want to listen then there is nothing anyone can do to help you. Learning to grade coins and spotting coins that have been processed is not easy. It takes years of learning and experience for most people. Some people never acquire those skills no matter how hard they try. >>
i understand and am not knocking you but i truely know the one peace was stored for 30+ years so how can it be AT thats all im asking could the oils in silk have done this ??? and if it did dosen't that make it NT ??? >>
1) The peace dollar is over 30+ years old, and I doubt you have a minute by minute accountability. Artificial toning wasn't invented just a few years ago.
2) Think of it as "questionable" toning. They don't feel comfortable trusting/supporting that toning as being natural.
3) If you have paid attention at all, you should understand that grading is not a science and that there are definitions that are still being fought over.
4) You are on the NGC boards as well....have you brought this up over there yet? You have other threads you have posted in the last day or two, but I don't see one about the peace dollars. This is the wrong board to ask.
5) While I don't think you will listen to this, it is somewhat obvious from your posts that you have a lot of learning to do.....about the coins, about toning, about the market, and about grading. Nothing wrong with that, but it also appears you aren't doing background work to learn AHEAD of time.....you are asking the questions AFTER the fact. Go back 6-8 years and read the threads...many still have pictures. There has been a lot of knowledge given in this forum that is still there for those willing to take the time to look. Stop spending the time promoting carr's copies and read older threads on toning, on grading, on coin series, etc.
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
<< <i>You're missing the point in the whole AT va NT debate. It is really a MA vs NMA >>
Bingo.
-Paul
<< <i>
5) While I don't think you will listen to this, it is somewhat obvious from your posts that you have a lot of learning to do.....about the coins, about toning, about the market, and about grading. Nothing wrong with that, but it also appears you aren't doing background work to learn AHEAD of time.....you are asking the questions AFTER the fact. Go back 6-8 years and read the threads...many still have pictures. There has been a lot of knowledge given in this forum that is still there for those willing to take the time to look. Stop spending the time promoting carr's copies and read older threads on toning, on grading, on coin series, etc. >>
Cheers to that, best advice given so far.
<< <i>Artificial toning wasn't invented just a few years ago. >>
There were raw AT coins on the brouse floor 20-25 years ago... Peace $1's are not new to being aided.
Some of the worst cases of AT I saw back then was on common commems like Colombians or 1926-S OT.
<< <i>
<< <i>Artificial toning wasn't invented just a few years ago. >>
There were raw AT coins on the brouse floor 20-25 years ago... Peace $1's are not new to being aided.
Some of the worst cases of AT I saw back then was on common commems like Colombians or 1926-S OT. >>
Ummm...broadstruck....you quoted me and the emoticon you used makes it looks like you disagree with what I wrote, but, what you typed in response, looks like you agree with what I wrote....which is it?
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
<< <i>Ummm...broadstruck....you quoted me and the emoticon you used makes it looks like you disagree with what I wrote, but, what you typed in response, looks like you agree with what I wrote....which is it?
Sorry Bochiman I'm a bit sleep deprived and did accidentally select the wrong emoticon as I was agreeing with you
gdavis70,Musky1011,cohodk,cucamongacoin,robkool,chumley, drei3ree, Rampage,jmski52, commoncents05, dimples, dcarr, Grouchy, holeinone1972, JonMN34, mission16,meltdown,Omega,PQpeace, SeaEagleCoins, WaterSport, whatsup,Wizard1,WinLoseWin,MMR,49thStateofMind,SamByrd,Ahrensdad,BAJJERFAN,timrutnat,TWQG,CarlWohlforth,Ciccio,PreTurb,NumisMe,Patches,NotSure,luvcoins123,piecesofme,perryhall,nibanny,atarian,airplanenut
<< <i>1 reason pcgs has said they will not slab a toned peace dollar >>
That's 100% incorrect. Show where that exact quote was stated.
I know the type of statement you are grasping for, and that was not it. I have toned PCGS Peace Dollars....as do others.
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
<< <i>1 reason pcgs has said they will not slab a toned peace dollar >>
This is not correct. I have had two toned peace dollars slabbed by PCGS in the last 6 months.
Please visit my website Millcitynumismatics.com
Or it used to be his money
Now it's pcgs's money
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>Rule 7) This is a PCGS forum. Posts promoting or bashing other grading companies or service are not allowed. Those posts will be removed and your posting privileges may be removed as well.
>>
I would tread real careful here. >>
+1 >>
Based on the results, I don't really see anything promotional towards or critical of NGC. He submitted a few coins to them based on some misinformation he had about our host. Twould seem the other guys disagreed with his opinion of the coins.
My only surprise about clicking through was the value. According to NGC, the gold has a value of $568.75? What a strangely accurate esimate. Not $568.70, not 568.80, but exactly $568.75. Seems strange to me. I have never looked at their price guides. Are they all like that?
merse
<< <i>Based on the results, I don't really see anything promotional towards or critical of NGC. >>
The original title of this thread said something quite different than it does now.
And coming from me thats huge.
Theyre blatant AT, they never had a chance. Dip em and place them in a album in 10 years theyll look very nice.
Like I said before, it comes down to MA vs. not-MA.
-Paul
Edited: thanks to Mark Feld who found the quote from DH:
<< <i>
Here's a little controversy...do naturally rainbow toned Peace dollars exist...I don't think so. Here's what I said on PCGS CoinFacts...
Note that I am of the very strong opinion that any 1921 Peace dollar...indeed any Peace dollar...that has any rainbow colors (blue, red, green, etc) is absolutely artificially toned. While not very scientific, my approach to toning on coins is to remember the colors I saw in the 1960's and 1970's and if a new look appears, it's artificial to me. This is kind of an "old school" approach and I may be wrong, but unless you believe global warming has created new colors for coins, it just seems illogical to me that new colors would suddenly appear naturally on coins.
So...I never saw a single Rainbow toned Peace dollar in the 1960s or 1970s, but of course I saw thousands of rainbow Morgans. Perhaps the silver was a little different, or handled a little different. You certainly don't see the white spots on Morgans that you see on 1922 and 1923 Peace dollars. Anyway...that's what I think.