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Who or what is a lowballer?
RedTiger
Posts: 5,608 ✭
The term lowballer was used in a recent mega thread about grading companies.
Have you heard it before? If yes, what does it mean to you? Is it an insult? Or something a person might say with pride? Would you describe yourself as a lowballer? Would you be insulted if someone else used that term to describe you?
I haven't heard it used on the bourse. Here is my guess at a definition: A lowballer is a collector or dealer that tends to make lowball offers, often using the excuse of the holder the coin is in, to rationalize the low offer. Some folks use any song and dance they can think of, if they think it will work. In the context of the other thread, the holder is the excuse for a low offer.
Have you heard it before? If yes, what does it mean to you? Is it an insult? Or something a person might say with pride? Would you describe yourself as a lowballer? Would you be insulted if someone else used that term to describe you?
I haven't heard it used on the bourse. Here is my guess at a definition: A lowballer is a collector or dealer that tends to make lowball offers, often using the excuse of the holder the coin is in, to rationalize the low offer. Some folks use any song and dance they can think of, if they think it will work. In the context of the other thread, the holder is the excuse for a low offer.
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maybe loosely it is also used for collector's of lowball coins/sets? lowballers?
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hoping for a newby or just a person who isn't up on colorful Jeffs to sell to- if I make him a lowball offer of say 70.00 bucks on his $150.00 Colorful Jeff.
I know of a dealer whom does just this and he sells them. So lowball is relative and at times not applicable, just another word to throw around. I or you make an offer
and if the other party gets offended then maybe you shouldn't deal with such a sensitive business person.
<< <i>A lowballer is one who repeatedly makes insultingly low offers for coins. Lowballers, be they collectors or dealers, often get the reputation as being such, word spreads in the numismatic community, and people shun doing business with them. >>
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
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<< <i>A lowballer is one who repeatedly makes insultingly low offers for coins. Lowballers, be they collectors or dealers, often get the reputation as being such, word spreads in the numismatic community, and people shun doing business with them. >>
Me too (because I usually needn't say a word after RYK in most threads), but I'd like to expound on the wide range and use of the word.
One may find the following are synonymous with lowball/lowballer :
B&M dealer
Pawn broker
You Suck recipients
cherrypickers who become YOU SUCK recipients
The wholesale automobile buyers at any car dealership where a person has a 'trade-in' (thank God a finance manager is skilled)
Difficult to define, but we know it when we get one and they're associated with "offers to buy at a price well below fair market value.
-wholesalers might be considered lowballers
-retailers might be considered rip off artists.
A pervasive attitude may be associated with those who are stuck in the middle, having to pay at the high end/ or sell at the low end.
Lest we forget motel/hotel gold buyers could also take part in these festivities.
``https://ebay.us/m/KxolR5
In honor of the memory of Cpl. Michael E. Thompson
That's right.The lowballer,as you describe him, is seen by most as an unethical trader and to be avoided.
Whoever is careless with the truth in small matters cannot be trusted with important matters.
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<< <i>A lowballer is one who repeatedly makes insultingly low offers for coins. Lowballers, be they collectors or dealers, often get the reputation as being such, word spreads in the numismatic community, and people shun doing business with them. >>
Interesting. I think agree about the first part. Not so sure about the second. As defined, I would think that an experienced lowballer gets a feel for how low he/she can go and still get the other party to agree to the transaction. They might do it by being nice, or bullying, or finding false flaws with the coins or holders, or complaining about overhead, or any number of negotiating tactics that hard bargainers might use. Some B&M lowballers have probably been in business for 30 years or more. If they were shunned, their doors would have closed long ago. Perhaps they are mostly doing business with the ignorant when they lowball (eg: hotel buyers, store buyers dealing with heirs). However, some probably know the line, know about how much room they have, and how motivated the seller is, and how low is low. Some might low ball if they think they have a fish on the line, and offer fair to other dealers. Thus the stories of how so many dealers get the illusion of low mark ups, when so many are lowballing and marking up high too.
The other side might be buying from lowballer dealers. If they lowball to get their inventory, there is a chance that they have more room when selling and still stay in business. On the other side, dealers paying true top dollar for inventory can not be on the low side of pricing when selling.
Another point is one person's lowball, might actually be an average wholesale offer. If someone gets offers from say 10 dealers and finds all 10 to be lowball offers, either the dealers are colluding, or the seller has over estimated the realistic wholesale price. Some collectors, especially those new to the hobby, might be shocked at how low the wholesale price was on the coin they are paying full retail for. Keep in mind that sometimes a coin is traded by three to six dealers, each taking a cut, before the retail buyer takes it home.
I don't agree with the list as a general rule.It always comes down to the individual.
Whoever is careless with the truth in small matters cannot be trusted with important matters.
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<< <i>A lowballer is one who repeatedly makes insultingly low offers for coins. Lowballers, be they collectors or dealers, often get the reputation as being such, word spreads in the numismatic community, and people shun doing business with them. >>
When I lived in New Jersey there was a B&M dealer who got that reputation. Collectors in the area warned their friends not to bother with him. I went to his shop once with a coin that was worth about $100. He put on one those stereoscopic visors that some dealers wear and their head, looked at the piece, and offered me “a whole” $20 for it. Needless say I declined his offer.
<< <i>A lowballer is one who repeatedly makes insultingly low offers for coins. Lowballers, be they collectors or dealers, often get the reputation as being such, word spreads in the numismatic community, and people shun doing business with them. >>
This and IMO they are one rung higher on the ladder of despisefulness than a schmuck is.
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<< <i>A lowballer is one who repeatedly makes insultingly low offers for coins. Lowballers, be they collectors or dealers, often get the reputation as being such, word spreads in the numismatic community, and people shun doing business with them. >>
When I lived in New Jersey there was a B&M dealer who got that reputation. Collectors in the area warned their friends not to bother with him. I went to his shop once with a coin that was worth about $100. He put on one those stereoscopic visors that some dealers wear and their head, looked at the piece, and offered me “a whole” $20 for it. Needless say I declined his offer. >>
Did you say "everyone was right, you are a lowballer" as you walked out?
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<< <i>A lowballer is one who repeatedly makes insultingly low offers for coins. Lowballers, be they collectors or dealers, often get the reputation as being such, word spreads in the numismatic community, and people shun doing business with them. >>
When I lived in New Jersey there was a B&M dealer who got that reputation. Collectors in the area warned their friends not to bother with him. I went to his shop once with a coin that was worth about $100. He put on one those stereoscopic visors that some dealers wear and their head, looked at the piece, and offered me “a whole” $20 for it. Needless say I declined his offer. >>
Did you say "everyone was right, you are a lowballer" as you walked out? >>
Unfortunately, most B&M dealers that I've encountered are like this. If they can't rip it, they don't want it.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
<< <i>One may find the following are synonymous with lowball/lowballer :
I don't agree with the list as a general rule.It always comes down to the individual. >>
I agree that we won't all agree, as a general rule and as individuals we cannot put labels on others and be justified doing so. This is why i left the possiblity open with the statement "one may find". Each person's own experiences help them define what "lowballing" is. I've lost a lot of bids in the contracting business to professional lowballers. They brag how they never have to climb up on a roof to measure. They just "lowball" the pros.
``https://ebay.us/m/KxolR5
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<< <i>A lowballer is one who repeatedly makes insultingly low offers for coins. Lowballers, be they collectors or dealers, often get the reputation as being such, word spreads in the numismatic community, and people shun doing business with them. >>
When I lived in New Jersey there was a B&M dealer who got that reputation. Collectors in the area warned their friends not to bother with him. I went to his shop once with a coin that was worth about $100. He put on one those stereoscopic visors that some dealers wear and their head, looked at the piece, and offered me “a whole” $20 for it. Needless say I declined his offer. >>
Did you say "everyone was right, you are a lowballer" as you walked out? >>
Unfortunately, most B&M dealers that I've encountered are like this. If they can't rip it, they don't want it. >>
Is there anything that ANY dealer should be able to buy and flip for a quick profit? If you walk into 5 different shops with 5 one ounce AGEs shouldn't you expect to get a fair and decent offer at all 5? It's not like they'll sit in the case for monthsafterwards if that's where he puts them.
Eric
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<< <i>A lowballer is one who repeatedly makes insultingly low offers for coins. Lowballers, be they collectors or dealers, often get the reputation as being such, word spreads in the numismatic community, and people shun doing business with them. >>
When I lived in New Jersey there was a B&M dealer who got that reputation. Collectors in the area warned their friends not to bother with him. I went to his shop once with a coin that was worth about $100. He put on one those stereoscopic visors that some dealers wear and their head, looked at the piece, and offered me “a whole” $20 for it. Needless say I declined his offer. >>
Did you say "everyone was right, you are a lowballer" as you walked out? >>
No, I didn't say anything. I just filed it away as useful information for the future. Some dealers just are not worth your time.
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I went to his shop once with a coin that was worth about $100. He put on one those stereoscopic visors that some dealers wear and their head, looked at the piece, and offered me “a whole” $20 for it. Needless say I declined his offer.
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Dealer side of story (speculative on my part):
"Guy brings in a very esoteric piece which he overpaid for several years ago. Claimed it was some goofy variety, which, upon close inspection it was. Still, I wouldn't have a customer for it in ten years and it would be hard to even wholesale out. I told him I wasn't for me, but he kept pestering me for a cash offer so finally I just said $20 to get rid of him. Even at that price I am probably losing money."
I have been looking for the typical dealer backlash at the implication that they may be lowballers!!!
The lack of their response is "Twilight Zone-ish"
Successful BST xactions w/PCcoins, Drunner, Manofcoins, Rampage, docg, Poppee, RobKool, and MichealDixon.
I consider a lowballer to be someone who makes well below market value offers (whether at a wholesale or retail level), yes the term has negative connotations to me, and I don't deal with them once I find out what they are.
World Collection
British Collection
German States Collection
The first, in a general sense, means somebody who makes routinely low and often insulting offers on something. This definition has some negative connotation.
The second, in a strictly numismatic sense, is somebody who deliberately collects low grade and/or damaged coins for the pure fun of it. In a PCGS context here, it usually means somebody who is assembling a set of coins grading PO01, FR02, AG03, or as low as they can find while still remaining problem free and datable so that PCGS will slab 'em. This second definition has no negative connotation (or coininotation), even though these people are stark, droolin' loonies who no doubt have wildly tousled hair, reddened pinwheel eyes, and spooky laughs.
I do respect their brand of madness, however, since I myself am a "holey" coin collector, which is a related field of lowball collecting (or mental illness, depending on how you see it). I still shoot for higher details like the mainstream collectors do, though, and I don't spend hard-earned money putting my lowball "damaged junk" in expensive little plastic coffins.
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I went to his shop once with a coin that was worth about $100. He put on one those stereoscopic visors that some dealers wear and their head, looked at the piece, and offered me “a whole” $20 for it. Needless say I declined his offer.
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Dealer side of story (speculative on my part):
"Guy brings in a very esoteric piece which he overpaid for several years ago. Claimed it was some goofy variety, which, upon close inspection it was. Still, I wouldn't have a customer for it in ten years and it would be hard to even wholesale out. I told him I wasn't for me, but he kept pestering me for a cash offer so finally I just said $20 to get rid of him. Even at that price I am probably losing money." >>
Not even close. It was an 1837 No Stars half dime in EF-45.