It's official................
morgansforever
Posts: 8,461 ✭✭✭✭✭
Obama signed the NDAA into law. Nice knowing you Habeas Corpus, Posse Comitatus, and the Constitution.
Burning of the Constitution
Burning of the Constitution
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U.S. soil is now considered part of the battlefield, incredible.
<< <i>I bet most of Congress have NOT read it. The scary part is, this opens the door for more sweeping Gov't power.
U.S. soil is now considered part of the battlefield, incredible. >>
The first part i do not agree with that particular law. The second statement is indeed a correct statement.
Ever since 9/11 when for the very first time those who want to destroy our way of life brought the battle to Mainland USA(NYC). And all these "homegrown terrorists" popping up like crab grass all over the country...trying to detonate a car bomb in NYC and people from other countries trying to come here and blow up planes by putting explosives in their shoe and in their underwear...When you have to go through body scanners and pat downs in the airport before you board a plane and could not even bring a bottled water with you ...See uniformed battle ready officers and national guards armed to the teeth with automatic rifles,flak jackets and helmets and bomb sniffing dogs every time there's an Alert that the public is not even informed about to prevent unnecessary panic... Would you not call our US soil now a part of a battlefield against terrorists homegrown or otherwise? Again i do not agree with this particular law but i do appreciate our men and women in uniform who protect us here and abroad and lay down their life protecting our country and its citizens.
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<< <i>Disgraceful. Hopefully the Supreme Court invalidates it. >>
eventually, this will happen.
Owning gold n silver may put you on a terrorist watch list
How the hell do you get that out of anything in the law?
By the way, what the hell does this have to do with precious metals, you know, what this forum is for?
<< <i>I really hope that the thread starter, as well as all others who chimed in here felt the EXACT same way when Bush signed the "Patriot Act" into law back in '01. Otherwise you are simply small minded partisan hypocrites. >>
If i recall nobody here liked that one all too much either. No need to keep up the instigateyness of the past few weeks.
It's the ultimate narcissist who would believe otherwise.
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I have very little faith in the Supreme Court anymore. Can be corrupted just like the other two branches of our government.
Box of 20
Careful
Wasn't a big fan of the PA until a few years later, when I woke up.
... and will NEVER be affected by it.
I'd write more, but the jack-booted terror gestopo is standing on my neck, while national security henchmen torture "the plot" information out of my wife and children
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
"Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety".~Benjamin Franklin.
"Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety".~Benjamin Franklin.
"Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety".~Benjamin Franklin.
"Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety".~Benjamin Franklin.
I suppose the sheep on this forum will willing hand over their wool
... and will NEVER be affected by it.
Exactly! Unless of course you're creating threads about guns on a PRECIOUS METALS forum.
The phrase, "there's a time and a PLACE for everything" comes to mind.
<< <i><<I really hope that the thread starter, as well as all others who chimed in here felt the EXACT same way when Bush signed the "Patriot Act" into law back in '01. Otherwise you are simply small minded partisan hypocrites. >>
Wasn't a big fan of the PA until a few years later, when I woke up. >>
Woke up to what?
economic history, the cycle of governments, is what lead me to metals and this forum, everything is connected.
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<< <i>So, they find a guy on an airplane with explosives wrapped around his nuts or someone with a bomb on his foot and this is a reason to keep the citizenry under battle watch? About 30,000 people a year die in car accidents but no one seems to be worried about it. I don't recall any terrrorist causing any domestic deaths in the last few years. So, they reach into our personal lives to keep everyone safe but they can't mandate that the big money automakers make a crash safe vehicle...really, you can't make a crash safe vehicle? I have some reservations about this bill and anyone that would sign it as well. >>
Not so. Numerous potential acts have been foiled, although some where not. That Muslim Army Officer killing a dozen people, unfortunately was not one. Auto death's have almost been halved since the 50's, primarily due to safety features, driver awareness and stricter enforcements of the laws.
And I agree, this thread has no business being on the PM forum. Coin forum, perhaps...lots of bleeding heart liberals posting there.
The terrorist want to distroy our way of life, our country; all they had to do was start it. We will finish it ourselves. Our founding fathers are turning over in their graves.
<< <i>So now we allow the military to indefinitely detain terror suspects, including American citizens arrested in the United States, without charge.
The terrorist want to distroy our way of life, our country; all they had to do was start it. We will finish it ourselves. Our founding fathers are turning over in their graves. >>
Nicely said, but to be honest, I'd rather see our founding fathers "turning over in their graves," then one of my kids or grand kids.
<< <i>
<< <i>So now we allow the military to indefinitely detain terror suspects, including American citizens arrested in the United States, without charge.
The terrorist want to distroy our way of life, our country; all they had to do was start it. We will finish it ourselves. Our founding fathers are turning over in their graves. >>
Nicely said, but to be honest, I'd rather see our founding fathers "turning over in their graves," then one of my kids or grand kids. >>
+1
peacockcoins
<< <i>
<< <i>So now we allow the military to indefinitely detain terror suspects, including American citizens arrested in the United States, without charge.
The terrorist want to distroy our way of life, our country; all they had to do was start it. We will finish it ourselves. Our founding fathers are turning over in their graves. >>
Nicely said, but to be honest, I'd rather see our founding fathers "turning over in their graves," then one of my kids or grand kids. >>
On the other hand, I don't think global warfare is in the best interest of anyone's kids or grandkids. Defending one's way of life is one thing, but defending coporate interests is an entirely different matter. I would argue that our biggest threat comes from the financial terrrorists on Wall St.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
The Freedom to carry guns and sharp things aboard planes? the Liberty to purchase and transport large amounts of fertilizer and fuel oil? the Independence to move large amounts of cash and tangible assets in order to launder money and evade taxes? the Right to send funds and data to hostile groups of people?
Am I going to get stopped and questioned as I go about my daily business? Because I've gotten stopped and questioned a few times in my life from the authorities, and guess what? I either deserved it (doing something I shouldn't) or was innocent and let go. What should I expect to change about that now that this law is in effect?
Specifically, with respect to precious metals, as I like to buy, sell, and own them, along with other tangible assets that might include real estate, art, antiques, firearms, etc. Should I expect a knock on the door? an audit? time in a detention camp?
You can save the smart ass comments about being naive or sheep or head in the sand, the eyes are open on a new year day with some time for intelligent internet chat... I'd really like to care about this enough to get all worked up, but can't find the energy.
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
Do tell?
In God We Trust.... all others pay in Gold and Silver!
<< <i>Could someone who knows please help me, an ordinary citizen, understand what "Essential Liberties" this or any other Law takes away from me my family and friends? >>
The Constitution (up until now) guarantees that the government cannot take away a citizen's basic rights to 'life, liberty or property, without due process of law." This new law allows indefinite imprisonment of American citizens on American soil without any right of trial to defend one's self. It also directs the detention to be carried out by the US miliatry under orders of the executive branch in direct vilolation of the Posse Comitatus Act of 1878 (established following the civil war to prevent the use of federal military personnel to enforce the laws of the land).
While a lot things can be done to protect Americans from terrorists - a line needs to be drawn at some point. If not, where will it end?
Opinion of two retired four star Marine generals
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
That door has now been unlocked and opened so yes it can happen in the future.
Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
So far I'm of the opinion that not much has changed. As of this time it still seems the PA is still the bigger offender to our rights. The NDAA while not a welcome addition is not the end of America or it's Bill of Rights.
I'm of the opinion that the Supreme Court will ultimately be the judge. In the mean time I am not loosing any sleep. I am considering after further study the possibility of entering the fray through the appropriate means.
In other words I'm not taking to the streets in armed rebellion yet. Take care. jws
A Ron Paul 2012 sign on my lawn? Indefinite detention, no trial, no lawyer, no charges revealed, this scares the SHAT out
of me.
I cannot even venture to imagine a USA with four more years of this sorry excuse for a president!
<< <i>So now we allow the military to indefinitely detain terror suspects, including American citizens arrested in the United States, without charge.
The terrorist want to distroy our way of life, our country; all they had to do was start it. We will finish it ourselves. Our founding fathers are turning over in their graves. >>
Amen brother! Any time one freedom or God given American right is taken away we are less FREE!
"Freedom's just another word for nothing left to lose,
Nothing don't mean nothing honey if it ain't free!" Janus Joplin sang it best!
My rights end where yours begin~ Why is this so hard to understand?
"Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety".~Benjamin Franklin.
<< <i>Pokermandude your Bush poster sums up your mentality.......warped and unfunny.
I cannot even venture to imagine a USA with four more years of this sorry excuse for a president! >>
I agree....
<< <i>My concern is the doors this opens; for example one reason many buy PMs is because of a lack of confidence in the dollar along with concern with the creative financial instruments. There is some fear the entire financial system could blow up. If this did happen there is a good chance of civil unrest which is supposed to be an issue for the police; not anymore. Now it is a very short step to get where instead of police we could have Army tanks on the streets. Mr. or Mrs. Innocent can be walking down the street at the wrong time and become mixed up in something they had no intentions of.
That door has now been unlocked and opened so yes it can happen in the future. >>
Just remember, Isreal Switt was once arrested for possessing gold because one man decided that it was in the national interest to make owning gold illegal.
And this is coming from someone who voted for the guy during his first run and at the time was a life long republican up until about 3 years into his term. When he was re-elected, I cried. I cried because the writing was on the wall FOR STUFF LIKE THIS NEW LAW TO HAPPEN. THAT was the "thing" that "opened" the door!
I'm not being true to my annual new years resolution to not talk about politics on a chat board, so this is all that I'm going to say about this.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
It's our fault we elected both President.
<< <i>Your masters want you to blame it on one of the two groups. That is why they gave you the two groups. Remember though, your masters control them both. When they develop the ability to control three groups at once, you will be given a third choice. >>
Bingo!
<< <i>I really hope that the thread starter, as well as all others who chimed in here felt the EXACT same way when Bush signed the "Patriot Act" into law back in '01. Otherwise you are simply small minded partisan hypocrites. >>
Absolutely . I am a Republican but dont like Bush. He is either stupid or a fascist, I am just not sure which. The only candidate who has spoken out against this is Ron Paul!
<< <i> If you asked the man on the street I bet like 5% (at best) would even be aware of it let alone what is in it.
... and will NEVER be affected by it.
I'd write more, but the jack-booted terror gestopo is standing on my neck, while national security henchmen torture "the plot" information out of my wife and children
Real funny Baley.
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<< <i>Pokermandude your Bush poster sums up your mentality.......warped and unfunny >>
Very mature of you to insult my mental faculties because you can't take a joke.
Well, we should go back to what we know as fact. The following excerpts were considered big enough issues for our Founding Fathers to declare war over them:
"He has forbidden his Governors to pass Laws of immediate and pressing importance, unless suspended in their operation till his Assent should be obtained; and when so suspended, he has utterly neglected to attend to them." (Arizona's enforcement of immigration law in the absence of the feds doing their job)
"He has erected a multitude of New Offices, and sent hither swarms of Officers to harrass our people, and eat out their substance." (pick your favorite agency)
"He has kept among us, in times of peace, Standing Armies without the Consent of our legislatures." (wants a federal police force, as well-funded and well-trained as the military)
"For imposing Taxes on us without our Consent:" (obamacare)
"For depriving us in many cases, of the benefits of Trial by Jury:
For transporting us beyond Seas to be tried for pretended offences" (on point - see above conversation)
"For taking away our Charters, abolishing our most valuable Laws, and altering fundamentally the Forms of our Governments:
For suspending our own Legislatures, and declaring themselves invested with power to legislate for us in all cases whatsoever." (investing EPA with powers to regulate business and commerce that rightfully reside in Congress)
Specifically, with respect to precious metals, as I like to buy, sell, and own them, along with other tangible assets that might include real estate, art, antiques, firearms, etc. Should I expect a knock on the door? an audit? time in a detention camp?
Baley, what do you think? Do you think "it could never happen here"? What is your view on 2nd Amendment rights? Do you believe in a national firearms owner database? How do you feel about being put on a terrorist watchlist for conducting a $10,000 cash transaction? I'm serious - what do you think?
I knew it would happen.
<< <i>Pokermandude your Bush poster sums up your mentality.......warped and unfunny.
I cannot even venture to imagine a USA with four more years of this sorry excuse for a president! >>
almost as asinine as Jerko109
If the Gov't were to try to seize my (or anyone else's) couple of legally owned and registered guns, my coin collection, or my few hundred dollars of cash, I'd be outraged. If i were detained without due process, interrogated, etc, while I'm minding my own business (going to work, raising a family, entertaining myself with sports programming and internet chat boards), I'd be outraged. If in my life--in any way outside of "the media (including this chat board)-- I even NOTICED any unreasonable limits to my or anyone else's Liberty, I'd be OUTRAGED!!
Also, if the Gov't were to NOT investigate people with large, unregistered arsenals, people with illicit drug and explosive caches, and people doing large, undocumented cash transactions, I'd also be outraged.
Every couple of days, the WSJ and other papers publish lists of Federal seizures: It's usually full of large amounts cash, gold and guns. Were the people that stuff was taken from just normal , law abiding citizens like us, and did they acquire the stuff by legitimate means, and were their intentions for it honorable? or did their associations and behavior somehow gain the attention of law enforcement?
What do I think? I think this (and other) laws will go unnoticed by the vast majority of citizens. And I think there's a high probability that anyone they DO affect, deserves it.
There will be a very small number of unfair searches and seizures, detainments and questioning. And the media hype will reward the "victims" with lots of publicity and book deals.
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
Do tell?
Oh, nothing more scandalous than the usual teenage mischief: speeding, tresspassing, and some good-natured vandalism (I've noticed that they STILL haven't abridged folks' Liberty to purchase toilet paper, shaving cream, or eggs, although my friends and I are probably still on "the list" for having firecrackers and BB guns.)
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
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