Why do buyers ask what you want for itiem?

Scottiec2288 · August 15, 2011 1:16PM

Why do people on BST ask what you want for an itiem only to tell you what they are gonna pay for it?

Sean1125 · August 15, 2011 1:18PM

This makes no sense.

bigreddog · August 15, 2011 1:19PM

Why do sellers on the BST not bother to list a price? Then act SHOCKED when someone makes an offer.

Scottiec2288 · August 15, 2011 1:23PM

I didn't list the card on there, a guy was asking if anybody had some 55s i said i had 2 of the #s he needed, he asked what i wanted for them

Piggs · August 15, 2011 1:27PM

I'm lost and confused.

Dboneesq · August 15, 2011 1:30PM

<< I'm lost and confused.

>>

Doug Squared.

Scottiec2288 · August 15, 2011 1:39PM

I am sorry if i didn't make sense but i'll give an example; what if i go on there and ask does anyone have a pete rose rookie psa 7? You write i have 1..I say how much do you want for it? You say $850..I write back and say vcp is $750 thats what i'm gonna pay for it.. I hope that makes a little more sense..

Piggs · August 15, 2011 2:01PM

OK, now I see what you're saying. Someone has to name a price right off the bat with words like, $850 "Firm", right at or slightly lower than VCP average, and some feel what they are selling is

priced higher because of condition. The key is letting people know how much the item is or if buying how much you're willing to pay. Don't knock it around like a ping pong ball of emails before

someone has a starting price, and walk away if it doesn't work. Doug

brendanb438 · August 15, 2011 2:02PM

Been getting a lot of dumb offers via eBay lately on items that are not even BINs but straight auctions. One person made an offer for less than what the item was already bid up to. Just hurts my head these days.

miconelegacy · August 15, 2011 2:24PM

No offers on auctions already going and bid on, that ain't right. Now everything else, well it's not Pawn stars.

Rick "So whatdya want for it?"

Seller. "$4,000"

Rick "I'll give you $400"

And then they settle on like $800. Desperate times bring great deals, even on EBay. If your looking to buy on the BST at least have a range or price in mind. The card if graded may or may not deserve that price, but know what your looking to spend.

bobbyw8469 · August 15, 2011 9:16PM

VCP average is just an average. Poor quality cards for the grade will bring the average down. High quality cards for the grade will bring the average up. Compare the condition of your card against cards that have recently sold as well. Does yours look better, worse, or roughly the same? All that will help you determine the price.

MeteoriteGuy · August 15, 2011 9:58PM

There is nothing wrong with a buyer (or seller) countering with an offer.

Brick · August 15, 2011 10:32PM

It's called negotiating. Many don't like to tip their hand until they know what the other guy is thinking.

mcadams · August 15, 2011 10:50PM

Its a double-edged sword. If anyone here has ever studied Negotiations in a academic setting- The text would tell you there is both advantage and disadvantage to the strategy of asking what someone wants. 1) If their selling price is lower than what you were going to offer, thats the potential upside. 2) The first person to actually throw out a number wins the game of "Anchoring". Anchoring is the notion that the first number provided in a negotiation has more validity than any future number provided.

-Michael

mtcards · August 16, 2011 5:54AM

<< No offers on auctions already going and bid on, that ain't right. Now everything else, well it's not Pawn stars.

Rick "So whatdya want for it?"

Seller. "$4,000"

Rick "I'll give you $400"
>>

I actually like it when someone is wanting to get $500 for something, they bring in an expert and say thats its value is $5000 and then all of a sudden, the guy is having a problem when he's ONLY offered $3k for it. I also like it when someone is told their item is worth 5k and then they are wanting 5k for it. Like the buyer is there to just increase his stock, forgetting a profit.

I get the same thing in the store with cards sometimes. Card books for $50, I have the same card in the case, same condition for $25, buyer wants to get $40 for it. I couteroffer with about 50% of what they sell for on ebay, since I would be selling that particular card on ebay. Ebay price is about $15-$20, I offer $10, person says he can get more for it, I say fine, no problem, even tell him up front he can get $15-$20 on ebay and he says thats where he JUST bought it from. DOH!!

Sethro · August 16, 2011 6:10AM

I can't say I do much monetary negotiating in my day to day life, but I have encountered what I think is a strange phenomenon in my brief time selling some of my extra cards. Maybe what I'm about to describe is totally normal, but it seems weird to me. If anyone has any input on this, I'd appreciate it.

I've offered up for sale some items here on the B/S/T, as well as other places. I usually state a price up front, because as a buyer I like knowing where we're at up front; I like to give that same courtesy to potential buyers. (Also, didn't know I was "anchoring" but cool!)

On a few occasions I have gotten counter-offers, and they are usually quite low. Just for sake of illustration: I offer card for $100, they offer $50. Now, what I keep thinking is that they are negotiating. They offer something low, and want me to come back with a price that is more to their liking. Usually I say something like "let's split the difference"(in the illustration that would be $75) and almost every single time they say no, my $50 offer is firm.

Now, I've never accepted these low offers. And I've always wound up getting what I actually wanted for the cards, but I just don't get the low-ball, non-negotiating types. Is that some kind of style of negotiating? Do they see my low posting numbers and think I don't know better? I have no idea. Any thoughts? Thanks!

ndleo · August 16, 2011 6:32AM

Lowball buyers think they are negotiating, but in reality they are fishing for a desperate seller. I get these offers all the time on ebay, typically I ignore them but some persistent fisherman keep asking for a response.

I wish there was a way to block certain people from sending you ebay messages,

bobbyw8469 · August 16, 2011 6:34AM

<< Now, I've never accepted these low offers. And I've always wound up getting what I actually wanted for the cards, but I just don't get the low-ball, non-negotiating types. Is that some kind of style of negotiating? Do they see my low posting numbers and think I don't know better? I have no idea. Any thoughts? Thanks >>

Flippers. Nothing more. Looking for an easy buck.

Sethro · August 16, 2011 7:43AM

Thank you both for your responses.

Looking at the possible reasons now, it seems obvious.

CollectorAtWork · August 16, 2011 8:17AM

<< Lowball buyers think they are negotiating, but in reality they are fishing for a desperate seller. I get these offers all the time on ebay, typically I ignore them but some persistent fisherman keep asking for a response.

I wish there was a way to block certain people from sending you ebay messages, >>

I believe if you block people from bidding on your auctions, this will also block them from sending you ebay messages. (you may need to check an option for this.) I've done this before for constant lowballers.

Garabaldi · August 16, 2011 10:40AM

Just ask what is the best you can do and then go from there.

miconelegacy · August 16, 2011 10:51AM

I love negotiations. The thrill of the chase is the best part. Rarely will a low ball get you the item. You have to offer enough to get the counter. Now some don't counter, and that's perfectly fine, but i'd say 90% do with my offers.

Some items last night were listed for a total of $750. I offered $500 as that's the price per item I am comfortable with. I got a counter of $600, I said let's meet in the middle and we did. We were both using smart phones, and I was sent a mobile paypal invoice. It was done in a few minutes. He loved it, I loved it and I wish all transactions were that smooth.

Happy bidding and countering...

Stone193 · August 16, 2011 11:06AM

<< Why do people on BST ask what you want for an itiem only to tell you what they are gonna pay for it? >>

Ya know Scottie...

There's phenomena in our vast universe that just defies explanation and we mere mortals just have to scratch our collective heads - except for Stephen Hawking - of course.

Heck, I'm still pondering who invented liquid soap...and why?

brendanb438 · August 16, 2011 11:10AM

<< Just ask what is the best you can do and then go from there. >>

This question from a possible buyer pisses me off on eBay for some reason more than anything else. I have a lot of BIN or best offers up were I have it set to decline below X amount and lately a lot of people have been asking this question instead of even making an offer. I just don't get it. If I didn't have the or best offer option I would understand this a little more but dang make an offer.

detroitfan2 · August 16, 2011 11:54AM

I once told a board member I wanted $x for a card, he countered with $(x+y).

Why, because he is one of the coolest dudes on the boards, that's why.

Mescalito345 · August 16, 2011 12:15PM

I don't understand why sellers are always complaining about low-ball offers, and buyers are always complaining about high prices. When I'm a seller, I'd rather receive a low-ball offer than no offer at all. When I'm a buyer, I'd rather see something offered at a high price, instead of not being available at all.

Mescalito345 · August 16, 2011 12:22PM

Back in the 1990's, I used to go to card shows. Sometimes I'd offer $100 for a bargain box filled with maybe 1000 cards. The seller would counter with $300. Not a problem, I'd go check out some cards offered by other sellers. A couple of hours later, I'd go back to the original seller and we'd agree on a price.

miconelegacy · August 16, 2011 12:55PM

I don't understand why sellers are always complaining about low-ball offers, and buyers are always complaining about high prices. When I'm a seller, I'd rather receive a low-ball offer than no offer at all. When I'm a buyer, I'd rather see something offered at a high price, instead of not being available at all.

Very well said...

bobbyw8469 · August 16, 2011 1:16PM

I love it when I offer a premium price towards a sellers bloated BIN price, only to be shot down outright. I am thinking to myself "you are going to be buried with this item"!! For some cards, I AM IT! I am the one paying the prices that the cards are getting! Without me chasing them to help substain the pricing, it would bottom out to low levels. And if I get out of the set, then they are stuck with the cards!! (until someone new starts to chase - but new blood is few and far between in this hobby!).

WinPitcher · August 16, 2011 10:36PM

You are the market Bobby.

bobbyw8469 · August 16, 2011 11:11PM

For some cards it seems like I am....then when I get out, it's like the lowballers push 'em way down.

Sethro · August 16, 2011 11:12PM

<< I don't understand why sellers are always complaining about low-ball offers, and buyers are always complaining about high prices. When I'm a seller, I'd rather receive a low-ball offer than no offer at all. When I'm a buyer, I'd rather see something offered at a high price, instead of not being available at all. >>

In my case, I was curious (not exactly complaining) because besides my general confusion at the lack of negotiation, the extreme low-ball offers seemed predatory, and some of the more thoughtful responses on the board confirmed that.

I personally do not like to profit off of other people's misfortune, and certainly do not want anyone to profit from my misfortune.

I guess what needs to be the standard caveat on these posts is that I am not saying I am right and the low-ballers or those who agree with them are wrong. My system works for me and makes me happy, and other people's ways of thinking works for them.

jeffcbay · August 16, 2011 11:50PM

Sellers who list items without a price are hunting for uneducated buyers, and buyers who send low-ball offers are looking for desperate sellers. Both are crooked.

Would you sell a car without listing a price on it? and when someone asks what you want for it, would you answer "what would you give me for it"? I doubt it.

Mescalito345 · August 17, 2011 12:10AM

In my opinion, it's not a good idea to start out with your best offer, either as a buyer or a seller. It's better to start out with a value that's somewhat in your favor. Then if the other side makes a counter-offer, you might be able to meet in the middle.

PSARich · August 17, 2011 12:47AM

I often make offers on both BINs and BIN / Make an Offer. For example, I collect 1950 Bowman baseball in PSA 9. If you check eBay you will find that there are not a lot listed and those that are often have BINS of $699 or $799 when the SMR is typically $250. They will tell you it is because the pops are low, like a 3, 4, or 5. Well the problem is that there are few 1950 Bowmans that have a pop of more than 4 in PSA 9 and most of those are star cards that have been heavily submitted. When I see one I want or need I normally make a seller contact and offer the SMR price. Sometimes my offer is accepted, more often it is not. I do not mean to offend the seller but there is very little market for these cards in PSA 9. Many of those BIN listings have been on eBay for month after month and I wonder why they don't drop the price to something that is more realistic. Perhaps what I don't know is if they get enough people to bite on those BIN prices to make it worthwhile just to keep them listed at the high price and then their patience gets paid off.

Mescalito345 · August 17, 2011 1:36AM

In my previous post, I said that it's not a good idea to start out with your best offer. But there could be exceptions. If you're looking for very specific items (like PSARich is), and they don't appear very often, I could see starting out with your best offer.

MULLINS5 · August 17, 2011 5:46AM

If (and only if) I see "best offer" I'll message the seller and ask what's the absolute best they can do on the item. If it's too much for me I pass.

bobbyw8469 · August 17, 2011 6:00AM

<< If (and only if) I see "best offer" I'll message the seller and ask what's the absolute best they can do on the item. If it's too much for me I pass >>

????? I am honestly surprised any dealer would answer that. The bottom line is the buyers want to get items as cheaply as possible - the sellers want to make as much as they can. To ask a seller his "rock bottom" price - unless the item has been sitting for years on end, no seller is going to have a rock bottom price.

MULLINS5 · August 17, 2011 6:09AM

<< 

<< If (and only if) I see "best offer" I'll message the seller and ask what's the absolute best they can do on the item. If it's too much for me I pass >>

????? I am honestly surprised any dealer would answer that. The bottom line is the buyers want to get items as cheaply as possible - the sellers want to make as much as they can. To ask a seller his "rock bottom" price - unless the item has been sitting for years on end, no seller is going to have a rock bottom price. >>

There're many customers (and sellers) who don't like negotiating. This is one reason why places like CARMAX flourish.

bobbyw8469 · August 17, 2011 6:12AM

<< This is one reason why places like CARMAX flourish >>

True...also the reason 707 flourishes. They might not be the cheapest game in town, but they set their prices and have what you want. However, savvy buyers will NOT buy a card from 707, nor will savvy car shopper buy a car from Carmax. But in your topic, you are comparing a set price dealer (Carmax) to a standar dealer (price negotiating).....something about your argument is flawed.

WinPitcher · August 17, 2011 6:34AM

<< savvy buyers will NOT buy a card from 707 >>

Really?

I consider myself savvy and I have bought from 707, as has many other savvy buyers.

Do you really think all his sales are from uneducated buyers?

KbKards · August 17, 2011 6:35AM

They don't want to submit the offer officially using the best offer function because they're afraid it will be accepted. They'll be kicking themselves thinking they should have offered less. When they send a message to the seller asking what the absolute lowest possible price is, they're hoping it will be less than what they were going to offer. Even if it's less than what they planned to offer, a few days later they'll submit an even lower offer.

Brianruns10 · August 17, 2011 6:46AM

Because sellers have formed in their own mind what the item is worth without respect to the actual market value or demand. Prices fluctuate, and this stuff is an investment. Either you can offload quickly for less, or let it sit and hope you find a buyer willing to pay. These cards aren't worth what you paid for them, or what a book says they're worth, but what someone will pay. And that goes to show buyers are smart. I mean, what would you think of someone who bought a new car for the sticker price? Either rich or an idiot. A card is no different.

detroitfan2 · August 17, 2011 6:53AM

<< 

<< savvy buyers will NOT buy a card from 707 >>

Really?

I consider myself savvy and I have bought from 707, as has many other savvy buyers.

Do you really think all his sales are from uneducated buyers? >>

He means as savvy as he is, Steve. The standard is pretty high.

bobbyw8469 · August 17, 2011 8:52AM

<< Do you really think all his sales are from uneducated buyers? >>

No....I think his sales are to people that are impatient, or too lazy to do their homework on what a card truly costs. You can equate that to having more money than sense.

bobbyw8469 · August 17, 2011 8:53AM

<< He means as savvy as he is, Steve. The standard is pretty high. >>

I am nothing compared to you Detroitfan. They broke the mold when they made you.

Brianruns10 · August 17, 2011 10:56AM

<< 

<< Do you really think all his sales are from uneducated buyers? >>

No....I think his sales are to people that are impatient, or too lazy to do their homework on what a card truly costs. You can equate that to having more money than sense. >>

Gotta agree with this myself. Can't tell you how many cards I've bought from ebay that were higher grade with better centering, and for LESS than competing offerings from 707. The one or two times I tried to negotiate a price with them, their idea of good negotiating was to knock off 2 bucks and some change. So yeah, quite frankly, if you buy from them, you're desperate for the card, wildly uneducated about the card, or a rube.

ndleo · August 17, 2011 11:06AM

<< Because sellers have formed in their own mind what the item is worth without respect to the actual market value or demand. Prices fluctuate, and this stuff is an investment. Either you can offload quickly for less, or let it sit and hope you find a buyer willing to pay. These cards aren't worth what you paid for them, or what a book says they're worth, but what someone will pay. And that goes to show buyers are smart. I mean, what would you think of someone who bought a new car for the sticker price? Either rich or an idiot. A card is no different. >>

I have actually worked for a car company and studied pricing. New car buyers may think they are smart, but in reality they are playing the game set-up by the manufacturer and dealer. People who buy cars do not neccessarily want a great deal, they want the FEELING that they got a good deal. Two car companies tried fixed pricing on new cars - Saturn and VW. Saturn is out of business (for many reasons), VW pulled the plug after their sales dropped. The prices on the VW cars were actually set at the same level (adjusted for options and inflation) as the average transaction prices from the previous year. They couldn't convince buyers that the fixed prices they set were good prices, people still wanted discounts.

VW scrapped the plan and went back to normal MSRP pricing. If you are buying a new car, you are a fool anyways since the value declines 20% as soon as you start it. The 2-3 year old used market is where the real deals are at. Dealer makes more money, Buyer gets a great car for 50-60% of the cost, and it is all funded by the smart new car buyers who didn't pay sticker.

So my point is that the card market is different than the car market.

Brianruns10 · August 17, 2011 11:45AM

Yes different, but at it's core, they're all commodities, and pricey ones at that, where the inclination is to negotiate on price rather than take the listed price by the seller.

perkdog · August 17, 2011 12:01PM

<< 

<< Do you really think all his sales are from uneducated buyers? >>

No....I think his sales are to people that are impatient, or too lazy to do their homework on what a card truly costs. You can equate that to having more money than sense. >>

WinPitcher · August 17, 2011 1:58PM

<< No....I think his sales are to people that are impatient, or too lazy to do their homework on what a card truly costs. You can equate that to having more money than sense. >>

One thing for sure is, he won't try to pawn off a trimmed card on anyone.

Why do buyers ask what you want for itiem?

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