US debt just past 14 trillion dollars.....which is equal to the distance light travels in almost two
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US debt is now 14 Trillion dollars. That's almost more money than TDN has. How much money is that?
Well, if we convert dollars into the number of miles that the speed of light covers it's about 2 and a half years of light travel.
As you know, light travels at 5,874,589,152,000 (five trillion, eight hundred seventy four billion, five hundred eighty nine million, one hundred fifty two thousand) miles per year.
So if light traveled one mile for each dollar our country owes, our debt is equal to light traveling for almost two and a half years, to wit:
$14,000,000,000,000 (14 trillion dollars) divided by 5,874,589,152,000 (five trillion, eight hundred seventy four billion, five hundred eighty nine million, one hundred fifty two thousand) = 2.38145380512901 years.
Well, if we convert dollars into the number of miles that the speed of light covers it's about 2 and a half years of light travel.
As you know, light travels at 5,874,589,152,000 (five trillion, eight hundred seventy four billion, five hundred eighty nine million, one hundred fifty two thousand) miles per year.
So if light traveled one mile for each dollar our country owes, our debt is equal to light traveling for almost two and a half years, to wit:
$14,000,000,000,000 (14 trillion dollars) divided by 5,874,589,152,000 (five trillion, eight hundred seventy four billion, five hundred eighty nine million, one hundred fifty two thousand) = 2.38145380512901 years.
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“Default would effectively impose a significant and long-lasting tax on all Americans and all American businesses and could lead to the loss of millions of American jobs," Geithner wrote in a letter to House Speaker John Boehner. “Even a very short-term or limited default would have catastrophic economic consequences that would last for decades.”
Saying that Congress needs to tread carefully, Boehner issued a response to the Administration's request to raise the limit.
“The American people will not stand for such an increase unless it is accompanied by meaningful action by the President and Congress to cut spending and end the job-killing spending binge in Washington,” Boehner said. “While America cannot default on its debt, we also cannot continue to borrow recklessly, dig ourselves deeper into this hole, and mortgage the future of our children and grandchildren.”
merse
That said, this is leaning towards politics, so a response is dicey. Americans know what needs to be done. When approximately 600 people control the fates of 300,000,000, that large of an electorate could easily clean house if they had the will, or got off their bums.
I don't know if this is all meant to instill fear, and to convince folks to invest in truely rare coins. But I am really starting to get that perception.
And many buyers of US coins take their advice and buy them as a hedge against inflation.
<< <i>I fail to see how this thread relates to US coins. >>
When they keep practicing what, IMHO, is legalized counterfeiting, the ability to purchase coins is affected. Dollars don't go as far in day to day purchases.
A significant number of people who buy rare US coins do so as a hedge against inflation
see no light?
bob
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
<< <i>It relates to US coins because many writers......Q. David Bowers, David Hall, Scott Travers.....and many, many others......discuss at length the prospects for stunning increases in US rare coin prices in the event of inflation.
And many buyers of US coins take their advice and buy them as a hedge against inflation. >>
Which would even further decrease the number of folks with the means to buy them. Another situation that favors the rich or super rich minority. There will come a time when the entire yearly income of the U.S. Treasury will go to satisfy the interest on the national debt. There will be no choice but to raise taxes leaving less money for coin purchases by Joe Sixpack.
<< <i>
<< <i>It relates to US coins because many writers......Q. David Bowers, David Hall, Scott Travers.....and many, many others......discuss at length the prospects for stunning increases in US rare coin prices in the event of inflation.
And many buyers of US coins take their advice and buy them as a hedge against inflation. >>
Which would even further decrease the number of folks with the means to buy them. Another situation that favors the rich or super rich minority. There will come a time when the entire yearly income of the U.S. Treasury will go to satisfy the interest on the national debt. There will be no choice but to raise taxes leaving less money for coin purchases by Joe Sixpack. >>
There is another option for the government---massive inflation of the currency. Print a bunch of money and pay off your debt with a bunch of near worthless money.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
Adrian: Your above quoted comment is classic, and I nominate you for Post of the Day!
Stuart
Collect 18th & 19th Century US Type Coins, Silver Dollars, $20 Gold Double Eagles and World Crowns & Talers with High Eye Appeal
"Luck is what happens when Preparation meets Opportunity"
my early American coins & currency: -- http://yankeedoodlecoins.com/
<< <i>No problem. Once the Feds print one of these, the problem will be solved.
Considering the hyperinflation in Zimbabwe, when are we going to see the 1 quadrillion note?
that size a number , that much debt , will only lead to Mr. Snakes other topic in another thread .....
the collapse of The U.S. economy
........and with it the complete collapse of the World economy
You doubt that ?? you only have to wait , it's right around the corner
<< <i>I fail to see how this thread relates to US coins. >>
I agree...it's an off-topic post.
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
1 trillion
U.S. Type Set
If one Morgan weighs 26.73 grams, that is .0589298 pounds
14 trillion Morgans would weigh 825,017,200,000 pounds
At 50,000 pounds to a load it would take 15,500,344 semis to haul them.
At 60 feet length per semi touching end to end that would make a convoy 990,020,640 feet or 187,504 miles long which would go around the earth 7.5 times at 25,000 miles circumference. Man that is a lot of VAMs.
Currently the Gross Domestic Product is $14 Trillion, just to put numbers into perspective.
U.S. GDP Gross Domestic Product
Past Trend Present Value & Future Projection
Billion US Dollars. Annual Rate Seasonally Adjusted.
<< <i>Of course if the USA GDP was a basket case, we'be in trouble.
Currently the Gross Domestic Product is $14 Trillion, just to put numbers into perspective.
U.S. GDP Gross Domestic Product
Past Trend Present Value & Future Projection
Billion US Dollars. Annual Rate Seasonally Adjusted.
Now Rick - let us not inject logic into some good irrational fearmongering.
merse
Chart found here
However, I really don't think public debt and hence inflation is off topic, but of course that is a matter of opinion and of course requires some education to make the logical leap between debt and inflation and rare coins.
3 out of 10 buyers of rare US coins buy them at least in part as a hedge against inflation......which is exactly what this thread is about. See my thread referenced earlier.
We discuss grading services but they don't just grade US Coins, and many coin buyers don't buy graded coins but they suffer.....with quiet fingers.....through our threads on grading servics.
So, if one of the reasons people buy US coins is off topic because it isn't about US coins, isn't discussing grading services also off topic because grading services aren't about US coins?
Now, If your logic is that discussing grading services isn't off topic because they have something to do with US coins, wouldn't a discussion about fountains found in the US that wishers throw US coins into be on topic because they have something to do with US coins?
Additionally, I know what I do when I see a thread that seems to me to be of no interest; I don't go in them. And, I certainly wouldn't go in them to post to them sending them to the top again which only prolongs having to look at them even more. That, for me, would be, well, to put it nicely, counterproductive.
Furthermore, I wouldn't point out that I believed a topic was off topic because that would be in no rational way whatsoever, related to US coins and is in violation of the rules.
Finally, here is a video by David Hall. In this video he talks about the effects of our country's debt and the financial collapse which are interrelated, and their effect on US rare coins prices:
David Hall, President of Collector's Universe discussing the relevancy of our nation's debt and other things and their relevancy to US coin prices.
The study of numismatics involves a lot more than how shiny your 2009 lincoln cents are. There's a lot more to it then that. Or a lot less if you prefer and that's fine too, whatever floats your boat but to summarily dismiss a very important topic as "OT" because you don't like it, or understand it, or just feel like taking a shot isn't right.
It never ceases to amaze me how little collectors KNOW about the coins they collect.
Get with it man, numismatics is a GREAT hobby that so much can be learned. They don't call these little spheres the footprints of history for nothing!
Quote: open for me your cabinet of coins and I will show you the history of the world.
Coin's for sale/trade.
Tom Pilitowski
US Rare Coin Investments
800-624-1870
<< <i>So $1 = 1 mile. Learned something new today.
I agree that its a totally irrelevant comparrison. What would be neat.....but take some serious numbers crunching.....is calculating the distance that 14 trillion $1 bills would cover if laid endwise. Then converting that to light "hours", or light "minutes", or would it be just light "seconds"?
Edited to do the math:
$1 bill = 6 inches
14 trillion of them = 84 trillion inches
84 trillion inches = 7 trillion feet
7 trillion feet = 1.3 billion miles
1.3 billion miles = 7,127 light seconds
7,127 light seconds = 118 light minutes
118 light minutes = about 2 light hours
Talk about "moon money"!!!
(David Hall Rare Coins)
The article is called "The Rare Coin Market’s Ten Best Bets Which coins should you buy Now!"
Here's a link to the article:
Rare Coin Market's Ten Best Bets.....
The rare coin market is in a very good place. But the value of the U.S. dollar is not in a good place. Rare coins are a classic inflation hedge and the last time we had big inflation and
rising gold prices (the 1970s), rare coin prices went up over 1000%. But not all coins are not created equal. Certain coins do much better in certain scenarios than others. And as we enter
the second decade of the 21st century, the question is…which rare coins are the best bets?
Let’s start by looking at the current “scenario.” There are two major outside influences on the rare coin market; the value of the U.S. dollar/rate of inflation, and the price of gold bullion. And both of these factors are of course very related to one another.
So what about the value of the U.S. dollar? Well, I don’t think we have to talk a lot about this as we all know what’s happening. Our Government is printing paper at an incredible, probably unsustainable rate. The money supply, by all methods of measurement, is exploding. To finance bailouts, social programs, health care, and wars, the U.S. Government is inflating away
the value of the U.S. dollar.
<< <i>If our debt was converted to $100 bills.......and they were laid end to end......they would stretch just over 13 million MILES....or wrap around the earth 530 times! >>
If it was paid off at the rate of a million $$ a second, it would take 162 days to get it paid in full.
<< <i>
Well, if we convert dollars into the number of miles that the speed of light covers it's about 2 and a half years of light travel.
. >>
This is meaningful how? The debt works out to $46,000 per American. That's less than the cost of 2 years at a good college. Or 1/6 of a median house price. Or a mid-line BMW. The sky is not falling.
<< <i>
<< <i>
Well, if we convert dollars into the number of miles that the speed of light covers it's about 2 and a half years of light travel.
. >>
This is meaningful how? The debt works out to $46,000 per American. That's less than the cost of 2 years at a good college. Or 1/6 of a median house price. Or a mid-line BMW. The sky is not falling. >>
You know of any 9 month old babies who drive a mid-line BMW? Me neither. Lets put it in more easy to understand terms....we'll use YOUR figure of $46,000/person.
If every single man/woman/child sent the FED $500/month.......every single month...towards paying down the debt, it would take "just" 8 years to accomplish it.....oh, and thats if there was no running interest on the debt....which there is.
Fewer than 50% of the ADULT population paid federal income tax last year, so we had better make that monthly donation now $1,000/month to compensate for those who already dont pay a dime into the system. So congratulations Frank! If you are a mid 40's father of 3 with a stay at home wife, please forward your $5,000 monthly payment to the FED...every month for 8 years!
But you're right...the sky isnt falling.
....which I believe has been confirmed by Clucky Lucky
The economy is being held together with smoke and mirrors ; the printing of money is the only way to attempt to buy our way out
Very few homes are being built out of bricks anymore, the Big Bad Wolf of inflation will engorge himself on the three little pigs of America
<< <i>I fail to see how this thread relates to US coins. >>
To make it coin related, it's how many times more than US coins ever minted?
<< <i>Can you say, "Upsidedown"... >>
Ca you say "Rule 6" or "Rule 8"?
The name is LEE!
<< <i>past 15 trillion now >>
Yep. In ten short months add another trillion to the charge card. Frightening..........MJ
Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
The only way to make an economic system truly stable is to permit the free market to take over.
Those who want to talk politics and expound their theses are hopefully as grateful PCGS has kindly provided the pm forum.
The entertainment can never be overdressed....except in burlesque