Is this a whizzed draped half?

mumu

The top pictures present a totally different look than the actual as well.

link

SirAnthonyAC

Honestly, the coin looks good to me. The ware looks natural and even, the details do not appear to have been softened by whizzing or over polishing but, I'm sure others will add their opinions.

Steve27

No indication of whizzing whatsoever.

mumu

So those are not hairlines?

Steve27

Just as I suspected, you don't know what "whizzing" is.

From the PCGS glossary:

"whizzing
Term to describe the process of mechanically moving the metal of a lightly circulated coin to simulate luster. Usually accomplished by using a wire brush attachment on a high-speed drill."

DoubleEagle59

definitely not whizzing,

but I would say hairlines are present from an old cleaning.

mumu

<< <i>Just as I suspected, you don't know what "whizzing" is.

From the PCGS glossary:

"whizzing
Term to describe the process of mechanically moving the metal of a lightly circulated coin to simulate luster. Usually accomplished by using a wire brush attachment on a high-speed drill." >>




So you are saying the wire brush doesnt leave any hairlines?

DoubleEagle59

<< <i>

<< <i>Just as I suspected, you don't know what "whizzing" is.

From the PCGS glossary:

"whizzing
Term to describe the process of mechanically moving the metal of a lightly circulated coin to simulate luster. Usually accomplished by using a wire brush attachment on a high-speed drill." >>




So you are saying the wire brush doesnt leave any hairlines? >>



In every single case of a whizzed coin I have either owned or personally seen, I would not describe the marks left by whizzing as 'hairlines'.

Rather, the surface imperfections left by whizzing could almost be described as very small and minor 'digs' in the surface, usually with an overall alignment to them. This feature, in my opinion, is very distinctive and very diagnostic for 'whizzing'.

And I should add, most whizzed coins appear at arm's length to be an ms67, but actually are quite bad at 10 power.

Whizzed coins can best be described as:

"Good from far, but far from good".

Walkerguy21D

The wire brush hairlines would be extremely short, visible under high mag, and wouldn't appear as what is generally refered to as 'hairlines' either from a wiping, like this coin probably had, or circulation hairlines.

Nysoto

Cleaned, not whizzed. The coin is within lower condition census for the rare variety and could grade EF45 with the grade inflation since it was slabbed, thus the $3450 realized price. The 1805 O107 "small five" is one of the more difficult R5's, I doubt if more than 25 of this variety could be traced.

BillJones

It has been lightly cleaned, but has not had a full-blown whiz job. It's not the type of early coin that I like collect, but for a price, it's certainly acceptable.

pmac

<< <i>Cleaned, not whizzed. The coin is within lower condition census for the rare variety and could grade EF45 with the grade inflation since it was slabbed, thus the $3450 realized price. The 1805 O107 "small five" is one of the more difficult R5's, I doubt if more than 25 of this variety could be traced. >>


Does this go with PCGS grading coins with 'problems' because they are older and rarer rather than 'body bagging' them? I understand that early coins were often cleaned by well intentioned collectors before this was taboo, but what are PCGS's parameters concerning this issue?

slumlord98

This coin is from the Charlton Meyer collection. It had an 'off' look, duller than the pics indicate and definitely wiped, as others have said. Not at all unusual for the series, as most have been mishandled in one way or another, regardless of whether slabbed or raw.

As for the top pics having a different look, that is Heritage's effort at saturating the images for whatever reason. I'm not sure why they offer the two sets of pics only with more valuable coins. The lower set always seems to give a more realistic view of the coin and shows hairlines but hides some flaws such as smoky toning.

Walkerguy21D

Not sure anyone could generalize what PCGS does or doesn't do regarding cleaning - it seems, at least to me, to be kind of whimsical. Some coins that look fine get bagged, while other obviously cleaned coins get slabbed, almost regardless of age or scarcity.
Also, noting that this coin is in a 'doily holder', it was slabbed quite a few years ago - so this particular coin in a slab may not represent what they would slab today.

Nysoto

<< <i>Does this go with PCGS grading coins with 'problems' because they are older and rarer rather than 'body bagging' them? I understand that early coins were often cleaned by well intentioned collectors before this was taboo, but what are PCGS's parameters concerning this issue? >>


In this case, PCGS had no idea of the variety or rarity at the time it was graded, the O107 was only listed as an R-4 rarity in 1990. If the coin was cracked and resubmitted, it could go either way, cleaned or slabbed. PCGS does grade coins that have "acceptable cleaning", the fine line that determines this is up to the judgement of the graders at the time, the mood they are in, the position of the moon, etc.

Steve27

<< <i>

<< <i>Just as I suspected, you don't know what "whizzing" is.

From the PCGS glossary:

"whizzing
Term to describe the process of mechanically moving the metal of a lightly circulated coin to simulate luster. Usually accomplished by using a wire brush attachment on a high-speed drill." >>




So you are saying the wire brush doesnt leave any hairlines? >>




If the coin had been whizzed, the "hairlines" would be in a circular pattern; the lines on this coin are obviously straight.

TomB

A coin that is whizzed and a coin that has hairlines are not necessarily the same thing. Additionally, circulated silver often has circulation hairlines present all over the surfaces. The images of this coin do not make it look whizzed at all to me, but it of course has hairlines on it.

mumu

All comments noted. Thanks.