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Chris Chipoletti Now Under Criminal Investigation

This appeared in yesterday's "Colorado Springs Gazette"

Ex-numismatic association director under investigation
DEBBIE KELLEY
June 5, 2009 - 8:09PM

The Economic Crimes Division of the 4th Judicial District Attorney's office is
investigating Christopher Cipoletti, the former executive director of the
American Numismatic Association, senior deputy district attorney Robyn Cafasso
said Friday.

"The investigation could lead to charges being filed or charges not being
filed," Cafasso said, declining to give further details about the investigation.
"Everyone is innocent until proven guilty."

The DA's office began reviewing information it received on Cipoletti about eight
weeks ago to decide whether to open a criminal investigation, District Attorney
Dan May said.

Cipoletti said Friday he was unaware of the investigation.

In 2007, the Economic Crimes Division examined about 3,600 such inquiries, of
which 277 were investigated, May said. Of those, criminal charges were filed on 253.

The DA's action comes after four years of legal proceedings involving Cipoletti
and the ANA, a federally chartered association for coin collectors headquartered
in Colorado Springs.

Last month, the ANA filed an addendum to an existing lawsuit involving
nonpayment of fees to a Denver law firm that represented both Cipoletti and the
ANA in another lawsuit initially filed in 2005. The 2005 lawsuit was settled
last year.

The recent addendum accuses Cipoletti of civil theft. The new documents filed
May 19 in 4th Judicial District Court claim that while Cipoletti was employed by
the ANA, he intentionally took, misappropriated or converted monies belonging to
the ANA, used ANA resources for personal benefit, double-billed travel expenses,
personally accepted money that was to be paid to the ANA for services, billed
private clients using ANA time and resources, and misrepresented the status of
his vacation and sick time.

Cipoletti refuted the claims Friday.

"I certainly didn't steal anything. I didn't cheat. I didn't commit fraud," he
said. "This is another step in the ANA's effort to absolutely destroy me and my
reputation."

The ANA's allegations stem from findings that surfaced during an arbitration
regarding Cipoletti's employment contract, said Larry Shepherd, who took over as
the ANA's executive director in March 2008.

"There were certain things that we knew and certain things that came to light as
we did our investigation, and we feel we have an obligation to our membership to
disclose those," he said this week.

Documents resulting from an arbitration, an alternative form of resolving
disputes, typically are not public record. But because the ANA added the
information as supporting documentation to an existing lawsuit, it became public.

Cipoletti, an employment attorney who has specialized in representing nonprofit
organizations, started working for the ANA in 1997 as an attorney and became the
organization's general counsel in 1998.

He became executive director in 2003 and continued to serve as its general counsel.

On Oct. 15, 2007, the ANA board voted to terminate Cipoletti with undisclosed
cause during a closed meeting at its local headquarters.

Cipoletti contended the board had no cause to fire him and requested arbitration
to decide whether his employment contract, which was to end Dec. 31, 2008,
should be honored.

He earned about $338,000 annually, according to the ANA's 2006 tax forms.

In his Feb. 5, 2008 demand for arbitration, Cipoletti sought to recover $52,529
in vacation pay, $112,790 in accrued sick leave and $48,400 in deferred
compensation, according to court documents.

But the results of the arbitration, released last week, were in favor of the ANA
on most issues, Shepherd said. Whether Cipoletti should pay fees associated with
the arbitration, including legal fees of the ANA, is yet to be determined.

Former ANA Executive Director now Under Criminal Investigation
Mike Ellis
«1

Comments

  • firstmintfirstmint Posts: 1,171
    $338,000 annually...isn't that about the same as some of the Senator's make in Washington DC?

    What's the salary of the US President these days?
    PM me if you are looking for U.S. auction catalogs
  • foodudefoodude Posts: 3,591 ✭✭✭
    What's the salary of the US President these days?

    I believe about $400,000 plus some other expenses ...
    Greg Allen Coins, LLC Show Schedule: https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/573044/our-show-schedule-updated-10-2-16 Authorized dealer for NGC, PCGS, CAC, and QA. Member of PNG, RTT (Founding Platinum Member), FUN, MSNS, and NCBA (formerly ICTA); Life Member of ANA and CSNS. NCBA Board member. "GA3" on CCE.


  • << <i>$338,000 annually...isn't that about the same as some of the Senator's make in Washington DC?

    What's the salary of the US President these days? >>



    The last I heard the President's base pay is $250K. Senators less. But I am sure they all have residual income of some kind from somewhere too! Amazing!
    Mike Ellis
  • ZoinsZoins Posts: 34,406 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>

    << <i>$338,000 annually...isn't that about the same as some of the Senator's make in Washington DC?

    What's the salary of the US President these days? >>



    The last I heard the President's base pay is $250K. Senators less. But I am sure they all have residual income of some kind from somewhere too! Amazing! >>

    According to Wikipedia, the POTUS makes $400,000.

    How much do the top people at the ANA get paid now?
  • ZoinsZoins Posts: 34,406 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I'm not sure if anyone's posted this Nusmismatic News article by David Ganz. It includes some of the allegations which may of interest.

    << <i>For example, the papers filed in May by ANA allege “Claimant’s fraudulent conduct predates the parties’ signing of the Employment Agreement. Claimant fraudulently induced the ANA to hire him and pay him $195,000 based on his representation that in the event he accepted the full time position as General Counsel he would lose money. Cipoletti was the top outside counsel to ANA before becoming an employee.

    Cipoletti “further alleged that it was necessary for him to maintain ‘several clients’ to offset his alleged reduction in pay,” ANA says in its papers. But then a revelation from the income tax returns filed by Cipoletti: “Actually, the income tax records show that Cipoletti made $50,000 less than his starring salary at ANA during the year preceding the start of his employment at ANA;” the particular exhibits are then cited–all coming from discovery documents.

    Another allegation by the ANA: In June 2004, Cipoletti “traveled to Indianapolis to testify on June 15, 2004, at a hearing on behalf of the ANA. He was “asked to testify about a person’s membership ... and to testify about issues with regard to being a member in the ANA.””

    According to Mr. Cipoletti, he notified the ANA’s Board of Governors “that he was going to act as an expert witness and that “we are being paid for it.”” The story then continues in the ANA narrative.
    Cipoletti “submitted a Purchase Order to the ANA,” which the filing said “detailed travel expenses” for the Indianapolis trip. “Two days later, on June 23, 2004, Christopher Cipoletti, P.C. issued a bill to the law firm of Barnes & Thornburg for services and travel expenses relating to” the same trip, the court filing says.

    Except for $18 not billed twice, ANA’s brief says, “all of the expenses charged to” the Barnes law firm “had clearly previously been paid by the ANA.” The result: a claim that Cipoletti had “converted over $6,500 belonging to the ANA, and was able to do so using his position as Executive Director-General Counsel” to conceal “the theft.”

    As a result of a subpoena issued on Feb. 27, 2009 – just months ago– the ANA was able to confirm its claim that Cipoletti was paid, and had not turned over the check, or himself made payment to the ANA of the funds he in essence was given twice.

    ANA claims other instances of improper accountings, and goes on to say that its discovery of how Cipoletti failed to account for double reimbursements was his “production of false or fraudulent tax returns” which prevented ANA’s own forensic experts from recognizing the problem. The returns were evidently produced under order from the arbitrators.

    The ANA claims that thousands of dollars it was entitled to were never turned over to it and that Cipoletti was properly discharged for cause. In a related development, the ANA’s outside litigation counsel handling this matter has asked to amend the counterclaims asserted against Cipoletti to include a claim for civil theft.

    All of the claims involved in the arbitration are also part of a larger court proceeding in El Paso County, Colo., court in Colorado Springs. Cipoletti has the right to respond to the documents that were electronically filed with the court on May 19. He had not responded by press time. >>

  • Well, all I can say to this is that is a major reason as to why I am no longer an ANA member. I guess I have a big oar out recently stirring the pot of controversy!!!! The world of organized conglomerates in regards to corruption, favoritism, selfishness, and total disregard for the good of all is finally reaching a catechism reaching its long arm to our passionate hobby and business. True pinnacles of sorts when it comes to who can one really trust these days. This hobby has become so political that I have become very cynical when it comes to trusting a grade given to a certain coin by any TPS or any so called governing body of our hobby. Alright, my rant again has been projected so flame away as I enjoy creating controversy, despite being a 20 year Rookie.

    Edited to add that I am 20 year rookie in regards to coin collecting yet only a 4 year rookie on the CU forum.
    Charter member of CA, Coinaholics Anonymous-6/7/2003
    Kewpie Doll award-10/29/2007
    Successful BST transactions with Coinboy and Wondercoin.
  • BroadstruckBroadstruck Posts: 30,497 ✭✭✭✭✭
    He earned about $338,000 annually, $52,529 in vacation pay, $112,790 in accrued sick leave and $48,400 in deferred
    compensation


    image
    To Err Is Human.... To Collect Err's Is Just Too Much Darn Tootin Fun!
  • I don't know how much any of them make but nobody has a base salary near half of that! The only thing Cipoletti could make happen was to get the board to keep approving increases in pay and benefits. Put all known variables together and he was not even there half the time which we knew, we just didn't know all the "whys."
    Mike Ellis
  • BearBear Posts: 18,953 ✭✭✭
    It would seem the American way. The worse job an

    executive does, the more money they earn. It is a

    heck of a deal for them.
    There once was a place called
    Camelotimage
  • How much do the board members make?

    I'm curious...
  • BearBear Posts: 18,953 ✭✭✭
    You realize of course, what

    curiosity did to the cat?
    There once was a place called
    Camelotimage
  • ZoinsZoins Posts: 34,406 ✭✭✭✭✭
  • PerryHallPerryHall Posts: 47,416 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>ou realize of course, what

    curiosity did to the cat? >>



    Curiosity killed the cat.
    Satisfaction brought him back.image

    Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
    "Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
    "Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire

  • abitofthisabitofthatabitofthisabitofthat Posts: 2,142 ✭✭✭


    << <i>I don't know how much any of them make but nobody has a base salary near half of that! The only thing Cipoletti could make happen was to get the board to keep approving increases in pay and benefits. Put all known variables together and he was not even there half the time which we knew, we just didn't know all the "whys." >>



    If only there was someone willing to serve on the ANA board to safeguard our hobby's leading organization.

    merse



  • << <i>

    << <i>ou realize of course, what

    curiosity did to the cat? >>



    Curiosity killed the cat.
    Satisfaction brought him back.image >>



    and I will die only when my curiosity has been satisfied..

    which in the long run will never stop.

    but I did get an email today

    Hey Mike- howyadoin?
  • BarndogBarndog Posts: 20,523 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>

    << <i>I don't know how much any of them make but nobody has a base salary near half of that! The only thing Cipoletti could make happen was to get the board to keep approving increases in pay and benefits. Put all known variables together and he was not even there half the time which we knew, we just didn't know all the "whys." >>



    If only there was someone willing to serve on the ANA board to safeguard our hobby's leading organization. >>



    yes, some savior, someone with 10% of his lifetime posts to this forum in this particular thread.
  • BarndogBarndog Posts: 20,523 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>

    << <i>

    << <i>I don't know how much any of them make but nobody has a base salary near half of that! The only thing Cipoletti could make happen was to get the board to keep approving increases in pay and benefits. Put all known variables together and he was not even there half the time which we knew, we just didn't know all the "whys." >>



    If only there was someone willing to serve on the ANA board to safeguard our hobby's leading organization. >>



    yes, some savior, someone with 10% of his lifetime posts to this forum in this particular thread. >>



    let me add: someone who can't spell Cipoletti


  • << <i>

    << <i>

    << <i>

    << <i>I don't know how much any of them make but nobody has a base salary near half of that! The only thing Cipoletti could make happen was to get the board to keep approving increases in pay and benefits. Put all known variables together and he was not even there half the time which we knew, we just didn't know all the "whys." >>



    If only there was someone willing to serve on the ANA board to safeguard our hobby's leading organization. >>



    yes, some savior, someone with 10% of his lifetime posts to this forum in this particular thread. >>



    let me add: someone who can't spell Cipoletti >>



    R U curious as well Barndog?

    did U get an email as well?


  • << <i>

    << <i>

    << <i>

    << <i>I don't know how much any of them make but nobody has a base salary near half of that! The only thing Cipoletti could make happen was to get the board to keep approving increases in pay and benefits. Put all known variables together and he was not even there half the time which we knew, we just didn't know all the "whys." >>



    If only there was someone willing to serve on the ANA board to safeguard our hobby's leading organization. >>



    yes, some savior, someone with 10% of his lifetime posts to this forum in this particular thread. >>



    let me add: someone who can't spell Cipoletti >>



    Excuse me everybody for mispelling Cipoletti's name once out of hundreds of times I have typed it today.
    Mike Ellis


  • << <i>

    << <i>

    << <i>ou realize of course, what

    curiosity did to the cat? >>



    Curiosity killed the cat.
    Satisfaction brought him back.image >>



    and I will die only when my curiosity has been satisfied..

    which in the long run will never stop.

    but I did get an email today

    Hey Mike- howyadoin? >>



    I am doing fine, how about you bass-a-sassun?
    Mike Ellis


  • << <i>
    Excuse me everybody for mispelling Cipoletti's name once out of hundreds of times I have typed it today. >>



    You've typed this name "hundreds of times" today? image Wow, for someone with a conflict of interest, you sure are publicizing your vendetta! The article says "Everyone is innocent until proven guilty," but I guess you want to make sure you get the man tried and convicted in the court of public opinion long before he get's his legal due process. And this from the man about whom I received a broadcast spam with an endorsement for office???
  • edix2001edix2001 Posts: 3,388
    Maybe Mike had a few misspellings since he actually felt like writing "crapoletti", as in all the mess that bozo caused for the ANA while he had ensconced himself on the throne of unlimited power.
    Truly, Mike Ellis was an opponent of the faker from the early days, when some were willing to turn a blind eye or even participate in the charade, like during the embarrassing removal of Walt Ostromecki from the board of governors.
    In fact the misdeeds of "crapoletti" likely radicalized Mike Ellis to eventually become a candidate for the ANA. Without "crapoletti's" grand hybris, Mike might've stayed situated in whatever comfortable roles he had set up for himself to enjoy the hobby. Instead, he invested plenty of time trying to get the ANA moving back in the right direction, on behalf of the hobbyists that it ostensibly represents, and not the special interests of a handful of people out for personal gain and status seeking.
  • BlindedByEgoBlindedByEgo Posts: 10,754 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>Maybe Mike had a few misspellings since he actually felt like writing "crapoletti", as in all the mess that bozo caused for the ANA while he had ensconced himself on the throne of unlimited power.
    Truly, Mike Ellis was an opponent of the faker from the early days, when some were willing to turn a blind eye or even participate in the charade, like during the embarrassing removal of Walt Ostromecki from the board of governors.
    In fact the misdeeds of "crapoletti" likely radicalized Mike Ellis to eventually become a candidate for the ANA. Without "crapoletti's" grand hybris, Mike might've stayed situated in whatever comfortable roles he had set up for himself to enjoy the hobby. Instead, he invested plenty of time trying to get the ANA moving back in the right direction, on behalf of the hobbyists that it ostensibly represents, and not the special interests of a handful of people out for personal gain and status seeking. >>




    I heartily agree.

    I don't really have a horse in this race, but I sure hope that Mike keeps posting here, and everywhere else, to pursue his "vendetta".

    What a load of crap! Vendetta? Mr. Cipoletti has been an alledged bad actor for quite some time. It is people who are passionate about this hobby (and business) that deserve leadership posts and support.

    If, as stated, Mr. Cipoletti falsified tax returns and submitted them in arbitration, he has far, far bigger issues with which to deal than the ANA.

    Good luck, Mike!
  • EagleEyeEagleEye Posts: 7,677 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Thanks for posting this Mike.

    Good luck with the election!

    And Congrats on the CONECA Hall of Fame award. You certianly deserve it.
    Rick Snow, Eagle Eye Rare Coins, Inc.Check out my new web site:
  • cmerlo1cmerlo1 Posts: 8,015 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I think Mike's contributions to the hobby over the years speak for themselves. He's certainly done more than legal-counsel-turned-ANA Director Cipoletti (hope I spelled it right). Once again, it's apparent that the attitude of some of the people here is to attack someone who posts wherever they feel they can, regardless of the subject.
    You Suck! Awarded 6/2008- 1901-O Micro O Morgan, 8/2008- 1878 VAM-123 Morgan, 9/2022 1888-O VAM-1B3 H8 Morgan | Senior Regional Representative- ANACS Coin Grading. Posted opinions on coins are my own, and are not an official ANACS opinion.
  • TrimeTrime Posts: 1,863 ✭✭✭
    Regarding the allegations against Chris Cipoletti:
    It seems reasonable to have all the details of the investigations to become public knowledge and the determinations available before forum opinions are cast.
    I neither know Chris well nor do I have a position on his guilt should he be indicted. The fact that he was paid very well is not grounds for indictment nor judgment any more than the business members of the Association should be criticized for being financially successful. Whether Cipoletti was worth the pay is a reasonable question but hardly grounds for opinion on guilt.
    It is clear that the ANA has moved on and members seem to be pleased (at least for now) on the job done by the new CEO and BOD.
    The ANA in my opinion is a very important part of the numismatic world. I wish it the greatest success.
    Trime
  • edix2001edix2001 Posts: 3,388
    There seems to be sufficient evidence the dood was double dippin', to say the very least.

    But at the very base of it all, the guy is an attorney and yet he has lost out in every venue so far where anyone had a chance to judge him. I guess at one point he felt himself impervious to challenge due to his legal astuteness, but apparently it was only a facade, the poor fella even fooled himself -- for he wasn't a legal genius at all, but more of a bamboozler. This period has been a long drawn out portrait of a schlemiel.
  • Mr. Ellis,you are truly a breath of fresh air for sure, I only wish that I was a standing member of the ANA as you woud have my vote for sure. Good luck and I hope you win!
    Charter member of CA, Coinaholics Anonymous-6/7/2003
    Kewpie Doll award-10/29/2007
    Successful BST transactions with Coinboy and Wondercoin.
  • TwoSides2aCoinTwoSides2aCoin Posts: 44,957 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Sad news abounds in numismatics, doesn't it ?
  • PerryHallPerryHall Posts: 47,416 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>Mr. Ellis,you are truly a breath of fresh air for sure, I only wish that I was a standing member of the ANA as you woud have my vote for sure. Good luck and I hope you win! >>



    Agree. That's why he was one of the candidates that got my vote in the ANA election.

    Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
    "Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
    "Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire



  • << <i>How much do the board members make?

    I'm curious... >>



    Board members do not get paid anything. Most of the current board doesn't even ask for reimbursement of travel expenses!
    Mike Ellis


  • << <i>

    << <i>If only there was someone willing to serve on the ANA board to safeguard our hobby's leading organization. >>



    I have never put it that way, nor have many of the other candidates, but I promise you this is a primary reason why many of us are running - to safe guard our organization.
    Mike Ellis
  • TwoSides2aCoinTwoSides2aCoin Posts: 44,957 ✭✭✭✭✭
    In other news, I'm becoming a life member this year. Monthy charges on my credit card are proof image


  • << <i>In other news, I'm becoming a life member this year. Monthy charges on my credit card are proof image >>



    Awesome! This is a great vote of confidence in today's ANA and justifiably so.
    Mike Ellis
  • abitofthisabitofthatabitofthisabitofthat Posts: 2,142 ✭✭✭


    << <i>

    << <i>If only there was someone willing to serve on the ANA board to safeguard our hobby's leading organization. >>



    I have never put it that way, nor have many of the other candidates, but I promise you this is a primary reason why many of us are running - to safe guard our organization. >>



    Mike - I thank you for running and wish you well in the election. My comment might have been taken the wrong way. I did not mean to cast aspersions on your reason for seeking office. It was supposed to be a very gentle prod about the allegations surrounding Mr. Cipolleti and the election.

    What I would like from the ANA board is accountability, but also transparency. It seemed to me that your original post should have included the statement that you were running for the office. To simply put the allegation in a post and not mention this seemed...disingenuous. I like full disclosure in all things related to the ANA. Their has been too much secrecy and closed doors.

    Best of luck in the election.

    Chris

    merse



  • << <i>Mr. Ellis,you are truly a breath of fresh air for sure, I only wish that I was a standing member of the ANA as you woud have my vote for sure. Good luck and I hope you win! >>



    That's okay. Rejoin when you are comfortable enough to join again. You are not alone. Lot's of people let their memberships lapse over the past few years. Some even went as far as to publicly renounce their membership in protest. I encourage all of you to renew now if you have not already.
    Mike Ellis
  • astroratastrorat Posts: 9,221 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>How much do the board members make?

    I'm curious... >>



    The Board members are unpaid volunteers. However, in the past, many Board members have received "comps" as a direct result of being on the Board. Fortunately, few have used the ANA as a workshop for their own gain, but in the not-so-distant past, some "famous" Board members were notorious for their indiscretions.

    As Mike mentioned, many of the recent Board members have made a conscious decision to cover their own expenses.

    Lane
    Numismatist Ordinaire
    See http://www.doubledimes.com for a free online reference for US twenty-cent pieces


  • << <i>

    << <i>

    << <i>If only there was someone willing to serve on the ANA board to safeguard our hobby's leading organization. >>



    I have never put it that way, nor have many of the other candidates, but I promise you this is a primary reason why many of us are running - to safe guard our organization. >>



    Mike - I thank you for running and wish you well in the election. My comment might have been taken the wrong way. I did not mean to cast aspersions on your reason for seeking office. It was supposed to be a very gentle prod about the allegations surrounding Mr. Cipolleti and the election.

    What I would like from the ANA board is accountability, but also transparency. It seemed to me that your original post should have included the statement that you were running for the office. To simply put the allegation in a post and not mention this seemed...disingenuous. I like full disclosure in all things related to the ANA. Their has been too much secrecy and closed doors.

    Best of luck in the election.

    Chris >>



    Chris, I did not take it wrong. I just wanted to reassure readers that they can have faith in most of the candidates as most of them really do care. Not all of them, but most of them. I also see what you mean about starting this post with the statement I am running for the board. I really did not intend for this to be tied to the election in any way. I did a search to see if forum readers were aware of this big news recently reported in the primary newspaper in Colorado Springs. It had not so I posted it with the intention of just reporting the news. Nothing more, nothing less. I agree with you 100% that people who really care should be the ones on the board. Thanks for the best wishes too!
    Mike Ellis
  • cinman14cinman14 Posts: 2,489


    << <i>"The investigation could lead to charges being filed or charges not being filed" >>



    Ya think.... image


  • << <i>

    << <i>"The investigation could lead to charges being filed or charges not being filed" >>



    Ya think.... image >>



    When I first read the article this line made me say out loud exactly what you did! "Ya think?" Just semantics. Ms. Kelley has been great for ANA membership for some time now.
    Mike Ellis
  • TwoSides2aCoinTwoSides2aCoin Posts: 44,957 ✭✭✭✭✭
    If a politician had to work for the same things I get as a business owner... They'd not be politicians nor business owners, but recipients of the very welfare system they created. .
  • I dont know the OP or the guy the op is talking about. I have read about it at length though in CW and here.

    Whatever this guy did in the ANA it sure doesnt seem like the membership was at all happy with it.

    Ive heard of Mr. Ellis and hope he stays and becomes a more frequent poster. Im sure he has alot of great coin stories and past experiences to share with all of us.



    Thanks for the post and the info. Maybe now is a good time to consider joining the ANA finally... image
  • ElcontadorElcontador Posts: 7,740 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I don't know Mr. Ellis, but he sounds like a breath of very much needed fresh air for our hobby. We've had far too many prominent people in numismatics be guilty of various kinds of abhorrent behavior, such as "appropriating coins for personal use from the ANA" and child molestation, for example, along with the more minor stuff, such as allegations of knowingly dealing in stolen numismatic property and outright theft.
    "Vou invadir o Nordeste,
    "Seu cabra da peste,
    "Sou Mangueira......."


  • << <i>I let my membership expire because of that guy. Why would I ever rejoin? The ANA is obsolete now.

    BTW, who is "Supergem?" If it is who I think it is, then re. conflict of interest, talk about the pot calling the kettle black!

    Everyone knows Mike Ellis is a good man. More than I can say about that other crowd. >>



    I am simply a collector and passive ANA member. I have zero connections to Mike Ellis or Chris Cipoletti or any other officer (current, former, or nominated). I do not now, nor have I ever served on the governing board of the ANA or any such public organization, and I am not a dealer nor employed by a dealer. I am an appreciative coin collector, plain and simple. Who are YOU to claim that I have a conflict of interest when you obviously haven't a clue as to who I am?

    I do not have any personal knowledge of the backgrounds of either party in this matter, nor do I have any fixed opinions regarding the allegations in this matter. My mind is open and objective, and I will wait for the parties involved to resolve the matter before forming any opinions of my own. So, no, I for one do not know that Mike Ellis is a "good man," eventhough he certainly may be. What I do see is a man, who I have never met nor heard of before, who is the subject of an unsolicited spam email into my inbox touting him for a role as governor in the ANA, and then later that same morning this gentlemen comes to the Forum to very selectively choose to link very unfavorable (and as yet unproven) allegations against another person connected with the ANA, all without explicitly disclosing his own connection. Frankly, if I hadn't received that spam email, I would not have recognized that connection myself.

    Santion II regularly gives us updates on the Langbord case. As far as I know, he is not connected with either side of that dispute. He is simply providing a service to all of us Forum members by wading through very technical documents to relay information to those of us who might be interested. Kudos to Santion II for his service! However, when someone comes here with what seems to me to be the sole intention of grinding his axe and spreading (as yet) unproved allegations that have already been reported in many places elsewhere, I have to question the person's objectivity and motives. Like I said, Mike Ellis might indeed be a great guy to those who already know him, but his timing and his choice of contributions to this Forum causes me to feel suspicious in my own first impressions of him.
  • TwoSides2aCoinTwoSides2aCoin Posts: 44,957 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Give that man an "A" for articulatin' so well.
  • DieClashDieClash Posts: 3,688 ✭✭✭


    << <i>There seems to be sufficient evidence the dood was double dippin', to say the very least.

    But at the very base of it all, the guy is an attorney and yet he has lost out in every venue so far where anyone had a chance to judge him. I guess at one point he felt himself impervious to challenge due to his legal astuteness, but apparently it was only a facade, the poor fella even fooled himself -- for he wasn't a legal genius at all, but more of a bamboozler. This period has been a long drawn out portrait of a schlemiel. >>



    You folks need to stop talking Yiddish around here! In the past month I've discovered what schmutz means and now edix is talkin about schlemiel. Enough already! imageimage

    P.S. Seems I'm learning more Yiddish here than I am numismatics.image
    "Please help us keep these boards professional and informative…. And fun." - DW
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  • LongacreLongacre Posts: 16,717 ✭✭✭
    Call me old-fashioned, but Longacre likes to assume that he is innocent until proven guilty.
    Always took candy from strangers
    Didn't wanna get me no trade
    Never want to be like papa
    Working for the boss every night and day
    --"Happy", by the Rolling Stones (1972)
  • edix2001edix2001 Posts: 3,388
    The connection to Cippoletti's alleged and actual misdeeds (whatever they may be) long pre-date Mike Ellis' decision to run as a candidate for office with the ANA.
    In fact, while Cippoletti was executive director, I believe that he had defamed Ellis then, who was a supporter of transparency in ANA governance as a mere mortal member at the time.
    Mike Ellis and some others were calling a spade a spade while all the nonsense was going on when Cippoletti held the reins of power and many other voices at that critical time were mute.
    Mike Ellis would likely be alerting folks to the various comeuppances currently being handed to Cipploleti as the wheels of justice make their fine grounds, whether he was a candidate or not.
    So, superdupergem, I think that your perceptions of the gestalt at hand are quite distorted, and though you seem to enjoy being wordy, your lack of familiarity of the issues detracts from your claims and emphasis and thus your analysis lies empty.

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