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Help! Maple Leafs vs. American Eagles

RollSearcherRollSearcher Posts: 227 ✭
in Precious Metals
I've never bought bullion before, bu I'm going to take the plunge and buy some. I was looking at APMEX and I noticed that the prices for Maple leafs are about $20 lower than the prices for American Eagles. Should I know anything before I buy the maple leafs? are they harder to sell than eagles? gold is gold, right?
Bottom line is, if I go to sell these x years from now, a dealer would pay the same for the leafs as they would for the eagles, right?

If anyone out there could weigh in on this, I'd appreciate it.

Comments

  • COINB0YCOINB0Y Posts: 4,505
    Eagle!

    Buy American until November 4th!, then Buy either one because both Coins will be of the same type of Govt. after that!
  • COINB0YCOINB0Y Posts: 4,505
    Just kidding, buy Eagle, better re-sale.
  • jmski52jmski52 Posts: 22,899 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I think that it's a wash. Eagles = higher premium buying/selling, but also more liquid if you live in the US.
    Q: Are You Printing Money? Bernanke: Not Literally

    I knew it would happen.
  • ilikebuffaloesilikebuffaloes Posts: 711
    I had a dealer advise me to buy Krugerrands because the premium was the lowest of all of the commonly accepted gold coins.

    YMMV image
    I'd keep playing. I don't think the heavy stuff will be coming down for quite a while!
  • RollSearcherRollSearcher Posts: 227 ✭
    Thanks for the responses so far.

    If I went to a dealer tomorrow with 10 eagles and 10 maple leafs, is there a chance they would offer me less for the maple leafs? The $20 less sounds attractive, but if I get a premium on the eagles when re-selling, I'll go with them.
  • 57loaded57loaded Posts: 4,967 ✭✭✭
    them SA Krugerrand coins do not have a monetary denomination on them.

    right now? i'd get AGE

    image
  • jmski52jmski52 Posts: 22,899 ✭✭✭✭✭
    is there a chance they would offer me less for the maple leafs?

    Yes.

    The question you might want to ask is, "what is your buy/sell spread on (10) Eagles, Maples, Kruggerands", etc.

    Any dealer will be looking for reasons to offer you less when you go to sell. The less popular coins are more available because the popular coins are already dispersed. The less popular coins give a dealer more reasons to knock his offering price down when you are selling to him.

    And buy/sell spreads do change over time. For instance, if the market cools off, you can expect the spreads to shrink a bit. Right now, the spreads are wider because it takes a little more work to actually find the bullion before he can sell it to you.
    Q: Are You Printing Money? Bernanke: Not Literally

    I knew it would happen.
  • DeadhorseDeadhorse Posts: 3,720 ✭
    Both gold and silver Maple Leafs have lost their premium over the last couple years.

    The return on selling can be significant.

    While I own some gold and silver Maples, I bought them long ago at a far better price.

    Personally, I have no desire to buy any more of them.

    As far as the K-Rands, yes they have the lowest premium and far less premium on selling.

    I used to be able to buy K-Rands at under spot, that how highly they are thought of.

    "Lenin is certainly right. There is no subtler or more severe means of overturning the existing basis of society(destroy capitalism) than to debauch the currency. The process engages all the hidden forces of economic law on the side of destruction, and it does it in a manner which not one man in a million is able to diagnose."
    John Marnard Keynes, The Economic Consequences of the Peace, 1920, page 235ff
  • mkman123mkman123 Posts: 6,849 ✭✭✭✭
    American Eagles cost more and the dealers pay more for them compared to Krugs and Maples.
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  • DeadhorseDeadhorse Posts: 3,720 ✭


    << <i>American Eagles cost more and the dealers pay more for them compared to Krugs and Maples. >>




    There is no such thing as a silver Kruggerand, only gold.
    "Lenin is certainly right. There is no subtler or more severe means of overturning the existing basis of society(destroy capitalism) than to debauch the currency. The process engages all the hidden forces of economic law on the side of destruction, and it does it in a manner which not one man in a million is able to diagnose."
    John Marnard Keynes, The Economic Consequences of the Peace, 1920, page 235ff
  • mkman123mkman123 Posts: 6,849 ✭✭✭✭
    I'm talking about gold krugs.

    Isn't the OP talking about gold???

    If he is talking about silver, then definitely get Eagles. The B&M store in my area gives more for Eagles than Maples.
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  • DeadhorseDeadhorse Posts: 3,720 ✭


    << <i>Isn't the OP talking about gold??? >>




    You are correct, I read past it.

    Since people have been talking about Teletrade and their silver Maple Leafs so much, I made a qick assumption.

    With gold, Eagles over Maple Leafs by a wide margin.

    Not even a contest.
    "Lenin is certainly right. There is no subtler or more severe means of overturning the existing basis of society(destroy capitalism) than to debauch the currency. The process engages all the hidden forces of economic law on the side of destruction, and it does it in a manner which not one man in a million is able to diagnose."
    John Marnard Keynes, The Economic Consequences of the Peace, 1920, page 235ff
  • cinman14cinman14 Posts: 2,489 ✭
    With a 20 dollar spread he has to be asking about AGE and Gold Maples...

    I have invested in both..... Silver that is. The spread on ASE will be greater. But I look at it as
    Silver bullion... If the world goes to hell in a hand basket... It will not matter. Plus the maple has a greater
    face value...

    So if for some reason silver falls to under 5 dollars an ounce.. My Maples will be worth more in face value..

    That's a new perspective for ya ain't it....image
  • DeadhorseDeadhorse Posts: 3,720 ✭


    << <i>So if for some reason silver falls to under 5 dollars an ounce.. My Maples will be worth more in face value..

    That's a new perspective for ya ain't it....image >>




    Not really.

    I'd have to consider it seriously to develop a perspective.
    "Lenin is certainly right. There is no subtler or more severe means of overturning the existing basis of society(destroy capitalism) than to debauch the currency. The process engages all the hidden forces of economic law on the side of destruction, and it does it in a manner which not one man in a million is able to diagnose."
    John Marnard Keynes, The Economic Consequences of the Peace, 1920, page 235ff
  • Danny9995Danny9995 Posts: 115
    Hey Cinman, I was thinking the same thing. No matter where silver is at, those maples have to be worth $8-$9 each. If silver fell to $4, maples are still going to be worth $8 or so, just because of the chance that silver will go back up. Noone would ever sell it for $5, when it will always be worth $5 or more because there would be no risk to hold it ( other than time value of money) but a real probability of gain. So I say a maple goes for $8-$9 even with silver at $3. Right now, Maples can be had for $12.50-$13.00 each with a little work. So really there is very little downside and tremendous upside potential. And the way the US is spending money, soon Canadian $5 will equal US $6.
  • cinman14cinman14 Posts: 2,489 ✭


    << <i>Hey Cinman, I was thinking the same thing. No matter where silver is at, those maples have to be worth $8-$9 each. If silver fell to $4, maples are still going to be worth $8 or so, just because of the chance that silver will go back up. Noone would ever sell it for $5, when it will always be worth $5 or more because there would be no risk to hold it ( other than time value of money) but a real probability of gain. So I say a maple goes for $8-$9 even with silver at $3. Right now, Maples can be had for $12.50-$13.00 each with a little work. So really there is very little downside and tremendous upside potential. And the way the US is spending money, soon Canadian $5 will equal US $6. >>



    image Glad to see i'm not the only one who has thought of it....image

    I really don't see why the mint won't bump the face value of these to match the times... It seems pointless to many
    but a higher face value would be nice...
  • CalGoldCalGold Posts: 2,608 ✭✭


    << <i>No matter where silver is at, those maples have to be worth $8-$9 each. If silver fell to $4, maples are still going to be worth $8 or so, just because of the chance that silver will go back up. Noone would ever sell it for $5, when it will always be worth $5 or more because there would be no risk to hold it ( other than time value of money) but a real probability of gain. So I say a maple goes for $8-$9 even with silver at $3. >>



    Sorry but this makes no sense at all. I would be willing to pay $5 Canadian for the silver Maple Leaf when silver is $4 for the same reason as I would be willing to pay $5 Canadian for a Canadian $5 bill. But If silver is $4 and I expect the price to rise, then I would want to buy silver for $4, not for $8 or $9 since every dollar of that premium is “wasted” and could instead be invested in more silver at $4.

    Edited to add: the face value "floor" should be worth some insurance value premium, but the premiums you are projecting are 100% or more and that would make them an unattractive investment vehicle.

    CG
  • Danny9995Danny9995 Posts: 115
    Cal Gold,

    I would want to also.

    The question is why would anyone sell you a maple for $5, when silver is $4. It will always be worth $5 so if they sell it for $5, they get nothing. Then when silver goes up to $10 they lost $5 per coin. By selling it to you at $5, you are in a no lose position, which really means they are in a no win position. Right now ASE are going for about $15 if you try at all. I guarantee if the face vale on an ASE was $15, you would not be able to buy one for less than $20-$22. You shouldnt wouldnt get one for $15. Even though you would want to, of course.
  • cinman14cinman14 Posts: 2,489 ✭
    They place a face value on them for a reason.... Hopefully we will never have to know why...image
  • Danny9995Danny9995 Posts: 115
    Silver is $4, you buy 1000 ASE's for $4000. Maybe you win, Maybe you lose.

    Silver is $4, you buy 1000 maples for $5000, maybe you win, maybe you break even.
  • mkman123mkman123 Posts: 6,849 ✭✭✭✭
    guys don't worry, I highly doubt silver will ever be $4! If so, it would sell for like 6+ more if you could even find it.

    I found a JM round today for 10 dollars! woohoo, first time ever getting a round near spot price. image
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  • CladiatorCladiator Posts: 18,050 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I solve the problem of having equal quantities of both. image
  • CaptHenwayCaptHenway Posts: 32,227 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>I've never bought bullion before, bu I'm going to take the plunge and buy some. I was looking at APMEX and I noticed that the prices for Maple leafs are about $20 lower than the prices for American Eagles. Should I know anything before I buy the maple leafs? are they harder to sell than eagles? gold is gold, right?
    Bottom line is, if I go to sell these x years from now, a dealer would pay the same for the leafs as they would for the eagles, right?

    If anyone out there could weigh in on this, I'd appreciate it. >>



    The reason that gold eagles are preferred in the marketplace over gold maple leafs is quite simple. If you sell us a certain large quantity of gold maple leafs we are required to report the transaction to the IRS, while the sale of gold eagles is not reportable in any quantity.
    Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
  • WegWeg Posts: 544
    Is there a reason (beside the thread asked of eagles/maples?) where nobody brought up philharmonics? As I just got 500 I'm hopeing there's no bad reasons.
    Remember, I'm pullen for ya; we're all in this together.---Red Green---
  • ttownttown Posts: 4,472 ✭✭✭
    I'd say either. You can't find Eagles for $13 but you can Maple Leafs. Don't let the "you can sell Eagles for more", when silver makes it's run both will bring about the same. You have to look at the buy sell ratio which is less on the Maple Leafs IMO but even if it's about the same you pay more for the Eagles and you can sell them for more but that doesn't mean you made more money.
  • RollSearcherRollSearcher Posts: 227 ✭
    thanks for the input everyone - I wound up going with the American Eagles @ $804 and change apiece.

  • CaptHenwayCaptHenway Posts: 32,227 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>Is there a reason (beside the thread asked of eagles/maples?) where nobody brought up philharmonics? As I just got 500 I'm hopeing there's no bad reasons. >>



    Most people do not know them. However, they are not reportable either (at this time, though regulations could change in the future).
    Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
  • dimplesdimples Posts: 1,286 ✭✭✭
    Rollseacher...Where did you buy them
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