Results of a little eBay DSR expieriment

UtahCoin · October 21, 2008 10:59PM

For the last month (about 60 auctions), I charged ZERO for shipping. I emailed the seller and thanked them for buying the item as soon as it was sold, I then emailed them and thanked them as soon as it was paid for and shipped every item the day it was paid and notified them of the shipping. I used very high resolution pictures that represented the item exactly as it was. As a result, here's my 30day DSR:

Item as described, 4.90
Communication, 4.95
Shipping Time, 4.95
S&H Charges, 4.95 (EVERY item was shipped free)

With some people you just can't win. I do find it odd that eBay allows a buyer to do a S&H rating when the S&H is free....

DoubleEagle59 · October 21, 2008 11:04PM

Yes, it is too bad you didn't get 5.0's across the board because you deserved it.

Some people you just can't please.

Perhaps the lower score on 'shipping and handling' had something to do with the packaging of the coin/s. I'm sure it was top-notch, but maybe one or two buyers didn't see it that way.

Interesting survey though.

OPA · October 21, 2008 11:05PM

I agree, if s/h/i is free, it should be an automatic 5

UtahCoin · October 21, 2008 11:06PM

<< Yes, it is too bad you didn't get 5.0's across the board because you deserved it.

Some people you just can't please.

Perhaps the lower score on 'shipping and handling' had something to do with the packaging of the coin/s. I'm sure it was top-notch, but maybe one or two buyers didn't see it that way.

Interesting survey though. >>

I should mention that I ship with the coins in a flip, surrounded by foam, in a padded mailer, with Delivery Confirmation and insurance.

zeek · October 21, 2008 11:06PM

why do you even let DSR scores bother you? I don't think anyone pays attention to them, I know I don't.

pheh · October 21, 2008 11:09PM

<< why do you even let DSR scores bother you? I don't think anyone pays attention to them, I know I don't. >>

There's the little matter of a discount percentage on FV applied to every sale. It matters.

rgCoinGuy · October 21, 2008 11:10PM

<< why do you even let DSR scores bother you? I don't think anyone pays attention to them, I know I don't. >>

DSR scores are what determines how much you save on your final value fees each month, it is not important to buyers, but is to powersellers.

CarlWohlforth · October 21, 2008 11:11PM

<<why do you even let DSR scores bother you?>>

High DSR = Lower fees

I think some people think that nobody is perfect so nobody deserves a 5. If all shipping should be free and somebody who ships for free deserves a 3 or 4. I'm stretching here, I can't imagine not getting 5s for free shipping! I don't have 5s for shipping time but I ship within 24 hours of payment...

Millertime · October 21, 2008 11:11PM

I almost always give a 5 on item as described and communication, it has to be way out of line for me to deduct here. If I have the item in 7 days or less (I pay within an hour 99% of the time) I will give a 5 otherwise they get a 4. If S&H is below $4 or less they automatically get a 5 otherwise they'll sometimes get a 4 (usually $6 and above). Usually the sellers that offer free shipping do a good job across the board so they most often get 5's.

Millertime

zeek · October 21, 2008 11:26PM

OIC. I didn't know this. Where's my discount? I'm a powerbuyer.

rgCoinGuy · October 21, 2008 11:29PM

<< OIC. I didn't know this. Where's my discount? I'm a powerbuyer. >>

www.live.com, go to cashback.

coinpictures · October 21, 2008 11:33PM

<< If I have the item in 7 days or less (I pay within an hour 99% of the time) I will give a 5 otherwise they get a 4.

Millertime >>

Uhh... you do realize that the time to you in hand is dependent upon more than just the seller's handling time, right? I've had packages from the coasts take almost 2 weeks to get to me here in the midwest. I have a serious issue with a DSR policy like the one you quote. You're effectively punishing sellers for the pitfalls of the USPS.

Now, if the seller takes a week to ship that's a different matter, but if the seller ships within 3-4 days and it takes another week to get to you, how is that the seller's fault?

shorecoll · October 21, 2008 11:43PM

I have been in market research for 30 years, as a result I never give 5's for anything. But even I would rate free shipping a five. FYI, the behavior I mentioned is one of the reasons market research, advertising, brand strategy, marketing communications people, etc. are routinely excluded from surveys. But they're not excluded from eBay ratings so there's a built in bias to the feedback system. Also 10% (at least) of the US population are offically curmudgeons who would criticize free $20 bills. My first hundred eBay transactions or so I never gave feedback because of my self-admitted bias, and then I got accused of shilling (because I would put in 20 low-ball bids on a single seller's lots and never leave feedback) so I started leaving feedback (skewed though it may be).

mrpotatoheadd · October 21, 2008 11:56PM

FWIW, I have seen numerous reports on eBay's message boards of S&H DSRs dropping after a seller starts offering free shipping.

gecko109 · October 22, 2008 12:01AM

My DSRs after 80 ratings are: 4.9---4.9---4.9---4.8 and I havent ever gone out of my way to boost any of these numbers. Just be honest, courteous, and prompt and the numbers will take care of themselves.

UtahCoin · October 22, 2008 12:04AM

<< FWIW, I have seen numerous reports on eBay's message boards of S&H DSRs dropping after a seller starts offering free shipping. >>

I may try charging a token $1 and see what happens.

Millertime · October 22, 2008 12:07AM

<< 

<< If I have the item in 7 days or less (I pay within an hour 99% of the time) I will give a 5 otherwise they get a 4.

Millertime >>

Uhh... you do realize that the time to you in hand is dependent upon more than just the seller's handling time, right? I've had packages from the coasts take almost 2 weeks to get to me here in the midwest. I have a serious issue with a DSR policy like the one you quote. You're effectively punishing sellers for the pitfalls of the USPS.

Now, if the seller takes a week to ship that's a different matter, but if the seller ships within 3-4 days and it takes another week to get to you, how is that the seller's fault? >>

Before I give them a 4 I consider factors such as weekends, holidays and if I get the shipping notification. I do give them the benefit of doubt but if it's 5 days or more before they ship than they're likely to get a 4. Since I can't see the scores I've left I'm guessing that the number of sellers I've dinged on shipping time over the last 100 auctions has only been 1 or 2 so 98% of sellers have done a decent to excellent job of shipping. I don't think I'm out of line there.

Milleritme

ebaytrader · October 22, 2008 12:30AM

We did free shipping in June and July. For July, our shipping DSR was 4.6.
In September, we again began charging for shipping. Our 30 day DSR for shipping is 5.0.
Draw your own conclusions.

UtahCoin · October 22, 2008 12:32AM

<< We did free shipping in June and July. For July, our shipping DSR was 4.6.
In September, we again began charging for shipping. Our 30 day DSR for shipping is 5.0.
Draw your own conclusions. >>

What do you charge for S&H?

mike92694 · October 22, 2008 12:45AM

<< I have been in market research for 30 years, as a result I never give 5's for anything. But even I would rate free shipping a five. FYI, the behavior I mentioned is one of the reasons market research, advertising, brand strategy, marketing communications people, etc. are routinely excluded from surveys. But they're not excluded from eBay ratings so there's a built in bias to the feedback system. Also 10% (at least) of the US population are offically curmudgeons who would criticize free $20 bills. My first hundred eBay transactions or so I never gave feedback because of my self-admitted bias, and then I got accused of shilling (because I would put in 20 low-ball bids on a single seller's lots and never leave feedback) so I started leaving feedback (skewed though it may be). >>

See, herein lies the problem. Everybody has a different grading scale, and it is unclear, even with the same company (such as eBay) how to interpret it.

For example, where I work as a software developer, if you complete your tasks on time without too many mistakes, you're supposed to get a "3". If you do extra tasks and complete them on time, you're supposed to get a "4". If you do extra tasks and finish everything early without only a few minor errors, you can get a "5" if you're lucky ...

So, it's hard to say. To me, a "4"on eBay means good enough. a "5" means exceptional.

Walmann · October 22, 2008 1:02AM

S&H. Its odd how people will value and rate something higher that they have to pay for, even if a very nominal fee, versus something they get for free.

Dog97 · October 22, 2008 1:16AM

The buyers probably read this board and know that sellers build the shipping price & PP fees into the starting bid or reserve and nothing is actually free.
I've noticed that BIN items with FREE SHIPPING always are priced higher than like items with BIN and separate shipping.
This is readily obvious when the search page is displayed.
You didn't mention your format so my remarks may not be applicable to you.

UtahCoin · October 22, 2008 2:59AM

<< The buyers probably read this board and know that sellers build the shipping price & PP fees into the starting bid or reserve and nothing is actually free.
I've noticed that BIN items with FREE SHIPPING always are priced higher than like items with BIN and separate shipping.
This is readily obvious when the search page is displayed.
You didn't mention your format so my remarks may not be applicable to you. >>

99% of my auctions start at 99 cents....

zeebob · October 22, 2008 3:08AM

I've been doing free shipping as well. Doesn't seem to impact my DSRs. Buyers seem to be getting pretty flip about feedback.

braddick · October 22, 2008 3:12AM

Having a 4.9 average or better give you exactly the same discount as having a 5.0.

The test would be to offer another 60 auctions and charge postage/insurance and take a couple of days to send the coins and (generally) without an email response of thanks.

I bet the averages would drop to about 4.8 and thus reduce your eBay powersellers discount.

Dog97 · October 22, 2008 3:35AM

A lot of time the postage stickers don't have the actual amount on them so I honestly don't have a clue if the shipping charges warrants a 1* or 5* so I arbitarily leave 4* across the board. I didn't know that affected the seller's profit.
I don't run back & forth from the mailbox to computer everytime I get something, I like to leave multiple feedbacks at once every week or so and it's really a pain & time consuming to review the old auctions that ended several weeks ago to remember the details and to dig the box out of the trash to see when the seller actually shipped it vs when I won the auction etc etc, so again I arbitarily leave 4* across the board.
And gettting 5 emails from eBay, Paypal and the seller everytime something is won, bought, invoiced, paid, cleared, shipped, etc clutters up my email account and aggrevates & confuses me. And to top it off, my email address goes in their contact lists and I get an endless barrage of viruses, spams, fowarded "Thought you might like this" "please read" "Thought this was funny" crap.
I know you sellers can't help it but eBay is just getting too complicated and user unfriendly.

notwilight · October 22, 2008 3:45AM

<< OIC. I didn't know this. Where's my discount? I'm a powerbuyer. >>

Buyers don't pay fees, sellers do. Give good sellers 5s so they get their rebate and they can keep prices down. My rebate was $300 last month so I have about $300 at risk every month. --Jerry

notwilight · October 22, 2008 3:47AM

<< 

<< FWIW, I have seen numerous reports on eBay's message boards of S&H DSRs dropping after a seller starts offering free shipping. >>

I may try charging a token $1 and see what happens. >>

Utah, I have the best luck charging actual shipping charges. Just enter the weight and class of service and ebay will calculate it for you. You have to put delivery confirmation or signature confirmation in as a handling charge, they aren't set up to handle that. --Jerry

zeek · October 22, 2008 4:24AM

<< 

<< OIC. I didn't know this. Where's my discount? I'm a powerbuyer. >>

Buyers don't pay fees, sellers do. Give good sellers 5s so they get their rebate and they can keep prices down. My rebate was $300 last month so I have about $300 at risk every month. --Jerry >>

Don't give eBay any ideas

Normally don't 'participate' in DSR, but I have been lately. For thos I didn't rank; Were they effected negatively?

dan8402 · October 22, 2008 4:29AM

I usually just give all 5s, within reason of course. I would much rather see the seller keep the discount money then have to pay it to eBay. If the seller is an idiot, I have no problem giving less than 5s, but it has to be deserved.

lkeigwin · October 22, 2008 4:45AM

I used to ship free and got similar results. So now I charge $2 and my numbers are a little better.

Ebay needs to fix the DSR rating when shipping is free. Just plain stupid. If they did this I'd go back to free shipping.

I start all auctions at $.01. I ship within 12 hours usually but never more than 48. I try to take good pix (but I know I need to improve there). I spend time to actually describe the coin, not just the grade. I even say when I don't like the coin, like this auction. Funny, that's like shooting yourself in the foot but I still get buyers.

My ratings are 4.8, 4.9, 4.9, 4.8. I give up.

Elynn · May 22, 2009 9:29AM

<< 

<< I have been in market research for 30 years, as a result I never give 5's for anything. But even I would rate free shipping a five. FYI, the behavior I mentioned is one of the reasons market research, advertising, brand strategy, marketing communications people, etc. are routinely excluded from surveys. But they're not excluded from eBay ratings so there's a built in bias to the feedback system. Also 10% (at least) of the US population are offically curmudgeons who would criticize free $20 bills. My first hundred eBay transactions or so I never gave feedback because of my self-admitted bias, and then I got accused of shilling (because I would put in 20 low-ball bids on a single seller's lots and never leave feedback) so I started leaving feedback (skewed though it may be). >>

See, herein lies the problem. Everybody has a different grading scale, and it is unclear, even with the same company (such as eBay) how to interpret it.

For example, where I work as a software developer, if you complete your tasks on time without too many mistakes, you're supposed to get a "3". If you do extra tasks and complete them on time, you're supposed to get a "4". If you do extra tasks and finish everything early without only a few minor errors, you can get a "5" if you're lucky ...

So, it's hard to say. To me, a "4"on eBay means good enough. a "5" means exceptional. >>

LindeDad · May 22, 2009 9:40AM

Never mind it's a old thread.

adamlaneus · May 22, 2009 9:44AM

<< For the last month (about 60 auctions), I charged ZERO for shipping. I emailed the seller and thanked them for buying the item as soon as it was sold, I then emailed them and thanked them as soon as it was paid for and shipped every item the day it was paid and notified them of the shipping. I used very high resolution pictures that represented the item exactly as it was. As a result, here's my 30day DSR:

Item as described, 4.90
Communication, 4.95
Shipping Time, 4.95
S&H Charges, 4.95 (EVERY item was shipped free)

With some people you just can't win. I do find it odd that eBay allows a buyer to do a S&H rating when the S&H is free.... >>

Some folks simply will not give five stars.

When I watch a movie on NetFlix, there is a rating system. I rarely give a movie five stars. You have to be really, really exceptional to get five stars from me.
Five stars is reserved for only the truly exceptional and that is few and far between.
Constant five star ratings cheapen the meaning of the excellence of five stars.

Now, take this logic, which makes sense in NetFlix...plop it onto the wasteland which is eBay...

eBay is probably very happy with this arrangement.

(by the way, I usually either leave five stars in all ratings...or if I am not in the mood, I don't leave star ratings at all.
CORRECTION: I do believe I gave heritage 3 stars once because I was feeling snarky for their photo quality on that auction. The coin did not look like the photo, but not bad enough to return)

shmort6552 · May 22, 2009 9:46AM

I'm mainly a buyer on ebay and when shipping is free---It's always 5 stars (unless the packaging is just terrible).

Bruce

GrumpyEd · May 22, 2009 9:50AM

It seems like they made the 5 star rating system more as a way to give themself an excuse to charge the sellers more as opposed to a usefull system to rate anything.

AUandAG · May 22, 2009 9:52AM

People don't see any value in free. You are just giving your profit away. I don't see any
difference in my DSR's or sales or prices, with or without free shipping. As long as the
S & H is reasonable I don't do any worse.
bob

Years ago my wife and I owned a Hardware store in Castle Rock, Colorado. One Christmas season
I bought 6 pairs of Midland walkie-talkies that were meant to retail at $99. These were not cheap
kids toys but fairly nice units.

Had them right at the check out counter at $19 (my cost was over $50).
I was just saying "thank you" to 6 customers.

However, after 6 weeks on the counter and none sold I was starting to panic as it was a week before
Christmas. I did not want to get stuck with them. So, my charming little wife said put them up to $99
and mark them down to $79 and they'll sell. Well, being the nice husband that knows nothing about
sales, I did just that. Three days later they were all sold.
Had several folks after Christmas ask for more.
Point is, at $19 there was no value but at the sale price of $79 they were a bargain.
Go figure.
I should have majored in Psychology instead of Accounting.

pheh · May 22, 2009 10:24AM

Food for thought...

ProofRainbowRoosevelt · May 22, 2009 10:31AM

My DSR is only 55 and I had 5's for Communication and Shipping time. Until I sold a Roosevelt a couple weeks ago and they both went to 4.9. I now have all 4.9's The guy bought my coin and 5 day later had it ( I know this cause he left + feedback). Well he left me a less than 5 for shipping time. As for communication, I thanked him and let him know I shipped it (the very next day). I don't think I can do much more than that. You can't please everyone. Anyone who has 5's is either very lucky, has a secret.

I was kinda upset at first, but now don't really care.

Forgot to add: I only charged 3.95 to ship it. And the shipping lable was 4+. So he knew I ate a little on shipping.

Russ · May 22, 2009 10:37AM

Russ, NCNE

OPA · May 22, 2009 11:33AM

<<

Russ, NCNE >>

bad boy .... you only deserve a 15% rebate ...

yellowkid · May 22, 2009 11:40AM

I ship as soon as I get payment. I live 5 minutes from the PO and if I get a payment at 4pm, I ship that day. I have a 4.6 for shipping time, it's mostly BS, don't worry about it.

Russ · May 22, 2009 11:44AM

<< bad boy .... you only deserve a 15% rebate ... >>

Yeah, that's pretty much the case each month, and always because of the shipping cost DSR. I worry about it the least, since I can't control it.

Russ, NCNE

pennyannie · May 22, 2009 1:34PM

Like Yellowkid stated i also live 5 minutes from the post office and my post office is never very busy. If it is paid for buy 4 or 4:30 i ship that day. I package well, always track the item and provide insure. I generally lose a little on shipping every time. I send the buyer a email giving them the tracking info. I never ask for feedback and i do not follow up with the sale. ( i usually check to see that the item was delivered and when) I feel like i provide decent pictures and good descriptions. My ratings are from 4.8 to 4.9X. I feel like i do a better job than when i recieve a item i have won on ebay. So now i just leave all 3's reguardless. I would leave 1's but then another screen pops up. So if you are worried ban me from your auctions.

sinin1 · March 12, 2010 2:48PM

I think many buyers have no clue on what the post office charges

I got zapped a 1 on shipping/handling charges = I state in the auction what it is going to cost (usually $2 - unless going to be over 13 oz - then $5+)

if you don't like it, skip the auction - don't make me pay eBay more because you can't add your total cost to your bid and figure accordingly

pennyannie, I hope you were kidding about leaving the 3's
if not give me your eBay handle so I can block you

GoldenEyeNumismatics · March 12, 2010 3:20PM

For a long time I held a rounded 5.0 for shipping & handling charges (I think the actual decimal was somethign like 4.98). I charge the full shipping rate. Most buyers don't care about what you charge---that gets figured into their bid. They just care about how fast the item gets to their doorstep. That means getting the coins in the mail ASAP.

BTW, the only reason I lost the 5.0 (which now is something like 4.88) was because I started shipping a lot of expensive items internationally, and USPS EMS International is very, very costly).

leothelyon · March 12, 2010 4:27PM

If no-one has already mentioned it, some folks just don't believe we live in a perfect world. But what would have been the flaw or oversight that one buyer was thinking?

Leo

19Lyds · March 12, 2010 6:05PM

<< I do find it odd that eBay allows a buyer to do a S&H rating when the S&H is free.... >>

Especially when they encourage sellers to do so via listing and FVF discounts.

In other words, eBay KNOWS when the shipping is free!

BUMS!

halfhunter · March 12, 2010 7:14PM

I think that alot of folks don't realize how much the DSRs affect a seller's fees.
The way e-Bay has the DSR descriptions worded, leave a 4 and the thing says something like "very satisfied" where a 5 is like "extremely satisfied", makes it sound as if you're giving good FB by leaving a 4. I think a 3 is something like "satisfied" . . . it's like e-Bay is stacking the deck against the seller with their wording.
Also alot of people, for some reason, seem to have it instilled in them not leave the highest score on anything.

I have never sold on e-Bay and most of what I buy is less than $200. I rarely have any problems with what I buy so the first three are always 5s. Free shipping always gets a 5.
Reasonable shipping always gets a 5. When a seller charges something like $6.95 - $8.95 and the item comes wrapped in 2 cents worth of bubble wrap, in a padded envelope, with $1.65 postage on it, I leave a 4 for shipping just cause it pisses me off. I DO figure ship charges in my bids, but that puts me competeing with folks who evidentially don't, and I often lose those auctions. Free shipping at least levels the playing field for bidders.

HH

coinvac41 · March 13, 2010 3:54AM

<< I think that alot of folks don't realize how much the DSRs affect a seller's fees.
The way e-Bay has the DSR descriptions worded, leave a 4 and the thing says something like "very satisfied" where a 5 is like "extremely satisfied", makes it sound as if you're giving good FB by leaving a 4. I think a 3 is something like "satisfied" . . . it's like e-Bay is stacking the deck against the seller with their wording.
Also alot of people, for some reason, seem to have it instilled in them not leave the highest score on anything.

I have never sold on e-Bay and most of what I buy is less than $200. I rarely have any problems with what I buy so the first three are always 5s. Free shipping always gets a 5.
Reasonable shipping always gets a 5. When a seller charges something like $6.95 - $8.95 and the item comes wrapped in 2 cents worth of bubble wrap, in a padded envelope, with $1.65 postage on it, I leave a 4 for shipping just cause it pisses me off. I DO figure ship charges in my bids, but that puts me competeing with folks who evidentially don't, and I often lose those auctions. Free shipping at least levels the playing field for bidders.

HH >>

messydesk · March 13, 2010 5:55AM

I wonder if a loud, flashy auction listing with lots of colors, fonts, and fine print makes buyers more or less forgiving when it comes to the star ratings.

Results of a little eBay DSR expieriment

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