The slow and unfortunate decline of Ebay...
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Posts: 610
I finally have some free time, so here are some thoughts on what is going on at Ebay that I've been meaning to share.
To start with some background....I've been using Ebay since 1999. I was exclusively a buyer until about a year ago, when I started selling off parts of my collection in order to fund other card purchases. When Ebay first came into existence it was revolutionary. It brought buyers and sellers together in a way that had never been done before. As the company has matured, however, its customers have become much more demanding in terms of the level of service that they expect, something to which Ebay has either been both low to recognize and slow to respond to.
From a seller's perspective, Ebay has dropped the ball on both fees and feedback, especially on high-value items. Combined Ebay and PayPal fees for most items are now anywhere from 4-8%. With the major auctions house now virtually eliminating consignment fees for buyers (I had some stuff in the most recent Mile High Cards auction consigned at 2%, and Mastro was advertising 0% for PSA items over $1000), Ebay is no longer financially competitive for high value items. On a $100 item, you pay 4.8% to Ebay, and on a $500 item you pay 3.8% (both before any PayPal fees). Unless you desperately need the cash right away, the auction houses are now a better deal for sellers than Ebay.
From a buyer's perspective, Ebay has done a horrible job in terms of weeding out fraud. The "we're just a marketplace" line doesn't wash anymore. As a buyer, all I care about is that the item I am buying is authentic. If that means that Ebay has to spend a lot more time, effort, and money policing sellers, then so be it. It's ridiculous how easy it is for fraudsters to open new accounts.
With regard to the feedback system, the recent changes reflect an astounding lack of understanding of how the system actually works. It's basically a MAD (mutually assured destruction) type of system which only works when both parties can leave feedback. The recent changes leave sellers at the mercy of unscrupulous buyers, which will cause many people like me to reduce the amount of selling I do on Ebay. Additionally, Ebay's hands-off policy when it comes to unjustified retaliatory negatives also needs to be changed. Personally, I think that all negatives (from both buyers and sellers) should be reviewed by Ebay, removed if found to be unwarranted, and the person leaving the unwarranted negative suspended. I recently received a negative from a buyer (my first ever) from somebody who lost their PayPal dispute with me after their compaint was found to be groundless. Ridiculous!
The bottom line is that Ebay, IMHO, has lost touch with its customers (amazing given the amount of feedback they get on their boards). As a seller, all I want is to get paid and to be protected from unwarranted negative feedback. As a buyer, all I want to for the items I buy to be guaranteed to be authentic and arrive in a reasonable amount of time. After ten years of being the dominant company in online auctions, Ebay has gotten arrogant and complacent. And like any company that gets arrogant and complacent and loses touch with the needs of their customers, they will suffer financially in the long run.
Matt
To start with some background....I've been using Ebay since 1999. I was exclusively a buyer until about a year ago, when I started selling off parts of my collection in order to fund other card purchases. When Ebay first came into existence it was revolutionary. It brought buyers and sellers together in a way that had never been done before. As the company has matured, however, its customers have become much more demanding in terms of the level of service that they expect, something to which Ebay has either been both low to recognize and slow to respond to.
From a seller's perspective, Ebay has dropped the ball on both fees and feedback, especially on high-value items. Combined Ebay and PayPal fees for most items are now anywhere from 4-8%. With the major auctions house now virtually eliminating consignment fees for buyers (I had some stuff in the most recent Mile High Cards auction consigned at 2%, and Mastro was advertising 0% for PSA items over $1000), Ebay is no longer financially competitive for high value items. On a $100 item, you pay 4.8% to Ebay, and on a $500 item you pay 3.8% (both before any PayPal fees). Unless you desperately need the cash right away, the auction houses are now a better deal for sellers than Ebay.
From a buyer's perspective, Ebay has done a horrible job in terms of weeding out fraud. The "we're just a marketplace" line doesn't wash anymore. As a buyer, all I care about is that the item I am buying is authentic. If that means that Ebay has to spend a lot more time, effort, and money policing sellers, then so be it. It's ridiculous how easy it is for fraudsters to open new accounts.
With regard to the feedback system, the recent changes reflect an astounding lack of understanding of how the system actually works. It's basically a MAD (mutually assured destruction) type of system which only works when both parties can leave feedback. The recent changes leave sellers at the mercy of unscrupulous buyers, which will cause many people like me to reduce the amount of selling I do on Ebay. Additionally, Ebay's hands-off policy when it comes to unjustified retaliatory negatives also needs to be changed. Personally, I think that all negatives (from both buyers and sellers) should be reviewed by Ebay, removed if found to be unwarranted, and the person leaving the unwarranted negative suspended. I recently received a negative from a buyer (my first ever) from somebody who lost their PayPal dispute with me after their compaint was found to be groundless. Ridiculous!
The bottom line is that Ebay, IMHO, has lost touch with its customers (amazing given the amount of feedback they get on their boards). As a seller, all I want is to get paid and to be protected from unwarranted negative feedback. As a buyer, all I want to for the items I buy to be guaranteed to be authentic and arrive in a reasonable amount of time. After ten years of being the dominant company in online auctions, Ebay has gotten arrogant and complacent. And like any company that gets arrogant and complacent and loses touch with the needs of their customers, they will suffer financially in the long run.
Matt
0
Comments
I can always rely on you to be one bundle of sunshine.
It's a beautiful day here - think I'll take advantage of it - ebay will be there for a rainy day I guess?
mike
You got a negative and you are mad. You will get over it and run back to ebay.
<< <i>The bottom line is that Ebay, IMHO, has lost touch with its customers (amazing given the amount of feedback they get on their boards). As a seller, all I want is to get paid and to be protected from unwarranted negative feedback. As a buyer, all I want to for the items I buy to be guaranteed to be authentic and arrive in a reasonable amount of time. >>
I've been on Ebay since 1998 (and Paypal gave you $5 to join - remember those days?) - but I've quit buying as well as selling. I've stopped even looking at the thing because honestly, selling is too much of a hassle and buying there is a chore.
A year ago I got ripped off from a NARU seller. I lost $40 - not much in the grand scheme of things - but I found that USPS was more helpful than Ebay was. Sorting the gems from the dross is now harder than ever. Ebay's website tries as hard as it can to shove stuff in your face that you aren't looking for, while hiding what you are. You'd think that they would have learned a thing or two from Google - and less from AOL - when it came to online searching. Everything seems geared towards making money off sellers by promoting their items instead of streamlining the search process.
I'm focused on building Topps baseball sets between 1967-71. I've found that Beckett makes it a breeze to search for exactly the cards I'm looking for - and for commons and semi-stars I pay about the same from established sellers without worrying about whether a seller's idea of "EXMT" would be a "VG" in my collection.
Consistency. Quality. Ease of use. And now price. I can now find all of these elsewhere.
What does Ebay have to offer someone like me?
So I quit - for now. Hopefully Ebay will change and buying/selling there will be fun again. I'd rather see it get better rather than go under.
I, too have been the victim of retaliatory negatives (when I was the buyer, never got my otem and left the seller a neg) and it's ridiculous. In that respect, I agree that eBay should be policing negatives that were left unnecessarily.
The fees are a bit absurd, but that's one point that's really not worth debating over, it's really never going to change. All you can do is deal with the fees or find another service.
I've been buying and selling on eBay since 1998.
The major auction houses may be better for selling high dollar items, but eBay is the place to sell everything else.
As for the negatives, so what if everyone isn't going to have 100 % positive feedback anymore.
If 98 % becomes the standard, what difference does it make? It's still a level playing field for everyone.
Without eBay, nobody would own the collections they now possess. All the changes are for the better in my opinion.
I like the changes PSA has made too. Life is wonderful. Enjoy!
"How about a little fire Scarecrow ?"
BUT, for sellers of collectibles it is the ONLY viable game in town.
The damage that EBAY has done to the collectible markets by
failing to police fraudsters is FAR outweighed by the positive
impact it has had on the same market.
The long-term profitability of EBAY is doomed; but, it will continue
to provide the best venue collectible sellers/buyers have ever
seen.
acution house - a seller's 1k item that is sold for $850 before the BP...they get $850 if paying Zero commission. that zero percent to date has been with Masto..others you are still paying 5-10% commission so getting the full $850 is best case.
ebay - that item sells for the 1K it is worth. pay ebay their 4% and add 2.9% for paypal - the seller gets $931 dollars
and the shipping thru and auction house....people complain about paying $4 shipping on ebay for a graded card...try paying $25 and up thru an auction house. don't get me wrong...I purchase from auction houses on a regular basis but the BP and shipping fees are factored in the bids and in the end the seller gets less and the auction house gets more.
ebay fees - about 4% for higher price items and paypal fees of 2.9% - they are both bargains. it's not exactly free for Paypal to accept credit card payments...that 2.9% is not all profit for them.....your credit card is charging a fee to paypal to collect that money. if you don't like ebay fees don't sell on ebay. if you don't like paypal fees then do not accept paypal.
if you want ebay to review every negative feedback....and you think the selling fees are high now? wait until they have to staff people to look at every negative feedback....
I happen to agree that most (90%) of the recent changes and most notably the increased fees and feedback abortion, have been negative.
With no real competition Ebay rules the roost. It is incredibly easy as a buyer, to screw any legitimate seller, claim they never received an item, rip you off and there is pretty much no recourse.
I'm glad so many people don't care, but I think you will care when you get burned.
Do I still sell on Ebay? sure, what else am I going to do. I don't see any harm in criticisizing them though, if enough people had the balls to say enough is enough maybe they would change for the better.
Of course the easiest thing to do, and what most people do is say nothing and do nothing.
It's a giant flea market. Stupid people get burned. Fraud is for the police to handle.
Ebay deciding to police their own system, while trying to maintain they're still "just a venue", is creating the worst of both worlds.
Ebey can't even police their own members for violating obvious ebay policies. Ebay is more or less a monopoly and as a result, is staffed with people who couldn't care less, and have no accountibility.
They need to become "just a venue" again.
<< <i>I wanna ask a stupid question relating to ease of search. Where did the completed listings link go in eBay??? >>
It there under the advanced search link or as a check box on the left hand column after you complete a normal search.
<< <i>I don't know what this means, but Blackborder is definitely quitting the hobby because of it. >>
You're just mad because my catch phrase caught on and yours died out.
But, you're right, I'm quitting the hobby because of it.
<< <i> Stupid people get burned. >>
Yup. Just like in real life.
Fat, drunk and stupid is no way to go through life, but 2 out of 3 ain't a bad way to roll ...
"How about a little fire Scarecrow ?"
The reason I post so many critical comments is that I run a business (a Sylvan Learning Center) that depends on good customer service for its survivial and therefore I'm probably more sensitive about customer service issues than others on this board.
I agree with some of the other posters that Ebay, for many things, is still often the best option out there. But that doesn't mean it can't improve itself. It has gotten compacent and arrogant and that disappoints me. I thought that they were a better run business than that. However, they are making the same mistakes many other businesses have made....focusing on improving the short-term bottom line at the expense of customer service.
Allen....I'm not complaing because of the one neg I received....that's insignificant in light of my overall feedback. I'm complaining because the Ebay customer experience has deteriorated significantly, and is nowhere near what it could be.
And Mr. Becker....have you noticed that Ebay is making a lot less money than they used to? Since December 04, their stock is down 57% Wonder why? It's because they aren't keeping their customers happy and people are buying and selling less on their website.
??? I'm in downtown seattle and it's not raining. looking at 8th ave right now. been up since 4:30 and no rain
I'm a bit north of Seattle, and it hasn't rained all day,
but keep telling everyone that it rains here all the time.
"How about a little fire Scarecrow ?"
<< <i>Stone...sorry I'm not being a ball of sunshine, but its raining here in Seattle (as usual).
??? I'm in downtown seattle and it's not raining. looking at 8th ave right now. been up since 4:30 and no rain >>
The plot thickens......
Sellers could bid on thier own items and then sell them again a week later.
You could leave anybody feedback for anything, even if you didnt buy from them.
<< <i>Stone...sorry I'm not being a ball of sunshine, but its raining here in Seattle (as usual). >>
No problem guy with numbers for name.
Still - from now on your Delta Tau Chi name is....
Sunshine.
mike
"...numbers for name..."
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Fibonacci number
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
A tiling with squares whose sides are successive Fibonacci numbers in length.
A Fibonacci spiral, created by drawing arcs connecting the opposite corners of squares in the Fibonacci tiling shown above; see Golden spiral
In mathematics, the Fibonacci numbers are a sequence of numbers named after Leonardo of Pisa, known as Fibonacci, whose Liber Abaci published in 1202 introduced the sequence to Western European mathematics.
The sequence is defined by the following recurrence relation:
That is, after two starting values, each number is the sum of the two preceding numbers. The first Fibonacci numbers (sequence A000045 in OEIS), also denoted as Fn, for n = 0, 1, 2, … , are:
0, 1, 1, 2, 3, 5, 8, 13, 21, 34, 55, 89, 144, 233, 377, 610, 987, 1597, 2584, 4181, 6765, 10946, 17711, 28657, 46368, 75025, 121393, ...[1]
Each third number of the series is an even number.
The sequence named after Fibonacci was first described in Indian mathematics.[2][3]
The sequence extended to negative index n satisfies Fn = Fn−1 + Fn−2 for all integers n, and F-n = (−1)n+1Fn:
.., -8, 5, -3, 2, -1, 1, followed by the sequence above.
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Modern animal-husbandery science has its roots in the Fib-sequence.
In the late 1800s, dairy farmers still used Fib-Charts to prove to
bankers that their herds would expand enough to finance the servicing
of an applied for loan.
He's not a number, dammit he's a man!- Bob Seger
<< <i>I'm so darn old I can remember:
Sellers could bid on thier own items and then sell them again a week later.
You could leave anybody feedback for anything, even if you didnt buy from them. >>
I'm so darn old I can remember when a number was something we smoked ...
"How about a little fire Scarecrow ?"
<< <i>
<< <i>I'm so darn old I can remember:
Sellers could bid on thier own items and then sell them again a week later.
You could leave anybody feedback for anything, even if you didnt buy from them. >>
I'm so darn old I can remember when a number was something we smoked ... >>
thats what my dad calls them.. "numbers".. or "doobs"..
he was telling me the otehr day about some dude on COPS that had a "number" tucked behind his ear while the cop was talking to him..
Did he say "That's not mine!"?
"How about a little fire Scarecrow ?"
<< <i>
I'm so darn old I can remember when a number was something we smoked ... >>
Heh heh, young feller... I'm so old, I can remember when we used to call them, get this. Ok, wait for it... joints
<< <i>
<< <i>
I'm so darn old I can remember when a number was something we smoked ... >>
Heh heh, young feller... I'm so old, I can remember when we used to call them, get this. Ok, wait for it... joints
They were still calling them joints in 99
Giovanni
<< <i>Still - from now on your Delta Tau Chi name is....
Sunshine. >>
Why "Sunshine"?
I agree the company (and the market) have definitely matured. Customers are much more demanding now than when it first started. It was such an improvement over classified ads, you were grateful for the convenience when it first started.
It's gotten very complicated though. I don't like using the word, but its almost like a cult, or vortex that seems to suck people in. I don't see how people have time to do everything on there and still have lives. All the features, ebay radio, ebay announcements, classes. Who has time for all that?
<< <i>he was telling me the otehr day about some dude on COPS that had a "number" tucked behind his ear while the cop was talking to him.. >>
But was he wearing a shirt Perry?
Now collecting:
Topps Heritage
1957 Topps BB Ex+-NM
All Yaz Items 7+
Various Red Sox
Did I leave anything out?
Looking for 1970 MLB Photostamps
- uncut
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<< <i>How does paying 4-8% to ebay/paypal costmore than the 15-20% buyer's fee from the large auction houses? >>
Because the seller pays the Ebay/PayPal fees, whereas its the buyer that pays the auction house fees.
The assumption that auction house buyers automatically reduce their bids by 15-20% to account for the buyer's fees they will have to pay is not necessarily valid. Many auction house bidders are much less price sensitive because they are wealthier, and are often much less price aware because they are not "serious" collectors like we are.
Roughly half the items I consigned to the Mile High Card auction were items I originally bought on Ebay (most in the past two years), and I realized a profit on all but one. There were even a couple of items on which I doubled my money.
I'm not sure i agree with that.
Steve
<< <i>Many auction house bidders are much less price sensitive because they are wealthier, and are often much less price aware because they are not "serious" collectors like we are. >>
And with that I dismiss anything you have to say about anything.
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
You are more than welcome to ignore everything I say if it makes you happy. I'm just trying to stimulate discussion....what I say is my opinion, no more and more less. It's entirely possible that my theories, on both this and other topics, are wrong. But it's the exchange of ideas and the debate, however, that are fun. I'm an open-minded person....too bad that many others on here are not.
My theory in this case is that because auctions usually contain higher priced items, they attract wealthier bidders who are less price sensitive because they are much more willing to pay whatever it takes to get an item.
Bargain-hunters with $500 to spend are much more likely to be found searching Ebay, whereas investment bankers earning half a million dollars a year who want to brag to their friends about how much they just spent on a Mantle are much more likely to be found at an auction house, and they have enough money that they aren't going to care whether or not they paid over book for someting they want.
That's my theory, and yes....it could be wrong.
<< <i>Ebay is a lot like Britney, used to be great but now it is so weaksauce. >>
I'd still hit brit.
EBAY makes me money while I do whatever; 24/7/365.
Brit will be just fine, if she knocks off the drugs/booze.
Hopefully, that will happen soon.