Exonerating Centsles
gamer1958
Posts: 147
I started a thread about Centsles almost 2 yrs ago, and its still being resurrected almost 2 years later.
I could just keep my mouth shut, but to set the story straight, I ordered a coin from Centsles in Jan 2005, and the coin hadn't shown up by February. I negotiated with Centsles, up into March or April (he kept telling me to be patient, etc). Since the coin was shipped insured, he told me he would file a claim with the US Post Office and send me my money back. I accepted that offer, and he sent me a check. End of the story, or so I thought. The coin finally showed up -- Memorial Day weekend, of 2006!!!
Now, how to settle this -- Centsles (presumably) got his money back from the post office; I have the coin PLUS my money back. It would seem that uncle sam is out the money...so what should I do? There was no negative feedback, anything like that.
The coin was a silver Ike in MS-67. Maybe it should be a giveaway or something (who'd want it?). The real point was that Centsles, in this case, at least, was NOT at fault.
I could just keep my mouth shut, but to set the story straight, I ordered a coin from Centsles in Jan 2005, and the coin hadn't shown up by February. I negotiated with Centsles, up into March or April (he kept telling me to be patient, etc). Since the coin was shipped insured, he told me he would file a claim with the US Post Office and send me my money back. I accepted that offer, and he sent me a check. End of the story, or so I thought. The coin finally showed up -- Memorial Day weekend, of 2006!!!
Now, how to settle this -- Centsles (presumably) got his money back from the post office; I have the coin PLUS my money back. It would seem that uncle sam is out the money...so what should I do? There was no negative feedback, anything like that.
The coin was a silver Ike in MS-67. Maybe it should be a giveaway or something (who'd want it?). The real point was that Centsles, in this case, at least, was NOT at fault.
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Comments
"Uncle Sam" (aka the taxpayer, or in this case, the postal service consumer) doesn't deserve to be out cash either. This assumes Centsles ever got paid out any insurance of course. If not, then it really is his coin.
Either way, it's not your coin.
JMHO
Cathy
“In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." - Thomas Jefferson
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<< <i> I think you owe the Post Office a refund - immediately. I suspect they don't look kindly upon being ripped off. >>
I ripped them off? The coin was lost in limbo-land for 16 months! How'd I rip them off?
“In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." - Thomas Jefferson
My digital cameo album 1950-64 Cameos - take a look!
“In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." - Thomas Jefferson
My digital cameo album 1950-64 Cameos - take a look!
And so far the replies point toward a refund to the post office.
“In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." - Thomas Jefferson
My digital cameo album 1950-64 Cameos - take a look!
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
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If the USPS did pay up, then it (not you) is the owner as they paid out on the insurance policy. If not, it's still Centsles' coin.
You owe Centsles the courtesy of asking if he was paid. If he was, then you should make an attempt to return to the post office the amount of the insurance claim paid (or give them the coin if you've already purchased another in it's place). Alternativley, you could send the coin back to Centsles and let him deal with the post office return.
The only person I'm sure doesn't own the coin is you.
If the post office won't tell you, well then go back to the original idea, and very clearly note that copies of the communication have been sent to the USPS as well--so no force, but strong encouragement
TorinoCobra71
As for who owns the coin, and how to square that:
1. I don't keep any paperwork from that long ago.
2. As someone pointed out, we don't know if Centsles ever filed a claim with the P.O.
BUT -- I have the coin AND I was re-imbursed, so I need to square this one.
And cameonut, go make a purple fighting sword for Barney or something, ok?
Like if I really tried to rip anyone off, I would come back in here and spread the news about it.
I will send the P.O. the money and a letter of explanation and let them figure it out; if Centsles was indeed
paid, then its all square. If not, that's his problem; he should have filed the claim long ago.
PS. We are talking about a grand total of $35.
<< <i>PS. We are talking about a grand total of $35. >>
Forget about it! You'll waste $100 of taxpayer money just having a civil servant trying to figure out what to do with a check you send them. If centsles paid you and was not reimbursed, return the money to him. If not, leave it be or (if it is a matter of conscience) donate $35 to a charity or do a YN giveaway.
BTW, I did business with centsles one time on eBay and had no problems with the transaction or the coin. Your setting the record straight here was a noble thing. It's nice to see people give credit and not always blame.
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You should really edit out your ridiculous, unwarranted, and inflammatory comments.
First thing. Contact Centsles and see if he did indeed receive a settlement from the USPS or if he ate it. Either way, mail it back to him. It's not your coin to do anything with.
17 months later buyer received coin and was honest enough to send it back to me. I took it to the P.O. and explained the situation and was told to keep it.
Successful BSTs with: Grote15, MadMarty, Segoja,cucamongacoin,metalsman.
(1.) you keep the ike ...(as this was your objective anyway.)
(2.) send back the exact amout of money that centsles refunded to you.
at this point your conscience should be clear, putting the clearing of conscience "ball" in centsles's court.
you do the right thing...now its up to him to do the right thing.
The only thing I don't understand is if you recieved the coin in May of 2006 (Memorial Day Weekend), why do you still have it on December 17, 2006 nearly six months later?
edit: this assumes Centsles received a claim from the PO.
<< <i>"Uncle Sam" (aka the taxpayer, or in this case, the postal service consumer) doesn't deserve to be out cash either >>
your joking right?
its payback for the slow service, awful customer service and general apathy they have for customers. screw the post office.
Send it to PCGS and get it graded properly.
In fact, the first order of business is to determine if it was mail fraud since the coin probably is an MS63 and probably was that in the beginning.
Stirrin' the soup !
<< <i>The only thing I don't understand is if you recieved the coin in May of 2006 (Memorial Day Weekend), why do you still have it on December 17, 2006 nearly six months later? >>
I'm one a' those lazy gov't officials.
<< <i>Send it to PCGS and get it graded properly. >>
It's one of those rare Centsles coins that was PCGS-graded...
The more I think about it, the more confused I get.
Contact Centsles, explain what happened, provide a scan showing the actual delivery date (if possible) and send him a check for the amount you were reimbursed.
If he filed a claim with the PO, he'll have the necessary paperwork to square up with the PO. Regardless, you will have cleared yourself from any monetary or ethical obligations in this matter.
Edited to add: And NO, you didn't rip anybody off as a ripoff is an intentional attempt to defraud someone!
The name is LEE!
<< <i>
<< <i>Send it to PCGS and get it graded properly. >>
It's one of those rare Centsles coins that was PCGS-graded... >>
I shoulda known ... LOL
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Tom, formerly in Albuquerque, NM.
<< <i>It's really quite simple: Contact Centsles and tell him what happened, then ask which he wants returned - the coin or the money. The seller, not the buyer, is the one who files the insurance claim with the P.O. (or whatever), so it's the seller's option at this point. >>
It really isn't the seller's option, it's the buyer's at this juncture, but in actuality, everything before that statement is PRECISE.
An MS67 silver Ike might not have been of a value for Centsles to have taken the time.
Just speculating, but it sounds like Centsles cut you a check and possibly just wrote it off as a loss witout messing further with the post office.
-Contact Centsles and be prepaired for him to either tell you to keep the coin or to send it back. It wouldn't surprise me if he suggested the former before he demanded the latter.
peacockcoins
Dear Sir:
I won an auction with you back in January 2005. The coin was a 1974-S SIlver IKE $1 Silver in PCGS MS67. I believe I won the auction for approx. $35, but its been so long ago, I would have to dig through my checkbook to find out the exact price.
In late February, 2005, I wrote you and said the coin had not been received. In March, 2005, you agreed that the coin had been lost, and you sent me a refund check.
Well, lo and behold, the coin was delivered this year, and I have it sitting in front of me. Now I have a dilemma. I received a refund from you, and I now also have the coin.
What would you like me to do? And, if I may ask, were you ever reimbursed for this by the US Postal Services?
Sincerely yours.
As of right now, you have both the coin and the money. IMHO, your next step is to contact centsles, explain what has happened, and offer to send either the money or the coin back to him. That makes you square, and your part in the matter is completed.
Now, if centsles filed a claim with the USPS and received a settlement, it is now his responsibility to go back to the USPS and work that out. His, not yours.
Grateful that you posted
Joe
<< <i>gamer1958---Considering the time the USPS caused you to waste due to their gross incompetence and the emotional distress they put you through, I wouldn't do a darn thing and I would sleep well at night. Almost a year and a half late is outragous. >>
The name is LEE!
You bid and won the coin and paid for it. You own the coin. You were re-imbursed. You owe the re-imburser a refund. Simple as that. Simply explain what happened and refund the $35 to whoever sent you it. Bob
<< <i>Your deal is with centsles. You have nothing to do with the Post Office.
As of right now, you have both the coin and the money. IMHO, your next step is to contact centsles, explain what has happened, and offer to send either the money or the coin back to him. That makes you square, and your part in the matter is completed.
Now, if centsles filed a claim with the USPS and received a settlement, it is now his responsibility to go back to the USPS and work that out. His, not yours. >>
<< <i>It's really quite simple: Contact Centsles and tell him what happened, then ask which he wants returned - the coin or the money. The seller, not the buyer, is the one who files the insurance claim with the P.O. (or whatever), so it's the seller's option at this point. >>
I agree with Aldefarte on this one
Most everybody here would keep the coin and the money in spite of what they say.
Fantasy:
Losing sleep over a $35 undeserved gain.
Truth:
This ain't gonna get you sent to hell if you keep it.
Ray
<< <i>Fact:
Most everybody here would keep the coin and the money in spite of what they say.
Fantasy:
Losing sleep over a $35 undeserved gain.
Truth:
This ain't gonna get you sent to hell if you keep it.
Ray >>
Best response so far.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
<< <i>Fact: Most everybody here would keep the coin and the money in spite of what they say. >>
No way. My sense of ethics would not permit it. Somebody besides me is going to get the money, whether it's the seller, the USPS, or a charity. I have no right to that money.
<< <i>Truth: This ain't gonna get you sent to hell if you keep it. >>
Typical Xtian. It doesn't matter if it's right or wrong; only if it keeps you out of "heaven". Sickening.
<< <i>
<< <i>"Uncle Sam" (aka the taxpayer, or in this case, the postal service consumer) doesn't deserve to be out cash either >>
your joking right?
its payback for the slow service, awful customer service and general apathy they have for customers. screw the post office. >>
You must go to a different post office than I do. It's run by human beings. Of course, you may be one of those perfect people we sometimes hear about.
And, no, I don't work for the USPS or am I in any affiliated with them.
I just hate "Holier than thou" attitudes.
<< <i>Donate the coin to Jeremy's upcoming charity auction. >>
Throw in the check as well!
I have several lost packages out there. If any of them ever happen to show up........their mine and sois the cash!
Treat the windfall like a wrong shelf price freebee........take it and run!
Had a similar situation occur with a prioity package that was "returned to sender" (that's me), but yet the buyer had somehow managed to view the coin without damaging the box too much when opening it. The buyer had managed to return the coin in it's original box without paying postage. Like a good samaritan, I took it back to the PO and let them know and they did not give a rats arse about it.
If you actually send back a check to whomever, I guessing you're a YN collector. If true, perhaps a few years down the road, you won't give a rats arse about it either.
Regards, Leo
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<< <i>
<< <i>Donate the coin to Jeremy's upcoming charity auction. >>
GOOD IDEA
Throw in the check as well!
THAT IS NOT HIS MONEY !
If you actually send back a check to whomever, I guessing you're a YN collector. If true, perhaps a few years down the road, you won't give a rats arse about it either.
>>
RIGHT and WRONG are not based on experience they are based on principle.