<< <i>Listen, the flip side of this is how ethical would it be for the buyer to knowingly purchase an expensive coin (i.e. spread of more than $1k) for peanuts? It wouldn't be. Ethics and integrity are not only the responsibility of the seller, but of the buyer as well. Everybody here wouldn't hesitate to pile on a seller who fails to divulge significant information about a coin prior to a sale, yet everybody is willing to say that when the buyer does the same thing, the seller is still obligated to complete the transaction? >>
Good point, but harder to make. It depends if the buyer knew it was a mistake verses a liquidation of some type that he just got lucky on. In my view, if the buyer knew he was taking advantage of a mistake, he too is full of bs when he says that he truly buys and fully believes that there is a God watching and an afterlife waiting where things like honesty and immoral self-centeredness will be taken into account.
Immoral self-centeredness is the key here.
24HourForums.com - load images, create albums, place ads, talk coins, enjoy the community.
<< <i>Listen, the flip side of this is how ethical would it be for the buyer to knowingly purchase an expensive coin (i.e. spread of more than $1k) for peanuts? It wouldn't be. Ethics and integrity are not only the responsibility of the seller, but of the buyer as well. Everybody here wouldn't hesitate to pile on a seller who fails to divulge significant information about a coin prior to a sale, yet everybody is willing to say that when the buyer does the same thing, the seller is still obligated to complete the transaction? >>
Good point, but harder to make. It depends if the buyer knew it was a mistake verses a liquidation of some type that he just got lucky on. In my view, if the buyer knew he was taking advantage of a mistake, he too is full of bs when he says that he truly buys and fully believes that there is a God watching and an afterlife waiting where things like honesty and immoral self-centeredness will be taken into account.
Immoral self-centeredness is the key here. >>
No, the reason/type of sale is irrelevant. The key is that a transaction is defined as what a seller is willing to sell something for, and what a buyer is willing to pay. If one side or the other is missing critical information, then it's not a transaction but rather a scam. The OP's question relates to whether it's ethical to knowingly fall victim to a scam, IMHO. God is irrelevant because the presence of a higher power is not a proven, concrete variable. Also irrelevant is what God would think, assuming his presence, because he would not be a party to the transaction.
<< <i>Listen, the flip side of this is how ethical would it be for the buyer to knowingly purchase an expensive coin (i.e. spread of more than $1k) for peanuts? It wouldn't be. Ethics and integrity are not only the responsibility of the seller, but of the buyer as well. Everybody here wouldn't hesitate to pile on a seller who fails to divulge significant information about a coin prior to a sale, yet everybody is willing to say that when the buyer does the same thing, the seller is still obligated to complete the transaction? >>
I understand what you're saying, but it's the seller's coin. It's their responsibility to find out what it's worth before it goes on Ebay. As long as the buyer pays what the seller requires them to, there's no ethical problem. The only time this isn't true is when the buyer gets something that the seller wasn't trying to sell.
As an example: One of my first auctions (and thank you, if it was someone on the board) was for a Morgan dollar (maybe 1885-O) slabbed by ANACS. I won the auction, fair and square, and got the coin. When I opened the package, there were two coins in there: the Morgan, and an 1878-CC Trade Dollar. I immediately e-mailed the seller, letting him know. As it turns out, that was a cast dollar he included because he thought I'd like it. But I felt obligated, because it wasn't part of the original deal, and I wasn't sure it was intentional.
That's really the essence of it: As long as the item is what the seller and buyer agreed upon, at the agreed-upon price, the ethical thing is for the transaction to be completed. Neither buyer's or seller's remorse (and I've been on both ends) is a reason to renege on a deal.
Edited to change "either" to "neither".
If you haven't noticed, I'm single and miserable and I've got four albums of bitching about it that I would offer as proof.
<< <i>No, the reason/type of sale is irrelevant. >>
I disagree. If both the seller and buyer knew what the coin really was (a coin worth 15K, etc.) then there is no question of ethics. The question of ethics or honesty or integrity and honor is coming in because in the example given, it was NOT intended to be a "start at $1 bid and I get what I get for this 15K coin" type of liquidation auction.
<< <i>The key is that a transaction is defined as what a seller is willing to sell something for, and what a buyer is willing to pay. If one side or the other is missing critical information, then it's not a transaction but rather a scam. The OP's question relates to whether it's ethical to knowingly fall victim to a scam, IMHO. God is irrelevant because the presence of a higher power is not a proven, concrete variable. Also irrelevant is what God would think, assuming his presence, because he would not be a party to the transaction. >>
Sorry, but I believe the chances of someone scamming another, whether as buyer or seller, are dramatically reduced if they truly believed that their immoral self-centeredness is being watched and noticed by the God they expect to have a great afterlife with.
24HourForums.com - load images, create albums, place ads, talk coins, enjoy the community.
<< <i>"... integrity begins with being honest with yourself and being able to recognize what is in your best interest."
Wow. Whose definition of integrity are you using? To me (and not too surprisingly, to Webster's Collegiate Dictionary) integrity means soundness of moral principle and character; uprightness, honesty. To keep the coin after you recognized your mistake would be more self-righteous, and not upright. No, for me the coin would ship. End of subject. >>
<< <i>Sorry, but I believe the chances of someone scamming another, whether as buyer or seller, are dramatically reduced if they truly believed that their immoral self-centeredness is being watched and noticed by the God they expect to have a great afterlife with. >>
Hi, FF.
In the case we're talking about here (getting "cherried"), I don't think a scam occurred at all. The seller put the coin up for auction, getting whatever bids he/she could. The buyer put up the highest bid. Where's the scam in that? If it was an honest mistake (e.g., the seller meant to put a BIN of $10,000 and it somehow got posted as $1000), that's a different issue. But here we're just talking about two people, each doing their level best to come out on top in a transaction. If the buyer got the coin for a song, then it's the seller's fault for not doing the research on what he/she could potentially get for the coin.
Please note: I'm not talking about the grandmother down the street that puts her MS-65 high-relief 1907 St. Gaudens on Ebay for face. I'm talking about a collector who should know what a coin is worth in the market they're targeting. There's always the possibility that a buyer knows a market in which a coin will go for more, but that's the chance you take when you put any item on Ebay. I have a few items that I'd be very hesitant to sell on Ebay, for that exact reason: They've got irregularities (RPMs or die breaks) which could potentially change the value, and I don't want to put anything up without knowing its value.
If you haven't noticed, I'm single and miserable and I've got four albums of bitching about it that I would offer as proof.
Hi Bh, I hear that. That is why I am not focusing on the exact details of the auction because all that really matters is if someone knows they are doing something wrong for the sake of material gain.
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Just to set the record straight, there is no mention of an auction in the original poster's question. >>
Point well-taken, but I don't think it changes the outcome, in this case. If we're talking about someone who put a BIN on a coin with the knowledge of what a generic coin of that type in that condition (e.g., a 1943-D Mercury dime in PCGS MS66FB) was worth, then it's on them if it's a variety and they didn't catch it. Again, I'm assuming it wasn't a typographical error in the BIN, and that the "problem" was, in fact, cherry-picking on the part of the buyer. In a situation like that, there's really no question what to do: You let out your best Homer-Simpsonish , and you ship the coin.
If you haven't noticed, I'm single and miserable and I've got four albums of bitching about it that I would offer as proof.
Fats at some point a person becomes a bumbling doofus sucker on a item. The key is to not continue to be a bumbling doofus sucker on items in the future. Peers probably would not remember you as a bumbling doofus sucker unless you kept doing the same thing over and over and over again. That is why the replys you made for a single item suprised me.
Of course! I might add a note of encouragement to the buyer(cherrypicker- N.B COXE) that they spread the word to all of their coin collector friends about the fabulous deal they just got from me. What better way could there be to get free(well, sorta) advertising and promotion for the purpose of establishing a growing customer base?
Why do I get the feeling that the OP was taking aim at Superior's Uckfupped way of handling their fixed price listings that appeared to have been priced way under market?
If lie detector tests were administered all around, I wonder how many of the people patting themselves on the back here would, in fact, ship a $10K coin to the bidder who paid $10. My guess is far less than half.
What would I do? Honestly, I don't know. I would hope I would do the right thing. However, you can pontificate all day long about fictitious situations, but until you are confronted by one of this financial magnitude, it's far too easy to imagine yourself doing the right thing; the consequences aren't tangible either way.
I've been the victim of far too many coins "lost" or "misplaced" after the ends of Ebay auctions to have any faith in sellers, myself included...
I truely believe that those that would go through with a transaction that would end up costing them thousands have never had that experience, and I hope they never will.
But we have seen major auction houses make blunders not so large & have not held up their part of the deal.
Do any of you that say they would follow through on a similar deal boycott these auction houses?
I think not. Is that hypocritical? Maybe not, but if you still do business with them, then why wouldn't you do business with a person, or small dealer that would do the same?
I'm not going to sit here and BS like some other people have. If someone wins my auction for $10 and I find out the coin is worth $1000, I'm offering something worth it to the seller to make him/her change their mind.
Coinpictures makes a good point. How many people are just trying to "look good" on here. I'm not out to look good or BS myself and everyone else.
WTB: Eric Plunk cards, jersey (signed or unsigned), and autographs. Basically anything related to him
<< <i>I truely believe that those that would go through with a transaction that would end up costing them thousands have never had that experience, and I hope they never will.
But we have seen major auction houses make blunders not so large & have not held up their part of the deal.
Do any of you that say they would follow through on a similar deal boycott these auction houses?
I think not. Is that hypocritical? Maybe not, but if you still do business with them, then why wouldn't you do business with a person, or small dealer that would do the same? >>
Just to clarify:
I've never had a $10,000 coin go for $10,000, but I've definitely had auctions where I lost 2/3 of the value in the sale. It certainly sucks, and it would be a doubly-hard lesson if Ebay was my business. But you can't simply renege on a sale because you didn't get the best deal for yourself.
And the question is, what can you offer the person who won the item that can be worth:
1) the value of what they thought they were getting, and 2) your reputation as a seller?
If your oversight was really that large, it's going to be tough to convince the buyer that there's anything you can do to make up for it, other than shipping the coin.
And again, I'm not talking about the kind of honest mistake where your finger slips on a BIN. I'm talking about a coin sold at fair market value that you realize you can sell for more as a die variety. Those are two entirely different situations, IMO.
As an aside: How often does this kind of thing come up? I mostly buy Mercury dimes, but I have to admit that 90%+ of the images I see on Ebay aren't good enough to distinguish a die variety, so while I have no doubt that it must happen (given the hypothetical posed here, at least), I have a hard time picturing snagging a die variety other than by serendipity.
If you haven't noticed, I'm single and miserable and I've got four albums of bitching about it that I would offer as proof.
If lie detector tests were administered all around, I wonder how many of the people patting themselves on the back here would, in fact, ship a $10K coin to the bidder who paid $10. My guess is far less than half.
With apologies to all who are so sure of how they would respond, I agree with this 'guess'. I recently went through a scenario where I pre-sold gold AGE 20th Ann. sets for an amount that was about $3K less than what they were worth by the time I received shipment from the mint. I went through with the sale but during that process as the Gold AGE sets seemed to just go up every day, I realized that there was SOME PRICE at which I wouldn't have went through with the deal. Fortunately, they never reached that price and I never had to learn what my integrity was worth. But I did have to come face to face with the fact, that there is SOME PRICE at which 'integrity' gets overrid. For those who are certain they would complete the deal regardless of how many thousands of dollars it would cost them, I am envious of your certainty and truly hope you never have to prove your integrity. It's not that fun!
<< <i>I have no doubt that the vast majority, perhaps all, of the people that replied here "ship no matter what" would in reality not ship a coin that they sold for $10 that they found out was worth ten thousand. >>
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
I find it highly interesting (and probably good) that in 71 replies the word 'lawyer' has not come up, especially since there are at least a couple of lawyer/collectors/dealers that post with some regularity. I think that for most of us, if we found that we sold an item worth 10k for $10, we would go through a serious reappraisal of our options, and decide that maybe the ethical aspects of the transaction needed some advice from the legal informants. I would guess that there might be some legal advice that if a coin is shipped that meets the description of the coin offered for sale, then there is no requirement that the exact coin advertised be shipped, unless it was explicitly stated in the ad or auction that the buyer would receive the exact coin shown. One poster appears to have had this experience and accepted the situation. There would probably be other possible ways to meet the legal contract suggested that were in fact an evasion of the ethical responsibility, at least in effect. In the end, people look for a legal out to what is a seemingly straight-forward ethical situation, which is why the buying party responds in kind, and lawyers stay employed. Whether it is really right or not, people feel that their ethical obligations are relieved if a lawyer assures them that there is no legal obligation. This is different from buying dispensions from the priesthood in the sense that it is, well....legal.
Ship the coin. Integrity should not carry a price tag. Being true to yourself means owning up to your own mistakes, admitting you are human, and moving on. Ship the coin.
<< <i>Wow. Whose definition of integrity are you using? To me (and not too surprisingly, to Webster's Collegiate Dictionary) integrity means soundness of moral principle and character; uprightness, honesty. To keep the coin after you recognized your mistake would be more self-righteous, and not upright. No, for me the coin would ship. End of subject. >>
Comments
<< <i>Listen, the flip side of this is how ethical would it be for the buyer to knowingly purchase an expensive coin (i.e. spread of more than $1k) for peanuts? It wouldn't be. Ethics and integrity are not only the responsibility of the seller, but of the buyer as well. Everybody here wouldn't hesitate to pile on a seller who fails to divulge significant information about a coin prior to a sale, yet everybody is willing to say that when the buyer does the same thing, the seller is still obligated to complete the transaction? >>
Good point, but harder to make. It depends if the buyer knew it was a mistake verses a liquidation of some type that he just got lucky on. In my view, if the buyer knew he was taking advantage of a mistake, he too is full of bs when he says that he truly buys and fully believes that there is a God watching and an afterlife waiting where things like honesty and immoral self-centeredness will be taken into account.
Immoral self-centeredness is the key here.
<< <i>
<< <i>Listen, the flip side of this is how ethical would it be for the buyer to knowingly purchase an expensive coin (i.e. spread of more than $1k) for peanuts? It wouldn't be. Ethics and integrity are not only the responsibility of the seller, but of the buyer as well. Everybody here wouldn't hesitate to pile on a seller who fails to divulge significant information about a coin prior to a sale, yet everybody is willing to say that when the buyer does the same thing, the seller is still obligated to complete the transaction? >>
Good point, but harder to make. It depends if the buyer knew it was a mistake verses a liquidation of some type that he just got lucky on. In my view, if the buyer knew he was taking advantage of a mistake, he too is full of bs when he says that he truly buys and fully believes that there is a God watching and an afterlife waiting where things like honesty and immoral self-centeredness will be taken into account.
Immoral self-centeredness is the key here. >>
No, the reason/type of sale is irrelevant. The key is that a transaction is defined as what a seller is willing to sell something for, and what a buyer is willing to pay. If one side or the other is missing critical information, then it's not a transaction but rather a scam. The OP's question relates to whether it's ethical to knowingly fall victim to a scam, IMHO. God is irrelevant because the presence of a higher power is not a proven, concrete variable. Also irrelevant is what God would think, assuming his presence, because he would not be a party to the transaction.
<< <i>Listen, the flip side of this is how ethical would it be for the buyer to knowingly purchase an expensive coin (i.e. spread of more than $1k) for peanuts? It wouldn't be. Ethics and integrity are not only the responsibility of the seller, but of the buyer as well. Everybody here wouldn't hesitate to pile on a seller who fails to divulge significant information about a coin prior to a sale, yet everybody is willing to say that when the buyer does the same thing, the seller is still obligated to complete the transaction? >>
I understand what you're saying, but it's the seller's coin. It's their responsibility to find out what it's worth before it goes on Ebay. As long as the buyer pays what the seller requires them to, there's no ethical problem. The only time this isn't true is when the buyer gets something that the seller wasn't trying to sell.
As an example: One of my first auctions (and thank you, if it was someone on the board) was for a Morgan dollar (maybe 1885-O) slabbed by ANACS. I won the auction, fair and square, and got the coin. When I opened the package, there were two coins in there: the Morgan, and an 1878-CC Trade Dollar. I immediately e-mailed the seller, letting him know. As it turns out, that was a cast dollar he included because he thought I'd like it. But I felt obligated, because it wasn't part of the original deal, and I wasn't sure it was intentional.
That's really the essence of it: As long as the item is what the seller and buyer agreed upon, at the agreed-upon price, the ethical thing is for the transaction to be completed. Neither buyer's or seller's remorse (and I've been on both ends) is a reason to renege on a deal.
Edited to change "either" to "neither".
-- Adam Duritz, of Counting Crows
My Ebay Auctions
<< <i>No, the reason/type of sale is irrelevant. >>
I disagree. If both the seller and buyer knew what the coin really was (a coin worth 15K, etc.) then there is no question of ethics. The question of ethics or honesty or integrity and honor is coming in because in the example given, it was NOT intended to be a "start at $1 bid and I get what I get for this 15K coin" type of liquidation auction.
<< <i>The key is that a transaction is defined as what a seller is willing to sell something for, and what a buyer is willing to pay. If one side or the other is missing critical information, then it's not a transaction but rather a scam. The OP's question relates to whether it's ethical to knowingly fall victim to a scam, IMHO. God is irrelevant because the presence of a higher power is not a proven, concrete variable. Also irrelevant is what God would think, assuming his presence, because he would not be a party to the transaction. >>
Sorry, but I believe the chances of someone scamming another, whether as buyer or seller, are dramatically reduced if they truly believed that their immoral self-centeredness is being watched and noticed by the God they expect to have a great afterlife with.
<< <i>"... integrity begins with being honest with yourself and being able to recognize what is in your best interest."
Wow. Whose definition of integrity are you using? To me (and not too surprisingly, to Webster's Collegiate Dictionary) integrity means soundness of moral principle and character; uprightness, honesty. To keep the coin after you recognized your mistake would be more self-righteous, and not upright. No, for me the coin would ship. End of subject. >>
DITTO
<< <i>Sorry, but I believe the chances of someone scamming another, whether as buyer or seller, are dramatically reduced if they truly believed that their immoral self-centeredness is being watched and noticed by the God they expect to have a great afterlife with. >>
Hi, FF.
In the case we're talking about here (getting "cherried"), I don't think a scam occurred at all. The seller put the coin up for auction, getting whatever bids he/she could. The buyer put up the highest bid. Where's the scam in that? If it was an honest mistake (e.g., the seller meant to put a BIN of $10,000 and it somehow got posted as $1000), that's a different issue. But here we're just talking about two people, each doing their level best to come out on top in a transaction. If the buyer got the coin for a song, then it's the seller's fault for not doing the research on what he/she could potentially get for the coin.
Please note: I'm not talking about the grandmother down the street that puts her MS-65 high-relief 1907 St. Gaudens on Ebay for face. I'm talking about a collector who should know what a coin is worth in the market they're targeting. There's always the possibility that a buyer knows a market in which a coin will go for more, but that's the chance you take when you put any item on Ebay. I have a few items that I'd be very hesitant to sell on Ebay, for that exact reason: They've got irregularities (RPMs or die breaks) which could potentially change the value, and I don't want to put anything up without knowing its value.
-- Adam Duritz, of Counting Crows
My Ebay Auctions
<< <i>You sold it, you ship it.
This reply sums it up EXACTLY!
TorinoCobra71
<< <i>The seller put the coin up for auction >>
Just to set the record straight, there is no mention of an auction in the original poster's question.
<< <i>
<< <i>The seller put the coin up for auction >>
Just to set the record straight, there is no mention of an auction in the original poster's question. >>
Point well-taken, but I don't think it changes the outcome, in this case. If we're talking about someone who put a BIN on a coin with the knowledge of what a generic coin of that type in that condition (e.g., a 1943-D Mercury dime in PCGS MS66FB) was worth, then it's on them if it's a variety and they didn't catch it. Again, I'm assuming it wasn't a typographical error in the BIN, and that the "problem" was, in fact, cherry-picking on the part of the buyer. In a situation like that, there's really no question what to do: You let out your best Homer-Simpsonish
-- Adam Duritz, of Counting Crows
My Ebay Auctions
<< <i>Hey Bhartman, long time no see. Great to see your posts again! >>
FF, you're on the CU Coin Forum. He posts all the time.
Apropos of the coin posse/aka caca: "The longer he spoke of his honor, the tighter I held to my purse."
<< <i>FF, you're on the CU Coin Forum. He posts all the time. >>
He just hasn't been in the few threads I skim or read, but thanks for helping! Bh and I used to be on the same page a lot in the OF, I miss him...
Superior ?....
Ken
<< <i>Would you still ship it? >>
Of course! I might add a note of encouragement to the buyer(cherrypicker- N.B COXE) that they spread the word to all of their coin collector friends about the fabulous deal they just got from me. What better way could there be to get free(well, sorta) advertising and promotion for the purpose of establishing a growing customer base?
Why do I get the feeling that the OP was taking aim at Superior's Uckfupped way of handling their fixed price listings that appeared to have been priced way under market?
"Everything is on its way to somewhere. Everything." - George Malley, Phenomenon
http://www.american-legacy-coins.com
"La Vostra Nonna Ha Faccia Del Fungo"
What would I do? Honestly, I don't know. I would hope I would do the right thing. However, you can pontificate all day long about fictitious situations, but until you are confronted by one of this financial magnitude, it's far too easy to imagine yourself doing the right thing; the consequences aren't tangible either way.
I've been the victim of far too many coins "lost" or "misplaced" after the ends of Ebay auctions to have any faith in sellers, myself included...
1/2 Cents
U.S. Revenue Stamps
But we have seen major auction houses make blunders not so large & have not held up their part of the deal.
Do any of you that say they would follow through on a similar deal boycott these auction houses?
I think not. Is that hypocritical? Maybe not, but if you still do business with them, then why wouldn't you do business with a person, or small dealer that would do the same?
Coinpictures makes a good point. How many people are just trying to "look good" on here. I'm not out to look good or BS myself and everyone else.
Positive BST: WhiteThunder (x2), Ajaan, onefasttalon, mirabela, Wizard1, cucamongacoin, mccardguy1
Negative BST: NONE!
<< <i>I truely believe that those that would go through with a transaction that would end up costing them thousands have never had that experience, and I hope they never will.
But we have seen major auction houses make blunders not so large & have not held up their part of the deal.
Do any of you that say they would follow through on a similar deal boycott these auction houses?
I think not. Is that hypocritical? Maybe not, but if you still do business with them, then why wouldn't you do business with a person, or small dealer that would do the same? >>
Just to clarify:
I've never had a $10,000 coin go for $10,000, but I've definitely had auctions where I lost 2/3 of the value in the sale. It certainly sucks, and it would be a doubly-hard lesson if Ebay was my business. But you can't simply renege on a sale because you didn't get the best deal for yourself.
And the question is, what can you offer the person who won the item that can be worth:
1) the value of what they thought they were getting, and
2) your reputation as a seller?
If your oversight was really that large, it's going to be tough to convince the buyer that there's anything you can do to make up for it, other than shipping the coin.
And again, I'm not talking about the kind of honest mistake where your finger slips on a BIN. I'm talking about a coin sold at fair market value that you realize you can sell for more as a die variety. Those are two entirely different situations, IMO.
As an aside: How often does this kind of thing come up? I mostly buy Mercury dimes, but I have to admit that 90%+ of the images I see on Ebay aren't good enough to distinguish a die variety, so while I have no doubt that it must happen (given the hypothetical posed here, at least), I have a hard time picturing snagging a die variety other than by serendipity.
-- Adam Duritz, of Counting Crows
My Ebay Auctions
With apologies to all who are so sure of how they would respond, I agree with this 'guess'. I recently went through a scenario where I pre-sold gold AGE 20th Ann. sets for an amount that was about $3K less than what they were worth by the time I received shipment from the mint. I went through with the sale but during that process as the Gold AGE sets seemed to just go up every day, I realized that there was SOME PRICE at which I wouldn't have went through with the deal. Fortunately, they never reached that price and I never had to learn what my integrity was worth. But I did have to come face to face with the fact, that there is SOME PRICE at which 'integrity' gets overrid. For those who are certain they would complete the deal regardless of how many thousands of dollars it would cost them, I am envious of your certainty and truly hope you never have to prove your integrity. It's not that fun!
Greg Hansen, Melbourne, FL Click here for any current EBAY auctions Multiple "Circle of Trust" transactions over 14 years on forum
<< <i>I have no doubt that the vast majority, perhaps all, of the people that replied here "ship no matter what" would in reality not ship a coin that they sold for $10 that they found out was worth ten thousand. >>
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
<< <i>Wow. Whose definition of integrity are you using? To me (and not too surprisingly, to Webster's Collegiate Dictionary) integrity means soundness of moral principle and character; uprightness, honesty. To keep the coin after you recognized your mistake would be more self-righteous, and not upright. No, for me the coin would ship. End of subject.
>>
<B>
</B>
Your reply about not shipping strengthens your integrity blows me away.
I think the clear correct choice here is ship it.
Sold is sold.
Keeping it is stealing.