Bids are in for japanese star.
WinPitcher
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pete gammons today said on espn radio that baseball is awash in cash. even the small market teams have pocketed between 80 and 100 mil over the past decade. baseball has gone from a 1.2 billion dollar industry to one that is now over 5 billion per year. He claims that while every team may not be interested, every team has the assets to bid. Some teams would rather pocket the dough then use it for maj lg salaries.
The team that wins the bid earns the right to negotiate with the star pitcher that boasts 5 pitches. he throws in the mid to hi 90's
I hope the Mets get him.
Steve
The team that wins the bid earns the right to negotiate with the star pitcher that boasts 5 pitches. he throws in the mid to hi 90's
I hope the Mets get him.
Steve
Good for you.
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Even the Yankees aren't THAT nuts
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As far as Papelbon goes, if he can succeed as a starter, that's where I'd rather see him. Pitch him 30 times a year and let him eat up innings and you need your bullpen less (especially since the Sox are likely to consider Tavarez their bullpen star and middle reliever after some late season success as a starter). The Hot Stove Season is often better than the real season, isn't it? Everyone has a chance in December!
Let's not kid ourselves: we all know the yankees had a high bid in there too...and if they had won it, you yankee fans would be saying 'ha ha we got him! eat it red sox!'
Only reason I was mentioning Red Sox is because it was mentioned they had won the bid.
And sure, why wouldnt Yankees fans enjoy busting on Red Sox fans? You know if they end up on top they will be saying the same to Yankees fans! But its all in good fun. Just the rivalry.
Only other team I could see bidding real high is the Rangers. But seems that Zito has expressed interest with them so that could end up being Rangers focus.
<< <i>Let's not kid ourselves: we all know the yankees had a high bid in there too...and if they had won it, you yankee fans would be saying 'ha ha we got him! eat it red sox!' >>
Ummm ... no, yankee fans here would be reading endless posts from the regulars about the money, big market, revenue, boo hoo hoo hoo. So, its not the Yankees and all is good with that ludicrous amount if proven correct just as long as it was not the Yankees
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<< <i>Sounds like the Rangers have expressed strong interest in signing Bonds, too. >>
where did you hear this? That would put fans in the seats which is something TX really does need!
<< <i>
Ummm ... no, yankee fans here would be reading endless posts from the regulars about the money, big market, revenue, boo hoo hoo hoo. So, its not the Yankees and all is good with that ludicrous amount if proven correct just as long as it was not the Yankees
Wait, that's not what was said.
I said that yankee fans would be gloating over it - just the same as when Damon signed with the yankees.
<< <i>
I said that yankee fans would be gloating over it - just the same as when Damon signed with the yankees. >>
Gloating? Ha! Why don't you try HAPPY Ax. I understand that whenever a Yankee fan dares to express some happiness you confuse this with gloating .... but come on man
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You're going to sit there and say that you were happier because you signed Damon, or happier because you 'stole' him from the sox? The same would have happened with this pitcher.
<< <i>Please.
You're going to sit there and say that you were happier because you signed Damon, or happier because you 'stole' him from the sox? The same would have happened with this pitcher. >>
nah, none of the above. I just LOVE watching the Yanks get lambasted for outspending everybody ...... but when 38 - 45 million just for the right to deal with a guy is thrown around its Okey dokey ....... just as long as it is not the Yankees.
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Whenever I bring up payroll disparity, I am all over the sox as much as I am the yankees. Both teams are fortunate to be where they are geographically, as that gives them a tremendous advantage.
Please don't insult my intelligence or memory in trying to say I *never* mention any other team when it comes to payroll disparities.
<< <i> Please don't insult my intelligence or memory in trying to say I *never* mention any other team when it comes to payroll disparities. >>
hmmmm. yeah I do remember you saying one or two things about how much money the Sox spend. Sorry about that ..... but weren't you another one who claims that the Red Sox only spend as much as they do BECAUSE of the Yankees .... which somehow makes it a fine thing to do?
Correct me if I am wrong Ax .... maybe that was CT's line.
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How can a team like the sox compete when they have to play the yankees 19 times a season, if they aren't spending tons of cash?
simple answer: they can't.
I don't justify any team spending ridiculous amounts of money, but I can see how and why the 'keeping up with the jones' attitude has invaded nearly the entire AL east.
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<< <i>So, its OK for the Red Sox to throw ludicrous money at a unknown quantity? I understand the keeping up with the Jones's thing but this pitcher could be as sure a thing as Hidecki Irabu was. And don't kid yourself ... every baseball guy in the land thought Irabu was the real deal. >>
When did I say it was ok?
I simply was countering the yankee guys who were ridiculing sox management for spending this much to negotiate with him. But all indications point to this guy being the real deal. You're right, though, the proof will be on the diamond.
<< <i> I simply was countering the yankee guys who were ridiculing sox management for spending this much to negotiate with him. But all indications point to this guy being the real deal. You're right, though, the proof will be on the diamond. >>
Ridicule? Come on man ..... just a jab or two
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<< <i>but weren't you another one who claims that the Red Sox only spend as much as they do BECAUSE of the Yankees .... which somehow makes it a fine thing to do?
Correct me if I am wrong Ax .... maybe that was CT's line.
>>
Indeed, that was my line. If the Yanks didn't have a monster payroll, the Sox wouldn't have to practice reactionary spending just to stay competitive within that division. It's a fact.
<< <i>They are a team desperate for arms. No one needs to mention the fact that Schilling is at the most 2 seasons from retirement, Beckett has a problem with the gopherballs, and really who else is gonna be in the rotation. I'm really doubting the rumor that the phenom closer will be going to the rotation next season. >>
Topps, again - your posts amaze me.
Your precious Yankees are not desperate for arms? Every team in baseball, except for maybe the Tigers and A's are in need of pitching. And, Papelbon is indeed going to be a starter. It's not a "rumor", Theo Epstein announced it. Beckett will be fine - you tell me the Yanks wouldn't love to have him?
This bid isn't even official yet - but I like what I am hearing.
<< <i> Beckett will be fine - you tell me the Yanks wouldn't love to have him? >>
Your "precious" little Beckett has been over-rated since just before and after the Marlins beat the Yankees in the World Series. Jerry, congratualtions, you and your precious little Red Sox are the proud recipient of bonafide grade A media overhype. As Beckett has not pitched well in quite some time. Can't wait to face him again next year. Josh Beckett scares nobody but himself.
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<< <i>You couldn't be more wrong.
Whenever I bring up payroll disparity, I am all over the sox as much as I am the yankees. Both teams are fortunate to be where they are geographically, as that gives them a tremendous advantage.
Please don't insult my intelligence or memory in trying to say I *never* mention any other team when it comes to payroll disparities. >>
When do you get all over the sox as much as the Yankees? lol, come on the majority of us read your drivel and 9 times out of 10 it's about the Yanks.
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even after the team that wins the bidding, they then must negotiate with the player. if all reports are correct this whole deal from start to finish could amount to almost 100 mil dollars.
Baseball, like gammons said is awash in cash. Even the small markets could have done this deal. they have pocketed 100 million from various sources (luxuary tax, revenue sharing, merchandizing, Tv money from the comm. office, etc over the past 10 years and could have used it to get the star. This is what gammons said on Mike and Mike radio program. He is afterall more knowledgable in these matters then all of us.
Steve
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<< <i>Baseball, like gammons said is awash in cash. Even the small markets could have done this deal. they have pocketed 100 million from various sources (luxuary tax, revenue sharing, merchandizing, Tv money from the comm. office, etc over the past 10 years and could have used it to get the star. This is what gammons said on Mike and Mike radio program. He is afterall more knowledgable in these matters then all of us. >>
Ok, so a small market team is going to be able to dump $100 MILLION on one player? Really? Well I suppose *technically* that's right, but then, they'd have to everyone else on the team playing for the league minimum.
What people fail to realize time and time again is yes, teams could throw $100 million on one guy, but then, what happens if he gets hurt? Turns into a bust? Unlike the sox, the yanks, these other huge market, huge payroll teams, they don't have the money to cover up that mistake with more players.
Where would, say, the tigers be if they had pavano and wright (and their contracts) on their team? Does anyone for a second think they'd have the financial resources to recover and sign more players?
Baseball is not 'awash' in cash...attendance may be up (hey, its up in every sport), but tv ratings have been plummeting (while other sports continue to get stronger, blowing away the notion of too many distractions), and the sport in general is tanking monetarily.
if they did use the 100 million and he got hurt I'm sure they have an insurance policy.
to answer your question regarding the Tigers yes I think they could. (recover)
I believe almost every club can. Do not be fooled, the owners of these clubs are no longer just sportsmen who do not mind breaking even or are on a sole quest for a world chapionship. Those days are over. They are businessmen, some of these clubs are owned by conglomerets<sp> Heck some of these teams get millions just from allowing a bank, or whatever to name the field.
Steve
<< <i>Ax the 100 million is above and beyond what they can spend on payroll. It was money given to them and they pocketed it. >>
What teams are receiving $100 million in sharing?
<< <i> if they did use the 100 million and he got hurt I'm sure they have an insurance policy. >>
Uhm, it doesn't work that way. If a guy gets injured, they don't get to retract his payroll. They still have to pay him (unlike the NFL).
<< <i>to answer your question regarding the Tigers yes I think they could. (recover)
I believe almost every club can. Do not be fooled, the owners of these clubs are no longer just sportsmen who do not mind breaking even or are on a sole quest for a world chapionship. Those days are over. They are businessmen, some of these clubs are owned by conglomerets<sp> Heck some of these teams get millions just from allowing a bank, or whatever to name the field.
Steve >>
I understand the revenue streams, but do you honestly think that a KC royals team, for example, is receiving enough money from ball park and TV revenue to spend $100 million+? I don't think so either.
<< <i>Also, what sports are increasing in TV ratings, except maybe March Madness? Furthermore, what timeframe are you referring to? >>
The NBA, college football, and college basketball (not just the tourney) have all seen increases in TV ratings over the past 5 years, the same time frame we've seen drastic fall off in MLB tv ratings (I didn't mention the NFL increases in ratings, as that goes without saying).
I never said teams get 100 million in sharing. (all at once)
I said they got it over a ten year period. actually gammons said it.
yes, teams have taken out insurance policys for players in case of injuries. that i know as fact. not sure on the ratio but it is known that teams can take out policys in case a player gets injured. they insure the contract.
steve
I have no doubt they have insurance policies on their players, but for a game-related injury I am certain they don't apply.
Wright played this year. so why would the yanks get insurance money? that is we have no idea that contract was insured.
as for pavano they still are looking forward to his play.
I could not tell you if those 2 contracts were insured. not everyone is I would imagine. We were talking about a 100 million dollar investment and that is why I mentioned insurance.
Do you really think that Arods monster contract was not insured?
If he broke his leg and could never walk again do you honestly think that Hicks did not have insurance on that contract?
Steve
edited to add: in your original comment you did not state game related injury. You simply said "got hurt"
Whatever is written in the policy would be what they go by.
game related, not game related. heck the insurance company could add all kinds of things in there and the club could pay for all types of things.
bottom line a contract with 100 million involved will have some sort of insurance on it.
Steve
here is an article that pertains to owners insuring baseball contracts.
<< <i>
<< <i>Baseball, like gammons said is awash in cash. Even the small markets could have done this deal. they have pocketed 100 million from various sources (luxuary tax, revenue sharing, merchandizing, Tv money from the comm. office, etc over the past 10 years and could have used it to get the star. This is what gammons said on Mike and Mike radio program. He is afterall more knowledgable in these matters then all of us. >>
Ok, so a small market team is going to be able to dump $100 MILLION on one player? Really? Well I suppose *technically* that's right, but then, they'd have to everyone else on the team playing for the league minimum.
What people fail to realize time and time again is yes, teams could throw $100 million on one guy, but then, what happens if he gets hurt? Turns into a bust? Unlike the sox, the yanks, these other huge market, huge payroll teams, they don't have the money to cover up that mistake with more players.
Where would, say, the tigers be if they had pavano and wright (and their contracts) on their team? Does anyone for a second think they'd have the financial resources to recover and sign more players?
Baseball is not 'awash' in cash...attendance may be up (hey, its up in every sport), but tv ratings have been plummeting (while other sports continue to get stronger, blowing away the notion of too many distractions), and the sport in general is tanking monetarily. >>
Show me ONE POOR OWNER. These guys are not multimillionares, most are multi-billionares.
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On Baseball | Embarrassment of Riches
By Jim Salisbury
Inquirer Columnist
Baseball is a business, and you don't need an MBA to know its business is good.
The sport set an attendance record for the third straight year in 2006, pulling in over 76 million paid admissions. All this helped revenues top $5.2 billion. That number got the attention of those two old warring factions, the players and the owners. Neither side wanted to risk boiling the golden goose and a new labor deal was harmoniously forged two months before the old one expired.
A byproduct of this era of wealth will begin revealing itself this week as another free-agent season opens to the sound of ringing cash registers. The industry is awash in money (with revenue-sharing giving everyone a piece of the action) and owners are ready to spend, even if there's not enough talent to go around.
Teams can start bidding on free agents today. There are proven pitching arms and run-producing bats to be had, just not a lot of them.
Oakland lefty Barry Zito, San Francisco righthander Jason Schmidt and Japanese phenom Daisuke Matsuzaka head a thin crop of starting pitchers. They will all strike rich deals.
But pitching is so thin, and the industry is so healthy, that the second tier of available starters will also score big paydays.
Jeff Suppan is 106-101 in his career, but his brilliant postseason for the St. Louis Cardinals might put him in the $10 million-per-year category. Teammate Jeff Weaver, known for his unfulfilled potential most of his career, could also land a big deal as fat-wallet teams look for pitching.
Randy Wolf, who spent the last eight seasons pitching for the Phillies, but was injured most of the last two, is likely to be a beneficiary of baseball's bulging coffers. A number of teams, including the Phillies, Blue Jays and Twins, are ready to move on Wolf.
Former Phillie Vicente Padilla, coming off a 15-win, 200-inning season with Texas, could also be in for a nice financial score if teams aren't scared off by his checkered off-field history. Padilla, by the way, is acting as his own agent. Add your own punch line.
"Money-wise, there are going to be some guys who make you say, 'Wow!' " one general manager said. "Wolf could be one of them. He's lefthanded. He's got some track record. Teams are dying for pitching. Almost any pitcher is going to get action."
The market for hitters is also thin, but there are some good power bats in Alfonso Soriano, Aramis Ramirez, Carlos Lee, Gary Matthews Jr. and J.D. Drew, who walked away from the Dodgers and $33 million to enter this thin free-agent class.
The opening of the free-agent market could make Naples, Fla., an interesting place this week. That's where baseball's general managers assemble tomorrow for their annual meetings. Many years, the GM meetings come and go before free-agent bidding even begins. This year, the meetings are a week later and that should help enkindle the free-agent buzz as it reaches a peak during the winter meetings Dec. 4-7.
The highlight of this week's meetings in Naples could come when the results of the bidding on Matsuzaka are announced. If Japan's Seibu Lions accept a bid for Matsuzaka, it will be announced no later than Tuesday, though it could come as early as today, and the winning team would have 30 days to strike a deal with the 26-year-old pitching phenom and his agent, Scott Boras.
Both New York teams, the Red Sox, Cubs, Rangers and Diamondbacks are all angling for Matsuzaka, who was the MVP of the World Baseball Classic, one of the events that helped boost baseball's revenues to new heights this year.
What i don't understand about this process is now the winning team can low ball the player. he basically has to take it or leave it. I heard that it would be a disgrace to go back to Japan for him. Anyone have any insight on to how this actually works?
It sorta is like Ebay. Just consider the 42 million as shipping and bid accordingly. Say the Sox figure that they will spend 60 million overall on this. 42 million goes to his employer (seibu) and 18 million to him. 18 million over 3 years would be a bargain.
It appears to me that the Sox (if in fact they are the winners) are in the drivers seat.
Steve
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<< <i>
What i don't understand about this process is now the winning team can low ball the player. he basically has to take it or leave it. I heard that it would be a disgrace to go back to Japan for him. Anyone have any insight on to how this actually works?
Steve >>
Steve,
If the pitcher does not come to a agreement he must go back to Japan for 1 more year when he would become an all out free agent next year. I do not expect this to happen but there is NO WAY the Red Sox will low ball him with Scott Boras as his agent. I have already heard that Boras will hang his "all out" free agent status next winter over the Red Sox head.
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51 million just to talk to the guy. Can only imagine how much Boras is going to fleece the Sox for...
Forget blocking him; find out where he lives and go punch him in the nuts. --WalterSobchak 9/12/12
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-- Yogi Berra
Baseball's mad new world
I wonder if he will turn out to be another Irabu.
Such talks have, in the past, made fools of rich men, turned dark hair gray and sent systolic and diastolic pressures to unhealthy levels. And yet here are the Red Sox, coveting Japanese pitcher Daisuke Matsuzaka enough that they might just be breaking a commandment, and steeling for discussions that, if successful, will end with them shelling out another $12.5 million or so a year to actually get the right-hander in uniform.
If the Red Sox do work out a contract with Matsuzaka over the next 30 days – Boras will push for three years to get Matsuzaka back on the free-agent market before he turns 30, and Boston will pull for four or five years to get the full value of the posting fee they pay the Seibu Lions – he becomes the new Alex Rodriguez, around a $25 million-a-year man.
Only he'll play in one-fifth the games.
As sound a maneuver as signing Matsuzaka seems for the Red Sox – they import a No. 1 pitcher ready to enter the prime of his career and block the New York Yankees from signing him – this is dangerous for baseball. Though the infusion of cash into the game calls for an equitable amount to go to the players, here is what the public, already wary of exorbitant salaries, sees: The Red Sox paying more per year for a player who has never thrown a major-league pitch than Roger Clemens, Barry Bonds, Randy Johnson or Ken Griffey Jr. ever made in a season.
Now it's salaries on steroids.
I hear the Yankees bid was less than half of what the Sox stupidly threw at this. I mean, wow, 5 or 6 teams in the game had less payroll then what the Red Sox just paid for the "RIGHT" to pay him even more.
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Bri, this is way different that not overpaying Damon - forget Damon for a minute, this is a guy who by all accounts comes around very rarely these days (one Boston writer drew a comparison to when the Sox landed Pedro from Montreal). This will not only give the Sox a young and powerful starting rotation for the next 3 years (at least, with Matsuzaka, Papelbon, Beckett and Schilling for 2007) but it will allow Boston to make serious inroads into the Japanese market and fanbase (which the Yankees have had great success with thanks to Matsui over the last several seasons).
And, while it's a ton of money, think of it this way - is it any worse than giving Carl Pavano $40 million for 4 years?
To invest this much money in any player who hasnt seen a day in the majors is just NUTS. And believe me, I even think that the Yankees bid at 50% of that amount is still nuts!
<< <i>I am soooooo happy that the Yankees didnt win this bid >>
Okay, man!
I really believe you, too!