My position on Moderns and Classics.
Russ
Posts: 48,514 ✭✭✭
Russ
Posts: 48,514 ✭✭✭
Russ
Posts: 48,514 ✭✭✭
Comments
Cameron Kiefer
for tiny nickels. Us Morgan guys can't even see the entire staircase much less the steps at Montecello with our eyesight!!!
profits jusy because their eyesight is better than mine. Give me those big ole Silver Dollars and big
shiney 35 year old Kennedys!
<< <i>and now someone is offering big money
for tiny nickels. >>
Nickels aren't that small. Look at the size of this sucker:
Russ, NCNE
So that I can sell them to make money to buy classics!
It's the best of both worlds!
Ken
<< <i>I love classics AND moderns!! Can't we all just get along??
We can. I like them both too. My problem is with those who sell and promote ultra high grade modern coins who claim that one can never pay too much for one of them.
who in the heck has made that claim??
al h.
I like Coins. Yes it's a lot like the old saying.
I LIke Ike
Sacagawea is nice to.
If you would care to recall an example of this phenomena in action, think back to this time last year when the lemmings were bidding up that spotted, toned 1963 cent in PCGS PR-70 De-Cam to $40K ++. You know, the one that sold at a record price the year before that PCGS bought back and took out of numismatic circulation before the coin further damaged THEIR reputation. We didn’t hear a peep out of any of the modern coin hustlers about that one. If they were to show an ounce of integrity, they should have been laughing with the rest of us or warning the lemmings about their foolish behavior.
But no. They were doing the "You can pay enough for the finest graded" dance,
Bill: I am not sure who those hustlers were that did not "utter a peep", but, I will tell you this - a number of us alerted DH to the problem of the 1963 Lincoln as quickly as we saw the coin. Indeed, since I lot viewed the coin a bit later than some other folks did, by the time I alerted DH to the coin, he was already well informed about it. Which is how PCGS was able to respond as quickly as they did and ensure that this problem coin was taken off the market as quickly as possible and not sold to anyone else. And, PCGS is alerted routinely about both classics and moderns. Not to mention, a number of board members who also alert auction companies to pull mislabeled modern coins (or classic coins). Bottom line - IMHO, the saga of the 1963 Lincoln cent is an example of the system properly at work - the coin turned in the holder and PCGS paid up!
Wondercoin
<< <i>think back to this time last year when the lemmings were bidding up that spotted, toned 1963 cent in PCGS PR-70 De-Cam to $40K ++. >>
You really ought to come up with a fresh example. That one has been beaten to death.
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>Which is how PCGS was able to respond as quickly as they did and ensure that this problem coin was taken off the market as quickly as possible and not sold to anyone else. >>
As quickly as they did? The coin sold twice - a YEAR apart.
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>We can. I like them both too. My problem is with those who sell and promote ultra high grade modern coins who claim that one can never pay too much for one of them. >>
Which is one of the best reasons why we should continue to promote education in this forum.
Well maybe so Wondercoin, but it certainly took them long enough.
That coin was sold at an outragious price in January of 2003, and then it was shown to be a piece of crap in the photos that were published in COINage. THEN the coin was offered up for auction again and once more it was bid up to even MORE insame levels. ONLY THEN did the system react AFTER a whole lot of people started laughing at the situation and making PCGS look bad.
If we had all shut up, that $5 coin would have again changed hands at $40k. That's not good enough.
Russ: Not my understanding - the coin did not sell 2x, unless you mean it sold to PCGS, who bought it back a year later? Obviously, the first sale took nearly everyone by surprise.
I think they did a fine job of responding and addressing a $40,000 issue in a manner where the original buyer appears to have been made whole (some questioned whether that was even appropriate under the circumstances).
Wondercoin
P.S. Bill - I hear you - and, of course, the consignor of the coin chose to sell it at public auction as part of the entire collection - obviously, he made that decision. And, I believe it did end well for everyone in the collecting community.
<< <i>Russ: Not my understanding - the coin did not sell 2x >>
What are you smoking? It sold at auction for $39,100 the first time and then a year later it came up at auction again when PCGS bought it. If they actually would have "responded quickly" they'd have bought that dog off the market the first time it came up. It's not as if it wasn't heavily discussed here and everywhere else. Instead it took a year of crappy publicity before they stepped up to the plate.
Russ, NCNE
Agreed - PCGS made arrangements for Heritage to pull the coin from the auction so they could remove it from the market and pay off the consignor - if you call this "selling twice" - so be it.
Also, the "year" time frame is meaningless - it could have been 10 years -- as the collector simply tucked the coin away in his collection once he bought it and PCGS obviously could not have forced him to sell it back to them.
Wondercoin
<< <i>Also, the "year" time frame is meaningless >>
Yeah, I guess it would be if we ignored your assertion that PCGS "responded quickly" to the problem. They should have stepped up the FIRST time it was auctioned and got it off the market right then and there.
Russ, NCNE
Sean Reynolds
"Keep in mind that most of what passes as numismatic information is no more than tested opinion at best, and marketing blather at worst. However, I try to choose my words carefully, since I know that you guys are always watching." - Joe O'Connor
<< <i>I buy and slab moderns.
So that I can sell them to make money to buy classics!
It's the best of both worlds!
Ken >>
Though I should say for the record that I'd get just as excited finding a clip on a 2004 cent as I would finding one on an 1804 cent.
Sean Reynolds
"Keep in mind that most of what passes as numismatic information is no more than tested opinion at best, and marketing blather at worst. However, I try to choose my words carefully, since I know that you guys are always watching." - Joe O'Connor
<< <i>I thought that coin turned in the holder sometime after the first sale. I can't believe it looked like it did when Heritage had it when it went into the holder. >>
Nope. It looked like crap the first time it sold.
Russ, NCNE