Slimeball Seller Alert: donald115

BigGreek

Just wanted to given the forum a heads up on this guy.

Here's the story:

Purchased Peace$ and Walker from him.

Look carefully at the pictures. The Peace$ has an area on the cheek which
is a slightly different texture. The coin arrived and this area was hiding some
contact marks which would definitely keep the coin below MS-64. Likewise on
the Walker, the sun in the lower left of the obverse also hides some detail.
The coin in hand shows a couple of deep dings in that area. Clearly the images
have been doctored.

I contact the seller to return the coins and the response was predictable:
I can return the Peace$ but he will take out all fees and costs associated with
the sale. The Walker I get to keep based on his returns policy regarding slabbed
coins.

I'm not one to hold grudges or make superfluous gripes.
I will not be doing further business with this seller.

kieferscoins

That is major photoshop on the peace dollar. The fuzzyness of the pic in that area didn't alert you that there might be a problem?

I'm sorry you got burned But if they talk about slabs and the grade, and the price is way under what a slabbed example would go for in that grade red flags should go up.

Cameron Kiefer

dbldie55

What fees and costs? Ebay will refund the final value fees and if you use Paypal, they will as well. The only fee not refunded is the listing fee.

BigGreek

<< <i>That is major photoshop on the peace dollar. The fuzzyness of thepic in that area didn't alert you that there might be a problem?

Cameron Kiefer >>



Cameron, no it did not occur to me. I am no expert in this area. I am now aware of this.

Bikingnut

Report it to ebay. He clearly states in the add that the Peace dollar has a nice cheek and doctored the photo.

itsnotjustme

Now the question is what you leave for feedback. Probably deserves at least a neutral... doctored photo--accepted return minus feesshipping.

You may need to take a retaliatorry in return....

BigGreek

<< <i>What fees and costs? Ebay will refund the final value fees and if you use Paypal, they will as well. The only fee not refunded is the listing fee. >>



This remains to be seen. I also wondered what he was referring to. The coin is in
the mail to him.

His name is Donald Esterman and he is based in Cincinnati, OH.

kranky

Too bad you can't save the photos to a web page and link to it in a negative feedback. I think most people who saw those photos would realize something funny is going on, especially if pointed to the specific areas.

BigGreek

<< <i>Report it to ebay. He clearly states in the add that the Peace dollar has a nice cheek and doctored the photo. >>



I think I will try this. Thanks for the suggestion.

Sequitur

Yes, please negative this fraudster and highlight the fact his photos were doctored. Put up a small page with his auction photos versus the actual coins in hand. It is richly deserved.

K6AZ

You have plenty of time to leave feedback. Get your money back first before leaving any type of feedback.

ss350camaro

Post a pic of that Walker.

I would think if it can be positively proven that the pic was doctored you would be able to get a return/refund.

Barry

Blur filter applied to cheek. Not even subtle.

ziggy29

<< <i>Blur filter applied to cheek. Not even subtle. >>

Looking back at this seller's past auctions, there are some surprisingly "clean" cheeks out there...

Peaceman

That's a lot of $ for a raw coin......

BigGreek

<< <i>That's a lot of $ for a raw coin...... >>



Yep. I blew it.

Sequitur

Yep. I blew it.

What, $80? Hardly worth worrying about, a small gamble that didn't pay off. Just be sure to draft a succinct, powerful negative and slap it on his feedback.

cdan12

If you paid with paypal, you can get all your money back by filing a complaint against him.

K6AZ

<< <i>If you paid with paypal, you can get all your money back by filing a complaint against him. >>



That's true, under the significantly-different-than-described complaint. On the Walker, that image alone along with a good one of what the coin really looks like should be enough to win a PayPal complaint.

wjd283

Here's a current auction that does'nt look quite right either.


At least MS64,probably better???????????

I think not.

K6AZ

Sequitur

And the photo doesn't look right, either.

Sequitur

If this 1899 half eagle is MS62, I'm Louis Eliasberg. And the picture screams, "doctored."

TayTay

What's the problem? From the auction -



<< <i>MARKS ARE FEW AND WHAT IS THERE IS VERY WELL HIDDEN >>

Bear

Unfortunately, most of us learned our lessons from making the same mistakes.

Better to get it over early and join the ranks of the veterins.

ss350camaro

<< <i>What, $80? Hardly worth worrying about, a small gamble that didn't pay off. >>



Next time you have a measly $80 laying around just go ahead and send it my way. Not all of us can afford to throw away money.

Sequitur

Not all of us can afford to throw away money.

What? I merely told the original poster he shouldn't beat himself up over a two-figure deal gone bad -- it simply is not the end of the world and, more to the point, not the buyer's fault -- looks to me like the seller is a fraud. No reason to pace the halls worrying about the transaction -- it's not worth it.

What this has to do with "throwing money away," I don't know -- the purchase was not "throwing money away," as you appear to suggest, and in any event your response is a contorted reading of what I said.

Myqqy

I merely told the original poster he shouldn't beat himself up over a two-figure deal gone bad

I agree- I hated getting burned when I first started back into coins, but I learned valuable lessons and had to forgive myself for taking ill-advised risks. It's merely a matter of getting your first battle scars and learning how to (hopefully) out-think the corrupt sellers...

eddyemack

That's a real bummer!!!!! If you didn't pay with paypal, I would wait until I receive my refund then really bash him. You exposed him on this forum. And you have some of the best minds in the business here. If I lived in Ohio, I would get you a 100% refund plus a nuisance fee. ( I have a real good collection dept.) We all have to keep exposing the ebay frauds. I don't mean the trivial bs that I have seen from some others but in your case, you have a legitimate beef. Good luck and be thankful it wasn't for more cash. Take care.

eddye

GO STEELERS

eddyemack

I like your icon Myqqy!!!!!!

GO STEELERS

topstuf

And he calls the cent "copper" when we all know it's bronze.

BigGreek

Just wanted to follow up with a few pictures of the Walker. I already sent back
the Peace$.

Here's the area in question. Refer to K6AZ's zoom of the same area:



Here are a couple of picture of the entire coin. The coin is barely an MS-64
as far as the number of marks but the strike puts it above the bar as far as
NGC is concerned. Had I gotten a look at the coin without the obvious touch
ups, I would have passed for the price.

K6AZ

Thanks for posting those pictures. If you used PayPal, file a claim for significantly different than described. What this seller did is blatant misrepresentation and fraud in my opinion. That is a low end 64, the photo was touched up to make it appear to be a high end 64.

BigGreek

Here is my latest message to the seller:

Dear Seller,

after a closer inspection of the pictures in your listing
and comparison with the coin in hand. I believe you
may have enhanced the pictures to hide
defects in the coin. In particular I am looking at
the sun in the lower left portion of the obverse.
Several large hits in that area are blurred out in
your image but are very clear on the coin.

The same seems to have happened with the cheek
on the Peace $ which I am returning.

I don't know if the blurring was caused by your
camera on some other method but it greatly affected my buying decision.

I would like once again to request a refund for the
1941-S Walker given that I was completely misled.

Sincerely,
-Dimitri.

kranky

Save the pictures to your computer in case the seller takes them down.

ziggy29

<< <i>And the photo doesn't look right, either. >>

And even if it were right, it looks AU-58 to me. The rub on the cheek and jawbones is plainly evident.

guysmy

That is some hideous Photoshop work. Be glad that most of these people are amateur photo retouchers. Now you have clues to watch out for. That was done with the cloning tool - feathered paintbrush selected.

Sequitur

What a fraud. Auction pic versus coin in hand:

BigGreek

I don't want to drag this thread out but I thought I would share my last
e-mail from the seller. My next step is to file a complaint through paypal.
I will do so for both coins.

You asked:
"Dear Seller, after a closer inspection of the pictures in your listing and comparison with the coin in hand. I believe you may have enhanced the pictures to hide defects in the coin. In particular I am looking at the sun in the lower left portion of the obverse. Several large hits in that area are blurred out in your image but are very clear on the coin. The same seems to have happened with the cheek on the Peace $ which I am returning. I don't know if the blurring was caused by your camera on some other method but it greatly affected my buying decision. I would like once again to request a refund for the 1941-S Walker given that I was completely misled. Sincerely, -Dimitri."

I would be very careful of the accusations you are making. Your accusations are bordering upon libel. I do not enhance photos....I don't even know how to do that. If there are imperfections in my scanner, so be it. You bought a coin graded MS64 which I believe had a shot at going into an MS65 holder. You also bought a coin knowing that there was no return priviledge. Now you want a refund? Sorry, but you knew the rules going in. You chose to buy the coin with the off chance that you could upgrade and make $500 or so on the coin. It is my position that that is still possible, but any liability attaches to the coin when sold. There is absolutely nothing misleading in the auction. If you can read, which I know you can, you are responsbile for your actions. No refund.

Coinhusker1

File a PayPal complaint and a complaint to Coinwatch. You should get a full refund, including shipping, plus he should pay for return shipping.

This scumbag should be NARU'ed for this blatant misrepresentation. That Peace Dollar was a blatant Photoshop and should be the only evidence you need.

BigGreek

Please give details on coinwatch.

Jdurg

The way the seller responded to your very polite, non-accusation e-mail is a clear sign that he doctored the photo and is upset that he was caught. I would definitely file some complaints and not stop until you get all your money back. If he leaves a negative feedback or a negative response to feedback you left him, I'm fairly certain that E-Bay will remove that feedback/response if you can prove that you were correct and he was fraudulent. (And with the photos you have, E-Bay would need to be blind to not see the fraud).

Sequitur

I would be very careful of the accusations you are making. Your accusations are bordering upon libel.

Uh, no. Typical fraudster-speak. Ignore this nonsense.

I do not enhance photos....I don't even know how to do that.

Funny stuff. He's a John Marshall genius when it comes to snap judgments about libel thresholds, but he's a blithering idiot when it comes to photo doctoring -- photo doctoring that's painfully obvious across multiple auctions.

You've caught a live one, all right. Time to stick him with the gaff.

BigGreek

Here's the latest fro him:

Dimitri,

Regardless of who Paypal rules in favor of, one of us is going to be left
with a bad taste in their mouths. It is never my intention to be
confrontational with a buyer, but then virtually all of my buyers abide by
the rules.

In an effort to end this spitting contest, I will make a one time exception
and agree to take back the 41-S Half Dollar. Cancel your complaint as filed
with Paypal, return the coin to me and I will refund your original purchase
price less any paypal fees. Postage and shipping will not be refunded.

If that's acceptable to you, please so indicate and let's get this mess
cleared up.

Don Esterman


I've decided to let him off the hook on this. I will send him back the coin
but I will cancel the complaint only after I get the refund. I wonder how
many of these "one time exceptions" he's had to make. My feeling is that
this is probably standard business practice for him. Unfortunately for him,
what he doesn't realize is that I don't give a rat's heiny about retaliatory
feedback

ss350camaro

We'll have to watch his future auctions to see if this coin pops up again with "doctored" photos.

Congrats' on getting your return/refund

coinguy1

BigGeek, isn't there a way for him (and thus you) to avoid the Paypal fees/penalty if the transaction is voided./reversed?

Coinhusker1

<< <i>Here's the latest fro him:

Dimitri,

Regardless of who Paypal rules in favor of, one of us is going to be left
with a bad taste in their mouths. It is never my intention to be
confrontational with a buyer, but then virtually all of my buyers abide by
the rules.

In an effort to end this spitting contest, I will make a one time exception
and agree to take back the 41-S Half Dollar. Cancel your complaint as filed
with Paypal, return the coin to me and I will refund your original purchase
price less any paypal fees. Postage and shipping will not be refunded.

If that's acceptable to you, please so indicate and let's get this mess
cleared up.

Don Esterman


I've decided to let him off the hook on this. I will send him back the coin
but I will cancel the complaint only after I get the refund. I wonder how
many of these "one time exceptions" he's had to make. My feeling is that
this is probably standard business practice for him. Unfortunately for him,
what he doesn't realize is that I don't give a rat's heiny about retaliatory
feedback >>




Don't do it!! You should get every cent of your money back and insist on it!!! He is a scammer and should not get away with taking ANY of your money.

ziggy29

From the seller:

<< <i>...but then virtually all of my buyers abide by the rules >>

Rules? You mean like obviously doctoring photos to hide blemishes?

Isn't that cute? A blatant photo doctor, busted in the act, accusing OTHERS of abusing "the rules."

Physician, heal thyself.

ss350camaro

<< <i> BigGreek, isn't there a way for him (and thus you) to avoid the Paypal fees/penalty if the transaction is voided./reversed? >>



Mark,

I believe that if the seller simply uses the "refund" feature on the PayPal transactions detail page the fees are refunded with no penalties.
It' simply a reversal of the entire transaction.

coinguy1

Thanks Doug. That is what I had thought, and why it seems the buyer should not incur any Paypal fees as referenced by the seller!

ss350camaro

P.S.

The only fees the seller will incur are Ebay fees.

He can file for fee credits.

In the end the only loser is the sellers reputation (BAD - which in this case is well deserved!)