<< <i>Would you tell someone that collecting shower caps is a great idea? >>
There is something to see in any collection; It is history, it is the passion with which items are pursued and it is the rarity. There is something to learn from accumulating just about any collection also.
Coins are not only about value and grade, nor are thay only about collecting what others collect or what others find interesting. If somone enjoys old circulated US coins than more power to him, but there is a vast universe of coins out there, and some of those coins ap- peal to some people.
If someone thinks he can have fun collecting liberty caps, die caps, or shower caps then he just might be on the right track.
When you are a steady, regular and strong buyer from a dealer and they forget about you until there is a coin show in your area. The concept of want lists, in this great market, seemingly is ignored by even the best dealers since they are doing so much business across the board. I am dissapointed when I give dealers 5 figures worth of business in a year or two and they neglect to keep the relationship up from their end. It's not a question of the availability of coins, rather, it is taking the custormer for granted.
<< <i>When you are a steady, regular and strong buyer from a dealer and they forget about you until there is a coin show in your area. The concept of want lists, in this great market, seemingly is ignored by even the best dealers since they are doing so much business across the board. I am dissapointed when I give dealers 5 figures worth of business in a year or two and they neglect to keep the relationship up from their end. It's not a question of the availability of coins, rather, it is taking the custormer for granted. >>
Wow, what kind of coins? How much is the dealer allowed to make? You shouldn't be taken for granted regardless of the business volume these days but what kind of customer are you?
I buy and sell an occasional coin for fun and if I am lucky, a little profit. Usually I learn a little along the way and I am not partial to moderns or classics when I buy or sell. I get coins that interest me or coins I think I can make a buck on.
However, the coins that I do collect and KEEP are 1982 modern mint state coins (non proof). I can enter the registry game and do fairly well without the mega budget that many collectors/dealers (you included) get to work with. Many of us could not participate in the registry in any meaningful way if we didn't collect moderns.
I realize the registry is not everyone's game but you do a disservice to folks by ruling out moderns.
In all seriousness, I like to tease but there is often a little truth in many teases.
You modern collectors need to fight back.
"Yeah, we'll have the last word...."
"You guys who collect early dollars have never run a dollar compounded annually into your calculators to see what a lousy return collectors of early coinage have gotton over the past 200 years..."
"I only lost $2,000 on modern coinage last year....what about you, hotshot snakeboy???"
You know, that kinda stuff.
Don't just get irritated and complain....look down at the teaser and see if they're hangin' to the left or right and give it a kick.....surely you can reach down inside of you and figure out why you collect modern coinage instead of early circulated coinage. Articulate it!
<< <i>"I only lost $2,000 on modern coinage last year....what about you, hotshot snakeboy???"
You know, that kinda stuff.
Don't just get irritated and complain....look down at the teaser and see if they're hangin' to the left or right and give it a kick.....surely you can reach down inside of you and figure out why you collect modern coinage instead of early circulated coinage. Articulate it!
Let's fight it out on an intellectual level. >>
OK, the other quotes I remember. This one not.
It's easy to lose money on moderns if you buy them for investment but it's much more difficult for collectors. It's probably impossible in recent times for a generalist.
There really is no need to defend moderns on an intellectual level or any other to col- lectors. It doesn't matter if you or much of the hobby doesn't like them. What does matter is that for every collector who thanked you for steering him away from moderns there are likely a small handful who gave up the hobby in frustration. What does mat- ter is the future of the hobby and what it will look like if large numbers of newbies are continually driven off.
Obviously this may well have been yet another "tease", but this is my pet peeve; that so many are doing this or find it humorous.
Dealers who charge a premium for certified toned coins, but then tell a collector trying to trade a slabbed, toned coin back that "The toning looks a little funny - it was probably played around with before it was graded, and now the results are showing." Dealers want to play the color issue to their advantage on both ends....if they're selling, it's "Hey- it's in a slab, so the toning is unquestionably worth a premium." If they're buying, it's "Hey - that coin was probably doctored before it got slabbed, I'm gonna have trouble moving that one." This has happened to me plenty of times in the past couple of years.
Don't you know that it's worth every treasure on Earth to be young at heart? And as rich as you are, it's much better by far, to be young at heart!
1. Luster lovers. That includes TPGs and collectors who so emphasize luster that coins with original patina are penalized a point in grading and are harder to sell in the market place.
2. TPGs that give grading bumps for toning. Result is a market grade a point higher than technical grade. Allows dealers to charge the higher grade price plus a premium to for toning so the collector pays a double premium
Any Ebay dealer that list 5 pages of coins at prices only an Idiot (or a snooty trial attorney) would pay. Almost to say..."Look at me...see how important I am"
Experienced dealers or collectors who overgrade by large margins. Usually this is evident on Ebay and not in the local coin shops I visit whose owners/dealers are very fair, and mostly accurate.
People who use the word "original" for every cleaned monstrosity they sell. Again, this seems to be an Ebay phenomenon. Finally, The ultimate pet peeve I have is THIS SELLER. Every week they offer a host of polished and completely putrid coins on Ebay. I am so sick of them that I am now in negotiations with a hitman out of New Jersey to rid them out of my life forever.
Most of my pet peeves are general, they really don't just relate to coin collecting.
a) People that hope I'll make a major purchase from them without making intelligent, appropriate inquiries b) Rude, inconsiderate people (like dealers who will talk with their friends at a show and ignore potential customers) c) People who are enamored of themselves. You know the type - they pretend that they want to speak with you, but really just want to hear themselves talk c) People who ruin original coins for "fun and profit" (overdipping, altering surfaces, etc). d) Know it alls e) People who don't know you, but provide unsolicited advice re what you should collect f) People who are in numismatics solely to take advantage of the ignorant and uninformed for "fun and profit." g) People who try to sell me a coin that looks like it'll jump out of its holder and bite my hand if I pick it up to inspect it.
I think I'm done now.
"Vou invadir o Nordeste, "Seu cabra da peste, "Sou Mangueira......."
Any Ebay dealer that list 5 pages of coins at prices only an Idiot (or a snooty trial attorney) would pay. Almost to say..."Look at me...see how important I am" >>
Interesting topic . While I agree with almost all previous posts , I need to add this one . I'ts the customer , (usually a collector, but not necessarily) , that asks for a coin price, then proceeds to wave grey sheets at me, and seemingly reprimand me as to ' how dare you sell this at ask or a tad over !?!? . I have the sheets , and you are unreasonable !!!! . Everyone knows you buy back of bid, and are making a killing! Dang, if i could buy everything at 30 back of bid , then ........
"Any Ebay dealer that list 5 pages of coins at prices only an Idiot (or a snooty trial attorney) would pay. Almost to say..."Look at me...see how important I am"
First of all, I'd like to say "Good one"! I like a good zinger.
Secondly, I have 6 page of coins, not 5, but that would be an easy mistake for anyone to make especially one that capitalizes 'idiot' in the middle of a sentance.
Thirdly, with regard to snooty, my 7 year old daughter speaks three languages, English, Spanish and French. Thought you'ld like that one.
Fourthly, most buyers of my coins are smart enough to know that if I list a coin at some really high price (not all of them are or were listed at really high prices), they can negotiate a better price with me; no one will really know what they paid for the item, which is handy for reasons which I'm sure you may be able to eventually figure out. This is especially helpful since many coins I sell are somewhat well known or finest known.
Lastly here are some pieces (off the top of my head) that I have sold, many of them to dealers, most in the past year:
Trade dollar in Proof 68 Specimen Wreath Cent in 65 Chain Cent in AU 50 Bison note in 68 Silver Dollar Back in 67 Barber Quarter in 69 Ultra Cameo Star Many, many commems in 65, 66, 67, 68 and one of the three early commems in 69 Twenty Cent piece in Proof 68 Seated Dollar in 67 Ultra Cameo Three Dollar Gold in 67 Ultra Cameo Barber Half in 69 Cameo (I bought it back) Small eagle Bust Dollar in 63 Many Bust Dollars including many uncs Octagonal Pan Pac $50 in 64 Round Pan Pac $50 in 63 1794 Cent in MS 66 Draped Bust Quarter in MS66 Standing Liberty Quarter in MS 68 Quite a number of Trade dollars mint state and proof in 65, 66 and 67 1836 Reeded Edge Half in 64 1804 $10 in 64 Set of Educational notes in 67
<< <i>"snobby high end, expensive coin collectors/dealers that make snide comments about a budget collector's lower end coins. "
Someone might accuse me of that if "lower end coins" includes modern coinage, however, I try not to be snide, but rather totally blunt.
I only mean to steer people into early circulated type coins and away from modern coinage, especially super high grade coinage that can often cost more than early circulated coins.
I try to always say in effect "I wouldn't collect modern coinage....it's boring (inherint in 'boring' is that it is my opinion)....you should collect early circulated coins..."
I never mean to suggest that if you collect inexpensive coins somehow that is less rewarding than collecting more expensive coins or that collectors of expensive coins are more important than collectors of inexpensive coins.
I realize this may bother some people but I truly believe that if it gets some people away from modern coinage, they will be glad they did. As a matter of fact, I have been thanked by a number of collectors for steering them away from modern coinage towards early circulated and truly rare U.S. coins. >>
It can include modern coinage but what I was refering to is inexpensive coins in general. I think quite a few people tend to forget that for many numismatics is merely a hobby and not an investment game. It's not always about value, it's about enjoyment of the hobby. Some people have a strict limited budget when it comes to coins and can't always go for high end coins. It's fine to suggest to or encourage a new collector to explore new ventures within the hobby, but belittleing a collectors current collecting venture is just a slap in the face and not a way to make friends. I believe what Cladking said hit the nail on the head.
<< <i>You modern collectors need to fight back. >>
Why should anyone feel the need to turn thier hobby into a pissing contest? That's not much fun at all. If you can afford and enjoy high end expensive ultra rare coins, good for you. More power to you. Not everyone can. If someone can find the same satisfaction in modern or just inexpensive common coins in general, so be it. Sorry, Anaconda, I just don't see why people have to play the role of 'playground bully' in a hobby where we're supposed to be having fun in.
Yeah, you're probably right. I just need to care less.
I've just met too many people at coin shows with boxes and boxes of modern coinage just almost in tears when they find out what fools they've been.
What's really sad is when an elderly fellow comes to a coin show with his wife who trusted him with their money. He stands there with her and a dealer tells him he doesn't even really want the material because no one else really wants it either. That it's really just too much work to get rid of.
Smitty is saying that some collect just for the pleasure of it and don't get wrapped up in the high dollar stuff so they don't have a lot to lose-----------------------------------BigE
<< <i>Yeah, you're probably right. I just need to care less.
I've just met too many people at coin shows with boxes and boxes of modern coinage just almost in tears when they find out what fools they've been.
What's really sad is when an elderly fellow comes to a coin show with his wife who trusted him with their money. He stands there with her and a dealer tells him he doesn't even really want the material because no one else really wants it either. That it's really just too much work to get rid of.
Maybe then you would start to feel like I feel. >>
Why doesn't the dealer tell him that he doesn't deal in such coins and point them toward someone who does instead of ripping them?
The only time I've seen such things as you describe it was someone trying to sell classics, especially Morgans, and couldn't get 10c on the dollar. There wasn't anywhere else to take the coins either since no one paid more.
Again, the only way you can even lose money on these coins in this market is to either spec- ialize in an over-priced area or to get caught in one of the many down drafts. This is why I tell people to not just throw money at these coins in the hopes of getting rich. One needs to do a little homework and have an idea of what's common and what's not. It's also why I al- ways recommend that all collectors sell some coins from time to time to see what the coins are really worth. What difference does it make whether your coins are classics or moderns if you find they're worth a small fraction of the purchase price when you go to sell. Many people are into their coins for more than they can get out in the near future. At least with moderns there's a chance that increasing prices might bail out sucker purchases.
The key to any collecting is to get into only as fast as you can understand. And it should be col- lecting, not investing because investors usually pay too much and they buy what the dealer has available rather than the rare coins they need for their collections.
So shed your crocodile tears if you wish, but the inescapable fact is that many of these coins are far higher than they've ever been before and still sell for a small fraction of what a comparably rare classic would sell for.
I posted this coin in another thread, and I used to think that people who collected them were a little UNUSUAL, but I have come to appreciate the fact that the coin biz may go to hell in a handbasket someday and the people who collect them will stand to lose a lot less than those of us who have spent 10 times as much for a similar example----------------------------------BigE
Big E....we're cool....you got me good. You and my wife today, KZ6X last week, probably 10 more guys tomorrow.
Clad....I don't know as much about modern coinage as you do. If it's going up in value like you say, good. But that's not what I'm hearing. To be specific, the stuff that isn't doing well is the non-top pop stuff, truckloads of which there is.
There are many guys who are putting together sets of all kinds of stuff....non pop top stuff and once they get done and want to sell it, they can't give it away. That's what I hear. If I'm wrong, I apologize. We could discuss this at length but I will agree with you that knowledge is key and I'm sure that that is true in moderns as well.
Having said that, I like poisonous snakes. I used to own many. Got bit. Finally decided that even though I knew quite a bit about them, it was just not a really good hobby. I moved on to something less risky. I would advise against keeping poisonous snakes. Same thing with moderns.
It's not a snob thing. $69,000 for a Lincoln cent is pretty damn snobby to me. I mean the jeans I'm wearing right now came from Target. I'm really just a redneck but I'd appreciate if you would not repeat that to my wife because so far, the coast has been clear.
You and I can disagree. I'll continue to listen to you. If you want to listen to me, cool. If not, cool. Just be nice to me. I'm very sensitive and bruise easily.
<< <i>Big E....we're cool....you got me good. You and my wife today, KZ6X last week, probably 10 more guys tomorrow.
Clad....I don't know as much about modern coinage as you do. If it's going up in value like you say, good. But that's not what I'm hearing. To be specific, the stuff that isn't doing well is the non-top pop stuff, truckloads of which there is.
There are many guys who are putting together sets of all kinds of stuff....non pop top stuff and once they get done and want to sell it, they can't give it away. That's what I hear. If I'm wrong, I apologize. We could discuss this at length but I will agree with you that knowledge is key and I'm sure that that is true in moderns as well.
Having said that, I like poisonous snakes. I used to own many. Got bit. Finally decided that even though I knew quite a bit about them, it was just not a really good hobby. I moved on to something less risky. I would advise against keeping poisonous snakes. Same thing with moderns.
It's not a snob thing. $69,000 for a Lincoln cent is pretty damn snobby to me. I mean the jeans I'm wearing right now came from Target. I'm really just a redneck but I'd appreciate if you would not repeat that to my wife because so far, the coast has been clear.
You and I can disagree. I'll continue to listen to you. If you want to listen to me, cool. If not, cool. Just be nice to me. I'm very sensitive and bruise easily. >>
I used to keep snakes of all kinds and one of my favorites was a python. It ate a rat every eight or ten days until "lunch" bit him and he died of the infection.
He was a great snake but had a little tendency to play with his food. We called him Stretch.
One can lose money on moderns and there are many types which are well off their highs and may not come back for some time. Even raw moderns have lost up to 20% of their value this year. Commems and unc coins of most denominations are still doing well. This extends from pop tops down to ChBU. It does exclude some of the coins which had already run up a great deal.
Well, non-moderns have also taken dumps in the past. In 1989 classic commems took a nose dive that would make even a seasoned tight rope walker flinch.
Alright, lest we totally side line our buddies thread, here's another peeve for you:
Dealers who sit behind their table working on some deal, totally oblivious to you standing in front of your case waiting patiently for some attention. They look up, don't say anything other than "just a minute" and then you wait and wait and wait........
and here's another one....along the same lines...
You go to a guys table...he's not there...you see a monster that you are dying for....you wait, you wait, you leave and come back....you wait....and it's like waiting for the birth of your child! Man! Can't they just leave a piece of paper with their cell phone number on it in their case?
(See...I know what it's like to be on both sides of the case...)
<< <i>I mean the jeans I'm wearing right now came from Target. I'm really just a redneck but I'd appreciate if you would not repeat that to my wife because so far, the coast has been clear. >>
Anaconda,
We don't know each other from "Adam". When I got back into numismatics I saw your stuff on Ebay and thought you were GOD himself. I thought how inspiring...how incredible...this guy is the man!!! I have also met a few people who have circulated Lincoln collections that are EXTREMELY proud of them...and I thought how inspiring...etc.
But some of the puke you throw down in these rooms is deplorable. My father told me once - "never tell people how much money you have because people either have more (and don't care) or have less (and don't care)...so the only thing you can accomplish is alienate a potential friend."
My point is: Your quote I used at the top is just cool! Some of the others I've seen lately are not.
I think the problem is in fact that you don't know me from Adam. I say many things tongue in cheek - like my response to the fellow who said his pet peeve in coin collecting was ambulance chasers, if you saw it.
When you get to know me, I think you'll understand me a little better, and who knows, maybe you'll even get to like me.
But hey, if not, you can join the ranks of folks that don't like me. Most of them quite frankly, don't like a lot of things.
I'm not out to make enemies but I'm also not here to win the approval of people. Cool Morgan by the way. AT or NT?
Comments
<< <i>Would you tell someone that collecting shower caps is a great idea? >>
There is something to see in any collection; It is history, it is the passion with which items
are pursued and it is the rarity. There is something to learn from accumulating just about
any collection also.
Coins are not only about value and grade, nor are thay only about collecting what others
collect or what others find interesting. If somone enjoys old circulated US coins than more
power to him, but there is a vast universe of coins out there, and some of those coins ap-
peal to some people.
If someone thinks he can have fun collecting liberty caps, die caps, or shower caps then he
just might be on the right track.
<< <i>When you are a steady, regular and strong buyer from a dealer and they forget about you until there is a coin show in your area. The concept of want lists, in this great market, seemingly is ignored by even the best dealers since they are doing so much business across the board. I am dissapointed when I give dealers 5 figures worth of business in a year or two and they neglect to keep the relationship up from their end. It's not a question of the availability of coins, rather, it is taking the custormer for granted. >>
Wow, what kind of coins? How much is the dealer allowed to make? You shouldn't be taken for granted regardless of the business volume these days but what kind of customer are you?
Rgrds
Tom
Coin's for sale/trade.
Tom Pilitowski
US Rare Coin Investments
800-624-1870
I buy and sell an occasional coin for fun and if I am lucky, a little profit. Usually I learn a little along the way and I am not partial to moderns or classics when I buy or sell. I get coins that interest me or coins I think I can make a buck on.
However, the coins that I do collect and KEEP are 1982 modern mint state coins (non proof). I can enter the registry game and do fairly well without the mega budget that many collectors/dealers (you included) get to work with. Many of us could not participate in the registry in any meaningful way if we didn't collect moderns.
I realize the registry is not everyone's game but you do a disservice to folks by ruling out moderns.
You modern collectors need to fight back.
"Yeah, we'll have the last word...."
"You guys who collect early dollars have never run a dollar compounded annually into your calculators to see what a lousy return collectors of early coinage have gotton over the past 200 years..."
You know, that kinda stuff.
Don't just get irritated and complain....look down at the teaser and see if they're hangin' to the left or right and give it a kick.....surely you can reach down inside of you and figure out why you collect modern coinage instead of early circulated coinage. Articulate it!
Let's fight it out on an intellectual level.
Now why would you wanna do that??????
<< <i>"I only lost $2,000 on modern coinage last year....what about you, hotshot snakeboy???"
You know, that kinda stuff.
Don't just get irritated and complain....look down at the teaser and see if they're hangin' to the left or right and give it a kick.....surely you can reach down inside of you and figure out why you collect modern coinage instead of early circulated coinage. Articulate it!
Let's fight it out on an intellectual level. >>
OK, the other quotes I remember. This one not.
It's easy to lose money on moderns if you buy them for investment but it's much more
difficult for collectors. It's probably impossible in recent times for a generalist.
There really is no need to defend moderns on an intellectual level or any other to col-
lectors. It doesn't matter if you or much of the hobby doesn't like them. What does
matter is that for every collector who thanked you for steering him away from moderns
there are likely a small handful who gave up the hobby in frustration. What does mat-
ter is the future of the hobby and what it will look like if large numbers of newbies are
continually driven off.
Obviously this may well have been yet another "tease", but this is my pet peeve; that
so many are doing this or find it humorous.
<< <i>I hate the words "pet peeve." they really make me angry. >>
No kidding. We have pet cats, not pet peeves. I've never taken a peeve to the vet.
every treasure on Earth
to be young at heart?
And as rich as you are,
it's much better by far,
to be young at heart!
2. TPGs that give grading bumps for toning. Result is a market grade a point higher than technical grade. Allows dealers to charge the higher grade price plus a premium to for toning so the collector pays a double premium
CG
So much "crap" out there...
Of course, that is the fun part too...
What a paradox!!
siliconvalleycoins.com
1. LQQK L@@K or L()()K in the auction title.
2. Fuzzy scans
3. No returns!
4. Hype
5. Doctored material which is convienently not disclosed.
Any Ebay dealer that list 5 pages of coins at prices only an Idiot (or a snooty trial attorney) would pay. Almost to say..."Look at me...see how important I am"
People who use the word "original" for every cleaned monstrosity they sell. Again, this seems to be an Ebay phenomenon. Finally, The ultimate pet peeve I have is THIS SELLER. Every week they offer a host of polished and completely putrid coins on Ebay. I am so sick of them that I am now in negotiations with a hitman out of New Jersey to rid them out of my life forever.
Worst coin seller in the history of mankind
Tyler
Hell, I don't need to exercise.....I get enough just pushing my luck.
a) People that hope I'll make a major purchase from them without making intelligent, appropriate inquiries
b) Rude, inconsiderate people (like dealers who will talk with their friends at a show and ignore potential customers)
c) People who are enamored of themselves. You know the type - they pretend that they want to speak with you, but really just want to hear themselves talk
c) People who ruin original coins for "fun and profit" (overdipping, altering surfaces, etc).
d) Know it alls
e) People who don't know you, but provide unsolicited advice re what you should collect
f) People who are in numismatics solely to take advantage of the ignorant and uninformed for "fun and profit."
g) People who try to sell me a coin that looks like it'll jump out of its holder and bite my hand if I pick it up to inspect it.
I think I'm done now.
"Seu cabra da peste,
"Sou Mangueira......."
<< <i>Here's One:
Any Ebay dealer that list 5 pages of coins at prices only an Idiot (or a snooty trial attorney) would pay. Almost to say..."Look at me...see how important I am" >>
Heh.
Self Indulgence | Holey Coins | Flickr Photostream
"A person who never made a mistake never tried anything new."
---Albert Einstein (b. 14Mar1879--d. 18Apr1955)
How about people on ebay who hold coins in the palm of their hand and take a picture of it........ ARG!!!!!!!
Sorry No Peeves at the moment.
Ken
First of all, I'd like to say "Good one"! I like a good zinger.
Secondly, I have 6 page of coins, not 5, but that would be an easy mistake for anyone to make especially one that capitalizes 'idiot' in the middle of a sentance.
Thirdly, with regard to snooty, my 7 year old daughter speaks three languages, English, Spanish and French. Thought you'ld like that one.
Fourthly, most buyers of my coins are smart enough to know that if I list a coin at some really high price (not all of them are or were listed at really high prices), they can negotiate a better price with me; no one will really know what they paid for the item, which is handy for reasons which I'm sure you may be able to eventually figure out. This is especially helpful since many coins I sell are somewhat well known or finest known.
Lastly here are some pieces (off the top of my head) that I have sold, many of them to dealers, most in the past year:
Trade dollar in Proof 68
Specimen Wreath Cent in 65
Chain Cent in AU 50
Bison note in 68
Silver Dollar Back in 67
Barber Quarter in 69 Ultra Cameo Star
Many, many commems in 65, 66, 67, 68 and one of the three early commems in 69
Twenty Cent piece in Proof 68
Seated Dollar in 67 Ultra Cameo
Three Dollar Gold in 67 Ultra Cameo
Barber Half in 69 Cameo (I bought it back)
Small eagle Bust Dollar in 63
Many Bust Dollars including many uncs
Octagonal Pan Pac $50 in 64
Round Pan Pac $50 in 63
1794 Cent in MS 66
Draped Bust Quarter in MS66
Standing Liberty Quarter in MS 68
Quite a number of Trade dollars mint state and proof in 65, 66 and 67
1836 Reeded Edge Half in 64
1804 $10 in 64
Set of Educational notes in 67
(And of course, they're all fools.....right!)
<< <i>"snobby high end, expensive coin collectors/dealers that make snide comments about a budget collector's lower end coins. "
Someone might accuse me of that if "lower end coins" includes modern coinage, however, I try not to be snide, but rather totally blunt.
I only mean to steer people into early circulated type coins and away from modern coinage, especially super high grade coinage that can often cost more than early circulated coins.
I try to always say in effect "I wouldn't collect modern coinage....it's boring (inherint in 'boring' is that it is my opinion)....you should collect early circulated coins..."
I never mean to suggest that if you collect inexpensive coins somehow that is less rewarding than collecting more expensive coins or that collectors of expensive coins are more important than collectors of inexpensive coins.
I realize this may bother some people but I truly believe that if it gets some people away from modern coinage, they will be glad they did. As a matter of fact, I have been thanked by a number of collectors for steering them away from modern coinage towards early circulated and truly rare U.S. coins. >>
It can include modern coinage but what I was refering to is inexpensive coins in general. I think quite a few people tend to forget that for many numismatics is merely a hobby and not an investment game. It's not always about value, it's about enjoyment of the hobby. Some people have a strict limited budget when it comes to coins and can't always go for high end coins. It's fine to suggest to or encourage a new collector to explore new ventures within the hobby, but belittleing a collectors current collecting venture is just a slap in the face and not a way to make friends. I believe what Cladking said hit the nail on the head.
<< <i>You modern collectors need to fight back. >>
Why should anyone feel the need to turn thier hobby into a pissing contest? That's not much fun at all. If you can afford and enjoy high end expensive ultra rare coins, good for you. More power to you. Not everyone can. If someone can find the same satisfaction in modern or just inexpensive common coins in general, so be it. Sorry, Anaconda, I just don't see why people have to play the role of 'playground bully' in a hobby where we're supposed to be having fun in.
Ask me no questions, I'll tell you no lies.
I've just met too many people at coin shows with boxes and boxes of modern coinage just almost in tears when they find out what fools they've been.
What's really sad is when an elderly fellow comes to a coin show with his wife who trusted him with their money. He stands there with her and a dealer tells him he doesn't even really want the material because no one else really wants it either. That it's really just too much work to get rid of.
Maybe then you would start to feel like I feel.
I have a pet peeve. I really dislike people who don't have coin libraries yet they want to play make believe numismatist.
Dealers with permanent stickers on slabs
My posts viewed
since 8/1/6
<< <i>It's really no different than old people walking in with an AT Morgan that they paid 4K for that's worth 75 bucks is it?------------BigE >>
<< <i>Yeah, you're probably right. I just need to care less.
I've just met too many people at coin shows with boxes and boxes of modern coinage just almost in tears when they find out what fools they've been.
What's really sad is when an elderly fellow comes to a coin show with his wife who trusted him with their money. He stands there with her and a dealer tells him he doesn't even really want the material because no one else really wants it either. That it's really just too much work to get rid of.
Maybe then you would start to feel like I feel. >>
Why doesn't the dealer tell him that he doesn't deal in such coins and point them toward
someone who does instead of ripping them?
The only time I've seen such things as you describe it was someone trying to sell classics,
especially Morgans, and couldn't get 10c on the dollar. There wasn't anywhere else to take
the coins either since no one paid more.
Again, the only way you can even lose money on these coins in this market is to either spec-
ialize in an over-priced area or to get caught in one of the many down drafts. This is why I
tell people to not just throw money at these coins in the hopes of getting rich. One needs to
do a little homework and have an idea of what's common and what's not. It's also why I al-
ways recommend that all collectors sell some coins from time to time to see what the coins are
really worth. What difference does it make whether your coins are classics or moderns if you
find they're worth a small fraction of the purchase price when you go to sell. Many people are
into their coins for more than they can get out in the near future. At least with moderns there's
a chance that increasing prices might bail out sucker purchases.
The key to any collecting is to get into only as fast as you can understand. And it should be col-
lecting, not investing because investors usually pay too much and they buy what the dealer has
available rather than the rare coins they need for their collections.
So shed your crocodile tears if you wish, but the inescapable fact is that many of these coins are
far higher than they've ever been before and still sell for a small fraction of what a comparably
rare classic would sell for.
Clad....I don't know as much about modern coinage as you do. If it's going up in value like you say, good. But that's not what I'm hearing. To be specific, the stuff that isn't doing well is the non-top pop stuff, truckloads of which there is.
There are many guys who are putting together sets of all kinds of stuff....non pop top stuff and once they get done and want to sell it, they can't give it away. That's what I hear. If I'm wrong, I apologize. We could discuss this at length but I will agree with you that knowledge is key and I'm sure that that is true in moderns as well.
Having said that, I like poisonous snakes. I used to own many. Got bit. Finally decided that even though I knew quite a bit about them, it was just not a really good hobby. I moved on to something less risky. I would advise against keeping poisonous snakes. Same thing with moderns.
It's not a snob thing. $69,000 for a Lincoln cent is pretty damn snobby to me. I mean the jeans I'm wearing right now came from Target. I'm really just a redneck but I'd appreciate if you would not repeat that to my wife because so far, the coast has been clear.
You and I can disagree. I'll continue to listen to you. If you want to listen to me, cool. If not, cool. Just be nice to me. I'm very sensitive and bruise easily.
<< <i>Big E....we're cool....you got me good. You and my wife today, KZ6X last week, probably 10 more guys tomorrow.
Clad....I don't know as much about modern coinage as you do. If it's going up in value like you say, good. But that's not what I'm hearing. To be specific, the stuff that isn't doing well is the non-top pop stuff, truckloads of which there is.
There are many guys who are putting together sets of all kinds of stuff....non pop top stuff and once they get done and want to sell it, they can't give it away. That's what I hear. If I'm wrong, I apologize. We could discuss this at length but I will agree with you that knowledge is key and I'm sure that that is true in moderns as well.
Having said that, I like poisonous snakes. I used to own many. Got bit. Finally decided that even though I knew quite a bit about them, it was just not a really good hobby. I moved on to something less risky. I would advise against keeping poisonous snakes. Same thing with moderns.
It's not a snob thing. $69,000 for a Lincoln cent is pretty damn snobby to me. I mean the jeans I'm wearing right now came from Target. I'm really just a redneck but I'd appreciate if you would not repeat that to my wife because so far, the coast has been clear.
You and I can disagree. I'll continue to listen to you. If you want to listen to me, cool. If not, cool. Just be nice to me. I'm very sensitive and bruise easily. >>
I used to keep snakes of all kinds and one of my favorites was a python. It ate
a rat every eight or ten days until "lunch" bit him and he died of the infection.
He was a great snake but had a little tendency to play with his food. We called
him Stretch.
One can lose money on moderns and there are many types which are well off their
highs and may not come back for some time. Even raw moderns have lost up to
20% of their value this year. Commems and unc coins of most denominations are
still doing well. This extends from pop tops down to ChBU. It does exclude some of
the coins which had already run up a great deal.
Alright, lest we totally side line our buddies thread, here's another peeve for you:
Dealers who sit behind their table working on some deal, totally oblivious to you standing in front of your case waiting patiently for some attention. They look up, don't say anything other than "just a minute" and then you wait and wait and wait........
and here's another one....along the same lines...
You go to a guys table...he's not there...you see a monster that you are dying for....you wait, you wait, you leave and come back....you wait....and it's like waiting for the birth of your child! Man! Can't they just leave a piece of paper with their cell phone number on it in their case?
(See...I know what it's like to be on both sides of the case...)
<< <i>I mean the jeans I'm wearing right now came from Target. I'm really just a redneck but I'd appreciate if you would not repeat that to my wife because so far, the coast has been clear. >>
Anaconda,
We don't know each other from "Adam". When I got back into numismatics I saw your stuff on Ebay and thought you were GOD himself. I thought how inspiring...how incredible...this guy is the man!!! I have also met a few people who have circulated Lincoln collections that are EXTREMELY proud of them...and I thought how inspiring...etc.
But some of the puke you throw down in these rooms is deplorable. My father told me once - "never tell people how much money you have because people either have more (and don't care) or have less (and don't care)...so the only thing you can accomplish is alienate a potential friend."
My point is: Your quote I used at the top is just cool!
When you get to know me, I think you'll understand me a little better, and who knows, maybe you'll even get to like me.
But hey, if not, you can join the ranks of folks that don't like me. Most of them quite frankly, don't like a lot of things.
I'm not out to make enemies but I'm also not here to win the approval of people. Cool Morgan by the way. AT or NT?