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Coin not stolen........but lessons were learned!

Last night, in response to a thread (a good one) started by CharlieB, I posted that I had perhaps been ripped off while setting up at the ANA. Well, I found the coin today so I was not ripped off. However, I learned some valuable lessons.....lessons that I think any collector and even some dealers would want to learn so I'll lay out the details so you guys can see what happened.

In typical fashion for dealer setup day, I waited until about the last 30 minutes to begin putting out my material. I prefer to first walk the floor and see what others are offering for sale and possibly get a shot at the material before my fellow buzzards begin dropping from the skies.

It's also my custom to set my coins out from the outside of the table, in other words from the side that the collectors will be viewing them. It's kind of hard to know what the setup looks like if you're looking at it upside down.

I had laid the lid of my case completely open and had already covered about 50% of the display area with coins, starting from the "bottom" up. I had run out of coins and since my case is at a dead end within the booth, I had to walk around to the other end of the table to get more coins. I left the lid open. As I was returning to the case to add more coins, a dealer I didn't recognize walked up and stood before my case looking at my coins. I glanced at him but didn't recognize him and really didn't attempt to get a good look at him.

As I got up along side the fellow, he leaned way over my case, and since the lid was not on it was able to sick his face right up to my coins. I was standing to his left and pretty much looking at the back of his head as he began picking up coins, looking at them and asking prices. Personally, I NEVER stick my hand in another dealer's case without getting his permission. But that didn't stop this guy.

He'd pick up one coin, look at it, and then ask a price. As I was looking at the coin, he'd pick up another and may not put it back where I had originally placed it. Instead, he'd place it on the top row. He did this a couple of times all the while leaning over my wide open case. I'd then reach in and place the coin back where I had it originally. He never looked me right in the face, and I never saw his name tag. Then, almost like a ghost, he was gone without hardly a word.

About that time, a dealer friend of mine walked up and reminded me of a coin I'd promised to show him. I remembered the exact coin as I'd seen it earlier that day and began looking for it both among the coins already out and those still in their boxes. I couldn't find the piece and began to panic. Then it hit me that the fellow that was leaning over my case could easily have grabbed a coin or two with his right hand (shielded by his body) and placed the coins in his pocket while I was giving him a price on a piece. Since the ANA security staff will literally carry you out of the bourse floor at closing time, I could not finish setting up and locate the coin.

Well, I didn't sleep last night worrying not only about that one coin, but wondering how many others might have been stolen.

In retrospect, I should have politely told the dealer not to reach into my case and to please wait until I was finished setting up before looking at and trying to negotiate prices on my material. Once I was finished and seated BEHIND the table, I could have opened the case and removed the coins one at a time for him to examine. This would have given me a chance to look him in the face and also to see his badge.

Unfortunately, there are many stories of dealers getting ripped off by other dealers. But just as with buying coins, it is the owner's responsibilty to not put himself in a position where others can rip him off. Don't try to do deals while setting up. Don't try to do multiple deals at one time. Don't rush during set up, look at the guy you're dealing with, place coins one at a time for examination, and keep track of which ones are missing from your case.

The missing coin? It was in my case all along but in my rushed panic I didn't see it!!! It was my fault and I feel badly that I suspected this fellow who really hadn't stolen a thing.

A lesson learned.

GSAGUY


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Comments

  • TonekillerTonekiller Posts: 1,308 ✭✭
    Glad that it all worked out. I hear you have to be careful whom you share your table with also. image

    TBT
  • StratStrat Posts: 612 ✭✭✭
    A lot happens on setup day, especially at a large show. Find a system of setting up that you're comfortable with and stick to it. I've seen some dealers close and lock cases, except for the one they're working on. While this works, it's a hassle having to wrangle with keys, and other dealers will get impatient. What I try to do is to have my stock boxes prepped in the order that I want displayed, this way the coins go from box to case quickly, so I can take care of any dealer traffic that comes along. Glad you found your coin GSAguy (again!).
  • MorganluverMorganluver Posts: 517 ✭✭✭
    Wow! A very interesting experience and a great lesson learned. Thanks.
  • 1jester1jester Posts: 8,638 ✭✭✭
    Great! A happy ending, and a lesson learned without paying a big price for it.
    Thanks for sharing it with us.


    imageimageimage
    .....GOD
    image

    "Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you." -Luke 11:9

    "Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God is one LORD: And thou shalt love the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy might." -Deut. 6:4-5

    "For the LORD is our judge, the LORD is our lawgiver, the LORD is our king; He will save us." -Isaiah 33:22
  • if you think the lesson learned is not to be so suspicious - WRONG! this industry is rife with ex-cons not to mention the ones that haven't been caught. nothing scarier than a room full of coin dealers.
    image
  • Thanks for sharing that. You had me worried about that
    coin. What you said is a golden rule:

    "Personally, I NEVER stick my hand in another's case without
    asking permission".

    "location, location, location...eye appeal, eye appeal, eye appeal"
    My website
  • Glad it all worked out for you. This is not the only hobby/past time that this type of thing happens with. I also collect old toys. Things got so bad with the "Buzzards", as you call them, that as you were wheeling in your boxes, there having a feeding frenzy litterally unpacking your boxes to cherry pick out the desireable items. Then they have the gall to ask for huge discounts so they can put the item out at their table for a lot more than you even had it pricd at. Things were known to dissapear during these frenzies, and sometime even outright brawls would ensue. It got to the point that rules were changed to prevent this type of activity. Some shows forbid sellers from unpacking ANYTHING until the opening bell. Others allow the dealers to set up then leave the hall. This of course would not be good for coin shows, but its an example. Others have this rule. Strict rules against any buying or selling, even pre-arranged deals, before the opening bell. ALL pre-opening sales are forbidden with the penalty being expulsion. Its worked very well at the toys shows, might be something the coin show sponsors should look into as well.
  • BRdudeBRdude Posts: 1,079 ✭✭✭
    Don't feel bad or guilty GSA, you did what anybody else would have done. So you were mistaken, no loss on your part or his. He was still rude for kind of helping himself when if he were a dealer he should have known you were in a bad spot to keep an eye out. You've done nothing to feel guilty about, and who is to say he WOULDN'T have if given the chance???? Can't be too careful when it's your livelyhoodimageimage
    AKA kokimoki
    the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed
    Join the NRA and protect YOUR right to keep and bear arms
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  • RLinnRLinn Posts: 596
    GSAGUY, <SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman'; mso-fareast-font-family: 'Times New Roman'; mso-ansi-language: EN-US; mso-fareast-language: EN-US; mso-bidi-language: AR-SA">great reminder of proper coin show etiquette.<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>I buy far more than I sell and I think your tale points out how all of us ought to respect another man’s property.<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Failure to do so may explain why some dealers are occasionally less than friendly to the curious general public who are not as versed in proper buyer/seller interactions.<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>It may also explain why some dealers are eager to leave the show early, after most of the hot action has subsided and only walkers and gawkers are left.</SPAN>
    Buy the coin...but be sure to pay for it.
  • gsaguygsaguy Posts: 2,425
    Thanks for the words of encouragement guys. I did feel badly about even having thought the guy had ripped me off when he hadn't. However, after recounting the tale to other dealers, I've heard numerous stories about coins disappearing in transactions between dealers.

    It's ashamed. It's hard enough for some of these guys to earn a living without others stealing their profits. And if you think about it, one decent missing coin can mean the difference between a profitable show and a miserable memory!

    GSAGUY
    image
  • braddickbraddick Posts: 22,990 ✭✭✭✭✭
    gsaguy- You were a total gentleman. You didn't speculate with names. I would have thought it was a theft too, under the same circumstances. I'm just glad you found the coin. I bet it was a great one also! (Of course, I've seen your cases. I can't name one coin that isn't!)

    peacockcoins

  • pocketpiececommemspocketpiececommems Posts: 5,723 ✭✭✭✭✭

    That happens at our garage sale quite often. Someone asked about something and you know that you haven’t sold it. Someone just moved it around. As the saying goes… So if coin you were looking for was a snake it would have bitten you.

  • jmlanzafjmlanzaf Posts: 31,611 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Zombie thread warning...

  • SanctionIISanctionII Posts: 11,660 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I have never considered dealer to dealer theft at coin shows.

    I always view coin show theft as a member of the public (collector or non collector) who attends a coin show being the one who steals coins from dealers or other members of the public while at a show; or as a person who robs a dealer as the dealer leaves a show for the trip home after following him.

    However, after reading this thread it does not surprise me that dealer to dealer theft takes place (human nature being what it is).

  • WAYNEASWAYNEAS Posts: 6,314 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Wisdom comes sometimes at a cost.
    Very happy you did not have to pay a price.
    Wayne

    Kennedys are my quest...

  • vplite99vplite99 Posts: 1,175 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Thanks for sharing. There is a lesson here for all of us.

    Vplite99
  • CryptoCrypto Posts: 3,368 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Pretty sure GSAGUY is no longer with us, this thread is 20 years old

  • JimTylerJimTyler Posts: 3,032 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I was proud of the fact he found one of my color GSA’s worthy for his collection.

  • Coin FinderCoin Finder Posts: 6,944 ✭✭✭✭✭

    rip

  • TreashuntTreashunt Posts: 6,747 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Crypto said:
    Pretty sure GSAGUY is no longer with us, this thread is 20 years old

    agreed: Last Active June 22, 2013 2:35PM

    Frank

    BHNC #203

  • MFeldMFeld Posts: 11,919 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Crypto said:
    Pretty sure GSAGUY is no longer with us, this thread is 20 years old

    That’s correct and he was a great guy.

    Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.

  • logger7logger7 Posts: 8,011 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Dealers can always decline to open their case for potential customers, access to show coins is a privilege not a right.

  • rickoricko Posts: 98,724 ✭✭✭✭✭

    GSAGUY was a knowledgeable and very nice guy. I bought several of my CC Morgans from him many years ago. Cheers, RickO

  • NicNic Posts: 3,340 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @MFeld said:

    @Crypto said:
    Pretty sure GSAGUY is no longer with us, this thread is 20 years old

    That’s correct and he was a great guy.

    +1

  • TONEDDOLLARSTONEDDOLLARS Posts: 2,928 ✭✭✭✭

    My mentor , my friend. RIP

  • BStrauss3BStrauss3 Posts: 3,107 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited May 12, 2022 12:09PM

    Never had the pleasure, but I'm sure I missed out on a great opportunity to learn some things.

    -----Burton
    ANA 50 year/Life Member (now "Emeritus")
  • ConnecticoinConnecticoin Posts: 12,470 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Did GSAGUY pass away? I had not heard of that here or on the OFR.

  • SoCalBigMarkSoCalBigMark Posts: 2,786 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Yes, quite some time ago of cancer I believe. He lived life to the fullest before he passed though.

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