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Zuul says...

.. Posts: 32
edited October 1, 2024 7:17AM in U.S. Coin Forum

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  • JBKJBK Posts: 15,571 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Shouldn't thus be on the BST forum? :*

    I'm not sure what a "punch die break on rim" is, but otherwise does this really constitute a "discovery coin"?

    Sorry for the cynicism - maybe I'm missing something.

  • johnny9434johnny9434 Posts: 28,328 ✭✭✭✭✭

    not interested

  • goodmoney4badmoneygoodmoney4badmoney Posts: 1,234 ✭✭✭✭✭

    The “punch die break” is referring to the blanking operation. The coin is far from a “discovery” though.

  • MFeldMFeld Posts: 13,485 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Welcome to the forum.

    Here's the correct forum to use for buying, selling, promoting, advertising, etc. : https://forums.collectors.com/categories/buy-sell-trade-u-s-coins

    Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.

  • DocBenjaminDocBenjamin Posts: 1,410 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I look at a fair amount of errors and have never seen that designation. Good luck on the auction.

  • JBKJBK Posts: 15,571 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @2lr said:
    Trust me it's a discovery piece first to the market for a punch Die break on rim error I've gone to experts the best it's also been advised that all of stacks and Bowers experts said they have not seen or heard of this error before as well as just like mike byers

    Well, aside from the fact that this is the wrong forum to plug an auction, could you elaborate on the punch die break? I've looked at the photos and I'm not seeing what that could be.

  • WAYNEASWAYNEAS Posts: 6,714 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited September 30, 2024 11:20AM

    Could the die punch error on the rim equate to a planchet clip?
    Wayne

    Kennedys are my quest...

  • .. Posts: 32
    edited September 30, 2024 5:03PM

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    edited September 30, 2024 5:04PM

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  • coinbufcoinbuf Posts: 11,296 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @2lr said:
    No, a punch die break on the rim is different from a clipped planchet error.

    A clipped planchet occurs when the blank (planchet) that the coin is struck on is improperly cut from the metal strip, resulting in a piece of the coin being missing, usually along the edge. It can have various shapes like curved or straight clips.

    A punch die break on the rim, on the other hand, involves a crack or break in the die, causing extra metal to flow into the damaged area during striking, creating a raised or distorted feature along the rim of the coin.

    What you describe here would be a cud, and I do not see a cud on the coin you linked. Like many others I am confused and unsure what the description that NGC used means.

    My Lincoln Registry
    My Collection of Old Holders

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  • jmlanzafjmlanzaf Posts: 34,187 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited September 30, 2024 12:37PM

    @coinbuf said:

    @2lr said:
    No, a punch die break on the rim is different from a clipped planchet error.

    A clipped planchet occurs when the blank (planchet) that the coin is struck on is improperly cut from the metal strip, resulting in a piece of the coin being missing, usually along the edge. It can have various shapes like curved or straight clips.

    A punch die break on the rim, on the other hand, involves a crack or break in the die, causing extra metal to flow into the damaged area during striking, creating a raised or distorted feature along the rim of the coin.

    What you describe here would be a cud, and I do not see a cud on the coin you linked. Like many others I am confused and unsure what the description that NGC used means.

    According to the AI, the punch die break is a break in the punch prior to it being used to place an element on the die. So the "cud" ends up being transferred from punch to die.

    I'm not 100% sure but is it the "F" in AMERICA?

  • MsMorrisineMsMorrisine Posts: 33,069 ✭✭✭✭✭

    not a big deal on the punch die break to me

    it's not a cud, but it is a small extra bit of metal on the rim. so, it generates about the same "wow" as a tiny cud

    Current maintainer of Stone's Master List of Favorite Websites // My BST transactions
  • MsMorrisineMsMorrisine Posts: 33,069 ✭✭✭✭✭

    oh yeah... wrong forum. try the buy sell trade to mention the sale

    Current maintainer of Stone's Master List of Favorite Websites // My BST transactions
  • coinbufcoinbuf Posts: 11,296 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @jmlanzaf said:

    @coinbuf said:

    @2lr said:
    No, a punch die break on the rim is different from a clipped planchet error.

    A clipped planchet occurs when the blank (planchet) that the coin is struck on is improperly cut from the metal strip, resulting in a piece of the coin being missing, usually along the edge. It can have various shapes like curved or straight clips.

    A punch die break on the rim, on the other hand, involves a crack or break in the die, causing extra metal to flow into the damaged area during striking, creating a raised or distorted feature along the rim of the coin.

    What you describe here would be a cud, and I do not see a cud on the coin you linked. Like many others I am confused and unsure what the description that NGC used means.

    According to the AI, the punch die break is a break in the punch prior to it being used to place an element on the die. So the "cud" ends up being transferred from punch to die.

    I'm not 100% sure but is it the "F" in AMERICA?

    Ok thanks that helped me to see what this is.

    My Lincoln Registry
    My Collection of Old Holders

    Never a slave to one plastic brand will I ever be.
  • JBKJBK Posts: 15,571 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I'm envisioning the broken punch die as causing less metal on the planchet. Instead of punching out a round disk, the punch has a void which is not there to punch the strip in that spot.

    But who knows.

  • .. Posts: 32
    edited September 30, 2024 5:05PM

    ZZZzzz

  • jacrispiesjacrispies Posts: 927 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Yes, this is what the punch die break is referring to. Not a significant characteristic but I've never seen one.

    @coinbuf said:
    Ok thanks that helped me to see what this is.

    "But seek ye first the kingdom of God and His righteousness and all these things shall be added unto you" Matthew 6:33. Young fellow suffering from Bust Half fever.
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  • coinbufcoinbuf Posts: 11,296 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @jacrispies said:
    Yes, this is what the punch die break is referring to. Not a significant characteristic but I've never seen one.

    I had never seen (or heard of) this either, my new thing learned for the day.

    My Lincoln Registry
    My Collection of Old Holders

    Never a slave to one plastic brand will I ever be.
  • JBKJBK Posts: 15,571 ✭✭✭✭✭

    If that's what it is then it's safe to say it's a non-issue if the coin is struck properly. The spread of the coin during striking would presumably eliminate that.

  • MsMorrisineMsMorrisine Posts: 33,069 ✭✭✭✭✭

    well, maybe as a more unheard of error someone will pay more for it

    Current maintainer of Stone's Master List of Favorite Websites // My BST transactions
  • MWallaceMWallace Posts: 4,095 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @coinbuf said:

    @jmlanzaf said:

    @coinbuf said:

    @2lr said:
    No, a punch die break on the rim is different from a clipped planchet error.

    A clipped planchet occurs when the blank (planchet) that the coin is struck on is improperly cut from the metal strip, resulting in a piece of the coin being missing, usually along the edge. It can have various shapes like curved or straight clips.

    A punch die break on the rim, on the other hand, involves a crack or break in the die, causing extra metal to flow into the damaged area during striking, creating a raised or distorted feature along the rim of the coin.

    What you describe here would be a cud, and I do not see a cud on the coin you linked. Like many others I am confused and unsure what the description that NGC used means.

    According to the AI, the punch die break is a break in the punch prior to it being used to place an element on the die. So the "cud" ends up being transferred from punch to die.

    I'm not 100% sure but is it the "F" in AMERICA?

    Ok thanks that helped me to see what this is.

    The area you marked is what I was thinking too. A blanking punch is much like a die without a design. I've never heard of this error before but if the punch has a piece out like a cud on a regular die, I could see it happening. One would probably have to see this piece in hand and the edge to understand it. I think it's a legit error. I have never heard of one nor thought of it happening, but I can envision it. Every blank produced with this particular punch would have the "cud" obliterated when the coin is struck. This one just happened to be on an off center struck coin.

    Here's a Cent blank punch that's in my collection.

  • MWallaceMWallace Posts: 4,095 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Here's a close-up of a photo from NGC's certification page. It shows the error better.

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    edited September 30, 2024 5:06PM

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    edited September 30, 2024 5:06PM

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    edited September 30, 2024 5:07PM

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    edited September 30, 2024 5:07PM

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    edited September 30, 2024 5:07PM

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  • JBKJBK Posts: 15,571 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited September 30, 2024 1:51PM

    @2lr said:
    It involves half of the coin

    ???

    Then half the planchet should be missing.

    Do tell. Something is definitely getting lost I'm translation here.

  • MWallaceMWallace Posts: 4,095 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @2lr said:
    Never mind i already know about it so it doesn't matter!

    What is your connection to the coin? Yours? A friends? Or??

  • DocBenjaminDocBenjamin Posts: 1,410 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited September 30, 2024 1:46PM

    @MsMorrisine said:
    oh yeah... wrong forum. try the buy sell trade to mention the sale

    Disagree. This is an interesting topic. Would have gotten lost in the BST.

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    edited September 30, 2024 5:08PM

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    edited September 30, 2024 5:09PM

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  • JBKJBK Posts: 15,571 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @2lr said:
    So if you turn it on its side where the upper far left is at it has interesting lip where the rim is at I believe. The die came down and at the same time both errors happened i believe in the same spot the punch is involves all off jefferson head and it pushed the metal outword and created the the lip I wish I had pic of the side but I don't!

    Not possible. The punch die creates the planchet, and the regular dies strike the coin (off-center, in this case).

  • .. Posts: 32
    edited September 30, 2024 5:10PM

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  • MFeldMFeld Posts: 13,485 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @DocBenjamin said:

    @MsMorrisine said:
    oh yeah... wrong forum. try the buy sell trade to mention the sale

    Disagree. This is an interesting topic. Would have gotten lost in the BST.

    An interesting topic doesn't negate the spam of the thread title : "I wanted to share and advertise this discovery coin for error people it's at cco auctions right now!" or the first post, the entirety of which was a link to the auction listing.

    Interesting information can be posted without spamming the forum.

    Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.

  • JBKJBK Posts: 15,571 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @DocBenjamin said:

    @MsMorrisine said:
    oh yeah... wrong forum. try the buy sell trade to mention the sale

    Disagree. This is an interesting topic. Would have gotten lost in the BST.

    We made it interesting. The first post was just an advertisement. :)

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    edited September 30, 2024 5:11PM

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    edited September 30, 2024 5:11PM

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  • DocBenjaminDocBenjamin Posts: 1,410 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @MFeld said:

    @DocBenjamin said:

    @MsMorrisine said:
    oh yeah... wrong forum. try the buy sell trade to mention the sale

    Disagree. This is an interesting topic. Would have gotten lost in the BST.

    An interesting topic doesn't negate the spam of the thread title : "I wanted to share and advertise this discovery coin for error people it's at cco auctions right now!" or the first post, the entirety of which was a link to the auction listing.

    Interesting information can be posted without spamming the forum.

    Unless it is a rare 1933 $20.

  • JBKJBK Posts: 15,571 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited September 30, 2024 2:26PM

    @P0CKETCHANGE said:

    @2lr said:
    The "punch die break on rim" indicates a crack or break in the die that caused a flaw on the coin's rim, further adding to its uniqueness. These factors—substantial off-centering and die breaks—make it a major error because they deviate significantly from the intended design, leading to rarity and increased collector interest. Very interesting

    You’ve convinced me. Just placed $10k bid.

    Talk is cheap unless other people are going to bid you up to your limit.

    I just placed a $9,999.99 bid. I guess you win! :D

  • goldengolden Posts: 9,598 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Oy Vey!

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    edited September 30, 2024 5:12PM

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This discussion has been closed.