After the passing of Willie May's, who is the greatest living player now?
frankhardy
Posts: 8,098 ✭✭✭✭✭
Who is the greatest living player now that Willie Mays has passed away?
My vote is Albert Pujols. I know that most will say I am biased, but the impact, 3 MVPs (that should have been at least 5), 2 World Series Championships, and the numbers speak very loud!
There are only two players in history with over 600 home runs, 600 doubles, and 3000 hits.... and both guys actually hit over 700 home runs. Those two players are Hank Aaron and Albert Pujols.
He is 2nd all time in RBIs.
He is 4th all time in HR.
He is 2nd all time in total bases.
He is 9th all time in hits.
He is 1st in hitting a HR off of different pitchers.
I could go on. His WAR is over 101. Even though there are a few living players with more WAR, his playing 1st base and DH hurt him in that category a little more.
What say you?
Shane
Comments
Barry Bonds
Michael Jack Schmidt
Grew up in Philadelphia area in 70s, so I am biased.
That said, he led MLB in HRs 8 times with the least benefit from expansion and the largest ballparks in the era post 1950.
Edit - and not for nothing, his fancy stats are right up there, particularly his 162 game averages.
Anecdotally, I recall him hitting a crapload of warning track outs in all of those big multipurpose stadiums. His SF totals are really high compared to most of his contemporaries. I would think that may indicate a high correlation. (In other words, had he played in stadiums from 1950-1968 or 1993 to today, some of those warning track outs would have been homeruns, perhaps 5 to 10 per year.)
Nolan Ryan
Enjoy the go.
Four people and four answers - thinking there may not be one anymore.
When MLB put out their official list in ‘04 in was Aaron, Bench, Koufax, Mays
Bench and Koufax are only ones left
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Bonds Rose Ryan AROD Clemens. These 5 alone are better than 99% of the current HOFers. And in just about all cases it's not even close.
I asked Reggie Jackson who it should be and he said "Me".
Enjoy the go.
If we go by WAR it is easily Bonds. If you want to avoid the for sure PED players it is Henderson. There will be no consensus - Willie was great enough that both the don’t care about PEDs crowd and the sanctity of baseball crowd could agree.
Ohtani will have to recover from surgery and dominate as a pitcher for a decade to have a chance at a consensus.
As a Pujols proponent I can agree that if you simply go by the numbers it's Barry Bonds and it's not close. However, he is tainted. So is Clemens.
As great as Johnny Bench was there is no way that he was a better all-time great than Albert Pujols. Same amount of championships. Pujols has one more MVP. And the rest of the numbers speak for themselves.
Shane
Pujols, Bonds or Henderson. I wouldn't be mad at either of those.
Koufax, Ryan, and yes Rose and Reggie.
Sadaharu Oh.
Kiss me twice.....let's party.
1) Bonds, 2) Pujols, 3) Clemens, 4) Arod, 5) Maddux, 6) Henderson, 7) Griffey, Jr., 8) Randy Johnson, 9) Ryan, 10) Schmidt.
Juice or not, these are the best living players in order. All of their numbers pre-juice even stand up against the all-time greats. Greenies were prolific in the 70s and 80s. PEDs were prolific in the 90s and 00s. True of the talent they faced as well as a few of them toward the later half of their careers. Regardless, these giants stood apart from everyone else…even the other All-Stars of their eras.
Position Player by Age: Pete Rose
Pitcher by Age: Sandy Koufax
I would tend to answer this question as "who is the greatest living legend," referring to old-timers. Like if we applied eras like they do to comic books, the Bonds, Pujols, Clemens are all modern guys. Who is the greatest silver or bronze-age players left? Like mentioned before, the Rose, Koufax, Bench, Schmidt, Yastrzemski group would be where I point toward. I would probably lean Koufax, but there's an argument for all of these guys.
You got all those pitchers ahead of Nolan Ryan and no Koufax?
Great question and because there's no clear answer (as the responses in this thread demonstrate) it'll be argued about for some time. As great as Bonds was it's hard to say the greatest living player is a guy who never won a ring. And that's not even accounting for the "other" reasons one might exclude him, ARod & Clemens. In addition, I love great pitching but in my mind the greatest living player has to have contributed offensively. Might be odd to some but that's the way I feel. So in light of all that my answer is...Pujols.
Yaz is like Frank Robinson to me. One of the greatest players of all time but his card prices just don't seem to reflect that. So undervalued based on his career but I guess collectors just don't feel enough love for him.
Yaz is clearly the one!
(Kidding, everybody knows my bias).
Yaz Master Set
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Also collecting Andre Tippett, Patriots Greats' RCs, Dwight Evans, 1964 Venezuelan Topps, 1974 Topps Red Sox
Bob Uecker, of course!
Ken Griffey Jr. Almost as good a hitter as Pujols, but was a great center fielder.
Speaking for myself. If I have to think about it too hard, then there is no choice for me. Would of been an automatic selection without much thought. But I 'm a vintage thinker.
Mariano Rivera. Most dominant at his position.
Pete Rose he is the MLB hit king and has multiple World Series rings. He played hard EVERY game he ever played.
Hobby darlings division: Sandy Koufax, Ken Griffey Jr., Johnny Bench, George Brett, Derek Jeter, Nolan Ryan, Reggie Jackson
Non-steroids division: Mike Schmidt, Ichiro, Rickey Henderson, Albert Pujols, Greg Maddux, Mike Trout, Randy Johnson
Juiced and banned division: Barry Bonds, Roger Clemens, Alex Rodriguez, Pete Rose
Never in a million years division: Harold Baines
He's a .303 lifetime hitter with no power, lots of guys played just as hard.
The nickname "Charlie Hustle" was not a compliment. Mickey Mantle said about Rose; "If I hit like that, I'd wear a dress."
Using your logic. Paul Krause was the greatest free safety in the history of the NFL.
In my opinion the greatest player was Griffey Jr., although his career numbers suffered some because of injuries. If PED players are included then it is easily Bonds. I prefer guys who could hit, field and run (at least in their prime).
It’s funny that the greatest living pitcher hasn’t even been mentioned but Nolan Ryan has been several times.
Pedro Martinez is the greatest living pitcher and it’s probably not particularly close who is second, Randy Johnson maybe?
I would actually put Kershaw second, Randy third.
Nolan or Randy Johnson, I’d say
Andre Dawson. 100% biased.
Good moderator work there.
I had to look around to see if there were cameras and to see if John Quiñones was lurking!
Three way tie; Joe Mauer, Kent Hrbek and Gary Gaetti.
You are insane! Of course it was a compliment. Pete went all out on every play. Mickey was one of the rare players that was just more gifted than others so he made it look easy. Most players like that cannot understand why other players struggle with certain things that they find easy. MJ was similar, he had a hard time understanding why other players couldn't do certain things as easy he could.
BTW it's easy to rule out longevity but it should be factored in. Rickey would not have the same stats without the extra 5 seasons but he stayed in great shape and added 671 more total bases. Pete added 800 more total bases in his extra 5 seasons because he also stayed in great shape.
I am sorry your Father never recovered from getting run over in the All Star game!
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I do remember a Rose interview when he said that his greatest athletic gift was a durable body like his father's.
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Everything I stated was a fact.
Pete is simply the most over rated player in MLB history.
Top 100 player, probably not in the top 50 though.
Poor Ray Fosse! I agree 100% with your commentary regarding Rose and Henderson.
On a side note, about The Mick - I have a taped interview in my archives when he was asked about Jose Canseco's accomplishment of being the first member of the 40-40 club. Mantle laughs and says, "If I knew it was going to be such a big deal, I would have done it every year." He was probably a little tipsy, but I believe him! LOL
ESPN did the top 100 at the end of 1999. It was a well done series and highly recommended if you are a fan of all sports. Their analysis took in the entire impact of the players career on the sport and society.
Willie was 8th on the list. The highest ranked living full time baseball player is Koufax at 42. Pete Rose is next at 56. The rest have passed.
I would probably choose another player that played longer but I could live with Koufax wearing the crown
Agreed, but they will not get the credit they deserve until after most of the current voters have died off.
I was shocked when Ortiz was voted in on his first try! That should breathe some life into their chance to be voted in.
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That must have been all sports, not just baseball.
Koufax had 4 great years. He's up there with Rose in the over-rated category.
I would agree with that.
all three of those pitchers were better than ryan. it probably isnt particularly close either.
George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.
Pedro was as good as I have ever seen. and I watched his entire red sox career. My issue with having him as the greatest living pitcher is that he didnt sustain for long enough. If memory serves, his duration of dominance was from 1997-2002 or so. For those years, there has never been anyone better. he just burned out to fast.
Give me Roger for greatest living pitcher. nearly as high of a peak, but MUCH more sustained.
George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.
people get all bent out of shape about comments like this, but you are correct. Koufax was fantastic. for about 5 years.
Rose was very good, not great for 15-20 years. both overrated.
George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.
There is only one real answer to this question. It has to be Barry Bonds. In fact, he was probably the correct answer last Thursday as well. Bonds did stuff at the plate only a couple of other guys could do. and both of those guys have been dead for decades.
George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.
I would disagree with Koufax being overrated.
I'm going to side with Hank Aaron and Joe Morgan on that one... When I listen to some of the greatest hitters in MLB history sit around and talk about how dominant Koufax I think that says everything.
I don't have Nolan Ryan in my top 10, but I think his greatness is being overlooked a bit. He played on some pretty mediocre teams for the majority of his career. He was in the midst of his worst year in MLB when his arm finally fell apart... and he just walked off the mound, back to his ranch, and off to Cooperstown. But the guy also had WHIP of like 1.05 for 3 of his last 5 years when he was 40+. His strikeout total is the product of accumulation... sure, but he also led the league in SO/9 half his career. There may never be another Nolan Ryan. Plus I put him up there with Gibson and Pedro as one of the most intimidating pitchers all time.
Except that the people who would put an asterisk for the PEDs would say his sustained performance was aided. His age 30 to 33 years have the appearance of a pitcher whose abilities were starting to taper, but then a renaissance occurs after that. You don't see that with Pedro - he seems to taper off more naturally. Between the two, I would much rather have Pedro pitching in a critical spot, which for me, makes him better than Clemens. That's just me, though.
Bonds is disqualified because of PEDs….cheaters should not be recognized because they chose to gain an unfair, illegal advantage. Bonds sucks!
I don't want to open up another discussion about Ryan, but > @JoeBanzai said:
trout is over rated not rose. bonds and rose records will never be broken. and they surpassed all the 1880's stars with all their bogus stats. cy young threw 70 mph fast balls and holds a lot records because they were playing pick up games.
but koufax is overrated, mattingly = koufax.