What do you do when you “hit the wall” - when upgrading starts to become cost-probitive?
jmski52
Posts: 22,987 ✭✭✭✭✭
I think I’m getting close to that moment with my favorite Modern series. I just upgraded 3 coins in my favorite set and as I look around, all of my potential next upgrades are getting “up there” in cost.
Part of the enjoyment for me has always been “the chase”. Does it make sense to hang in there and only make selected purchases every couple years or so? What do other collectors do?
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Everyone is different but I try not to buy coins with the intention of upgrading down the road. The auction houses or dealers are typically the winners at my expense.
When it happened to me I sold over 99% of what I had, with no regrets at all many years later. Now I collect and hunt for paper currency.
Any questions?
Disclaimer: I'm not a dealer, trader, grader, investor or professional numismatist. I'm just a hobbyist. (To protect me but mostly you! 🤣 )
Downgrade?
Start another set.
I am at that point w/ my US type set. Anyone tried filling in those 1793 copper slots? Yikes
If you have the patience you can save up and upgrade on a longer-term basis. Otherwise, I would just keep the set and enjoy it, while beginning a different set.
Sometimes, it’s better to be LUCKY than good. 🍀 🍺👍
My Full Walker Registry Set (1916-1947):
https://www.ngccoin.com/registry/competitive-sets/16292/
I like the chase, too. Although, as a collector, I died in 2009.
At the time, I thought buying a coin shop was upgrading. Boy, was I wrong.
That's an interesting perspective. I thought that becoming a dealer may get one better deals, even coins that are not on the market.
Start another collection. I recently completed my circulated 19th century type set, no gold and all the old gold ones are cost prohibitive to purchase at the rate I bought the others. So I’m working on the 20th century type coins, but in circulated the match the 19th century ones and they are much cheaper but also hard to locate in circulated grades for the newer ones, so to keep myself occupied I started a mint state R1 and R2 Patriotic Civil War Token set. The Mint State Civil War Tokens are much more affordable and are fun to collect so keeps me happy in terms of being able to work on a new set.
Mr_Spud
First World Problems
Empty Nest Collection
Matt’s Mattes
I stop upgrading.
I try to buy the “ultimate coin” in the first place. I have a few U.S. coins I would like to upgrade, but they are very scarce, like the 1796/5 half dime. I have the poorest example graded, a VG. But the population is about 50 pieces. The best ones are Mint State, which are beyond my financial reach. Middle grade pieces, like VF and EF are very scarce.
British coins are another matter. High grade hammered coins are quite scarce. When I run into one for a king or queen that I have in the lower grades, I jump on it. They are usually a couple to a few thousand, not tens or hundreds of thousands.
I am closing in on a top pop set, but it will take some deep digging or a lucky break to acquire the last two pieces.
BST transactions: dbldie55, jayPem, 78saen, UltraHighRelief, nibanny, liefgold, FallGuy, lkeigwin, mbogoman, Sandman70gt, keets, joeykoins, ianrussell (@GC), EagleEye, ThePennyLady, GRANDAM, Ilikecolor, Gluggo, okiedude, Voyageur, LJenkins11, fastfreddie, ms70, pursuitofliberty, ZoidMeister,Coin Finder, GotTheBug, edwardjulio, Coinnmore, Nickpatton, Namvet69,...
There's really only 2 answers to this for the primary collection:
For most it's easier to stop collecting than increase budget.
The fallbacks are:
if it is a modern series, you could change your search to raw coins for your submission for upgrades.
You could just walk away for a while. It’s not like you won’t come back.It’ll give you time to zoom out and get some perspective.
Or… you could sell everything and start over. Been down both these roads, and they both worked out fine.
Empty Nest Collection
Matt’s Mattes
The last time this happened to me, I took a really critical look at my set and pulled out all the coins in the set that I wasn’t 100% happy with or thought I would want to upgrade in the future. I sold them all which helped raise funds for a couple selective upgrades. The others will take time.
For now, I’ve set the series aside to complete when my hobby financial situation and priorities shift.
Personally, I'm really happy with ALL of my Walkers. They are 99% mint state. Sure, there are MANY slots that I could potentially upgrade. But for me, it just makes more sense to put that money, into other series, rather than spending thousands upgrading coins that I am already happy with. But you must do you....
Sometimes, it’s better to be LUCKY than good. 🍀 🍺👍
My Full Walker Registry Set (1916-1947):
https://www.ngccoin.com/registry/competitive-sets/16292/
Financially, I'd never try to complete a set where the next grade up from where I collect sells at a multiple. I don't have that option for what I collect, as the coins don't have this availability anyway. I've bought practically all of the more available dates already and what's left, will buy any decent coin at an acceptable price to me as it becomes available.
I recognize my budget only supports so much and enjoy as is.
Start running toward a different wall.
Keeper of the VAM Catalog • Professional Coin Imaging • Prime Number Set • World Coins in Early America • British Trade Dollars • Variety Attribution
Figure out why you collect. The answer lies therein.
Start a new set.
I understand. I'm getting to that point with all of my sets. There are still a very few upgrades, maybe 10, I'd to make, & might be able to afford over the next 5 years, but they are all big money, maybe once or twice a year acquisitions. As the new purchases seem to be less seldom, interest seems to wane somewhat also. All that being said, I would have never believed in a million years I would have the sets I have today!
Wayne
www.waynedriskillminiatures.com
I’ve never liked set building as it has set boundaries. Broaden out into defining your own set which can be a group of “collections of one” or just coins to like.
Latin American Collection
Start another set or the boredom will set in. Maybe try something completely different like banknotes with artwork you enjoy on them.
NFL: Buffalo Bills & Green Bay Packers
That is exactly what I did.
I actually started 8 more sets. I used the tab in the registry at the top "Start a Set" and it searches through your current inventory to pick sets that you have coins for. I was more then 75% complete in the new sets I started.
Now I have something to do while waiting for my "tough to find coins"
Mike
My Indians
Danco Set
I stop upgrading.
A Man's got to know his limitations.
This is if you just can't imagine collecting any other coin series. That happens but there are options. Buy a wall display case and place these banknotes inside so you can enjoy viewing them daily it helps a lot!!!
NFL: Buffalo Bills & Green Bay Packers
Yes , sometimes it does. Yet as a dealer , you have to think it through. Ask yourself ( if you’re a dealer) : “ Am I dealing to acquire for me, or to provide a service to customers ?
That's a timely question for me; I'll tell you what I'm doing.
I started collecting when I was a kid in the early 1960s, out of change. I collected Lincoln cents, buffalo nickels, Jefferson nickels, Mercury dimes, Roosevelt dimes, standing Liberty quarters, Washington quarters, walking Liberty half dollars (the Whitman folder was called "Liberty Standing Half Dollars") and JFK half dollars; all in Whitman folders.
I stopped actively collecting when I got a ways into high school, and didn't take it up again until advanced adulthood. Then I added Morgan dollars and peace dollars to the collections.
When I recommenced, I just hauled out the old Whitman folders, and commenced filling them. I still had the same mentality of not being particular about the quality of the coin, just that it was filled.
Eventually, I realized that I like less-worn coins more than more-worn coins. So I started upgrading. But I was unwilling to spend huge bucks on a coin, so the initial upgrades were modest.
But I realized that I could get later coins of the Mercury dimes, SLQs and WLHDs for relatively modest amounts, and that they were gorgeous in the high AU or (just about any) MS grades.
Which eventually resulted in another band of upgrades, attempting to rid my collections of any ugly coins.
Which ratcheted me to spending very large (for me) sums on a number of coins. Which resulted in attempting to get all the coins of all the collections in as high a grade as I could reasonably afford.
I'm starting to close in on that goal. And, yes, I do expect that that will be the end of wholesale upgrades.
So I started pondering the question in the original post.
My answer, for me, is in two parts: (i) I started a "box of 20" collection of 20 randomly-chosen coins that I find very interesting, and (ii) over an extended period of time, I'll look into upgrading some of my key- and semi-key-dates of my present collections (e.g., I don't like my VF35 1914-D Lincoln cent, so I'll look to get a much nicer one; there are others like that, like the VF20 1927-S SLQ). This will keep me engaged in this hobby I so enjoy, but will back me off from the somewhat compulsive way I have been going after the upgrades I've been doing so far.
Budget issues aside, would you be comfortable paying what it would take to upgrade the coins? If so, I'd encourage you to stick with the program and be patient. If the answer is no, it's probably time to move on.
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.
I have Registry Sets for proof and SMS sets from 1939 to 1970. They are mostly made up of raw coins I cherry picked since returning to the hobby as an adult in 1998.
I started submitting coins for grading in 2021. I have been upgrading the sets from time to time with self made upgrades and slabbed upgrades.
I think that further upgrades will mostly come from purchases of slabbed coins.
Many of them in grades of PF68 and PF69 CAM or even DCAM (especially minors from 1960 to 1970 are inexpensive). Similarly Cameo examples of the 1965 - 1967 SMS coins in grades of SP67 are also inexpensive.
I’m guilty of endlessly, looking at my place in the registry as far as rankings instead of actually spending time with the actual coins.
As long as you buy coins you like I think you’ll be happy.
I have SOOO much time invested in my Mercury dime set, I just hang on to it and when something of an upgrade comes along, I try to pick one up. This way I have NO pressure to upgrade, just when one comes along that I like and can afford!
I started out collecting middle and late date large cents, and joined Early American Coppers. I was doing one-per-date, and thought it was kinda nutty for some in EAC to seek all the die marriages. Nevertheless, I bought the Wright and Grellman guide books and happily attributed my coins. When I neared completion of that one-per-date goal, I started on another series - Liberty Seated Half Dimes. As that one-per-issue registry set neared completion (sans 1870-S, of course), I pondered the present question. Rather than pursue expensive upgrades or start another series (most of which would be harder to complete), I went nuts...
For several years, I've been pursuing Liberty Seated Half Dime die marriages and die states. It's a lot of coins, so the quality/price per coin has had to be lower. But for some, seeing the distinguishing features requires minimal wear. What makes this fun is that there isn't yet a good comprehensive guide to the die pairs and states in this series, so it is not uncommon to find previously undocumented things and improve documentation of those previously identified.
Collector of Liberty Seated Half Dimes, including die pairs and die states
I keep hitting the wall, most of what I want is no longer a 2-3 paycheck wait it’s sometimes 2-3 months. I read, I pick up minor upgrades to my circulated sets and I sell what I upgrade (mostly). In some cases, I purchase Raw and had the coins graded myself, sometimes I did good others the grade came in below what I expected. This hobby is so vast that there are many low cost ways to keep on collecting.
My current registry sets:
20th Century Type Set
Virtual DANSCO 7070
Slabbed IHC set - Missing the Anacs Slabbed coins
When I hit the wall with my Indian and flying eagle sets, I started adding the top 20 varieties.
After that, started adding Indian/FE patterns.
After that, started adding CWT's struck over IHC/FE cents.
After that, I quit and sold!
For coins - That happened for me a long time ago. Apply those funds elsewhere - Inventory, etc. My focus on keeping investment at plan, Opex lean and mean.
I do send in currency to be graded now and then. Banked big time on some raw CSA / Obsoletes had graded. Usually - Have largest inventory of graded currency at shows. Many of my graded notes top pop or single digit pop. Find something you enjoy that works for you / what the other guy does may not be for you.
I buy a nice coin for the grade, set it and forget it. If I've held a coin for many years and want to sell it, I will see if I can get an upgrade beforehand.
I have been collecting for over 50 years off and on, and have never and will never buy a coin with the idea of selling it later for an upgrade. As someone wrote above, the auction houses and dealers thank you for this. You're losing at least a 10% spread on every transaction. It adds up quickly. No thank you.
I think there is a difference between coins you bought with the intention to keep and coins that are space holders. I have 3 space holders in my Late Date LC set...1841, 1844 and 1845. These coins were under $80 each. The 1844 is VF30 in an OGH...the 1841 is VG8 with a TrueView and the 1845 is VF35. To be honest I like all 3 and am looking for an MS62 or MS63 for the upgrade. I the meantime I like to add Newcomb varieties to my overall collection. I am trying to remain focused....my 14 Commemorative halves in old holders stare at me as a reminder of what happens when I lose focus.
Go lowball! A real challenge for moderns.
Many of us who have been at this a while have hit a wall more than once because of resources, availability or boredom. Numismatics and historical collectibles present virtually unlimited areas of collecting. For myself I’ve gone into colonials, foreign that circulated in the US, tokens, medals, currency, and political Americana. I’ve added date sets for 1857 and 1873 coinage acts, 1876 centennial, family birth years, proof sets for transitional years like 1883, 1859, 1909. And that’s just US-related. I could go on but the idea is if one hits a wall, go around it. Lots to learn out there.
My experience (initially) was a lot like 124Spider's.
I also started collecting from change when I was a kid in the early 1960s - - starting with filling holes in blue Whitman folders while I was spread out on the living room floor of my Grandparents' house. I started with the affordable Lincoln cents, Jefferson nickels, & then Roosevelt dimes initially.
Over time, as my allowance would cover it, or as folders became available at the local coin shop or flea market, I expanded into IHC's, Buffalo nickels, Mercury dimes, Washington quarters, and JFK halves.
I wasn't aware enough at the time to grab up as much silver as I could and didn't expand into Liberty or Franklin halves or Peace/Morgan dollars until much much later. And I never really established a foothold in Barbers at all or SLQ's at all. I regret that the most, as (with the exception of Barbers) those are some of my most favorite designs/series.
I did gather a decent amount of IHC's, wheaties, silver coins, and silver certificates while working as a retail manager and cashing-out drawers, but they usually went either right into filling holes in folders or trading for dates I needed,
When the internet exploded, I found new life with eBay and trading partners on this Forum, and grew my collection further.
I also expanded into more and more blue Whitman folders (especially Darkside ones I'd find for $1 each at the local coin shop).
But my focus was always on filling holes and sticking with the blue Whitman folders, which kept me grounded & in touch with my start at the feet of my Grandparents with their encouragement. The coins in their raw state made me feel like I was holding pieces of history in my hands, with coins that would never be made again. And it's that which I want to pass on to my kids. They'll never be wealthy in a monetary sense, but hopefully with memories of their own.
Since I was always looking to FILL holes, and always came into collecting with the mindset that I had more urgent things to put my money towards other than buying the key or semi-key dates in any series, I always resigned myself to the fact that I would hardly ever complete any series I started.
So MY wall that I have hit is not that I have COMPLETED/UPGRADED any/all of my series, but that I NEVER will, and have instead completed all except those out-of-reach keys & semi-keys. I can't remember the last time I found an addition to fill any holes other than just keeping up with current yearly circulating issues. It's been quite a while. In the past, I have had slow spells that I came back from by expanding into new horizons with a new folder or series (lightside & darkside), but now I'm at the age where, rather than expand, I am trying to figure out in my mind my best way to pass what I already have to my kids......
--Dave
Seeing your cool ragged 10c image I always guessed you were an error coin specialist.
What do you collect that requires upgrades for sets ?
Time to enjoy what I have and wait. Always nice to pull out the albums and admire the sets. The market was been on a big uptick for several years now and although I have selectively upgraded several in the past 2 years, I am in no rush to jump on something because it upgrades my set, even if it looks like a perfect fit. I have 3 sets, Morgans, Peace and WLH and at this time in my life not starting anything new. Done the Washies & Franklins and had 50+% of the Seated Half set early on collecting, but finished with anything new.
This, to much is never enough 😜
I try to buy the right coin the first time, occasionally, I will upgrade some, but I usually try not to do that… I collect enough different stuff that it’s really not an issue for me…
My YouTube Channel
Hang in there, try a fun set in circulated grades which can be just as, or more, challenging. I have 1795 half dollars complete O.101 to O.131, it took 25 years and I am not about to sell. Lots of other interesting coins and medals to keep an interest for a lifetime.