@rte592 said:
When the mint first thought this up, you know someone in the group suggested to turn the blank planchet upside down on those 200
I hope some coin Sleuth finds a minute difference between the standard coin and the Directors coin someday that settles this. Would be great in my opinion. I hope I have one in my box when I submit my 3
@rte592 said:
When the mint first thought this up, you know someone in the group suggested to turn the blank planchet upside down on those 200
I hope some coin Sleuth finds a minute difference between the standard coin and the Directors coin someday that settles this. Would be great in my opinion. I hope I have one in my box when I submit my 3
If I'm not mistaken, mint said no difference only that she pressed the button for the first 200.
"When the rule of law collapses, civilization can no longer survive." - Martin Armstrong
Not sure how that submitter knew he/she had the Director's Strike COA. PCGS must have alerted that submitter.
or PCGS automatically upgraded the label.
You're saying they saw the special COA and just upgraded the submission? They would have to alert the submitter because of the $25 up charge(Big Deal in this case). Am I not correct?
@rte592 said:
When the mint first thought this up, you know someone in the group suggested to turn the blank planchet upside down on those 200
I hope some coin Sleuth finds a minute difference between the standard coin and the Directors coin someday that settles this. Would be great in my opinion. I hope I have one in my box when I submit my 3
If I'm not mistaken, mint said no difference only that she pressed the button for the first 200.
I imagine the ceremonial striking went something like this:
Operator: "Ma'am, we've set the press to do a run of 200. Just press this button to start."
Director: "This button?"
Operator: "No, ma'am, this button."
Director: "Like this?"
Operator: "Yes. ... You can let go now."
Another golden opportunity blown by the mint to make one of the dies special -- even just a dot somewhere to make the coin identifiable when separated from the card.
@Goldbully said: A better approach would have been to make each of the 200 coins distinctive. The Mint could have struck the coins from an obverse or reverse die bearing a privy mark. The coins could have been struck from a special collar, one that was plain rather than reeded, or from a collar with a gap in the reeding like that found on recent American Eagle coins, both bullion and numismatic issues. Each coin’s edition number, from 1 to 200, could have been engraved into the edge gap. Such coins, like 2019 and 2020 America the Beautiful quarter dollars with privy marks and the W Mint mark, and special coins distributed with various annual sets, are popular with collectors today. Something, anything, could have made the 2023 Peace dollars even more special.
I
@derryb said:
guesses for first documented sale of certified MS70 director label?
I'll start with $8500
Be interesting to know if anyone with an order of three or less Peace dollars found the Director Cert in the box or did mint just stick one in larger orders only?
Here’s a FDOI one. I’m surprised GC didn’t take pictures of the signed coa to show everything in the auction:
@derryb said:
guesses for first documented sale of certified MS70 director label?
I'll start with $8500
Be interesting to know if anyone with an order of three or less Peace dollars found the Director Cert in the box or did mint just stick one in larger orders only?
Here’s a FDOI one. I’m surprised GC didn’t take pictures of the signed coa to show everything in the auction:
@derryb said:
guesses for first documented sale of certified MS70 director label?
I'll start with $8500
Be interesting to know if anyone with an order of three or less Peace dollars found the Director Cert in the box or did mint just stick one in larger orders only?
Here’s a FDOI one. I’m surprised GC didn’t take pictures of the signed coa to show everything in the auction:
I do feel like the mint lost an opportunity here to differentiate these 200 coins other than an accompanying COA. Only a fraction of these 200 will be eligible for their provenance to be included in 3rd party grading.
@jerseycat101 said:
I do feel like the mint lost an opportunity here to differentiate these 200 coins other than an accompanying COA. Only a fraction of these 200 will be eligible for their provenance to be included in 3rd party grading.
Making only 200 coins different would have caused such extreme competitive pricing to complete a modern registry set it would be extremely unfair to 99.99% of collectors of these coins. The 1,945-mintage gold privy eagle is already selling very high at over $20,000.
People are already paying a lot for the special labelled box and the Mint Director's signature, even if they are not certified, but at least the coins are the same variety.
I can see putting a simple tamper-proof seal on the box with the signature card inside, and then all could be certified by the grading companies if sent in unopened. That does not require a special die and minting an over-the-top modern coin rarity on purpose.
Maybe PCGS should start labeling 1'st Graded and number them up to 200. Since no one knows which coins were struck first, maybe the first ones graded would be even more special.
Is the Golden ticket nothing more than a PEACE offering to collectors that believe the USM is under achieving and over pricing their products. ME THINK SO
USN & USAF retired 1971-1993
Successful Transactions with more than 100 Members
I can see putting a simple tamper-proof seal on the box with the signature card inside, and then all could be certified by the grading companies if sent in unopened.
This process certainly would solve the "problem", but it also means letting the TPGs drive mint policy. Of course, it's actually collectors who drive the policy by giving the TPGs the power over such things.
Why not just take the next step and have the mint get the special coins pre-slabbed prior to shipment? Why not just have the entire mintages of certain coins slabbed and sold based on grade?
@jerseycat101 said:
I do feel like the mint lost an opportunity here to differentiate these 200 coins other than an accompanying COA. Only a fraction of these 200 will be eligible for their provenance to be included in 3rd party grading.
Making only 200 coins different would have caused such extreme competitive pricing to complete a modern registry set it would be extremely unfair to 99.99% of collectors of these coins. The 1,945-mintage gold privy eagle is already selling very high at over $20,000.
People are already paying a lot for the special labelled box and the Mint Director's signature, even if they are not certified, but at least the coins are the same variety.
I can see putting a simple tamper-proof seal on the box with the signature card inside, and then all could be certified by the grading companies if sent in unopened. That does not require a special die and minting an over-the-top modern coin rarity on purpose.
Agree - and I, for one, am generally against contrived rarities. However, in this case, anyone buying an uncertified 2023 Directors Edition Peace dollar has no assurance the coin they received is actually one of the 200. Is it likely, yes? Guaranteed? No. Nevertheless, they are still paying a huge premium, without the benefit of that assuredness. In this case, your concerns could be mitigated by excluding the 200 coin variety from the mainstream registry sets.
However, in this case, anyone buying an uncertified 2023 Directors Edition Peace dollar has no assurance the coin they received is actually one of the 200. Is it likely, yes? Guaranteed? No. Nevertheless, they are still paying a huge premium, without the benefit of that assuredness. In this case, your concerns could be mitigated by excluding the 200 coin variety from the mainstream registry sets.
Has the mint confirmed that coins receiving the golden ticket were actually from the batch of 200 coins struck by the director?
"When the rule of law collapses, civilization can no longer survive." - Martin Armstrong
However, in this case, anyone buying an uncertified 2023 Directors Edition Peace dollar has no assurance the coin they received is actually one of the 200. Is it likely, yes? Guaranteed? No. Nevertheless, they are still paying a huge premium, without the benefit of that assuredness. In this case, your concerns could be mitigated by excluding the 200 coin variety from the mainstream registry sets.
Has the mint confirmed that coins receiving the golden ticket were actually from the batch of 200 coins struck by the director?
Being lazy, if I worked there, I would tell everyone that's what they were but then just go spread the COAs around rather than package the 200 up and spread those boxes around. No one will ever know.
However, in this case, anyone buying an uncertified 2023 Directors Edition Peace dollar has no assurance the coin they received is actually one of the 200. Is it likely, yes? Guaranteed? No. Nevertheless, they are still paying a huge premium, without the benefit of that assuredness. In this case, your concerns could be mitigated by excluding the 200 coin variety from the mainstream registry sets.
Has the mint confirmed that coins receiving the golden ticket were actually from the batch of 200 coins struck by the director?
Just to clarify, while your question is valid, that is now what I was suggesting. I was suggesting that someone could've received one of the 200 coins from the mint, and then put the COA on another coin, whether accidentally or otherwise.
@HATTRICK said:
These coins are going for big money on Ebay weather they are certified or not. As high as $3,550 raw. and threes sales listed.
also noted that bigger dealers seem to have multiples of these.
So, it turns out that these were gifts to the large dealers, with a few sprinkled among the common folk just to keep it fair. Okay, I guess it is what it is. If someone is going to take down thousands, or tens of thousands, of something with a 275,000 mintage, I guess it's only fair that they get their proportional 200/275,000 shot at a prize.
As it is with almost every entity selling something there is always special pricing and perks for their larger customers. Business Marketing 101. In this case nothing was promised to induce sales to the general public by the mint so they were free to distribute them any way they thought was in their best interest. At least there were some randomly inserted in smaller orders.
God bless America. Land of the free and home of the capitalists.
" If you push something hard enough, it will fall over. " The 1st Law of Opposition from The Firesign Theater
Comments
When the mint first thought this up, you know someone in the group suggested to turn the blank planchet upside down on those 200
I hope some coin Sleuth finds a minute difference between the standard coin and the Directors coin someday that settles this. Would be great in my opinion. I hope I have one in my box when I submit my 3
Well now
Does this mean more than 200?
🎶 shout shout, let it all out 🎶
@Jzyskowski1 That just means that they probably set aside 20 of the 200 made.
Successful BST with ad4400, Kccoin, lablover, pointfivezero, koynekwest, jwitten, coin22lover, HalfDimeDude, erwindoc, jyzskowsi, COINS MAKE CENTS, AlanSki, BryceM
@gumby1234
That makes sense. ( I’m worried now because they usually don’t make sense 😂😂😂)
🎶 shout shout, let it all out 🎶
LOL 175 went to thoes who are connected and only 25 were randomly inserted. Do you know where the back door is ?
Are you saying I was "randomly inserted?"
😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
🎶 shout shout, let it all out 🎶
If I'm not mistaken, mint said no difference only that she pressed the button for the first 200.
"When the rule of law collapses, civilization can no longer survive." - Martin Armstrong
Yours is extra rare as it is 1 of only 25 randomly inserted. It deserves a "special label"
We know for sure at this point it is 1 of 180, however you will soon see that many went out the back door.
Coming soon you will see a dealer with 50 available.
A 08/02/23 article from PCGS specific to COA encapsulation for the "director's strike" coins.
A hat tip to @Goldminers. He discovered the information first, and posted it to the "official" thread. I am merely sharing the information here.
Looks like three slabs from PCGS
"When the rule of law collapses, civilization can no longer survive." - Martin Armstrong
Appears PCGS gave credit to the forum's "golden ticket" reference. LOL
"When the rule of law collapses, civilization can no longer survive." - Martin Armstrong
Any of the certified ones showing up for sale yet ?
not yet.
New record for raw on ebay: #82 sold for $2850
"When the rule of law collapses, civilization can no longer survive." - Martin Armstrong
will be interesting to see if the golden ticket gets extended to the Proofs. If so, imagine what a matched numbered pair would sell for.
"When the rule of law collapses, civilization can no longer survive." - Martin Armstrong
Winner, winner !!!
That would be a substantial retirement contribution 💵💵💵💵
I imagine the ceremonial striking went something like this:
Operator: "Ma'am, we've set the press to do a run of 200. Just press this button to start."
Director: "This button?"
Operator: "No, ma'am, this button."
Director: "Like this?"
Operator: "Yes. ... You can let go now."
Another golden opportunity blown by the mint to make one of the dies special -- even just a dot somewhere to make the coin identifiable when separated from the card.
Keeper of the VAM Catalog • Professional Coin Imaging • Prime Number Set • World Coins in Early America • British Trade Dollars
The Silver Wolverine from 2 weeks ago.
I
Here’s a FDOI one. I’m surprised GC didn’t take pictures of the signed coa to show everything in the auction:
https://www.greatcollections.com/Coin/1426059/2023-Peace-Silver-Dollar-Directors-Strike-First-Day-of-Issue-PCGS-MS-70-with-Signed-Certificate-of-Authenticity-and-Congratulations-Certificate-197-of-200
should not all of the 200 Director's Strikes be FDOI? According to the mint they were the first 200 struck.
"When the rule of law collapses, civilization can no longer survive." - Martin Armstrong
The Eagle at Dusk and at Dawn sets were identical coins. They sold well.
I'm with you. But First Strike does not mean first struck at PCGS.
Scroll down the page to the "all images" section.
Edited to add image.
Source
Could these spots be on the plastic?
Top pic of obverse looks like a fiber.
Thoughts? Am I just bitter with jealousy?
They could easily be on the plastic... At least some of them anyways.
https://www.the4thcoin.com
https://www.ebay.com/str/thefourthcoin
@Goldbully i feel for you buddy
Martin
Thanks, man.
Now the question is, do we open our Mint boxes of proofs?
@Goldbully Lol I don’t know. I’d wait a bit. However because of you I have yet to open my box of UNC peace dollars🥴
What to do I know the odds are slim however my little voice is telling me send them in. But reality is stopping me
Martin
I do feel like the mint lost an opportunity here to differentiate these 200 coins other than an accompanying COA. Only a fraction of these 200 will be eligible for their provenance to be included in 3rd party grading.
Pinehurst has a certified MS70 FDOI signed COA on Ebay for $12,995
https://ebay.com/itm/175853971596?hash=item28f1b6a88c:g:VZUAAOSw6BBk0~G4&amdata=enc%3AAQAIAAAA0OJPIogBkWmKLugrNLKj%2FfifCaSYFraos%2Bf%2FRyOpegaii%2BE%2BKQTuQ3bFpFhpb9W5t8ku3TTaQ1L%2Bo6khS0BnNhl%2Bow0Gd1zFKY7ucNpF3EOKyZ03Lx6ZT2YfBoXoJ2RKERKtmGEF6DJJ53lSfSTbkVJwKsSNxkvWzxfnytuHTwkS5oHrSiL1vYoMF%2FP8ikg7Et%2B3xD%2Fp4Sh8BKvGZa4Gtc4Wi5s6tRczkuCXFtZHZ9VMQJT9sct%2BMyqDtctbykxLrpW3Uqcrb8S4Xi3n4Ggdxlg%3D%7Ctkp%3ABk9SR6Czy8S7Yg
@HATTRICK don’t let goldbully see that. 🙄
Seriously though that is insane
Martin
Looks like NGC accidentally switched/misholdered the coa and the congratulations card on pinehurst’s example. The labels are backwards
Making only 200 coins different would have caused such extreme competitive pricing to complete a modern registry set it would be extremely unfair to 99.99% of collectors of these coins. The 1,945-mintage gold privy eagle is already selling very high at over $20,000.
People are already paying a lot for the special labelled box and the Mint Director's signature, even if they are not certified, but at least the coins are the same variety.
I can see putting a simple tamper-proof seal on the box with the signature card inside, and then all could be certified by the grading companies if sent in unopened. That does not require a special die and minting an over-the-top modern coin rarity on purpose.
National Commemorative Medals of the U.S. Mint:
https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/u-s-coins/medals-tokens/national-commemorative-medals-united-states-mint-1940-present/alltimeset/195526
Maybe PCGS should start labeling 1'st Graded and number them up to 200. Since no one knows which coins were struck first, maybe the first ones graded would be even more special.
Good catch.
Is the Golden ticket nothing more than a PEACE offering to collectors that believe the USM is under achieving and over pricing their products. ME THINK SO
USN & USAF retired 1971-1993
Successful Transactions with more than 100 Members
This process certainly would solve the "problem", but it also means letting the TPGs drive mint policy. Of course, it's actually collectors who drive the policy by giving the TPGs the power over such things.
Why not just take the next step and have the mint get the special coins pre-slabbed prior to shipment? Why not just have the entire mintages of certain coins slabbed and sold based on grade?
So many possibilities....
Agree - and I, for one, am generally against contrived rarities. However, in this case, anyone buying an uncertified 2023 Directors Edition Peace dollar has no assurance the coin they received is actually one of the 200. Is it likely, yes? Guaranteed? No. Nevertheless, they are still paying a huge premium, without the benefit of that assuredness. In this case, your concerns could be mitigated by excluding the 200 coin variety from the mainstream registry sets.
Has the mint confirmed that coins receiving the golden ticket were actually from the batch of 200 coins struck by the director?
"When the rule of law collapses, civilization can no longer survive." - Martin Armstrong
Being lazy, if I worked there, I would tell everyone that's what they were but then just go spread the COAs around rather than package the 200 up and spread those boxes around. No one will ever know.
Just to clarify, while your question is valid, that is now what I was suggesting. I was suggesting that someone could've received one of the 200 coins from the mint, and then put the COA on another coin, whether accidentally or otherwise.
These coins are going for big money on Ebay weather they are certified or not. As high as $3,550 raw. and threes sales listed.
also noted that bigger dealers seem to have multiples of these.
So, it turns out that these were gifts to the large dealers, with a few sprinkled among the common folk just to keep it fair. Okay, I guess it is what it is. If someone is going to take down thousands, or tens of thousands, of something with a 275,000 mintage, I guess it's only fair that they get their proportional 200/275,000 shot at a prize.
Why were these not holdered with the COA in the same plastic like a side by side multiholder?
Dead Cat Waltz Exonumia
"Coin collecting for outcasts..."
As it is with almost every entity selling something there is always special pricing and perks for their larger customers. Business Marketing 101. In this case nothing was promised to induce sales to the general public by the mint so they were free to distribute them any way they thought was in their best interest. At least there were some randomly inserted in smaller orders.
God bless America. Land of the free and home of the capitalists.
No. 197 sold for ~$6500 tonight on GC...
https://www.greatcollections.com/Coin/1426059/2023-Peace-Silver-Dollar-Directors-Strike-First-Day-of-Issue-PCGS-MS-70-with-Signed-Certificate-of-Authenticity-and-Congratulations-Certificate-197-of-200