Grim Reaper here with a collection of "certified" coins from a German seller...
burfle23
Posts: 2,433 ✭✭✭✭✭
Almost mind boggling:
Verified the NGC coins are bad (2 already have updated certs) through images; the PCGS ones are more difficult to find comparison images:
Best, Jack.
6
Comments
They're getting better at marketing these in a way where it's harder to detect them. The Buffalo is easy to detect, but the Kangaroos may have fooled me since I have no idea what they should look like. Good thing NGC puts "POSSIBLE COUNTERFEIT HODLER" for any unsuspecting buyers.
And of course we have people like you Jack, looking out for us all. Much thanks and respect to you.
Coin Photographer.
I don't think it helps that we evaluate, critique and point out each fake holder and why it is fake.
No problem, I'll quit posting here and you won't have to see them...
There is a huge problem with fake holders & fake coins in the hobby right now, education and knowledge is very important.
Just because you don't find this information useful doesn't mean others here don't find it valuable.
Thanks for your efforts @burfle23 and I look forward to your next post.
+1 - Thanks @burfle23
I am a newer collector (started April 2020), and I primarily focus on U.S. Half Cents and Type Coins. Early copper is my favorite.
+1
USAF (Ret.) 1985 - 2005. E-4B Aircraft Maintenance Crew Chief and Contracting Officer.
My current Registry sets:
✓ Everyman Mint State Carson City Morgan Dollars (1878 – 1893)
✓ Everyman Mint State Lincoln Cents (1909 – 1958)
✓ Morgan Dollar GSA Hoard (1878 – 1891)
+1
Information like this is important and it is one reason why I have changed my collecting focus the last few years.
I've put a pause on collecting coins and gone towards gem gold from established trusted sellers, IN PERSON.
Unfortunately, we are educating the bad guys.
I think the above was taken wrong
Meaning…by telling how they are bad it helps the bad guys how to fix the issues.
That’s how I took the above
Which is the double edged sword; don't pass the info along and collectors stay in the dark as the counterfeiters improve their wares regardless...
Just a side note, NGC updated the one open cert immediately from being notified:
Agree
Was just suggesting it was mistaken as an ugly post / attack and likely just not expressed correctly. I’ve seen some tension here lately and didn’t want to lose you as a valuable member here. Good information please keep it up. PCGS should have you on payroll by now.
These posts of counterfeit coins are very valuable. They clearly illustrate just how far the counterfeiters have progressed from the 1990s era "Trade Dollars". Keep these posts coming!
@burfle23.... Thank you for the information and please, please continue to post this type of information. It is a service to the collecting community and valued highly. Cheers, RickO
It's unfortunate that the info that we post is out there for the counterfeiters to learn from to try to make a more deceptive product, but i doubt anyone would like you to stop posting. We need the critique of the fakes so we can avoid them, but our critiques help train the fakers, it's a double edged sword. We all get a little sensitive sometimes, i guess.
Just because the bad guys stop making X and move on to Y doesn't mean that X is not still out there in the marketplace.
There are fake generation 1 rattlers still for sale - do you remember how to tell them apart????
ANA 50 year/Life Member (now "Emeritus")
No but I’m reading…
@Atcarroll "but our critiques help train the fakers"
I haven't seen one post from @burfle23 that describes or dissects exactly what is wrong with the holders.
He is not providing the "fakers" with additional information to make their counterfeits better.
He is very careful to not provide too much information.
that sure helps seeing that and a reminder as well, just saying
I need a reminder on fake rattlers if someone would be so kind.
Thank you.
I was talking more about the post from relaxn that burfle23 replied to, and speaking more generally about the information that many people post that helps us identify fakes but also may help fakers get better, hence the "we". the reply seemed like burfle23 took offense to relaxn's post.
@burfle23 taught me more about counterfeit coins in a few weeks in one of my discussions than I would have gotten out of a counterfeit detection book in months. I am forever grateful for the lessons.
I am a newer collector (started April 2020), and I primarily focus on U.S. Half Cents and Type Coins. Early copper is my favorite.
The listing was removed; seller had another listing that was also removed:
His on the left, genuine image from the on-line cert on the right.