1894-S Half Eagle... Would you have grabbed this or walked on by?
mark_dak
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A little disclaimer... I love old raw American pre-1933 gold so this was no brainer for me.
Really tough date $5 Half Eagle. I came by this one at a local coin show this weekend. Dealer offered it to me at a small premium over spot... I decided to bring it home with me.
I'm kind of curious how many here would have done the same or would you either examine it and hand it back or just walk on past. This is the beginning of a hard to find run of S mint half eagles that rarely comes up in any grade. If you saw it in a dealer's case what would you have done?
Mark
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Don't have requisite gold knowledge, but the areas of inconsistent color/light on both sides would raise questions and thus I'd "walk on by"!
"Got a flaming heart, can't get my fill"
I dont know much about gold coins. It looks like alot of nicks, scratches in the field, which to my eyes would be distracting. I probably would have walked. jmo
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Looks like it may be ex-jewelry or something, I probably would have kept walking. They are quite scarce and if you only paid slightly over spot, I doubt you have any downside though.
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I would expect this to be a lower grade example(VF/XF). I can say without a doubt that the premium I paid on this one was less than what everyone was paying for ASE's or even junk 90% silver. This is an extremely tough date to locate in any condition.
Mark
Can’t go too wrong at a small premium over spot if it meets your collecting goals!
Third side of the coin is solid - Rims all intact and visible.
Mark
Pass.
I have only owned a couple of gold coins that were in this grade, and one of them was given to me by an aunt. The other one was a piece of Charlotte gold. It had far fewer marks that the OP coin, but about the same amount of wear. It never pleased me, and I sold it.
Only scarce in AU58 and above; does not look like ex/jewelry to me; I would buy for just above melt for the historical value.
That is a tough date but it's also in tough condition. At a a small premium over melt (10% or less) I think you did the right thing. If I were looking for one to fill a hole in my Liberty Half Eagle set and stumbled upon that one it would be mine but I'd keep looking for a replacement.
it's crackers to slip a rozzer the dropsy in snide
Great pick-up at a little over melt value. I see nothing that indicates that it's an ex-jewelry coin. Also, the tick marks are consistent with a circulated gold coin and your large pics make them look worse than they are when viewed in hand.
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"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
Do not believe it to be ex-jewelry either, just circulated old gold. I might take issue with the suggestion this is not a scarce date in lower grades. I believe a search of sales will come up nearly empty for this date in less than AU condition.
Not too much has appeared to change over the years, especially on this particular date:
David Akers (1975/88): The 1894-S is one of the most underrated and undervalued dates in the entire series. It is not often available in any grade and when offered for sale, the typical specimen is invariably only VF or EF. In AU, the 1894-S is very rare and strictly uncirculated examples are extremely rare. I have never seen a really choice 1894-S and I have only seen a few that were legitimately mint state.
The pop reports and recent sales should speak for themselves.
Mark
You are correct, even some of the unevenness in color is related to lousy cell pictures...
Mark
Thanks for your input Bill, always respect your comments and opinions on this area of the hobby. I do wish my pockets were deep enough to keep up with you. I'll have to live with this one until I can upgrade... LOL!
Mark
Pass. Badly marked up on both the obverse and reverse.
Mark,
I bought a 94-s in this condition on eBay about 10-12 years ago. $247. Sold it on a bid board years later.
Not really a collectible coin imo.
Very few 1890's $5 are collectible unless you count the 1894-s in ms67 piece or CC coins or MS branch coins. Just doesn't seem to be demand for circ pieces. Akers opinions were probably correct when he wrote them.
At a small premium over spot, that's a good buy.
Dave
So I was a little harsh. I might have considered it for a flip.
At near melt why not! Enjoy it as it is. I once had in inventory a Turban Head $10 in a lovely AU-58 that I offered to a customer looking for the type. He passed because it did not meet his minimum of MS-60. He ended up buying an ugly MS-60.
Mark @mark_dak
Sounds like you are happy and that's what counts the most
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My current Registry sets:
✓ Everyman Mint State Carson City Morgan Dollars (1878 – 1893)
✓ Everyman Mint State Lincoln Cents (1909 – 1958)
✓ Morgan Dollar GSA Hoard (1878 – 1891)
I didn’t intend to offend you. It’s just a matter of goals and tastes. When I was in my 20s and 30s, I used to buy one or two coins a year priced between $1,000 to $3,000 and a few much cheaper items. Prices were lower then, but so were wages and salaries. I bought mostly early U.S. coins in grades ranging from Choice VF to AU. After while the collection became fairly impressive, but it took more than a decade.
I bought the Charlotte gold coin I mentioned at the 1982 ANA show. It was one of a few items that I decided was a mistake. So I let it go. I had saved up for that show. I bought an 1806 half eagle that ultimately graded AU-58. I still have that one.
A hand full of AU+ 94-S specimens have sold over the past few years. Current eBay recent sale search will turn up exactly zero and one available for moon money. Local dealer had 7 circulated Liberty half eagles last week, by the time I got there, none were left. Someone's seeing them as collectible beside me.
I believe Akers' comments are still valid on this coin today. Fairmont brought out a couple extra higher end examples but doesn't appear to have dampened prices in any appreciable way.
Mark
Actually no wrong answers, I guess I was thinking much as you, if a better example came along in that fits my coin budget, I'd consider a flip... so far from comments here there may not be too many takers.
Mark
Absolutely no offense taken at all. I love the stuff you post and as I said, respect your opinions and comments. You are one of the members here I would love to meet some day so I could pick your brain on the subject. Keep posting and commenting.
Mark
I might take issue with the suggestion this is not a scarce date in lower grades. I believe a search of sales will come up nearly empty for this date in less than AU condition.
I was looking at raw coin values which is a better indicator of scarcity in the face of demand. if instead I look at survival rates the 94-s is estimated at 500, scarcer than adjoining S mints; however the 1848 only has 275 estimated survivors and is also reasonably priced at lower grades.
The fact that a dealer let it go for a little above melt reinforces my opinion that in the lower grades seemingly scarce Liberty gold is not in much demand (and perhaps a good value for partial set collectors); i would not expect it to run up at much of a premium to gold price though, certainly not like higher grades.
My first thought was ex jewelry as well, the rim from about 10 to 1 looks deformed, that and the whiteish areas on the obv and rev are why that was my first impression. From our further comments I'm now thinking those areas are shadows or lighting issues.
As to your question, let me preface my comments by saying that 19th century gold coins are not an area I have studied or bought much of raw. One thing seems "off", if this is such a desirable date why would a seller be willing to sell for a small premium, that seems incongruent to me and a red flag. This would make me wonder if the coin is legit, and because of that and my inexperience with this series I would have kept walking.
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At a small premium over gold when it's down somewhat sounds like a decent buy, which I'm a sucker for too.
Nice pickup.
I don’t see how you could possibly go wrong buying it for melt plus a small premium as long as it’s not fake and it looks real to me. It’s a rarer date but unfortunately very few people care about this date in a lower grade.
I would agree that while the coin looks like it has its share of issues, if I t was any Charlotte Half Eagle and was being offered at near melt, then I wouldn’t hesitate to purchase it. As it’s a scarce date, and particularly one you’re looking for, then you did well.
eBay reported sales in the past year:
1894-S NGC AU58 - $1,000.00 ea. (2 sales)
1894-S PCGS AU58 - $1,009.00
1894-S NGC AU DETAILS, CLEANED - $899.50
1894-S VF, looks cleaned - $514.00
@mark_dak... At a tad over melt, I think it was a good buy.... I would not have bought it, but only because I am partial to the $5 Indian piece... and would have been looking for one of those. Cheers, RickO