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GTG NEWP Saint Gaudens $20 -REVEALED , will it CAC?

DeplorableDanDeplorableDan Posts: 2,532 ✭✭✭✭✭
edited January 30, 2023 5:29PM in U.S. Coin Forum

I saw this coin offered in my pre-33 Facebook group over the weekend and I scooped it up quickly, for a very attractive price. The coin is in fresh PCGS Plastic and the TV isn't even available yet. From what I've been told by the seller, the coin was housed in a competitors holder and was cracked out and crossed, and he sent a picture of the old label. I will reveal the new grade and the old grade later tonight, and the coin is scheduled to be delivered today so hopefully ill have more pictures to add to the thread.






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Comments

  • BryceMBryceM Posts: 11,729 ✭✭✭✭✭

    The nose it a bit flat (as usual), but it looks pretty nice to me. Minimal hits, nice detail, slightly subdued luster. MS64, shot 64+.

  • JJMJJM Posts: 7,980 ✭✭✭✭✭

    64

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  • SmudgeSmudge Posts: 9,244 ✭✭✭✭✭
    1. Very clean for a large gold coin.
  • Walkerguy21DWalkerguy21D Posts: 11,144 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Going to guess it was 65 in the competitor’s holder, and now it’s in a 64+ holder.

    Successful BST transactions with 170 members. Recent: Tonedeaf, Shane6596, Piano1, Ikenefic, RG, PCGSPhoto, stman, Don'tTelltheWife, Boosibri, Ron1968, snowequities, VTchaser, jrt103, SurfinxHI, 78saen, bp777, FHC, RYK, JTHawaii, Opportunity, Kliao, bigtime36, skanderbeg, split37, thebigeng, acloco, Toninginthblood, OKCC, braddick, Coinflip, robcool, fastfreddie, tightbudget, DBSTrader2, nickelsciolist, relaxn, Eagle eye, soldi, silverman68, ElKevvo, sawyerjosh, Schmitz7, talkingwalnut2, konsole, sharkman987, sniocsu, comma, jesbroken, David1234, biosolar, Sullykerry, Moldnut, erwindoc, MichaelDixon, GotTheBug
  • CatbertCatbert Posts: 6,599 ✭✭✭✭✭

    My guess is 65. Congrats on scoring another for your gold type set!

    "Got a flaming heart, can't get my fill"
  • DeplorableDanDeplorableDan Posts: 2,532 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 30, 2023 2:38PM

    @Catbert said:
    My guess is 65. Congrats on scoring another for your gold type set!

    Thank you! For the record, this isn’t really a type set coin for me. It’s nice and all, but I can do better if I’m only going to have one saint. It was priced so well that I couldn’t resist, I’ll probably try to bean it and flip or use it to trade up on another coin.

  • FlyingAlFlyingAl Posts: 2,845 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I’m going to throw all caution to the wind and go with MS66.

    1908 No Mottos seem to come nice. Great coin!

    Young Numismatist, Coin Photographer.

  • KoveKove Posts: 2,025 ✭✭✭✭

    MS 65. Looks nice.

  • NeophyteNumismatistNeophyteNumismatist Posts: 871 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 30, 2023 4:50PM

    Nice coin. I agree, it looks 65 to me.

    I am a newer collector (started April 2020), and I primarily focus on U.S. Half Cents and Type Coins. Early copper is my favorite.

  • JimnightJimnight Posts: 10,810 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I like it at 65.

  • RLSnapperRLSnapper Posts: 516 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I have no idea how to grade Saints but I really like the color ..especially on the reverse. It has that very original look that I enjoy.

  • 1Mike11Mike1 Posts: 4,414 ✭✭✭✭✭

    64

    "May the silver waves that bear you heavenward be filled with love’s whisperings"

    "A dog breaks your heart only one time and that is when they pass on". Unknown
  • privatecoinprivatecoin Posts: 3,180 ✭✭✭✭✭

    64

    Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value. Zero. Voltaire. Ebay coinbowlllc

  • blitzdudeblitzdude Posts: 5,436 ✭✭✭✭✭

    64-ish RGDS!

    The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.

  • pcgscacgoldpcgscacgold Posts: 2,636 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Wild guess 65+

  • mirabelamirabela Posts: 4,963 ✭✭✭✭✭

    65

    mirabela
  • gumby1234gumby1234 Posts: 5,425 ✭✭✭✭✭

    64

    Successful BST with ad4400, Kccoin, lablover, pointfivezero, koynekwest, jwitten, coin22lover, HalfDimeDude, erwindoc, jyzskowsi, COINS MAKE CENTS, AlanSki, BryceM

  • ashelandasheland Posts: 22,679 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I was too late to guess, but that’s a Great Coin!
    Congratulations. 🥳

  • DeplorableDanDeplorableDan Posts: 2,532 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I see no reason to drag this out, a lot of you nailed it. The coin is fresh ms65 from our hosts. I am told from the seller that the coin was actually cracked out of an NGC 67 holder and resubmitted to pcgs. I have no idea why the owner would do that, when an NGC brown line Wells Fargo 67 sells for substantially more than double what I paid for it. Next, I’ll be submitting this to CAC and I think it has a good shot at a bean. Thoughts? Here’s a link to my instagram reel, let me know if this link works for someone without an instagram account

    https://www.instagram.com/reel/CoDu4RprEZq/?igshid=MDJmNzVkMjY=

  • braddickbraddick Posts: 23,097 ✭✭✭✭✭

    That is the finest MS65 Saint I've seen.
    If not an MS66 I am surprised it didn't +

    peacockcoins

  • vplite99vplite99 Posts: 1,180 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I think 66 is reasonable.

    Vplite99
  • DelawareDoonsDelawareDoons Posts: 3,241 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Looks 66 to me, ez. 65's a ripoff. But sell it to me as a 65 :D

    Professional Numismatist. "It's like God, Family, Country, except Sticker, Plastic, Coin."

  • SmudgeSmudge Posts: 9,244 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I think it will bean.

  • ifthevamzarockinifthevamzarockin Posts: 8,498 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Nice coin! <3

    I don't have an Instagram account and your link worked for me. ;)

  • PizzamanPizzaman Posts: 226 ✭✭✭

    At PCGS MS65, you bet it will CAC.

  • blitzdudeblitzdude Posts: 5,436 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @DeplorableDan said:
    I see no reason to drag this out, a lot of you nailed it. The coin is fresh ms65 from our hosts. I am told from the seller that the coin was actually cracked out of an NGC 67 holder and resubmitted to pcgs. I have no idea why the owner would do that, when an NGC brown line Wells Fargo 67 sells for substantially more than double what I paid for it. Next, I’ll be submitting this to CAC and I think it has a good shot at a bean. Thoughts? Here’s a link to my instagram reel, let me know if this link works for someone without an instagram account

    https://www.instagram.com/reel/CoDu4RprEZq/?igshid=MDJmNzVkMjY=

    No ideas what the Instagram reel is but I clicked the link and it tried to play me a very choppy video of your DE. Still looks 64-ish perhaps a shot it has a shot at 65. Personally, I wouldn't waste $$$ attempting to add graffiti to the plastic. Any day a fella can add some gold to the pile is a fabulous day. CNGRTS!

    The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.

  • gumby1234gumby1234 Posts: 5,425 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @DeplorableDan The link works and i have no Instagram. Allman bros rock.

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  • CladiatorCladiator Posts: 17,919 ✭✭✭✭✭

    let me know if this link works for someone without an instagram account

    Video worked fine for me, played nice and smooth and I have no IG account.

  • DisneyFanDisneyFan Posts: 1,669 ✭✭✭✭✭

    NGC MS67 becomes PCGS MS65 ? That's some drop! Makes one cautious about NGC grading.

    Hope your CAC is a gold CAC.

  • messydeskmessydesk Posts: 19,680 ✭✭✭✭✭

    It's a nice looking 65, for sure. Liberty's face isn't brutalized and there are no cuts across any of the rays on either side. If no bean, I'd really want to know what I'm missing here.

  • logger7logger7 Posts: 8,069 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 30, 2023 8:12PM

    I'd be resubmitting the coin out of the holder. That is too great a point spread.

  • DeplorableDanDeplorableDan Posts: 2,532 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I personally grade the coin as 66 shot 66+. These generally come flat in the nose, with a little weakness in the high points and they don’t often have booming luster like the 20’s dates do. The coin has a couple hits in the torch, but I think it is very conservatively graded at 65. There’s very little in the fields beyond some minor chatter near the base of the torch. The rays are in tact and there’s no major hits on the eagles feathers or the sun.

    Being that my price point was low, I wouldn’t mind having some fun with this coin experimenting with upgrades or sending to cac on my own. A gold CAC would be optimal, but even a green with + would justify the cost of some experimentation, and serve as a good learning experience.

    Just for reference, here are 3 plate coins on coinfacts, in 66+



  • gumby1234gumby1234 Posts: 5,425 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @DisneyFan said:
    NGC MS67 becomes PCGS MS65 ? That's some drop! Makes one cautious about NGC grading.

    Hope your CAC is a gold CAC.

    It may have been a 67 before the previous owner cracked it out. Coins can and do get damaged sometimes when cracked out. We will never know thou. The coin in the video looks like a 66 or better.

    Successful BST with ad4400, Kccoin, lablover, pointfivezero, koynekwest, jwitten, coin22lover, HalfDimeDude, erwindoc, jyzskowsi, COINS MAKE CENTS, AlanSki, BryceM

  • logger7logger7 Posts: 8,069 ✭✭✭✭✭

    There may be a previous record in auction of the coin if you have the NGC tab. My old GS has the 65 cac coins at a little over $3000, the 66 coins, non cac at a little over $3100 and the 67 coins at $6300. Someone made a big mistake cracking out a 67 Saint.

  • rickoricko Posts: 98,724 ✭✭✭✭✭

    That is a very nice gold Saint.... Late to the GTG.... However, should be no problem getting a bean, maybe even a gold bean. Cheers, RickO

  • ElmerFusterpuckElmerFusterpuck Posts: 4,627 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Also late to the game, but I would would have thought 65 or 66. Super nice Saint!

    Didn't know you were on Instagram, now following you.

  • DeplorableDanDeplorableDan Posts: 2,532 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @ElmerFusterpuck said:

    Didn't know you were on Instagram, now following you.

    Followed back 👍

  • Cougar1978Cougar1978 Posts: 7,612 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 31, 2023 12:50PM

    The 1908 $20 PCGS 65 above slab #2840. Yes I believe it will CAC. It’s a really nice lustrous, nice looking PQ piece. NN Coin Mkt Value $3000.

    So Cali Area - Coins & Currency
  • 1madman1madman Posts: 1,288 ✭✭✭✭✭

    First look at the coin made me think 64. It will not cac at a 65 grade.

  • BryceMBryceM Posts: 11,729 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 31, 2023 1:57PM

    Beautiful coin. I'm very happy to be wrong. Luster is tremendously nice on the new set of photos. It seems strange that someone would crack this out of a 67 NGC holder and be happy enough to sell it in a 65 PCGS holder. Someone took a pretty big hit on this. Might it be worth another try or two for a 66 grade before trying for the sticker? Or, maybe just send it to CAC for grading once they get going??

  • pcgscacgoldpcgscacgold Posts: 2,636 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Well @DeplorableDan , that first 66+CAC plate coin looks really nice. Oh wait, it is mine :smiley:

  • pmh1nicpmh1nic Posts: 3,142 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Very nice coin. I think the 67 is high and the 65 is low. I'd split it down the middle to a solid 66.

    The longer I live the more convincing proofs I see of this truth, that God governs in the affairs of men. And if a sparrow cannot fall to the ground without His notice is it possible for an empire to rise without His aid? Benjamin Franklin
  • DeplorableDanDeplorableDan Posts: 2,532 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @BryceM said:
    Beautiful coin. I'm very happy to be wrong. Luster is tremendously nice on the new set of photos. It seems strange that someone would crack this out of a 67 NGC holder and be happy enough to sell it in a 65 PCGS holder. Someone took a pretty big hit on this. Might it be worth another try or two for a 66 grade before trying for the sticker? Or, maybe just send it to CAC for grading once they get going??

    Though I grade the coin as a low to mid 66, especially if I'm comparing to pcgs plate coins, I like my coins to be conservatively graded rather than maxed out. I'm first going to attempt to sticker it at 65, and if that's successful I will shoot for a + via reconsideration as I think this coin deserves to be a 65+cac at the least. If either of those things fail I'm going to consider cracking and sending to CAC grading. Regardless of the grade they assign, as long as its no lower than 65, I think a CAC slab with a very early cert number could potentially be collectible in its own right some years from now. Even if the coin did make it into a P66 holder, I'm not as confident it would CAC at that grade, and if it wants to stay in my collection I would prefer that its CAC approved.

  • thebeavthebeav Posts: 3,751 ✭✭✭✭✭

    That's a beauty !
    I love the coloring........
    I don't know about anyone else, but I wouldn't have the nerve to crack-out ANY classic gold graded 67.......

  • VanHalenVanHalen Posts: 3,807 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Those who call it a 64; What do you see? Do you think something like luster, strike or color bring it down?

    Inquiring minds want to know.

  • 1madman1madman Posts: 1,288 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @VanHalen said:
    Those who call it a 64; What do you see? Do you think something like luster, strike or color bring it down?

    Inquiring minds want to know.

    Mushy weak strike, along with yellow magic marker streaked toning.

    I’d have that coin back at NGC so fast trying to attain that 67 grade again, and sell it

  • stevebensteveben Posts: 4,595 ✭✭✭✭✭

    my first thought was 65. i was surprised to see the 67 label. why was it cracked out?

  • orevilleoreville Posts: 11,780 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited February 1, 2023 2:08AM

    @1madman said:
    First look at the coin made me think 64. It will not CAC at a 65 grade.

    I would not be quite as harsh. 65.0 to 65.2 Prefer the more original looking better struck 1908 NM even if less brilliant looking. Agree that it will not sticker.
    CACG will grade it 64+. But very hard to grade just looking at photos.

    Too many hits on the torch. Softly struck face, breast, stomach and knee. Photo make it appear as if there is a luster break in these critical areas.

    JA is brutal on these 1908 NM. Tougher than the 1924 and 1928.

    Back to sleep.

    A Collectors Universe poster since 1997!
  • MFeldMFeld Posts: 12,020 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @1madman said:

    @VanHalen said:
    Those who call it a 64; What do you see? Do you think something like luster, strike or color bring it down?

    Inquiring minds want to know.

    Mushy weak strike, along with yellow magic marker streaked toning.

    I’d have that coin back at NGC so fast trying to attain that 67 grade again, and sell it

    I think it’s highly unlikely that the strike or the color on that coin would cause graders to penalize the grade.

    Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.

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