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1894 Morgan Real? Date and Position

This ones for sale locally and I cant look at in person right now because of weather. Its definitely been cleaned and I cant bring up detail enough to see known diagnostics. I wondering about date position, hows it look? The left foot of 1 in date appears broken, I couldnt find another example like this. I almost think I see remains of an S mintmark?


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    bretsanbretsan Posts: 112 ✭✭✭

    The pictures are far too blurry to discern authenticity. The date location looks like the one on my 1894 Morgan. If it’s cleaned I always assume one grade lower to determine a fair price.

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    ifthevamzarockinifthevamzarockin Posts: 8,498 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Hard to tell much from those photos but I would say questionable authenticity.

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    gumby1234gumby1234 Posts: 5,428 ✭✭✭✭✭

    At the least harshly cleaned.

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    BillJonesBillJones Posts: 33,486 ✭✭✭✭✭

    When you are looking for opinions concerning grade or authenticity, you need to show the whole coin in addition to the close-up photos. Think of how people evaluate coins in person. They look at the whole piece than pull out the 10x.

    Retired dealer and avid collector of U.S. type coins, 19th century presidential campaign medalets and selected medals. In recent years I have been working on a set of British coins - at least one coin from each king or queen who issued pieces that are collectible. I am also collecting at least one coin for each Roman emperor from Julius Caesar to ... ?
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    mbogomanmbogoman Posts: 5,127 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 25, 2023 6:28AM

    Fake. No doubt. The 1 in the date should be centered over the gap between the 3rd and 4th denticles to the right of where Liberty's pointy neck points. I don't even think it's an authentic Morgan - the denticles on the reverse pic are suspect, but it's tough to tell without the full coin.

    FYI - There is only one obverse die for this date/mm, so there is no doubt.

    Here's an authentic one I used to own. Note the position of the 1:

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    rickoricko Posts: 98,724 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Cannot determine authenticity from those limited - and blurry pictures....Cheers, RickO

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    coastaljerseyguycoastaljerseyguy Posts: 1,250 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Too blurry but I think the best & most obvious diagnostic is the vertical lines in the lips and nose. Always check vamworld as source.

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    telephoto1telephoto1 Posts: 4,751 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 25, 2023 2:47PM

    Not a genuine 1894 Plain for sure... but can't tell you whether it's an altered O or S. I see the shadow there to which you refer but would need crisper pics to confirm. At any rate, it's definitely not a Philly issue. The cleaning was done to hide the MM removal. Either this seller is clueless or trying to get rid of a mistake.

    RIP Mom- 1932-2012
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    messydeskmessydesk Posts: 19,704 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 25, 2023 9:43AM

    The date looks set a little too far to the left, but that could just be the quality of the pictures. Anyway, you want to take a look at this short die scratch above the eagle's left (viewer's right) foot. This is how I got the only PO1 1894 graded, so unless there's an unfortunate hit on the coin there, it'll be on yours if it's authentic.

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