Possibly Finest known 1828 O.107A CBH

KensCoins2287

I recently acquired this half that I believe may be the finest know O.107a. Does anyone know of one in MS62 or better? In also curious about the rarity of this die state, I’ve seen it listed as a “R.7?”. Is it really that rare? Or is this one of those die states that doesn’t get much attention so it isn't identified/attributed often?

lilolme

My 3rd Ed. of Overton list the 1828 O-107a as an R2.
A website also list it as R2.
Note the O-107 is also listed as R2.

Edit: so looking around a little more I do see where coinfacts and the bust half variety list the O-107a as R7 ?

Here is the link to that page.
http://www.maibockaddict.com/1828-o-107-r2-capped-bust-half-dollar.shtml

So it may be an R7 due to die state. The variety is R2 it appears.

Hopefully some real CBH'ers will chime in. I suspect so.

KensCoins2287

@lilolme said:
My 3rd Ed. of Overton list the 1828 O-107a as an R2.
A website also list it as R2.
Note the O-107 is also listed as R2.

Maybe I should have cited my sources for the R.7 rating. Here is a couple screenshots, one from heritage auctions and one from Dave’s bust half dollar website.... it is interesting that Overton had it listed as an R2.... I wonder how there came to be such a discrepancy....

lilolme

Agree. Looks like Edit beat you by a minute.

I looked at Gerry Fortin also and he has it as an R2 (107a) but I don't know how updated his stuff is.

Edit: One of the CBH club members can give the information that they currently have on it.

Another Edit: and here is the screen shot on pcgs price guide indicating R7 for Sheldon scale

LanceNewmanOCC

didn't read the thread. just posting this link.

see the bottom for SOME CC info.

http://maibockaddict.com/1828-o-107-r2-capped-bust-half-dollar.shtml

pursuitofliberty

I'll chime in for what I know.

First, I think that is Warren Long's old coin ... and I viewed this in hand at the ANA. Nice example even with the busy cheek and bust. Warren has an outstanding eye for quality.

Currently shown as a R.1 Die Marriage, but listed in my latest notes as a R.6+ Die State. This one is defined as DS 107.3 for what it's worth. Get that "Die States Progressions ..." handbook from the BHNC, available at David Kahn's website

Also, my only known reference to the finest known is a P55, so you may want to point out to Steve Herrman who handles the AMBPR, and is also the Treasurer and Census Keeper for the BHNC, that this is the 107a variety.

I can contact him if you like as there were several in that sale that need to be shown correctly in the AMBPR and States census, including another ex Long coin that I happened to win. PM me if you'd like me to take care of it that for you, and I'll include yours in my note this weekend.

COCollector

Have you seen this one?
1828 Capped Bust Half Dollar. O-107a. Rarity-7-. Curl Base Knob 2. AU-55 (ANACS)

Abehunter

@pursuitofliberty said:
I'll chime in for what I know.

First, I think that is Warren Long's old coin ... and I viewed this in hand at the ANA. Nice example even with the busy cheek and bust. Warren has an outstanding eye for quality.

Currently shown as a R.1 Die Marriage, but listed in my latest notes as a R.6+ Die State. This one is defined as DS 107.3 for what it's worth. Get that "Die States Progressions ..." handbook from the BHNC, available at David Kahn's website

Also, my only known reference to the finest known is a P55, so you may want to point out to Steve Herrman who handles the AMBPR, and is also the Treasurer and Census Keeper for the BHNC, that this is the 107a variety.

I can contact him if you like as there were several in that sale that need to be shown correctly in the AMBPR and States census, including another ex Long coin that I happened to win. PM me if you'd like me to take care of it that for you, and I'll include yours in my note this weekend.

What they said

KensCoins2287

Thanks for the info guys!!

LanceNewmanOCC

@KensCoins2287 said:
Thanks for the info guys!!

keep us apprised of any official updates you receive and hope it goes well !

establishing new C.C. coins is one tough and exciting endeavor.

pursuitofliberty

Not to jump the gun, post above my pay grade, or steal Ken's thunder, but this is the CC#1 for the Die State by all current accounts. Hands down.

Unfortunately, the publication that I think would have helped the most in that respect, the AMBPR, had gone to print prior to my getting word to the publisher last night. Even he was disappointed he hadn't noticed the Die State so it could have been listed correctly as an O-107a.

After some lamenting, and then agreeing it really needs to go into the Spring 2023 Edition, his exact quote to me was, "The 1828 O-107a R6+ die state in PCGS MS62 is a big deal. Double drat!"

While Die States do not always carry the demand and following of Die Marriages, some have made advances, especially when getting into R.5 or higher rarities. Having it recognized as the 107a may have altered the trajectory of who studied her closer, and then who bid. I believe in this case that some expert eyes missed the significance of this example, even though it went for good money (IMO, for a 107 in a 62 holder). Congratulations to Ken for catching it. There is a dedicated group getting quite serious about Die States, and this may have been a missed opportunity from that following.

It should also be noted that the 1828 O-107, and the rarer O-106 Die Marriages are also Red Book varieties for this date. Those two marriages are the only ones that are the "Curl Base and Knobbed 2" variety for 1828. This should bring even more attention and scrutiny to the issue, IMO.

As an AU collector, and already having a wonderful P58 for the O-107 DM, this one really wasn't on my radar, so I never went far in considering what it was or what it represented until Ken showed it here, and I started cracking the books on her.

There are still unattributed Die States and mis-attributed coins for those willing to look and pay attention. The coin I mentioned that I won from the same sale, also mis-listed to the Die State, was an advance from a R.3 to a R.4 state, and put my coin into what arguably should be the CC#5 slot for the Die State ... but that is a far cry from what this example represents.

Again, congratulations @KensCoins2287 for a keen eye, and a special prize.