verdigris(?)spots on NGC indian cent

moursund

I sold my ms65 indian cent on BST. Buyer noticed tiny spot of near the denticle on obverse, so is returning it.
I'll relist it on BST, and note the spots...

This is the photo I took before I sold it:

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Buyer has better eyes, and took better picture, and notes these spots, which he thinks are verdigris.

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This is NGC coin, MS65 RB.

General questions:

• I understand that PCGS will spot clean and reslab coins, if you pay for shipping both ways. Does NGC have something similar?
• Is this verdigris? Carbon spot of some kind? Other?
• How much would I expect such spots to lower the value of the coin?
• Other than keeping this coin in a low-humidity environment, what else could/should be done for it?

Thanks... I know very little about copper...

am

Rampage

I will have very little to offer, but I do have a couple of comments. It is really hard to say what kind of spotting that is. The pictures are just too small/pixelated. Don't lower your price. If it is a solid 65, then that is what it is. Two spots does not mean it is over graded or lack eye appeal. Just my opinion.

moursund

@Rampage said:
I will have very little to offer, but I do have a couple of comments. It is really hard to say what kind of spotting that is. The pictures are just too small/pixelated. Don't lower your price. If it is a solid 65, then that is what it is. Two spots does not mean it is over graded or lack eye appeal. Just my opinion.

I'll get a better look at it once I have it back in hand. Appreciate the comment. My daughter has a better camera than I, so I'll ask her to help get clearer pics.

ricko

The spots do not appear to be verdigris... though better pictures are necessary for a conclusive statement. They do look more like carbon spots... I would keep or sell it as is if not verdigris. If confirmed verdigris, send it in for restoration. Cheers, RickO

lkeigwin

@moursund said:

General questions:

• I understand that PCGS will spot clean and reslab coins, if you pay for shipping both ways. Does NGC have something similar?
• Is this verdigris? Carbon spot of some kind? Other?
• How much would I expect such spots to lower the value of the coin?
• Other than keeping this coin in a low-humidity environment, what else could/should be done for it?

PCGS will not conserve for free, if that's what you are suggesting. Those days are long gone. I don't think NGC will either.

That does not look like verdigris. Looks like carbon spots (probably a misnomer, but black corrosion spots). They are permanent.
Lance.

Connecticoin

Carbon spots are common on 65RD coins or even higher grades. Look at 65RD Indian Cents on Coinfacts.

I think another buyer would be happy with the coin - I have seen worse in 65RD holders.

bagofnickels

Pretty sure NGC only guarantees the grade of a copper coin for 10 years. I've noticed that when I search NGC graded copper coins there is note regarding them that says the following:

That being said many many copper coins in that grade that I looked at have a spot or 2. I have one in 63RB in an ANACs holder with a interesting spot. The person I bought it from said the spot has been there a while. In my eyes since my coin was in an older (30+ years old) holder that it likely wasn't going to change or "grow."

My coin with a spot:

That being said I'm no expert I've just been looking at and reading about Indian head cents lately.

clarkbar04

Just looks like carbon flecks or "fly specs" as I believe they are sometimes called.

moursund

@clarkbar04 said:
Just looks like carbon flecks or "fly specs" as I believe they are sometimes called.

@Connecticoin said:
Carbon spots are common on 65RD coins or even higher grades. Look at 65RD Indian Cents on Coinfacts.

I think another buyer would be happy with the coin - I have seen worse in 65RD holders.

@lkeigwin said:

ther than keeping this coin in a low-humidity environment, what else could/should be done for it?

PCGS will not conserve for free, if that's what you are suggesting. Those days are long gone. I don't think NGC will either.

That does not look like verdigris. Looks like carbon spots (probably a misnomer, but black corrosion spots). They are permanent.
Lance.

@ricko said:
The spots do not appear to be verdigris... though better pictures are necessary for a conclusive statement. They do look more like carbon spots... I would keep or sell it as is if not verdigris. If confirmed verdigris, send it in for restoration. Cheers, RickO

Thanks, all... when i get the coin back, i'll scrutinize it more carefully, then relist it on BST.
Perhaps one of you will want to buy it... PM me now, if you may be interested.

amwldcoin

You had a very picky buyer! The coin is above average IMHO.

Crypto

copper spots and even verdigris isn't always grade limiting esp on the lower grades. There is a premium for unspotted copper be it carbon or not. Neither company will conserve for free but NGC is a little better if the coin is unstable.

Relaxn

No,
That is not the spot in question.

Move your arrow to the spot on the rim not the two tiny spots you have highlighted. The spot on the rim nearest the C in. AMERICA

I will posy some more photos for you.

Relaxn

moursund

@Relaxn said:
No,
That is not the spot in question.

Move your arrow to the spot on the rim not the two tiny spots you have highlighted. The spot on the rim nearest the C in. AMERICA

I will posy some more photos for you.

Ah, that helps! So the rim itself is questionable.
Experts, can you tell whether that looks like normal spotting, or a more serious corrosion?

thanks!

am

lkeigwin

Need a better picture. That may very well be a touch of verdigris.

Look at it with a loupe. Is it green or whitish? If so, verdigris. it may be a trivial matter to remove it if it has not been there for ages.

Very old verdigris may have taken hold and done a little corrosion damage. More recent verdigris can usually be removed with no damage...a shiny spot may remain.
Lance.