Is this an outrageous ebay message?
COCollector
Posts: 1,334 ✭✭✭✭✭
From a complaining customer who bought a fairly-priced $200 item from me on ebay:
"Prior to posting any review I just wanted to see if this is something we can first resolve. Would you be willing to refund $100?"
Since I don't sell much on ebay, I'm wondering if anyone else receives that kind of message.
Successful BST transactions with forum members thebigeng, SPalladino, Zoidmeister, coin22lover, coinsarefun, jwitten, CommemKing.
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The first thing they say is they want money back but don’t describe the problem?
Sounds like trouble already.
They’ll them you are offering a full refund once it is returned.
It’s borderline feedback extortion
Feedback extortion policy
Buyers aren't allowed to:
Threaten to use feedback or detailed seller ratings (DSRs) in an attempt to force sellers into meeting their demands.
https://www.ebay.com/help/policies/feedback-policies/feedback-extortion-policy?id=4230
I’d contact eBay and make them aware of the (extremely flimsily veiled) feedback extortion attempt.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
Here comes trouble ... unfortunately.
No refund make them go through eBay but let him know extortion is a crime.
I’d be contacting eBay before replying. If he wants to return (and you allow them) that’s fine, but extortion like this is not. Whatever happens, he’d already be blocked and I’d be happy to block him, too, if I got his ID.
I'd love to know the ebay name of this person so I can add it to my block list.
block him. Never want to deal with buyer like this.
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He described the problem, but he was mis-informed that the raw item (exonumia) would receive no-grade "details" because of tiny imperfections.
I've seen far worse exonumia that straight-grades. But that doesn't matter, because PCGS & ATS don't slab that exonumia. And it's too big for an ANACS slab, so that's a non-starter too.
I'll likely offer a refund -- but return shipping is on his dime. And to cover my shipping costs, maybe a re-stocking fee?
Successful BST transactions with forum members thebigeng, SPalladino, Zoidmeister, coin22lover, coinsarefun, jwitten, CommemKing.
While the message from the buyer is probably in violation of eBay policy, I don’t think it reaches the level of a crime.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
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Thank you. I'll report him. And block him too.
Successful BST transactions with forum members thebigeng, SPalladino, Zoidmeister, coin22lover, coinsarefun, jwitten, CommemKing.
No restocking fee - that’s an overreaction
Full refund or nothing
While the part you quoted is still unacceptable and I thought there may be more to the email, presented as “this is what the buyer sent” makes your OP a bit disingenuous. I’m not giving a pass to the feedback comment, and in general I’m against partial refunds unless I screwed up, but I think additional context should be provided up front in this kind of scenario.
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My apologies, you're right. I should've provided more context up front.
But I literally spent the last 5 hours crafting a reply to the ebay message (which I haven't sent yet), and I didn't want this thread to get bogged down with a lengthy discussion of all the mis-information.
Of course, there are 2 sides to every story. But what he wrote just felt wrong, and I wasn't sure how to best deal with it.
And I really appreciate all the replies. VERY helpful, thanks to all.
Successful BST transactions with forum members thebigeng, SPalladino, Zoidmeister, coin22lover, coinsarefun, jwitten, CommemKing.
If it was me, I'd probably craft a reply too, discard it and then send this to the buyer: "I'm sorry you're not happy with the item. You are welcome to return it for a refund."
If push comes to shove, he'll almost certainly be able to force you to take it back and you might even have to pay for the return postage. If you make it easy enough to return the item, he may willingly pay the return cost.
edited to add... To clarify the "If push comes to shove..." part, I had a buyer once who admitted to lying about the reason he requested a return in order to force me to pay the return postage. I contacted eBay CS, they agreed with me that the buyer was in violation of their policy, yet still required that I pay the return postage.
As suggested above, offer a full refund. If he reports the item as a SNAD, you'll be on the hook for postage anyway.
Take the hit, block, move on.
This.
If the coin is raw and has some problems, he is within his rights to return it, especially if the imperfections were not fully disclosed. It's simply not worth arguing over.
Do not get into a back and forth with the guy, you can only lose as the seller, offer the refund and forget about trying to put conditions on the return, restocking fee etc... If you do that he will just file a SNAD and you will be on the hook anyway, offer the return, block and move on.
My Collection of Old Holders
Never a slave to one plastic brand will I ever be.
That’s where more background helps. If you want advice for writing a reply, knowing that there’s an issue (however petty or illegitimate) leads to a different response than a message out of the blue asking for 50% off. Knowing there’s an issue in his mind, I agree with the others about offering the return. I’d still talk to eBay to be on record so if he leaves poor feedback you’re in a better position to be protected.
You don’t have to tell him that, it’s called a bluff and in general I do believe extortion is a crime.
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I like it. Succinct and to the point.
Done.
And after reading ebay's Feedback Extortion Policy, I also blocked the buyer and reported him to ebay.
Successful BST transactions with forum members thebigeng, SPalladino, Zoidmeister, coin22lover, coinsarefun, jwitten, CommemKing.
The goal here is to get the buyer to go away and not leave bad feedback. Anything you do that can be poking the bear may hurt your chances of a positive resolution. This is where I work with eBay to protect me, and I give the buyer as little ammo as possible to make me need eBay’s help.
if i were u
^ I'm late to this party. But .... what they all said ^
High tail it out of there and be done with such customers.
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I’d pay the shipping costs in order to be done with the problem.
just curious (although it should not matter) ... was this an auction or BIN?
another eBay idiot.
BHNC #203
I'll withhold final judgement until I can see the original eBay listing and the full communication between the buyer and seller. I've seen too many eBay listings that are misleading including pics that purposely hide defects on the coin.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
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BIN fixed price, no "make offers".
Successful BST transactions with forum members thebigeng, SPalladino, Zoidmeister, coin22lover, coinsarefun, jwitten, CommemKing.
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If ebay says shipping is on me, right now my headache says just pay it and move on.
Successful BST transactions with forum members thebigeng, SPalladino, Zoidmeister, coin22lover, coinsarefun, jwitten, CommemKing.
Link to report a buyer to ebay
Be sure to use the words "feedback extortion."
He obviously wants to keep the item. Tell him no partial refund, return for full refund. He may buckle.
PM me the buyer's ID, I don't want to deal with him.
I realize we see 'bad' ebay experiences here, and there are likely thousands of good experiences that do not get reported. That being said, I do not think I would like being an ebay seller. I spent a career in business dealing with both supplier generated issues and customer issues... At least those were done in a direct manner with full, open communications. No third party involvement. Plus, the product and sale were backed up by specifications and contract. All of which contributes to a more reasonable negotiation. Ebay issues do not seem like that. Cheers, RickO
I agree with contacting eBay. My reply would be to tell him to return the item within the parameters of the return privilege for a full refund and your company policy is to not do partial refunds.
How easy is it to do 'partial' refunds now that eBay is controlling the money? I remember with PAYPAL it was rather easy.
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Here's the listing: https://www.ebay.com/itm/224876836148
The buyer's complaint was the "damage" in this area, specifically at the base of the 'V' and 'R' in SILVER.
I took the above photo upon receipt of the token in 2017. It was stored in an Airtite capsule ever since.
I'm reluctant to post the buyer's photos & message on an open forum. But I forwarded the info to a forum member; maybe he'll post his opinion here if he thinks it's appropriate.
Successful BST transactions with forum members thebigeng, SPalladino, Zoidmeister, coin22lover, coinsarefun, jwitten, CommemKing.
It looks like the buyer is nit picking some microscopic defect so he can extort money from you. Block him and offer a refund if he returns the coin and report him to eBay for "feedback extortion" and then move on. I'm guessing he'll keep the coin.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
I had a winning bidder claim that I had opened a mint sealed package that hadn't been opened, and actually barely touched. He was from Mississippi. I.learned a lot from this transaction. Basically ebay was all for the buyer, and all against the seller. I gave up. Things like "returns not accepted " mean nothing.
The buyer opened the package and claimed because there were no pieces of styrofoam in the box, but claimed the styrofoam had been replaced with paper(yes the mint does that), and the exterior box had tape on it(yes the mint does that), that that meant I had opened it. I should give you the buyers I d. He sounded like a pro at this game.
When he returned it for a refund, was it still unopened? I'm not sure why the buyer being from Mississippi is relevant.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
The buyer will not be able to get one nicer or cheaper, his loss.
It looks like two die chips so it's not damage. I'm guessing he'll keep the coin.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
Are you sure? By my eye, those marks do't match what is shown in the eBay listing.
As others have said, facts don't matter here. eBay will side with the buyer. Offer a full refund on receipt of the original, and report the buyer for feedback extortion.
It’s simple. The only nuisance is it can be a few extra clicks to get to the page where you can do it because eBay changed what links are on what various pages within the transaction. I routinely give them out when buyers pay extra shipping before I’ve combined their wins.
It looks like the same piece (no pun intended) to me.
Regardless, if your time is worth anything then there is no win with a buyer like this. Offer a full refund or keep the item and send a feedback extortion notice to ebay. Then move on.
In honor of the memory of Cpl. Michael E. Thompson
It's even easier.
This may not be the direction you want to go (and it may not work), but with @dcarr being here on the boards, perhaps he could write a quick note that says the "damage" is a normal part of the minting process and not actually damage.
Look what's on the BST forum: https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/1072779/want-to-trade-dan-carr-hard-luck-for-1970-peace-over-strike#latest
Successful BST transactions with forum members thebigeng, SPalladino, Zoidmeister, coin22lover, coinsarefun, jwitten, CommemKing.
Wow!!
small world...
Thank you, Heavenly Father, for first loving us.
"Look what's on the BST forum:"
No mention of damage.
Due to the large diameter of those and the excessive striking forces required, the far outer rim did not always strike out fully. Sometimes a little bit of planchet irregularity can show. It is hard to tell from your photo, but it is possible that there are a couple small flakes or flaps of loose silver there. Using a fingernail or other moderately hard tool, you might be able to pick them off. Or maybe they are little dings in the edge of the planchet that didn't strike out.