Provenance vs Pedigree
DrDarryl
Posts: 604 ✭✭✭✭✭
I've been reading several entries as it relates to provenance and pedigree on the US Coin Forum.
I required clarification of these two terms for an upcoming US numismatic presentation (Money Talks). I did not find any good numismatic sources that could explain the differences as it applies to US numismatics, so I made the effort to clarify these two terms.
Term "provenance"
Term "pedigree"
Clarifying "provenance"
Clarifying "pedigree"
Examples of pedigree
Pedigree is easier to prove than provenance. Both provide a "wow" factor for the specimen at hand. However, proving provenance is a difficult task for a collector and for a numismatist it is a challenge.
There are ways to establish provenance rather quickly. In these examples, I purchased the items (plural) from the estate of a politician. Items redacted for privacy.
Another provenance example. This from another estate sale.
Comments
PCGS is a good source
https://www.pcgs.com/lingo/p
While the terms "provenance" and "pedigree" are sometimes used synonymously, I believe that typically - though not always - the former refers to objects, while the latter refers to living things.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
To me, provenance implies proof of originality or authenticity by means of tracing an item back to its original source, for example.
Pedigree is just a record of the last owner, or a list of past owners.
If I own a rare antique object and I go to sell it, it can be pedigreed to me, but my ownership would not (usually) represent provenance.
Provenance can exist independent of pedigree.
For example, documentation or evidence that a particular stovepipe hat belonged to Abraham Lincoln is provenance. The hat's owner or owners are the pedigree.
But it is not always a clear distinction between the two terms.
Good work, but in my view, you are leaning too heavily on the phrase "conferring distinction" in this particular dictionary.
My view is the same as @MFeld, so I always use "provenance" for coins (and art).
Pedigree is for dogs and horses, plus the "Pedigree chart" in genealogy of persons (aka "family tree" or "ancestor chart").
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pedigree_chart
Pedigree should be reserved for horses and dogs (or other living things describing a birth lineage) . Provenance is an ownership history of an item.
Latin American Collection
I rather enjoyed the description and distinctions made in the OP. While it may be a little bit fast and loose at times, I like where he's going with drawing firmer lines.
TurtleCat Gold Dollars
There's a good reason why it's not called "Provenance".
https://www.google.com/search?q=pedigree+dog+food&rlz=1C1GCEB_enUS873US873&sxsrf=APq-WBtbs7kwfBLi6eRNcktHX4Xyuf6UIw:1646138995003&tbm=isch&source=iu&ictx=1&vet=1&fir=P1AlMrPU2jxyiM%2CJiWmddGmQ0QTsM%2C%2Fm%2F02njp8&usg=AI4_-kRzkZ3Oevj5JCtFTiYET2_ElDwdpA&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjv0LDQ-aT2AhVIJTQIHSkXCZIQ_B16BAgoEAI&biw=1745&bih=852&dpr=1.1#imgrc=P1AlMrPU2jxyiM
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
I agree with @MFeld... Provenance is for inanimate materials and pedigree is for people or animals. Just the way I have always used the terms. Being both a collector (of several types of objects) and a horse, dog, cat owner, that has been my usage over many, many years. Cheers, RickO
Pedigree
Can we say John Work Garrett comes from a strong collector pedigree?
As per the technical terminology, provenance would be the place of origin and that would be the Mint then right?
And as others have mentioned, pedigree would be more lineage of live things, animals etc.
Perhaps it is time for the "coinage" of a new word?
https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/u-s-coins/quarters/PCGS-2020-quarter-quest/album/247091
I don't think of provenance as place of origin. To me it is some sort of history that makes it special.
pedigree/provenance...penny/cent...
Yes, the former is technically incorrect. It's a waste of time to try convincing someone, though.
Well, if it's a six or seven figure coin, it's got to be provenance, pronounced correctly with a French accent, bien sûr.