What provenance would make you buy sight unseen?
DCW
Posts: 7,476 ✭✭✭✭✭
There are certain names in the hobby, I'm sure, that when attached to a piece would make a person buy it without the need to examine it.
You simply know the quality is there.
In the absence of an in person examination, I'm sure everyone would like to at least see a photo or two before making a purchase. But is there any provenance that you accept as "good as gold?"
For me, anything out of the personal collection of the late Steve Tanenbaum is going to be of superior quality. If not extremely eye appealing, it is almost certainly the very best that was out there in his many years of searching, dealing, and upgrading his own collection. I need no further info except the price. 😆
Your thoughts?
Dead Cat Waltz Exonumia
"Coin collecting for outcasts..."
Comments
None. There’s no guarantee that you’ll like a particular coin, regardless of its provenance. And that’s even if most others would love it.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
Gold CAC
None. I'm just not big into provenance. It can be interesting history of the coin but not worth any real premium to me. However, if I had one that had a great provenance I'd be excited to sell it to someone who does afford it a premium...
No one said anything about attaching a premium to the provenance. That is a different discussion.
I'm asking if there is a provenance that someone believes in to the extent that they know it is the very best.
In other words, "If it is good enough for their collection, it's good for mine."
The example I quoted is pretty solid in exonumia.
Dead Cat Waltz Exonumia
"Coin collecting for outcasts..."
TomB, Roadrunner
None, I place no value or importance to any provenance, no photo or in hand look then no dice.
My Collection of Old Holders
Never a slave to one plastic brand will I ever be.
From the 1971 STACK'S - Massachusetts Historical Society Collection of Foreign and Ancient coins, Featuring the Collection of President John Quincy Adams. I have a few foreign pieces with the original flips. No guarantee that they were in the former President's collection and no guarantee of quality, but still pretty cool!
I agree with the Tanenbaum comment, but nothing else comes to mind as guaranteeing quality.
Tom
None.
None.
Couldn’t care less about provenance.
I don’t think there is any provenance that I would buy sight unseen…that said there are certain dealers and board members tastes /coins always appeal to me that I would consider buying sight unseen.
Maybe ironically, there are a few provenance where my tastes run very different and I don’t want any of their tokens in my collection.
TDN, assuming I had TDN money.
Not really. I’ve got to like the coin and while someone I respect likes it, it’s about my satisfaction that matters.
"Got a flaming heart, can't get my fill"
@RYK gold. I've done it a couple of times when Doug Winters offered some of the collection. Sold one of the two (for exactly what I paid), kept the other:
Sight unseen, you'll get sight-unseen money, regardless of provenance.
Keeper of the VAM Catalog • Professional Coin Imaging • Prime Number Set • World Coins in Early America • British Trade Dollars • Variety Attribution
I still own the third in the trio, the 1909-S $20 in PCGS 64+ CAC. All three coins were in the Crawford Collection (another doc, BTW), prior to Simpson (to me to you).
None. I know what I like, and that does not always match up with some of the expert opinions.
And I got burned on the first and only gold CAC coin that I purchased.
As I will most likely never have one of the big boy coins, I do know that if a crazyhounddog coin came up for sale, I trust his coin selection to begin with and would have no problem bidding sight unseen.
Jim
When a man who is honestly mistaken hears the truth, he will either quit being mistaken or cease to be honest....Abraham Lincoln
Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it.....Mark Twain
Can you tell us about it or is the memory too painful?
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"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
Normally you’ll get nice coins but I recently ran into a quarter that suggested otherwise. It was likely undergraded but had negative eye appeal (at least to me).
If we are speaking about tokens/so-called dollars sight unseen, I’d be fairly happy with quite a few from the @Zoins or @coinsarefun collection
I'd be willing to roll the dice on any James A. Stack coin, betting it would be amazing....Pretty sure I'd be happy with the outcome. I also very much like the current collector "Young-Dakota" as he generally has proofs of exceedingly high quality. I'll also throw Eugene Gardner into the mix. From what I have seen of his coins, they were generally spectacular. Same with Pete Shireman, and Duckor as far as Barbers.
Every major collector has had his or her fair share of dreck. I don’t believe in sight unseen buying in most cases.
With decent pics...too many to list.
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Wow, such a nice compliment……I’m honored. Just so happens I’m listing a bunch of stuff on the bst.
And will be for sometime to come.
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CoinsAreFun Toned Silver Eagle Proof Album
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Gallery Mint Museum, Ron Landis& Joe Rust, The beginnings of the Golden Dollar
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More CoinsAreFun Pictorials NGC
It is a Christopher Bechtler gold dollar, 30 G. variety. PCGS graded the coin EF-40. CAC put a gold sticker on it indicating that it was conservatively graded. The implication is it's better than EF-40. I paid the price of an AU based on that grading.
When I got the stars out of my eyes and really looked at the piece, I decided that PCGS got it right and CAC got it wrong. The coin had been brushed and was hairlined. I think that EF-40 is the right grade. It's nothing higher than that.
I like gold dollars and have a fair sized collection of them, including a date and mint set of the Type I and Type II designs. I like this piece for the history and the fact that it has no major damage. Many of these coins do seem to be bent and messed up. What I don't like is the price paid based on the CAC sticker.
When the question was posed, I thought that we were talking about buying coins without pictures. That I would never do. ** I have bought many coins from the pictures posted on the Internet, especially during the pandemic. I have only been disappointed and returned one item over the past couple of years. I have a gotten pretty good at judging coins from GOOD photos.
** Woops! I just thought of an exception. Years ago I bought some tokens based up the dealer's grade with no pictures. The dealer was Steve Hayden. His grading almost always matches mine to a "T."
I love learning stuff like this, and fabulous coin. It sounds like if I ever sell, that I'll need to find a doctor who wants it.
Any CAC.
If I had to choose one....Maybe Jack Lee or Newman/Green...
Sometimes, it’s better to be LUCKY than good. 🍀 🍺👍
My Full Walker Registry Set (1916-1947):
https://www.ngccoin.com/registry/competitive-sets/16292/
None.
A coin removed from the grasp of George Washington's metacarpal bones. But that's just me. Peace Roy
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If I had to choose, I would say David Akers and Eric Newman.
If I had to choose, Pogue
If I had to choose, I’d go with the Oliver Jung collection. While it had the advantage of being a relatively small collection, coin for coin and relative to the assigned grades, I think it was the finest collection I’ve seen.
https://www.pcgs.com/auctionprices/auctionsaledetails/american-numismatic-rarities/oliver-jung-collection/firmid/10002/saleid/-4038365833384066588
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
I saw and am following to see if there is something I want.
I'm enjoying my last pickup (the Prima Beer token).
None. First of all, provenance is not important to me.... Other than if the coin has been in my family. Second, I want to see the coin... preferably in hand, but excellent pictures (and seller reputation) could suffice. I know what I like, and have seen coins in collections with reputation and good grades, that, quite frankly, do not appeal to me. Like art and beauty, it is a personal thing... Cheers, RickO
Rather than provenance, I would actually buy sight unseen from a trusted member. As an example, if @DCW sent me a PM about a new token ... I would strongly consider buying based upon his description only. Several other members from BST and this board also fall into that category.
Top 10 Cal Fractional Type Set
successful BST with Ankurj, BigAl, Bullsitter, CommemKing, DCW(7), Downtown1974, Elmerfusterpuck, Joelewis, Mach1ne, Minuteman810430, Modcrewman, Nankraut, Nederveit2, Philographer(5), Realgator, Silverpop, SurfinxHI, TomB and Yorkshireman(3)
Eliasberg is generally out of my league but I'd buy one just to have it if the price wasn't too crazy.
Some saints were very rare in his day that are not that way now.
He had a few low grade saints in his collection that set collectors probably wouldn't be too interested in today.
My Saint Set
Lordmarcovan..
Outside of that none.
My grading skills are unparalleled.
Couple that with a true understanding of what spectacular eye appeal is,
a collection that consists only of truly rare specimens, and you've eliminated any need for further provenance but my own.
TomB
In honor of the memory of Cpl. Michael E. Thompson
Hmmm, now where might one find TomB provenance coins for sale these days. As I am sure there are a few on the board who would agree and like to add some?
When Doug Winter recommends a gold coin, I listen and buy.
Successful BST with drddm, BustDMs, Pnies20, lkeigwin, pursuitofliberty, Bullsitter, felinfoel, SPalladino
$5 Type Set https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/u-s-coins/type-sets/half-eagle-type-set-circulation-strikes-1795-1929/album/344192
CBH Set https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/everyman-collections/everyman-half-dollars/everyman-capped-bust-half-dollars-1807-1839/album/345572
I've never turned down a coin offered to me from Cardinal. I'd likely feel the same about an offing from TDN.
mark
Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
None. I don't buy coins sight unseen. I do not care about provenance. If I don't like the look of the coin, I don't buy it,
I don't care about provenance but would buy sight unseen from a few of my trusted advisors.
Thanks @U1chicago! It's great to get such a great compliment and be in such good company with Stef! Finding nice tokens and so-calleds is a passion!
This Garrett went for more than triple guide.
I would sight unseen buy (any I could afford) Bass patterns. It's not because I expect these to be stunning coins, though many are, but because I admire the man and his generous contributions to numismatics.
Ok, for the reframed question, I would still say none. Even if I’ve seen pictures in the past (because the coin is famous enough) I’d still not buy simply because it was in someone’s collection before. I have to see it. In fact, other than for a few thing I can’t find any other way I’m largely abandoning picture only purchases.