@gorilla glue 4 said:
Just for the record,Beltre had a higher WAR,more hits and HR's then Chipper.
>
Since Beltre had about 1500 more Plate Appearances, he should have some higher totals.
Chipper had a .930 OPS and a 141 OPS+.
Adrian had a .819 OPS and a 116 OPS+
They both struck out about the same, Chipper drew about twice as many walks, hit more doubles and home runs, scored and drove in more runs during an average 162 game season. For his career Jones walked more times than he struck out, pretty amazing to me for a guy who was a "slugger".
Beltre's defense was significantly better, but Chipper "wins" all the batting numbers including oWAR where he's at 88.3 to Adrian's 71.6.
For me, I like a guy at 3rd who crushes the ball. Chippers SLG is fantastic at .529 (highest all-time at 3rd base), Adrian's is at a very good .480 (11th).
Beltre had a .960 to .954 advantage in fielding percentage at 3rd.
If my math is correct that's about 2.5 less errors a season based on 400 chances?
Looks like Chipper is a bit better on the basepaths too, but I don't think that matters too much.
Beltre is certainly an all time great. If you value fielding and longevity, I could see someone ranking him as high as 3rd all time.
Jones seems way under rated to me. He's number 1 all time in OPS and SLG, number 2 in OBP and RBI, number 3 in OPS+ and walks, number 4 in HR and number 5 in hits.
2013,14 and 15 Certificate Award Winner Harmon Killebrew Master Set and Master Topps Set
I'm a little bit old school I suppose but I have it at:
Schmidt
Brooks
Matthews
Brett
Jones
Beltre
Boggs
Brooks is just an enigma and I can not rate him lower. It wouldn't feel right
m
Walker Proof Digital Album Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
@brad31 said:
I think Mathews is number 2 and a cut above Beltre, Brett, Boggs and Jones. He is very underrated decades of playing most of his career with Aaron.
For me it is
Schmidt
Mathews
Brett
Boggs
Beltre
Jones
However, 3-6 are so close I can be convinced any if the four are 3rd.
This assumes someone has to have played the majority of games at 3B. A-Rod has over 1000 games at 3B and would be my number 1. However he played more games at SS.
Fun discussion.
This ^
Schmidt is one for sure and people need to look at Matthew’s numbers again - had some monster years. Also, any list without Brooks is not valid. Ishtar get some who say his offense was average, but he does have an MVP award and if his offense was average and he is in the discussion for GOAT 3b thst tells you how good his defense was.
His offense was a lot better than average. His 105 OPS+ puts him in a group with Javier Baez, Ruben Sierra, Joe Carter, Lance Parrish, and Johnny Damon. Not close to being HoF-worthy on its own, but still way above average. It is difficult to make the case that anyone else had a bigger contribution defensively. In my mind his value is a toss-up with Jones for sixth. Schmidt is clearly number 1, Mathews less clearly but solidly number two, then a small step down to Boggs, Beltre, and Brett is some order, then another step down to Jones, Robinson, and Santo, despite the fact that the three are complete opposites, or rather Jones and Robinson are opposites and Santo is a happy medium.
There is a reason that Brooks Robinson was called the Human Vacuum Cleaner. His defense was stellar and second to none. He was MVP of the 1970 WS mostly because of his defense in which practically no ball got by him and some plays were just spectacular and truly unbelievable. Fittingly...the 1970 WS ended with a routine groundball off the bat of Pat Corrales to...you guessed it, Brooks Robinson. And my beloved Cincinnati Reds had lost...4 games to 1.
@Ahmanfan said:
Where does Rolen rank? His defense was awesome.
Another step down, IMO, with Molitor and Edgar Martinez, who actually played quite a bit of third. Nettles is possibly also in this group.
It's probably pretty close between Rolen and Buddy Bell as to who was third best defensively after Robinson and Beltre. Rolen only won eight gold gloves because he played at a time when third base defense was overall very good, but he strongly stands out.
@Ahmanfan said:
Where does Rolen rank? His defense was awesome.
Top 10 for sure!
If he could have played another 5 years at the same level he would possibly be top 5. His SLG was a very impressive .490, behind only Jones, Schmidt and Mathews of the guys mentioned.
Hit about as well as Brett and was a superior fielder, but George was still crushing it at the age of 37, had he retired then, his numbers would look better.................no 3000 hits though.
2013,14 and 15 Certificate Award Winner Harmon Killebrew Master Set and Master Topps Set
@Ahmanfan said:
Where does Rolen rank? His defense was awesome.
Top 10 for sure!
If he could have played another 5 years at the same level he would possibly be top 5. His SLG was a very impressive .490, behind only Jones, Schmidt and Mathews of the guys mentioned.
Hit about as well as Brett and was a superior fielder, but George was still crushing it at the age of 37, had he retired then, his numbers would look better.................no 3000 hits though.
had Rolen played another 5 years, his totals would be better, but his rates would have fallen. the SLG would def. have gone down. he had fallen off at the end and he knew it.
@craig44 said:
for me, I have schmidt and brett at 1 and 2. but Beltre ranks very high for me, possibly 3rd because of the combination of elite defense and very very solid hitting. I would put boggs and either chipper or Matthews in to round out my top 5. chipper may rank 6th for me because of very poor defense.
You are CRIMINALLY under rating Mathews!
Ed was nearly the equal to Mike. Brett was a little lacking in the HR department with 1 HR for every 33 AB. Not good enough for a corner infield spot imo.
If you bring fielding into it and reduce the importance of being a "slugger", Boggs then becomes a better 3rd baseman than Brett, but not by much.
Beltre might have been the best fielder of the bunch, but his hitting was so far inferior to Jones', I couldn't say he was "better" than Chipper.
Joe- At the time Brett played in KC nobody you could put at third base was going to be a home run hitter,
besides Schmidt. And his HR totals would have been far less at Royals Stadium than road games.
Its funny that George isn't considered a power hitter because he had more extra base hits than
both Eddie Murray and Dave Winfield and those two both had more career plate appearances than George.
I won't get into ranking who was best but suffice to say Schmidt was just what the Phillies needed and
Brett was just what the Royals needed.
@Ahmanfan said:
Where does Rolen rank? His defense was awesome.
Another step down, IMO, with Molitor and Edgar Martinez, who actually played quite a bit of third. Nettles is possibly also in this group.
It's probably pretty close between Rolen and Buddy Bell as to who was third best defensively after Robinson and Beltre. Rolen only won eight gold gloves because he played at a time when third base defense was overall very good, but he strongly stands out.
@Ahmanfan said:
Where does Rolen rank? His defense was awesome.
Another step down, IMO, with Molitor and Edgar Martinez, who actually played quite a bit of third. Nettles is possibly also in this group.
It's probably pretty close between Rolen and Buddy Bell as to who was third best defensively after Robinson and Beltre. Rolen only won eight gold gloves because he played at a time when third base defense was overall very good, but he strongly stands out.
If you've got it close between Bell and Rolen then give it to the AL player because he didn't get to face
all those NL pitchers that took their turn at the plate. How many weak grounders did Rolen field compared
to hard shots from a DH that Bell faced.
@craig44 said:
for me, I have schmidt and brett at 1 and 2. but Beltre ranks very high for me, possibly 3rd because of the combination of elite defense and very very solid hitting. I would put boggs and either chipper or Matthews in to round out my top 5. chipper may rank 6th for me because of very poor defense.
You are CRIMINALLY under rating Mathews!
Ed was nearly the equal to Mike. Brett was a little lacking in the HR department with 1 HR for every 33 AB. Not good enough for a corner infield spot imo.
If you bring fielding into it and reduce the importance of being a "slugger", Boggs then becomes a better 3rd baseman than Brett, but not by much.
Beltre might have been the best fielder of the bunch, but his hitting was so far inferior to Jones', I couldn't say he was "better" than Chipper.
Joe- At the time Brett played in KC nobody you could put at third base was going to be a home run hitter,
besides Schmidt. And his HR totals would have been far less at Royals Stadium than road games.
Its funny that George isn't considered a power hitter because he had more extra base hits than
both Eddie Murray and Dave Winfield and those two both had more career plate appearances than George.
I won't get into ranking who was best but suffice to say Schmidt was just what the Phillies needed and
Brett was just what the Royals needed.
Brett was one of the all time greats, but his SLG was a bit lower than the guys I like and his fielding was fine, just not stellar.> @Darin said:
It's probably pretty close between Rolen and Buddy Bell as to who was third best defensively after Robinson and Beltre. Rolen only won eight gold gloves because he played at a time when third base defense was overall very good, but he strongly stands out.
If you've got it close between Bell and Rolen then give it to the AL player because he didn't get to face
all those NL pitchers that took their turn at the plate. How many weak grounders did Rolen field compared
to hard shots from a DH that Bell faced.
>
I would not put Buddy Bell in the top 10. Great fielder and decent hitter for average, but a SLG of .406 is way too low to be in the discussion, for me.
2013,14 and 15 Certificate Award Winner Harmon Killebrew Master Set and Master Topps Set
@craig44 said:
for me, I have schmidt and brett at 1 and 2. but Beltre ranks very high for me, possibly 3rd because of the combination of elite defense and very very solid hitting. I would put boggs and either chipper or Matthews in to round out my top 5. chipper may rank 6th for me because of very poor defense.
You are CRIMINALLY under rating Mathews!
Ed was nearly the equal to Mike. Brett was a little lacking in the HR department with 1 HR for every 33 AB. Not good enough for a corner infield spot imo.
If you bring fielding into it and reduce the importance of being a "slugger", Boggs then becomes a better 3rd baseman than Brett, but not by much.
Beltre might have been the best fielder of the bunch, but his hitting was so far inferior to Jones', I couldn't say he was "better" than Chipper.
Joe- At the time Brett played in KC nobody you could put at third base was going to be a home run hitter,
besides Schmidt. And his HR totals would have been far less at Royals Stadium than road games.
Its funny that George isn't considered a power hitter because he had more extra base hits than
both Eddie Murray and Dave Winfield and those two both had more career plate appearances than George.
I won't get into ranking who was best but suffice to say Schmidt was just what the Phillies needed and
Brett was just what the Royals needed.
Brett was one of the all time greats, but his SLG was a bit lower than the guys I like and his fielding was fine, just not stellar.> @Darin said:
It's probably pretty close between Rolen and Buddy Bell as to who was third best defensively after Robinson and Beltre. Rolen only won eight gold gloves because he played at a time when third base defense was overall very good, but he strongly stands out.
If you've got it close between Bell and Rolen then give it to the AL player because he didn't get to face
all those NL pitchers that took their turn at the plate. How many weak grounders did Rolen field compared
to hard shots from a DH that Bell faced.
>
I would not put Buddy Bell in the top 10. Great fielder and decent hitter for average, but a SLG of .406 is way too low to be in the discussion, for me.
JoeBanzai- The Buddy Bell, Scott Rolen discussion was strictly defensively. Daltex said it was close who was
3rd best defensively behind Brooks and Beltre and I said I would pick Bell over Rolen because he faced a lot of tough
Designated hitters in the AL as opposed to pitchers in the NL.
Curious who would you have as top 5 defensively? I guess I might throw in Aurelio Rodriguez in the top 5.
I actually don't know much about his stats but I know that's how he got in the lineup, because he was one
of the best defensively. Also Nolan Arenado probably deserves a mention as one of the best defensively
even though he is an NL guy.
@craig44 said:
for me, I have schmidt and brett at 1 and 2. but Beltre ranks very high for me, possibly 3rd because of the combination of elite defense and very very solid hitting. I would put boggs and either chipper or Matthews in to round out my top 5. chipper may rank 6th for me because of very poor defense.
You are CRIMINALLY under rating Mathews!
Ed was nearly the equal to Mike. Brett was a little lacking in the HR department with 1 HR for every 33 AB. Not good enough for a corner infield spot imo.
If you bring fielding into it and reduce the importance of being a "slugger", Boggs then becomes a better 3rd baseman than Brett, but not by much.
Beltre might have been the best fielder of the bunch, but his hitting was so far inferior to Jones', I couldn't say he was "better" than Chipper.
Joe- At the time Brett played in KC nobody you could put at third base was going to be a home run hitter,
besides Schmidt. And his HR totals would have been far less at Royals Stadium than road games.
Its funny that George isn't considered a power hitter because he had more extra base hits than
both Eddie Murray and Dave Winfield and those two both had more career plate appearances than George.
I won't get into ranking who was best but suffice to say Schmidt was just what the Phillies needed and
Brett was just what the Royals needed.
Brett was one of the all time greats, but his SLG was a bit lower than the guys I like and his fielding was fine, just not stellar.> @Darin said:
It's probably pretty close between Rolen and Buddy Bell as to who was third best defensively after Robinson and Beltre. Rolen only won eight gold gloves because he played at a time when third base defense was overall very good, but he strongly stands out.
If you've got it close between Bell and Rolen then give it to the AL player because he didn't get to face
all those NL pitchers that took their turn at the plate. How many weak grounders did Rolen field compared
to hard shots from a DH that Bell faced.
>
I would not put Buddy Bell in the top 10. Great fielder and decent hitter for average, but a SLG of .406 is way too low to be in the discussion, for me.
JoeBanzai- The Buddy Bell, Scott Rolen discussion was strictly defensively.
>
Duly noted.
2013,14 and 15 Certificate Award Winner Harmon Killebrew Master Set and Master Topps Set
@craig44 said:
for me, I have schmidt and brett at 1 and 2. but Beltre ranks very high for me, possibly 3rd because of the combination of elite defense and very very solid hitting. I would put boggs and either chipper or Matthews in to round out my top 5. chipper may rank 6th for me because of very poor defense.
You are CRIMINALLY under rating Mathews!
Ed was nearly the equal to Mike. Brett was a little lacking in the HR department with 1 HR for every 33 AB. Not good enough for a corner infield spot imo.
If you bring fielding into it and reduce the importance of being a "slugger", Boggs then becomes a better 3rd baseman than Brett, but not by much.
Beltre might have been the best fielder of the bunch, but his hitting was so far inferior to Jones', I couldn't say he was "better" than Chipper.
Joe- At the time Brett played in KC nobody you could put at third base was going to be a home run hitter,
besides Schmidt. And his HR totals would have been far less at Royals Stadium than road games.
Its funny that George isn't considered a power hitter because he had more extra base hits than
both Eddie Murray and Dave Winfield and those two both had more career plate appearances than George.
I won't get into ranking who was best but suffice to say Schmidt was just what the Phillies needed and
Brett was just what the Royals needed.
Brett was one of the all time greats, but his SLG was a bit lower than the guys I like and his fielding was fine, just not stellar.> @Darin said:
It's probably pretty close between Rolen and Buddy Bell as to who was third best defensively after Robinson and Beltre. Rolen only won eight gold gloves because he played at a time when third base defense was overall very good, but he strongly stands out.
If you've got it close between Bell and Rolen then give it to the AL player because he didn't get to face
all those NL pitchers that took their turn at the plate. How many weak grounders did Rolen field compared
to hard shots from a DH that Bell faced.
>
I would not put Buddy Bell in the top 10. Great fielder and decent hitter for average, but a SLG of .406 is way too low to be in the discussion, for me.
JoeBanzai- The Buddy Bell, Scott Rolen discussion was strictly defensively. Daltex said it was close who was
3rd best defensively behind Brooks and Beltre and I said I would pick Bell over Rolen because he faced a lot of tough
Designated hitters in the AL as opposed to pitchers in the NL.
Curious who would you have as top 5 defensively? I guess I might throw in Aurelio Rodriguez in the top 5.
I actually don't know much about his stats but I know that's how he got in the lineup, because he was one
of the best defensively. Also Nolan Arenado probably deserves a mention as one of the best defensively
even though he is an NL guy.
Not sure if you're asking me to round out my top 5, but Jimmy Collins, Clete (not Ken) Boyer, and Schmidt have to be in the discussion. By the way, all the metrics correct for the Pitcher vs. DH dichotomy.
@Darin said:
>
Curious who would you have as top 5 defensively? I guess I might throw in Aurelio Rodriguez in the top 5.
I actually don't know much about his stats but I know that's how he got in the lineup, because he was one
of the best defensively. Also Nolan Arenado probably deserves a mention as one of the best defensively
even though he is an NL guy.
>
Brooks Robinson, Mike Schmidt, Rolen, Bell and I guess Arenado would be a good guess. Beltre and Rodriguez were great too.
I only really saw Brooks a lot, so the rest are primarily on Gold Gloves.
Gary Gaetti had a nice run for my Twins.
2013,14 and 15 Certificate Award Winner Harmon Killebrew Master Set and Master Topps Set
Rodriguez was unreal with his glove and arm. The best I ever saw besides Brooks
m
Walker Proof Digital Album Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
I'm liking all the recent posts except the ones that mention Graig Nettles.
Just kidding I know he was pretty dang good at third base but I just don't care
for the Yankees of that era as they had a bad habit of beating up on the
Royals In the AL championship series in the late seventies. Old grudges die hard.
@Darin said:
I'm liking all the recent posts except the ones that mention Graig Nettles.
Just kidding I know he was pretty dang good at third base but I just don't care
for the Yankees of that era as they had a bad habit of beating up on the
Royals In the AL championship series in the late seventies. Old grudges die hard.
@craig44 said:
my top 5 defensive 3B would be Brooks, Beltre, Schmidt, Bell and Arenado.
Brooks first for sure, the other 4 may be interchangeable.
I'd like to see another year or two at this high level from Arenado before putting him above Rolen. Nettles is definitely top ten.
you are probably right about Arenado. I think he is only 31 or so now. if he can age gracefully he will make it into the top 5. His metrics are fantastic as of now though. on further review, Rolen deserves Arenados spot. at least for now.
Hank Aaron (who got to play with him for several years) said that Clete was the best he ever saw. He prefaced that by saying that he only really got to see Brooks in ASGs but it's still high praise from one of the true immortals.
I am a Yankee fan and many say Nettles was just as good as Brooks at his peak. His range factors were always very high and I believe he still holds the record for most assists in a season by a third baseman with 412 in 1971 as an Indian and two years later another season with 410 breaking a Yankees record set by Clete Boyer. 1978 World Series he was on fire with game saving defensive plays.
@Mikeygiggs_336699 said:
I am a Yankee fan and many say Nettles was just as good as Brooks at his peak. His range factors were always very high and I believe he still holds the record for most assists in a season by a third baseman with 412 in 1971 as an Indian and two years later another season with 410 breaking a Yankees record set by Clete Boyer. 1978 World Series he was on fire with game saving defensive plays.
I actually agree with this. Peak Nettles is not much worse than peak Robinson. The problem is that Nettles was able to play at that high defensive level for only seven years while Robinson was able to do it for 17!
@StatsGuy said:
I also think that collectors value an All Star (and HOF) who played for one team his entire career. Not the norm anymore.
Never was. For every Jim Rice, Stan Musial, Lou Gehrig, Walter Johnson there were many Babe Ruth, Honus Wagner, Ty Cobb, Willie Mays, Hank Aaron, Harmon Killebrew, Pete Rose, Barry Bonds types.
@StatsGuy said:
I also think that collectors value an All Star (and HOF) who played for one team his entire career. Not the norm anymore.
Never was. For every Jim Rice, Stan Musial, Lou Gehrig, Walter Johnson there were many Babe Ruth, Honus Wagner, Ty Cobb, Willie Mays, Hank Aaron, Harmon Killebrew, Pete Rose, Barry Bonds types.
I have to agree with daltex but it could imply to the home team and the area. In the 80's I would give my Dad money to buy me Monk and Riggins rookies while on travel. Locally they would be hiked up in price at shops or at the Tyson's Corner Best Western shows.
Successful coin BST transactions with Gerard and segoja.
Successful card BST transactions with cbcnow, brogurt, gstarling, Bravesfan 007, and rajah 424.
Comments
>
Since Beltre had about 1500 more Plate Appearances, he should have some higher totals.
Chipper had a .930 OPS and a 141 OPS+.
Adrian had a .819 OPS and a 116 OPS+
They both struck out about the same, Chipper drew about twice as many walks, hit more doubles and home runs, scored and drove in more runs during an average 162 game season. For his career Jones walked more times than he struck out, pretty amazing to me for a guy who was a "slugger".
Beltre's defense was significantly better, but Chipper "wins" all the batting numbers including oWAR where he's at 88.3 to Adrian's 71.6.
For me, I like a guy at 3rd who crushes the ball. Chippers SLG is fantastic at .529 (highest all-time at 3rd base), Adrian's is at a very good .480 (11th).
Beltre had a .960 to .954 advantage in fielding percentage at 3rd.
If my math is correct that's about 2.5 less errors a season based on 400 chances?
Looks like Chipper is a bit better on the basepaths too, but I don't think that matters too much.
Beltre is certainly an all time great. If you value fielding and longevity, I could see someone ranking him as high as 3rd all time.
Jones seems way under rated to me. He's number 1 all time in OPS and SLG, number 2 in OBP and RBI, number 3 in OPS+ and walks, number 4 in HR and number 5 in hits.
I'm a little bit old school I suppose but I have it at:
Schmidt
Brooks
Matthews
Brett
Jones
Beltre
Boggs
Brooks is just an enigma and I can not rate him lower. It wouldn't feel right
m
Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
Bottom line is that the Brett is a classic RC and shame on me for not picking one up back in 2015 when I was going on my PSA 10 binge.
His offense was a lot better than average. His 105 OPS+ puts him in a group with Javier Baez, Ruben Sierra, Joe Carter, Lance Parrish, and Johnny Damon. Not close to being HoF-worthy on its own, but still way above average. It is difficult to make the case that anyone else had a bigger contribution defensively. In my mind his value is a toss-up with Jones for sixth. Schmidt is clearly number 1, Mathews less clearly but solidly number two, then a small step down to Boggs, Beltre, and Brett is some order, then another step down to Jones, Robinson, and Santo, despite the fact that the three are complete opposites, or rather Jones and Robinson are opposites and Santo is a happy medium.
Where does Rolen rank? His defense was awesome.
HOF SIGNED FOOTBALL RCS
There is a reason that Brooks Robinson was called the Human Vacuum Cleaner. His defense was stellar and second to none. He was MVP of the 1970 WS mostly because of his defense in which practically no ball got by him and some plays were just spectacular and truly unbelievable. Fittingly...the 1970 WS ended with a routine groundball off the bat of Pat Corrales to...you guessed it, Brooks Robinson. And my beloved Cincinnati Reds had lost...4 games to 1.
Checkout the last inning of the 1970 WS:
And this play at old Riverfront Stadium in the 1st Game of the '70 WS off the bat of Lee May, really? :
Check out this Brett! Such a shame Wolverine got to this card first!
https://www.ebay.com/itm/1975-George-Brett-Topps-Rookie-Card-/284579323382?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&_trksid=p2349624.m2548.l6249&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0
chipper liked hooters girls!!
Another step down, IMO, with Molitor and Edgar Martinez, who actually played quite a bit of third. Nettles is possibly also in this group.
It's probably pretty close between Rolen and Buddy Bell as to who was third best defensively after Robinson and Beltre. Rolen only won eight gold gloves because he played at a time when third base defense was overall very good, but he strongly stands out.
Top 10 for sure!
If he could have played another 5 years at the same level he would possibly be top 5. His SLG was a very impressive .490, behind only Jones, Schmidt and Mathews of the guys mentioned.
Hit about as well as Brett and was a superior fielder, but George was still crushing it at the age of 37, had he retired then, his numbers would look better.................no 3000 hits though.
had Rolen played another 5 years, his totals would be better, but his rates would have fallen. the SLG would def. have gone down. he had fallen off at the end and he knew it.
George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.
His highlight plays are so good. Good to hear his reputation is strong.
HOF SIGNED FOOTBALL RCS
Joe- At the time Brett played in KC nobody you could put at third base was going to be a home run hitter,
besides Schmidt. And his HR totals would have been far less at Royals Stadium than road games.
Its funny that George isn't considered a power hitter because he had more extra base hits than
both Eddie Murray and Dave Winfield and those two both had more career plate appearances than George.
I won't get into ranking who was best but suffice to say Schmidt was just what the Phillies needed and
Brett was just what the Royals needed.
If you've got it close between Bell and Rolen then give it to the AL player because he didn't get to face
all those NL pitchers that took their turn at the plate. How many weak grounders did Rolen field compared
to hard shots from a DH that Bell faced.
Why do Luka Doncic RCs cost more than Brett's?? Puzzling
Also what does this do for the price of unopened 1975 cello and rack prices?
They call me "Pack the Ripper"
Brett was one of the all time greats, but his SLG was a bit lower than the guys I like and his fielding was fine, just not stellar.> @Darin said:
>
I would not put Buddy Bell in the top 10. Great fielder and decent hitter for average, but a SLG of .406 is way too low to be in the discussion, for me.
JoeBanzai- The Buddy Bell, Scott Rolen discussion was strictly defensively. Daltex said it was close who was
3rd best defensively behind Brooks and Beltre and I said I would pick Bell over Rolen because he faced a lot of tough
Designated hitters in the AL as opposed to pitchers in the NL.
Curious who would you have as top 5 defensively? I guess I might throw in Aurelio Rodriguez in the top 5.
I actually don't know much about his stats but I know that's how he got in the lineup, because he was one
of the best defensively. Also Nolan Arenado probably deserves a mention as one of the best defensively
even though he is an NL guy.
>
Duly noted.
Not sure if you're asking me to round out my top 5, but Jimmy Collins, Clete (not Ken) Boyer, and Schmidt have to be in the discussion. By the way, all the metrics correct for the Pitcher vs. DH dichotomy.
>
Brooks Robinson, Mike Schmidt, Rolen, Bell and I guess Arenado would be a good guess. Beltre and Rodriguez were great too.
I only really saw Brooks a lot, so the rest are primarily on Gold Gloves.
Gary Gaetti had a nice run for my Twins.
Rodriguez was unreal with his glove and arm. The best I ever saw besides Brooks
m
Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
my top 5 defensive 3B would be Brooks, Beltre, Schmidt, Bell and Arenado.
Brooks first for sure, the other 4 may be interchangeable.
George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.
Nettles may not be in this class, but he had 3-4 years of stellar defense including during critical games.
Nettles was a great defensive player!
I'm liking all the recent posts except the ones that mention Graig Nettles.
Just kidding I know he was pretty dang good at third base but I just don't care
for the Yankees of that era as they had a bad habit of beating up on the
Royals In the AL championship series in the late seventies. Old grudges die hard.
And George Brett had a habit of beating up on Graig Nettles.
https://youtu.be/vbdvlX1j77w
I'd like to see another year or two at this high level from Arenado before putting him above Rolen. Nettles is definitely top ten.
you are probably right about Arenado. I think he is only 31 or so now. if he can age gracefully he will make it into the top 5. His metrics are fantastic as of now though. on further review, Rolen deserves Arenados spot. at least for now.
George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.
Hank Aaron (who got to play with him for several years) said that Clete was the best he ever saw. He prefaced that by saying that he only really got to see Brooks in ASGs but it's still high praise from one of the true immortals.
I am a Yankee fan and many say Nettles was just as good as Brooks at his peak. His range factors were always very high and I believe he still holds the record for most assists in a season by a third baseman with 412 in 1971 as an Indian and two years later another season with 410 breaking a Yankees record set by Clete Boyer. 1978 World Series he was on fire with game saving defensive plays.
I actually agree with this. Peak Nettles is not much worse than peak Robinson. The problem is that Nettles was able to play at that high defensive level for only seven years while Robinson was able to do it for 17!
1969 OPC Twins Rookies Stars
My #1 Brett 1976 card.
Carew, Brett, Boggs, Bostock, and Gwynn were my favorite hitters growing up.
The ability to hit to all fields and wield the bat like a magician by getting hits across the entire field was my jam.
Erik
wow. now that is a very solid example
George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.
I also think that collectors value an All Star (and HOF) who played for one team his entire career. Not the norm anymore.
Gretzky,Ripken, and Sandberg collection. Still trying to complete 1975 Topps baseball set from when I was a kid.
Never was. For every Jim Rice, Stan Musial, Lou Gehrig, Walter Johnson there were many Babe Ruth, Honus Wagner, Ty Cobb, Willie Mays, Hank Aaron, Harmon Killebrew, Pete Rose, Barry Bonds types.
I have to agree with daltex but it could imply to the home team and the area. In the 80's I would give my Dad money to buy me Monk and Riggins rookies while on travel. Locally they would be hiked up in price at shops or at the Tyson's Corner Best Western shows.
Successful card BST transactions with cbcnow, brogurt, gstarling, Bravesfan 007, and rajah 424.