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Palladium now cheaper than gold

OverdateOverdate Posts: 6,890 ✭✭✭✭✭

Latest prices are: palladium $1670, gold $1775.

Just two weeks ago palladium was over $2150, with gold about $1860.

Is industrial demand weakening, or are there other factors at play?

My Adolph A. Weinman signature :)

Comments

  • OPAOPA Posts: 17,103 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Automotive Industry related...Less vehicles using Catalytic Converters in the future.

    "Bongo drive 1984 Lincoln that looks like old coin dug from ground."
  • MsMorrisineMsMorrisine Posts: 32,037 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Wah

    Current maintainer of Stone's Master List of Favorite Websites // My BST transactions
  • blitzdudeblitzdude Posts: 5,282 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Fancy gutter, I'll take a look once it tanks to $500-$600. Glad I passed on those $3K palladium eagles. lol

    The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.

  • RobMRobM Posts: 524 ✭✭✭

    @OPA said:
    Automotive Industry related...Less vehicles using Catalytic Converters in the future.

    Not exactly, at least not yet. Recent price declines in Pd, Pt, and Rh are more the result of 8 million fewer light vehicles being produced this year due to chip shortages. Take a look at the typical new car dealer..... The vast majority of their inventory is used vehicles.

  • OPAOPA Posts: 17,103 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @RobM said:

    @OPA said:
    Automotive Industry related...Less vehicles using Catalytic Converters in the future.

    Not exactly, at least not yet. Recent price declines in Pd, Pt, and Rh are more the result of 8 million fewer light vehicles being produced this year due to chip shortages. Take a look at the typical new car dealer..... The vast majority of their inventory is used vehicles.

    I forgot to add the + between my sentences.

    BTW, I fully agree with your assessment along with Fed Chair.. J.P's. press conference indicating sooner than previously announced rate hikes with a warning on the current Covid 19 variance .

    "Bongo drive 1984 Lincoln that looks like old coin dug from ground."
  • RobMRobM Posts: 524 ✭✭✭

    I think what JP actually said was that the bond purchase taper is transitory. :D

  • rickoricko Posts: 98,724 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I will stick with gold.... always liquid, always valuable. Cheers, RickO

  • ReadyFireAimReadyFireAim Posts: 1,800 ✭✭✭✭✭

    If Pt goes under $900, I might feel the need to stack.

  • TwoSides2aCoinTwoSides2aCoin Posts: 43,757 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited December 2, 2021 6:47AM

    Gold has been suppressed for a while now.

  • I might get palladium once it goes lower.

  • FrankHFrankH Posts: 756 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @ricko said:
    I will stick with gold.... always liquid, always valuable. Cheers, RickO

    And ....always money.
    It's the only sensible physical metal to ....stack.

  • Platinum seems more liquid because it's used to make "white gold", so jewelry shops are always interested. It'll probably be a year before the chip shortage ends and prices rebound but it could double IMHO. I'm getting ready to add a few more ounces to my stash. :smile:

  • RobMRobM Posts: 524 ✭✭✭

    I went APE (american palladium eagle) this morning. Palladium got beaten up again over night. Might have a lot further to fall. But the US coin looks so much better than the one from the north. So I picked up just a few.

  • taxmadtaxmad Posts: 960 ✭✭✭✭

    @RobM said:
    I went APE (american palladium eagle) this morning. Palladium got beaten up again over night. Might have a lot further to fall. But the US coin looks so much better than the one from the north. So I picked up just a few.

    With a $150 bid/ask spread plus a $300 premium how are these to sell when the time comes? Seems like a lot of ground to cover just to get back to even

  • RobMRobM Posts: 524 ✭✭✭

    @taxmad,
    Well, put like that, it seems like I have the same issue as anyone that is purchasing silver eagles. The difference is that there is the possibility that Pd auto catalyst demand returns over the next year or two. There is very little slack in supply, so $2K prices could return quickly. Maybe in a couple years I'll sell them for $2,500 in the BST :p

  • taxmadtaxmad Posts: 960 ✭✭✭✭

    @RobM - i hope so! I have pondered dipping my toe in, but worry about the sell side using a local B&M. The BST may be a great alternative...

  • RobMRobM Posts: 524 ✭✭✭

    One of the bigger and more reputable B&Ms with very visible internet presence is an easy drive away for me. They provide online buy back prices for some bullion to include more common PGM bars and coins. It definitely helps. I don't even bother walking into any of the smaller LCSs when it comes to bullion.

  • pcgscacgoldpcgscacgold Posts: 2,595 ✭✭✭✭✭

    With Pd at $1600 an oz this morning I just can't get myself to pull the trigger for the $2750 UNC and PR coins. That is a super high premium for an UNC.

  • RobMRobM Posts: 524 ✭✭✭

    @pcgscacgold said:
    With Pd at $1600 an oz this morning I just can't get myself to pull the trigger for the $2750 UNC and PR coins. That is a super high premium for an UNC.

    Right now, unc eagles can be had for around $1,850, maple leafs around $1,725, if you can find them.

  • pcgscacgoldpcgscacgold Posts: 2,595 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @RobM said:

    @pcgscacgold said:
    With Pd at $1600 an oz this morning I just can't get myself to pull the trigger for the $2750 UNC and PR coins. That is a super high premium for an UNC.

    Right now, unc eagles can be had for around $1,850, maple leafs around $1,725, if you can find them.

    I did see a place with that price. I was listing the mint price. Not sure why someone would pay $2750 for an UNC 2021 when dealers are selling the same coin for under $1900.

  • RobMRobM Posts: 524 ✭✭✭

    Up 15% from recent low less than a week ago. From an individual investor perspective, there seems very little available to purchase, and most of it is 2021 eagles. The less expensive maple leafs are out of stock just about anywhere. The buy/sell difference on the maple leafs shoud be right around 12% right now, not sure about the eagles. The same bullion dealer would have a 20% spread on ASEs.

  • LukeMarshallLukeMarshall Posts: 1,881 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Thanks for the update on premiums, @RobM . I was wondering what kind of “deals” could be had right now

    It's all about what the people want...

  • OPAOPA Posts: 17,103 ✭✭✭✭✭

    That was short lived. Palladium back on top.

    "Bongo drive 1984 Lincoln that looks like old coin dug from ground."
  • RobMRobM Posts: 524 ✭✭✭

    Anyone else believe Pd going to reach $4-5K in next 3 years? Barring some kind of economic collapse, of course.

  • OverdateOverdate Posts: 6,890 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @RobM said:
    Anyone else believe Pd going to reach $4-5K in next 3 years? Barring some kind of economic collapse, of course.

    What would be the catalyst? (Pun intended.) Wouldn't that price create a massive shift to the cheaper platinum?

    My Adolph A. Weinman signature :)

  • RobMRobM Posts: 524 ✭✭✭
    edited January 26, 2022 1:07PM

    @Overdate said:

    @RobM said:
    Anyone else believe Pd going to reach $4-5K in next 3 years? Barring some kind of economic collapse, of course.

    What would be the catalyst? (Pun intended.) Wouldn't that price create a massive shift to the cheaper platinum?

    Over time, yes. But I am also confident that barring economic disaster (a distinct possibility), that Pt is on its way to $2K in the same timeframe. Pd being 2x the cost of Pt is justifiable, IMO, due to it being roughly half as dense. Companies,like BASF are working with miners to optimize the mix of PGMs in industrial applications.

    Oh...and the catalyst. I'm not sure. But I think that hybrid electric vehicle production will grow and remain strong for decades.

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