Thoughts on ANACS??
coinguy96
Posts: 44 ✭✭✭
I've noticed PCGS & NGC are around 3 months out on grading ECONOMY so it got me looking at ANACS, which has a 3-4 week turn around time. Would anyone send Franklin Proofs to ANACS? Thanks!
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Comments
It depends. Do you ever expect to sell them?
In honor of the memory of Cpl. Michael E. Thompson
Haha that's my concern! I would be looking to sell them... But I'm mostly wondering on coins around the PF 66-68 range, if they would bring around 70% of PCGS/NGC?
I've been around a long time and the market for ANACS certified coins (not the classic ANA-ANACS) is nil. No doubt someone will come on here to argue that they got a good price for a nice coin in a new ANACS holder, but the reality of the situation is that ANACS has very limited liquidity when compared to PCGS and NGC and the price you might expect for a coin in an ANACS holder isn't going to generally challenge the other coins. Regardless, proof Franklin half dollars are neither rare nor expensive, unless you plan on sending in DCAM coins or coins issued from the first few years, which means you have a loser resale coin (generic proof Franklins) in a more-or-less shunned holder (new ANACS) and you will living with them until you die.
Again, someone will no doubt argue my points, but it is the broader reality of the situation.
In honor of the memory of Cpl. Michael E. Thompson
Gotcha, yeah that's what I was concerned about... Maybe I will send the "middle of the pack" Proofs to ANACS and send the others to PCGS or NGC.
This sums it up very well.
Agree also. Many years ago, many many years ago, I had no issue with ANACs and preferred their smaller holders. As years went on, their grading deteriorated. My love affair with them ended when I had a 19th century silver coin, quite scarce, and I tried crossing it to PCGS, then NGC and then spoke to the graders in each company who both insisted that the coin had been altered, and explained to me why. I contacted ANACS. This was just before I think they ended up in bankruptcy or something disastrous like that. At first they considered living up to their guarantee, but then had other graders of theirs evaluate it and all agreed there was nothing wrong with it. That was my last ANACS coin, and forever shall be that way.
I have several coins slabbed by ANACS and the assigned grades are spot-on.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
Yeah I watched a few videos on YouTube & read the comments and it seemed like there were a lot of people who liked the ANACS coins 🤷♂️
I have not worked for ANACS since 1984, but I have remained friends with several of my successors. I am not familiar with any bankruptcy on the part of ANACS since it became an independent company, nor anything particularly disastrous. Could you please clarify your statement?
Tom, perhaps he is conflating ANACS with PCI? In both cases I would feel very comfortable purchasing an older slab, but would consider the newer generations to be less reliable.
Sean Reynolds
"Keep in mind that most of what passes as numismatic information is no more than tested opinion at best, and marketing blather at worst. However, I try to choose my words carefully, since I know that you guys are always watching." - Joe O'Connor
As a newbie is this where I’m supposed to be thinking “What about buy the coin not the slab” and maybe mention that I have several anacs slabs (new and old) that are fine grade wise. I have slabs from the top 3 that have turned in the holder but not any one more than the other. I have grades I question in all three so. Just my 2cents 😉
🎶 shout shout, let it all out 🎶
Here is timely video from Ben - The Coin Geek. Published today:
I really like ANACS for their early copper grading and attributions; actually started the "details grading" concept and were always spot on in my experiences.
Unfortunately can't comment on Franklins...
Without a real pop report, not sure how useful any grading service is other than for authentication. Just my opinion.
"Look up, old boy, and see what you get." -William Bonney.
If it's anything in the 1956-1963 date range, it usually doesn't make sense to grade proof Franklins that aren't cameo. Anacs examples might be 70% of PCGS/NGC but even PCGS/NGC are in the $25-$100 range for those dates (the $100 being for the earlier dates in PF68).
Take a look at eBay, Great Collections, and Heritage selling prices for the dates you have in the PF 66-68 range. Subtract the selling fee and grading cost; if that amount is near or below what a raw example sells for, there is no point in grading.
In the late 90's to early 2000's anacs was spot on for the most part and if you wanted anything attributed you went to them BUT, if you wanted to make your money back on a regular coin you went to PCGS. Who ever heard of cac?
I find that, for some series at least, ANACS is hardest on the coins these days when it comes to grades. It always comes down to the coins, not the holders, unless you are trying to sell them. I always liked the line my old friend, Mikey [DeFalco], had regarding it all. Especially the registry players, too many are paralyzed by plastic. That detracts from enjoying the hobby. But the reality is that the market is more receptive to PCGS. There are great coins and dogs in everyones' holders. The reason why the lesser market players look worse is because their best ones get crossed over to PCGS too often. Just like the OP here. Might send them to ANACS, even though they might grade just the same at PCGS but faster. They could end up later in PCGS holders. It's a crazy game.
I will buy the old small anacs or the blue ana holders.
Yes and no. If you know what you’re buying, go ahead and find the right coins in the wrong holders, but understand what the market is if you will sell later. If you are sending coins in, understand what the benefits and drawbacks are of a given service based on what you plan to do with your coins. Buy the coin not the holder is very much based on not ignoring coins because of the holder they’re in, rather than ignoring the market realities of certain holders or the odds of you are buying without seeing the coin in hand and knowing how to assess it yourself.
anacs is the kiss of death in prices realized on ebay. Actually , there grading is not bad, also thieir authentication is fine, but you dont want to sell them and expect any good prices. On morgans, Ive done better selling them raw on ebay than leave in the anacs holders
I have a few ANACS slabs and found their grading to be fairly accurate, but in the same token, the only wrong labelling coin I happen to have is also their's.
There is an 1899 O Morgan in my collection that is wrongly labelled as 1889 O and am going to keep that for posterity as a example of the shoddy TPG work
https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/u-s-coins/quarters/PCGS-2020-quarter-quest/album/247091
I just buy the cheap ones on great collections and flip for a profit on ebay.
Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value. Zero. Voltaire. Ebay coinbowlllc
Couple of years ago I sent ANACS 45 Morgan dollar VAMS. I pre attributed each one.
Got them all right. Five weeks later I received the coins back. At the Atlanta ANA 2020
I consigned them with Great Collections. All but five sold, most 75% over my reserve.
I was very pleased with ANACS and their service.
Recently sold a nice Mexico MS70 onza in beautiful anacs yellow holder got from GC. Made good money on it too.
It happens.
Lance.
Maybe it is the coin that is labeled wrong... 🤔
Still not half as bad as the CAC'd one in the above post
https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/u-s-coins/quarters/PCGS-2020-quarter-quest/album/247091
Yeah, that is amazing... I would have thought PCGS would double check that the label matched the coin before it went out to the door.
Recommendation - Don't give up your day job for a career in comedy. 🚮
Anacs, ICG, PCGS, NGC the 4 TPG accepted by eBay & GC. That’s good enough for me. I just price them whatever: cost +, TPG, CPG, CW Trends, CU. And of course negotiable based on room I have in them.
Beyond that don’t give a darn. Now if it’s some big ticket coin that justifies the expense I may submit to our hosts get same grade or higher.
I have seen the posts in here about TPG A vs B or C. Reminds me of a group of sorority girls at a coffee shop debating about brands of lipstick lol.
I like ANACS for Daniel Carr items. I may include some other coinage on my ANACS submission.
Successful BST with BustDMs , Pnies20, lkeigwin, pursuitofliberty, Bullsitter, felinfoel, SPalladino (CBH's - 37 Die Marriage's)
$5 Type Set https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/u-s-coins/type-sets/half-eagle-type-set-circulation-strikes-1795-1929/album/344192
CBH Set https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/everyman-collections/everyman-half-dollars/everyman-capped-bust-half-dollars-1807-1839/album/345572
I have one or two ANACS holders...Just because I wanted the particular coin. I do agree that for selling coins, that TPG is not a good one in general. The case for sales is well stated by @TomB and @airplanenut above. Cheers, RickO
In addition to the poor taste you exhibited in your sexist comment, it sounds like you're unaware of the significant differences that the right grading company can make in a great many instances.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
Currently, ANACS is one of the toughest graders out there-- and when I told them so, they asked me to let everyone know.
As far as I have seen, on circ coins they are usually a grade below me, and I try to be pretty tough.
But! They are very good on varieties. And their in house specialist is a pro on VAMs.
BHNC #203
FWIW... I've liberated a number of coins from ANACS slabs over the years. In the ballpark for grade and I got them at decent prices...
Edited to add... and I likely got them at decent prices because they were in ANACS plastic and bidding was slow...
Successful BST transactions with: SilverEagles92; Ahrensdad; Smitty; GregHansen; Lablade; Mercury10c; copperflopper; whatsup; KISHU1; scrapman1077, crispy, canadanz, smallchange, robkool, Mission16, ranshdow, ibzman350, Fallguy, Collectorcoins, SurfinxHI, jwitten, Walkerguy21D, dsessom.
Moursund is actually an alias for Jerry Seinfeld. Don't tell anyone...
I do not own any of ANACS coins.
I trust them to be accurate in authenticating a coin but not so on the grades.
Maybe someone here can tell us how their coins crossed over with PCGS grading.
I am not talking about a few coin submissions but someone with a history of doing so, say somewhere in the 20-30 item range or more.
IMO: ANACS coins sell for a lot less than NGC or PCGS so if the grading by ANACS is accurate, I would buy them at the lower price and then send them in to PCGS for a crossover.
Wayne
Kennedys are my quest...
I look at every TPG slabbed coin as what would it be worth raw?
So I'd pay full PCGS/NGC value for the right ANACS slabbed coin.
my thoughts on ANACS is I am impressed they are still in business. Grades are typically ok but the intangibles you rely on a TPG for aren't there.
11.5$ Southern Dollars, The little “Big Easy” set
Unfortunately I have found them lately to be behind the times in counterfeit detection and authentication...
I own several counterfeits in their holders; this example was struck from dies made from a holed/ repaired genuine coin and it's not this one...
They actually noted the suspected repair on mine but the source was repaired prior to the dies being made and is accounted for.
I consider the small white ANACS and the certificates era a different company with a mission statement that doesn't reflect what ANACS has turned into today.
peacockcoins
A group of identical date & denomination coins were sent to ANACS six or seven years ago, came back graded MS64 and MS65. All were cracked out, half sent to NGC and half to PCGS, where they graded MS66 and MS67. Not my coins, but I saw this happen.
There u go again with your quote hobby. Baaa! I don’t think coins are your hobby the quote game seems to be. I wonder if you did c the post above this one where 2 ANACS coins upgraded. Then calling me names wow. I don’t c u on Coin Talk. We’re u kicked off lol.
I hold some very nice early coins in small holders. Prices were at the low end of the spectrum but no giveaways. Love the holders and love the coins. I have a Mexican cob in a yellow holder, no point in moving it and have no clue how these very early coins are graded, only concerned that it is genuine and not messed with.
Take it to PM, eh? Or better yet, knock it off.
ANACS has been a very good option for me when they have $10/coin grading specials which includes return shipping ( ten coin minimum ) when I’ve sold relatively inexpensive coins on eBay.
I agree here. Their grading is satisfactory but if I buy an ANACS coin I discount it about 10 - 20%. Some just don't trust the holdered coins to be properly graded. They are harder to sell at full retail.
I have a question that occurs to me every time this subject comes up (and it often comes up) but what difference does it make if you sell an ANACS/PCI/raw coin at a discount to what it would bring in PCGS plastic? I mean, being that you KNOW coins and what they are worth you paid a discounted price when you bought it didn't you?
Take a coin that wholesales at 1000 dollars in PCGS plastic and retail at 1200. You discount your buy price by 10% and pay 900. You then sell for 1080 and make the same 20 percent.
That could be the case. But the original post was about submitting coins to ANACS (instead of another grading company), not selling coins that had been bought in ANACS holders.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
Undergrading coins is not a virtue. Being "tougher" than everyone else causes just as many problems as it solves.
As for me, I'll occasionally look at coins in ANACS slabs, but I have yet to buy one. Too much Kool-Aide? Perhaps, but I haven't lost much sleep over it. I have considered them for Dan Carr items.