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Supreme Court Justices’ Autographs

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    JBKJBK Posts: 14,789 ✭✭✭✭✭

    BTW, Blackmun was the only SC justice who ever sent me a letter with a secretarial signature. I did subsequently get a genuine letter from him.

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    JMS1223JMS1223 Posts: 1,100 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @JBK said:
    BTW, Blackmun was the only SC justice who ever sent me a letter with a secretarial signature. I did subsequently get a genuine letter from him.

    Very interesting. Didn’t know ANY Supreme Court Justices ever used secretarial. Always assumed either autopen, printed or authentic. Good to know secretarial is a possibility but rare.

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    JMS1223JMS1223 Posts: 1,100 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Just thought I should post the only known example of Ketanji Brown Jackson’s autograph here for reference. It was originally found on a long government document she signed. So far so other example have shown up and no one has received anything ttm.

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    JMS1223JMS1223 Posts: 1,100 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @JBK said:
    BTW, Blackmun was the only SC justice who ever sent me a letter with a secretarial signature.

    When you have a chance, would you please post a picture of the secretarial example you received so I/we can use it as reference? I am looking to buy Blackmun’s autograph and want to see the secretarial version he sent out so I know what to avoid.

    Thanks

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    JBKJBK Posts: 14,789 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @JMS1223 said:

    @JBK said:
    BTW, Blackmun was the only SC justice who ever sent me a letter with a secretarial signature.

    When you have a chance, would you please post a picture of the secretarial example you received so I/we can use it as reference? I am looking to buy Blackmun’s autograph and want to see the secretarial version he sent out so I know what to avoid.

    Thanks

    I'd be happy to but it's somewhere deep in the "stacks". If/when I come across it again I'll take a picture.

    I do recall that it was not a very convincing signature and I assumed it wasn't meant to fool anyone.

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    JBKJBK Posts: 14,789 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @JMS1223 said:

    Just thought I should post the only known example of Ketanji Brown Jackson’s autograph here for reference. It was originally found on a long government document she signed. So far so other example have shown up and no one has received anything ttm.

    Here is another example. ;)

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    JMS1223JMS1223 Posts: 1,100 ✭✭✭✭✭

    And two more I found:

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    JBKJBK Posts: 14,789 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Still no KBJ autographs listed on ebay and few if any examples on the internet in general. :)

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    JMS1223JMS1223 Posts: 1,100 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @JBK said:
    Still no KBJ autographs listed on ebay and few if any examples on the internet in general. :)

    Still very rare it seems but maybe after she’s been sworn after a while a few might show up. I haven’t seen any Amy Coney Barrett ones either except that one handwritten letter several months ago. I think I saw a printed letter for Barrett once that said it was her policy not to sign autographs.

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    JBKJBK Posts: 14,789 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Same for Brett Kavanaugh as far as I know.

    He didn't even sign (or return) the Supreme Court engraving I sent him at his prior court before he was confirmed. :/

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    JMS1223JMS1223 Posts: 1,100 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited June 20, 2022 1:43PM

    @JBK said:
    Same for Brett Kavanaugh as far as I know.

    He didn't even sign (or return) the Supreme Court engraving I sent him at his prior court before he was confirmed. :/

    I have actually NEVER seen an example of his signature. Would love to know what it looks like.

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    JMS1223JMS1223 Posts: 1,100 ✭✭✭✭✭

    FOUND ONE. Just an example but now we know what Brett Kavanaugh’s signature looks like:

    Definitely the rarest of all the current justices - he has never responded to ANYONE. At least Amy Coney Barrett had sent out a few autopen letters of rejection. And one authentic handwritten letter sent one month before she got on the Supreme Court. Other than that non-existent. We shall see how Ketanji Brown Jackson is once she’s been on the Supreme Court for a bit to test the waters.

    Some Justices have been known to be non-responsive then change signing habits years later (Breyer). Other times there will be the one or two random lucky responses but usually nothing (Scalia for example). And of course there are those that used to sign good ttm then stopped (RBG). And the constant good signers that have pretty much done it all the time (Thomas).

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    JBKJBK Posts: 14,789 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 1, 2022 3:15AM

    So as of noon today there is a new Supreme Court Justice. KBJ was sworn in at the same hour that Stephen Breyer's retirement became official.

    We'll see how/if KBJ responds as a SC Justice. Based on recent history involving new justices, she might be difficult or impossible to get. Time will tell.

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    JMS1223JMS1223 Posts: 1,100 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @JBK said:
    So as of noon today there is a new Supreme Court Justice. KBJ was sworn in at the same hour that Stephen Breyer's retirement became official.

    We'll see how/if KBJ responds as a SC Justuce. Based on recent history involving new justices, she might be difficult or impossible to get. Time will tell.

    I sent her a request at the Supreme Court a few weeks ago. I sent a small photo I made to be signed. I will let you know if she turns out to be a Justice that signs ttm or is reluctant from the start like many of the other recent Justices have been.

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    JMS1223JMS1223 Posts: 1,100 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Not an autograph but something I was planning to get autographed by a Supreme Court Justice, a First Day Cover. Typically these costs $2-$3 max. Well I found one I really liked and the seller had started bidding at one cent with $1 shipping, so I figured I would bid just over $5 thinking that way I don’t have to remember to bid and that if anyone else wanted it they would bid $2 and call it a day. Well I just put in my $5 bid a few minutes ago, and with 5 days to go, someone decided to bid. Not only did they bid and give up, but kept bidding until I got outbid. Definitely not worth $6 (after shipping). Sad it seems it’s even difficult to get cheap items off eBay. Seems like everything is competitive. Unfortunately it was the only FDC like it so no others to bid/buy. Oh well. I guess I will give up on that idea.

    I have a funny feeling if I bid $20 I would still get outbid. Not going to try it because definitely not worth that much to me, but just a thought.

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    JMS1223JMS1223 Posts: 1,100 ✭✭✭✭✭

    The Clarence Thomas dealer is making a killing right now. This 4x6 signed by him is ALREADY over $50 so that makes me wonder where it will end with FIVE days still to go. There was another Thomas also bid up with plenty of time left. I really hope this doesn’t cause Thomas to stop signing because I have something I want to send him to sign but knowing he’s on recess now I have to wait until the Fall to send it.

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    JMS1223JMS1223 Posts: 1,100 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Just saw an Elena Kagan 4x6 signed photo show up on eBay. Perhaps she DOES still sign. Really hoping this means I might still get my four Justice women photo back signed by her. I was fearing she recently stopped since the last ttm success I heard of occurred 6 months ago (took her usual turnaround time of a month) and everything after that had been pending according to another forum to which I belong. Fingers crossed. No idea if she is away for the summer recess or if perhaps it could show up during these summer months if she stays in DC this summer. Otherwise I will have to start hoping for it in the Fall.

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    JMS1223JMS1223 Posts: 1,100 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Just found this on eBay:

    https://ebay.com/itm/114720176004?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=wkRIoddpTi2&sssrc=2047675&ssuid=da4IlHDuTvG&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY

    It says Clarence Thomas is “no longer signing.” I wonder if this is true and he recently quit signing ttm thanks to the 4x6 photo dealer hound.

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    bronzematbronzemat Posts: 2,605 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @JMS1223 said:
    Just found this on eBay:

    https://ebay.com/itm/114720176004?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=wkRIoddpTi2&sssrc=2047675&ssuid=da4IlHDuTvG&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY

    It says Clarence Thomas is “no longer signing.” I wonder if this is true and he recently quit signing ttm thanks to the 4x6 photo dealer hound.

    Could also be because of all the crap the man has been doing. Already a petition with a million sigs to get him booted.

    https://www.newsweek.com/impeach-clarence-thomas-petition-hits-1m-signatures-1721317

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    JMS1223JMS1223 Posts: 1,100 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @bronzemat said:

    @JMS1223 said:
    Just found this on eBay:

    https://ebay.com/itm/114720176004?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=wkRIoddpTi2&sssrc=2047675&ssuid=da4IlHDuTvG&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY

    It says Clarence Thomas is “no longer signing.” I wonder if this is true and he recently quit signing ttm thanks to the 4x6 photo dealer hound.

    Could also be because of all the crap the man has been doing. Already a petition with a million sigs to get him booted.

    https://www.newsweek.com/impeach-clarence-thomas-petition-hits-1m-signatures-1721317

    Could be that in addition to people selling his autograph on eBay. Other Justices stopped signing ttm years ago because people were selling their autographs on eBay. If Thomas stopped signing ttm that now means there are no Justices signing ttm.

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    JMS1223JMS1223 Posts: 1,100 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Just did a quick look on another forum and indeed it appears Thomas stopped responding to ttm since April. :o Last success was in March of this year.

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    JBKJBK Posts: 14,789 ✭✭✭✭✭

    That would be a terrible development. I was hoping he'd produce the others into loosening their policies, not the other way around.

    BTW, as far as i know Kagan still signs. I got a response from her within the past several weeks.

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    JBKJBK Posts: 14,789 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I am hoping that the "no longer signing" response is just what those ebay parasites are getting back. :/

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    JMS1223JMS1223 Posts: 1,100 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 4, 2022 8:56AM

    @JBK said:
    BTW, as far as i know Kagan still signs. I got a response from her within the past several weeks.

    On the database the last success for Kagan was in January so you got lucky with your recent response. I have not gotten my response back (yet) and I spent extra money to send it Priority Mail to avoid the Zapper. If I never get it back then I wasted $15 ($10 to send it Priority and $5 on SASE to return to me). But I am not giving up hope, especially if you got her much more recently than January.

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    JMS1223JMS1223 Posts: 1,100 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I purchased a Sandra Day O’Connor. I decided to go with a personalized example so that autopen was less likely. This is a signed book page I purchased (purchased as a book page). I paid more than I wanted to ($67) because I thought I was going to get $12 off due to eBay’s July 4th promotion but it did not apply to this item/category so I was stuck paying full price. Had I got the discount I would had been very close to my budget of $50.

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    bronzematbronzemat Posts: 2,605 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 7, 2022 3:42PM

    I'm shocked :o It's personalized, didn't think you liked other peoples names?

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    JMS1223JMS1223 Posts: 1,100 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @bronzemat said:
    I'm shocked :o It's personalized, didn't think you liked other peoples names?

    I like personalized on certain items and other things I think non-personalized looks better. All depends on autograph and the type of item signed.

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    kgakga Posts: 33 ✭✭

    I have enjoyed seeing the autographs and discussion about Supreme Court Justices. Back many years ago, I was working on a special project regarding the legacy of Abraham Lincoln and received permission to have several members of the SC personally comment for my project. I thought I would share here. Chief Justice Warren Burger and Chief Justice William Rehnquist provided me these handwritten comments. I will share others below.

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    kgakga Posts: 33 ✭✭

    More responses to my Lincoln Project - Associate Justices of the Supreme Court: Byron White Harry Blackmun Sandra Day O'Connor Clarence Thomas Antony Kennedy

    I will share more later.

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    JBKJBK Posts: 14,789 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 19, 2022 5:41AM

    That is an outstanding group of items!

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    JBKJBK Posts: 14,789 ✭✭✭✭✭

    BTW...if had to critique those SC trubites to Lincoln, I'd say that I'd rather have the tributes written on nice official SC stationery or note cards.

    HOWEVER....if they had replied on their own stationery the responses would almost certainly have been typed and then hand signed.

    You presumably sent those postcards to them and asked them to use them for their replies. Therefore, the replies are entirely handwritten.

    Typed and signed tributes would be great, but handwritten are fantastic. They are significant historical artifacts.

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    kgakga Posts: 33 ✭✭

    Yes JBK you are correct. I sent our my own Lincoln postcards and it gave me authentic replies that were handwritten. I wanted to go around autopen replies and secretarial written replies. It worked. I have more I will post.

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    JMS1223JMS1223 Posts: 1,100 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @kga said:
    Yes JBK you are correct. I sent our my own Lincoln postcards and it gave me authentic replies that were handwritten. I wanted to go around autopen replies and secretarial written replies. It worked. I have more I will post.

    I look forward to seeing the others you got. Also lucky for you these appeared to have been sent before 2001 which means they didn’t get zapped (irradiated and ruined).

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    kgakga Posts: 33 ✭✭

    Here are the rest of my Supreme Court responses regarding Abraham Lincoln. John P. Stevens Samuel Alito Lewis Powell Would be SC Justice Robert Bork

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    JBKJBK Posts: 14,789 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 20, 2022 4:42AM

    Very interesting.

    It seems that Powell was subtly admitting that his roots were with the Confederacy. :D

    I'm guessing the project dated from the era of the Bork nomination based on his inclusion.

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    kgakga Posts: 33 ✭✭

    I am retired from the National Park Service and had the honor of meeting a few Presidents and former Chief Justice Warren E. Burger on July 4, 1987 when he visited my park in St. Louis. I took this photo. Here is the autograph I got in person that day:

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    JMS1223JMS1223 Posts: 1,100 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Very interesting. I like how you managed to get one signed and written by Bork.

    Very cool you met Warren Burger! :o I would love to meet a Supreme Court Justice someday.

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    JMS1223JMS1223 Posts: 1,100 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I was browsing another autograph site and noticed someone sent Any Coney Barrett an autograph request a year or so ago and received two UNSIGNED Chambers Cards. She only has sent autopen letters otherwise rejection letters and unsigned items. Super rare. Anyway, just a heads up if you see a signed Barrett Chambers Card it could be a forgery produced on an unsigned Chambers Card she sent ttm.

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    kgakga Posts: 33 ✭✭

    I had a special opportunity with my historic Supreme Court collection, when I made contact with Chief Justice Rehnquist and requested that he hand sign my impeachment ticket from the Clinton impeachment. I received permission of the Chief Justice to sign this ticket and he did so in 2004. The Chief Justice passed away in 2005. Here is the ticket I received. I received a call from the Chief Justice Chambers Office informing me that Rehnquist hand signed my ticket and that it was being mailed to me. The current Chief Justice Roberts is very different and rarely gives any autographs to anyone that he does not know personally. Most autographs that come from his office are autopen examples.

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    JMS1223JMS1223 Posts: 1,100 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @kga said:
    I had a special opportunity with my historic Supreme Court collection, when I made contact with Chief Justice Rehnquist and requested that he hand sign my impeachment ticket from the Clinton impeachment. I received permission of the Chief Justice to sign this ticket and he did so in 2004. The Chief Justice passed away in 2005. Here is the ticket I received. I received a call from the Chief Justice Chambers Office informing me that Rehnquist hand signed my ticket and that it was being mailed to me. The current Chief Justice Roberts is very different and rarely gives any autographs to anyone that he does not know personally. Most autographs that come from his office are autopen examples.

    VERY historic and rare.

    Yeah, Roberts is nearly impossible to get. I have seen one or two in person examples throughout my research but find Brett Kavanaugh and Amy Coney Barrett to be super rare as I have not found or heard of even one authentic example obtained. Ketanji Brown Jackson is probably still too new to tell but she also seems elusive.

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    kgakga Posts: 33 ✭✭

    I did my Lincoln Project in the early 1990s. This sort of project would not work in our world post 9-11. I was pleased to get my responses when I did. Yes, Roberts is difficult to get an authentic example. I bought a book from a book dealer that had obtained the book from Sandra Day O'Connor when he children were clearing out some of her books. The book was personally signed by Chief Justice Roberts and given to O'Connor. I also corresponded with the author to get more information about the book and find out how and why Roberts would have signed it. I am certain of authenticity. Here is the signature page.

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    JMS1223JMS1223 Posts: 1,100 ✭✭✭✭✭

    That’s awesome! Lucky you for finding that!

    I found an example of the UNSIGNED Chambers Cards Amy Coney Barrett sends out.

    If you ever see one signed BEWARE!

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    kgakga Posts: 33 ✭✭

    @JMS1223 said:
    That’s awesome! Lucky you for finding that!

    I found an example of the UNSIGNED Chambers Cards Amy Coney Barrett sends out.

    If you ever see one signed BEWARE!

    Good advice. The new world of autographs will be difficult for many.

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    JBKJBK Posts: 14,789 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @kga said:
    I had a special opportunity with my historic Supreme Court collection, when I made contact with Chief Justice Rehnquist and requested that he hand sign my impeachment ticket from the Clinton impeachment. I received permission of the Chief Justice to sign this ticket and he did so in 2004. The Chief Justice passed away in 2005. Here is the ticket I received. I received a call from the Chief Justice Chambers Office informing me that Rehnquist hand signed my ticket and that it was being mailed to me. The current Chief Justice Roberts is very different and rarely gives any autographs to anyone that he does not know personally. Most autographs that come from his office are autopen examples.

    That's an incredible item.

    Rehnquist was funny - he sent out lots of autopens on letters and chambers cards but he was usually authentic when you sent something to be signed.

    I scrambled to get some of those impeachment tickets. I sent requests to dozens of senators. I ended getting two through John Kerry and two through Paul Wellstone.

    When the impeachment trial started I printed out the text of the oath that senators took and a got some signed. There was a special oath that Rehnquist took and I got him to sign two of those.

    The next time I see them I'll take some photos.

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    kgakga Posts: 33 ✭✭

    @JBK said:

    @kga said:
    I had a special opportunity with my historic Supreme Court collection, when I made contact with Chief Justice Rehnquist and requested that he hand sign my impeachment ticket from the Clinton impeachment. I received permission of the Chief Justice to sign this ticket and he did so in 2004. The Chief Justice passed away in 2005. Here is the ticket I received. I received a call from the Chief Justice Chambers Office informing me that Rehnquist hand signed my ticket and that it was being mailed to me. The current Chief Justice Roberts is very different and rarely gives any autographs to anyone that he does not know personally. Most autographs that come from his office are autopen examples.

    That's an incredible item.

    Rehnquist was funny - he sent out lots of autopens on letters and chambers cards but he was usually authentic when you sent something to be signed.

    I scrambled to get some of those impeachment tickets. I sent requests to dozens of senators. I ended getting two through John Kerry and two through Paul Wellstone.

    When the impeachment trial started I printed out the text of the oath that senators took and a got some signed. There was a special oath that Rehnquist took and I got him to sign two of those.

    The next time I see them I'll take some photos.

    Awesome work getting the oaths signed. Collectors need to be creative and you did the job.

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    kgakga Posts: 33 ✭✭

    Janet Tramonte was Rehnquist's secretary who helped me get the impeachment ticket signed. Years later I contacted her again (she moved on to work with the Supreme Court Historical Society). In an email I asked her about the signing habit of Chief Justice Rehnquist in regard to the impeachment tickets from the Clinton trial. She told me that he signed a few, but not many. So I know that the authentic signed impeachment tickets are rare. I have never seen any reference to John Roberts autographing any of the Trump impeachment tickets. I purchased one of the Nixon impeachment tickets that were actually never used. They were evidently being held in a Congressional safe and some leaked out to the market.

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    JBKJBK Posts: 14,789 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @kga said:
    I have never seen any reference to John Roberts autographing any of the Trump impeachment tickets.

    I scrambled once again for those tickets. I think I sent letters to 50 senators - any state I had the remotest connection to. I got 1 ticket each from my two senators and one from a state where I have family. I also got one from the press office. It was all in the timing.

    I'm not sure I'll ever try to get one signed through the mail. They are fairly scarce due to the short trial. There was one guy on ebay who sold one a week (I think he was with the press and applied for one each day.) They were consistently bringing $600 each. :o

    I purchased one of the Nixon impeachment tickets that were actually never used. They were evidently being held in a Congressional safe and some leaked out to the market.

    That's great background that I was not aware of. I knew they existed but not the story of their release.

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    kgakga Posts: 33 ✭✭

    Here are all my authentic/historic impeachment tickets. The second impeachment trial did not use this style of printed ticket. That trial used a plastic pass that was reused by each Senate Office. I have seen an image, but these did not leak out to the public as far as I know. Johnson 1868 (Different colors were used for different days of the week House Proceedings ticket for Nixon 1974 Never issued 1974 Senate Trial Nixon Never issued Clinton Senate ticket 1999 Trump first impeachment 2020 - Notice impeachment not in the wording on the ticket.

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    JMS1223JMS1223 Posts: 1,100 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Very interesting seeing the different impeachment tickets. I did not know Nixon ones were made and exist on the second market. I wonder what those cost?

    I also find it interesting the 2020 tickets don’t use the word “impeachment” on them. I wonder if the 2021 plastic reusable passes did? Did they change the format due to people trying to collect these tickets or more due to technology changing?

    I wish I knew about how to try to obtain these. Never even thought about trying to get any as I didn’t think you could. Neat how some Senators sent them out upon request.

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    JBKJBK Posts: 14,789 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I did not realize they made House and Senate tickets for Nixon.

    I know that the Clinton impeachment had multiple varieties: red press tickets, and a few special variations of the yellow tickets, such as VIP, Senate Family Gallery, etc.

    The Trump ticket is interesting for a couple reasons. As you pointed out, it does not mention the word "impeachment", nor does it mention "trial" or "president". It also has a security feature - a blind-printed seal that appears when you tilt the card in the light.

    As you mentioned, the second trial, which occurred during COVID, had no printed tickets. I was told the gallery was closed.

    I am aware that a sort of reusable plastic pass existed, as one for the media was listed by that seller on ebay. I am not sure if it was pulled before it sold, as it was still valid since the trial was still ongoing.

    I satisfy myself that I didn't miss the ticket for the second trial since the Sargent at Arms' office told me in a letter that none were issued. I tell myself that the plastic things were passes and did not count. ;)

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