Newbie PCGS Crossover Question
scotty4449
Posts: 717 ✭✭✭✭✭
I am attempting to cross 4 coins for the first time. If they receive the dreaded DNC, will I still see the grade that PCGS assigned to that coin? Thanks in advance!
0
Comments
They cannot grade it unless removed from the holder
huh, that's interesting. So they wont really know the grade, they just know it will at least cross at the grade specified before they remove it from the holder?
An overview of the process. It addresses 'when/if' a coin is removed from the original holder.
Unfortunately, it does not answer your question.
Hopefully, someone with some crossover experience will post.
Edited for a typo.
Thanks @MetroD. I did read through that looking for clues, but you are right, it doesn't really say if a DNC gets assigned a grade. I can see how it might be difficult to do that without removing it from the holder.
I ask because one of the coins I am crossing is a quarter eagle in a ICG holder. The coin has a questionable spot on the obverse. It would be good to know, if it DNCed, if PCGS thought it was a details coin.
I could be wrong, but I am not sure that this is correct.
The way I read the crossover page, they grade the coin in the original holder. It is only removed from the original holder if it crosses to the submitter's specification.
The same also seems to apply for reconsideration. A coin is only removed from the original holder if it upgrades to the submitter's preferences.
If the coin goes DNC then you will not receive the grade that PCGS might have given it.
In honor of the memory of Cpl. Michael E. Thompson
Thanks @TomB! That's a shame.
That’s incorrect and if it were the case, there wouldn’t be a crossover service.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
Ok here we go, how you submit will determine the outcome.
1) If you submit cross at any grade you will get your coins back in a shinny new PCGS holder with the grade they feel it merits that particular day; which may or may not be lower than the current holder.
2) If you submit cross at the same or higher grade you will only get the shinny new holder with the PCGS grade opinion if they feel the coin is meets or exceeds the current holder's grade. IF in their opinion it does not meet the grade on the current holder then you will not get a new holder or any grade opinion from PCGS. What you will get is your coin back in the holder that you submitted in, that is all.
My Collection of Old Holders
Never a slave to one plastic brand will I ever be.
Thanks for the info @coinbuf !
I don't think they are actually grading the coin in a crossover submission, only agree that the grade is correct and of course billing you for a grade. Once they remove it from the holder then it gets graded. Think of this logic, if not an NGC coin then it must be removed to be graded. This is why its called Crossover and not Early Bird (or whatever at PCGS).
How can you confirm the current grade on the coin is correct without grading it?
How can you grade a coin if you cannot see the edge ?
Do the best you can with what you can see, I suppose. You need to ask the grading services, as they're the ones doing it.
Ok- I answered your question as best I can. Will you answer mine:
How can you confirm the current grade on the coin is correct without grading it?
If the your coin meets the minimum grade you select on your submission form (unless you say any grade) then it will be cracked out and graded by the graders. Then it goes to the finalizer who decides if he agrees with the assigned grades or not. If not, then he changes it to what he feels is the correct grade.
Your coin is presented to the individual graders with a cover over the current slab’s grade and graded that way. If the edge is not visualized because of the holder then PCGS takes a risk that there may be some hidden damage, which they don’t like to do.
Dave
submit it for CAC?
Only someone who doesn't understand how CAC works would suggest that.
Just sayin'.
Hey! I represent that remark!
You don't have to. You can go to CAC's website and learn what it is they do, you know. They explain it there.
Then why not cross at any grade. If you value PCGS opinion over ICG, as the market does, you are not preserving any value.
Ignorance is a choice.
That coin should not be sent to CAC even if it is an undergraded 70.
Your homework is to figure out why.
Yes, yes... But I stand by my original witticism, you can confirm a grade without (you) grading it by sending it to CAC. Yah?
That coin? I thought we were talking about resubmissions and crossovers in general....
It multiple posted me... slow data connection on my phone.. never seems to happen on good wifi...
It multiple posted me... slow data connection on my phone.. never seems to happen on good wifi...
No. CAC can agree (or not) as they like, but the only entity that can confirm the PCGS grade is PCGS.
Is not the CAC sticker a confirmation that the coin is choice for the assigned grade, and problem-free? I know I could go look it up...
Boy, you are lazy.
You can't submit ICG to CAC.
That was a witticism?
Nah.
And failure to CAC does not mean the coin is not graded correctly. So, CAC will not allow you to "verify" the grade.
I once tried to cross a coin I thought was marginal and though it did not cross, was surprised to see PCGS designated it as “cleaned” and so I knew why it did not. The problem was printed out on the insert high said DNC.
No, it's not. A CAC sticker is CAC's opinion of the grade PCGS assigned. If you're trying to get a coin in a PCGS holder, the only opinion that counts is PCGS's.
If you’re talking about “CAC’s opinion of the grade PCGS assigned”, presumably, the coin’s already in a PCGS holder. On the other hand, if it’s CAC’s opinion of the grade NGC assigned and you’re trying to get the coin into a PCGS holder, then, the only opinion that counts is PCGS’s.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
My original comment on this thread (and the one that people have been replying to) was regarding a crossover submission. And I agree that the only opinion that counts is PCGS’s. Where I wrote "CAC’s opinion of the grade PCGS assigned”, it should have been "“CAC’s opinion of the grade the TPG assigned”, sorry for not being clearer.
Whoa, this old chestnut flared back up again!
I specified minimum grade for cross on that ICG coin at one grade lower. If it doesn't cross, I will sell it off. I think I could get more for it in the current ICG holder than in a PCGS holder at 2 grades lower or worse.
Yes, that I do recall. Only NGC and PCGS, if memory serves. I wasn't specifically talking about ICG.
That's the problem with quoting and replying to posts in a thread... the original context often morphs, or at best becomes ambiguous.
And you are answering a question I didn't ask...
After my (lame?) joke about CAC, I've been trying to validate my understanding, while having a conversation: Is not the CAC sticker a confirmation that the coin is choice for the assigned grade, and problem-free? (NGC/PCGS, of course). No need to beat this dead horse further...
Boy, you are critical.
Cross, double cross triple cross then cacs. Hell you'll have $400+ in it and the value may change $10. Crazy world......but then 39% of "merica gets their newz from facebooks..........Wur jacked! Semper!!
The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.
BOOMIN!™
But failure to CAC doesn't mean that the coin isn't properly graded - see my earlier post. So even if you could CAC and ICG slab, you wouldn't learn anything from the failure as it still might be properly graded.
And, even if it were NGC and did CAC, that doesn't guarantee it will cross at the grade - although it is likely. CAC's opinion of NGC's grade isn't necessarily the same as PCGS's opinion of the grade.
So, if you want to cross, the only way to know is to cross.
It's actually an ICG slab, so you can't even get a CAC opinion.
While I think CAC would increase the probability that it SHOULD cross, I still think the only way to know if it will cross is to cross it.
Wow.... I am continually amazed at what happens in some threads..... confused confusion becomes further confused with confusing but inconclusive contributions. Cheers, RickO
Wayne
Kennedys are my quest...
Well they must trust the other TPG to a certain extent without seeing the edge. There could be graffiti behind the insert. Seriously I think we are tossing around a definition of 'grade' for no other reason than it being a grey area.